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General Discussion 

The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Come on already, we need a true mmo !!!

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250 posts found
  delete5230

Elite Member

Joined: 8/15/07
Posts: 2647

 
OP  9/29/12 6:36:03 AM#1

What we need is an old school mmo.  In other words we need an mmo that is hard.

 

 We DON'T need.  Dungeon finders, cross realm nothing,Dynamic events with auto group, story telling that other social people can't get involved,cinematic that pulls players away from the game for 3  minutes when in groups....This stuff is bull crap...Bottom line.

 

We DO need.  A somewhat hard mmo.  One that relays on the guy next to you having a hard time soloing too.  A game that joining a guild means something, and helps the players progress as a team.  Make a friend that you click with?....Add him to your friends list....It's all about survival in a hard world.

 

SOMETHING THAT MAKES YOUR HART POUND, BUT WITH FRIENDS,IT CAN BE DONE.  This is an mmo !....I don't know what you call all this crap we have now.  GuildWars 2 in a nice game.  Well made, tons of features.  BUTT is still a  disappointment as a sociable mmo.  It's too easy, no chatting, no social, no guild or friends dependent.  It's almost hard to call it an mmo depending on how you look at it ( yes and no ).

I for one would like ( my opinion ) An old school mmo with no auto features, yet nice graphics.  An mmo where the developers promise to not ever screw it up and make it easy mode.  A game where developers can concentrate on making the world larger, more exploration, more dungeons and raids . Always working on coding to make the game run better.  What I would like to see ( my opinion ) is the opposite of SWTOR, with its shallow game play yet a bunch of crap cintamatics and cut seens that takes away from grouping and game play.

 

NOW THIS IS IMPORTANT :

People here will bash anyone that brings up old school here on mmorpg.com.  BUT understand this:

What we have now is something other than true mmo's, mixed in with mmo's.  New people are here on this site.  I would guess half like auto everything solo based games with others around them, and half would like a social dependent hard mmo.

It would be nice to separate the distinction between the two and call one something different.  However, we no longer have true mmos so maybe there is no point in doing this.

 

What we have now are 30 day fun to play games.

 Without social dependence there is no reason to log in day after day, month after month, year after year.....Community is what keeps players playing.  For me, once I learn all the thousands of features of this newer style of mmo's I get tired of it.  But if you add a very social dependent environment I could play for years,but thats for me, how about you?

There is a market for old school,Why did things even change ?.....I know ! World of Warcraft changed there formula to easy mode,NO ONE ASKED FOR THIS, BLIZZARD DID THIS ON THERE OWN. Now every mmo follows the big dog,because they think this is what players all like......Did your game go F2P ?

  UtukuMoon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/03/11
Posts: 1109

9/29/12 6:49:37 AM#2

Their is one but you are obviously not playing it.

Vanguard is not quite as harsh as EQ but it really isn't a walk in the park,it's a thinking mans old time MMO.It also has a vast non instanced world which has depth and mystery.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8ymgFyzbDo

  immodium

Elite Member

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 1403

9/29/12 6:50:24 AM#3

It's not so much a game then, but more of a virtual world. Which I would love to see tbh.

Theres not really been an MMORPG I have played where I have actually cared about the character I have created.

When I first got into MMORPGs in 2007 with LOTRO, I loved the idea of this living, breathing world I could make a mark in or impact some how. I slowly realised I couldn't and now MMORPG's seem to be getting more action based and cater for people who need instant gratification. They feel more FPS than RPG.

I missed SWG before it got basterdised by Sony. The Repopulation sounds interesting.

  worldalpha

Novice Member

Joined: 11/03/11
Posts: 401

Working hard on WorldAlpha

9/29/12 7:20:50 AM#4
I agree that MMOs need to have a challenge.  So, that is why I'm developing a challenging MMO RTS, not an RPG, with in-depth economy, military and politics modules.  Check out WorldAlpha.

Thanks,
Mike
Working on Social Strategy MMORTS (now Launched!) http://www.worldalpha.com

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 19494

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

9/29/12 7:31:28 AM#5

Yeah, sure, I'm with you, more of a virtual world, more of a challenge, more socialization mechanics etc etc.

Along with you and me and perhaps 500K of our friends it still isn't enough of an audience to encourage a AAA developer to sink 100M plus into such a design, so don't get your hopes up.

What we really need is for a large size indie title to hit the big time, much like CCP did with EVE.

Which as crazy as it may seem is why I'm going to support DF:UW, despite my misgivings with some of the game mechanics.

 

Arrogant, Condescending, Dismissive, Elitist, "Meany", you speak as if these are bad things?
"People can do with their money what they want. But... that doesn't make it smart" - COORS
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  Loktofeit

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 12405

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ArcheAge, and Combat Arms

9/29/12 7:41:05 AM#6

"And wikipedia is as accurate as Britannica. Wikipedia is very reliable. You would be hard pressed to find a more reliable source for these kinds of things." -fivoroth

  Lord.Bachus

Elite Member

Joined: 5/14/07
Posts: 8875

I believe in life before death... So dont forget to enjoy it while you still can.

9/29/12 7:44:03 AM#7

To the OP...

 

The majorrity of MMO players is actually very happy with things like dungeon finders, instance quests crossrealm interaction and such

 

 

So dont say We need, but refer to me and my friends, or even the very lonely I.

 

When do people like the OP start to realise they are currently a very small minority.

Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 19494

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

9/29/12 7:55:38 AM#8
Originally posted by Loktofeit

Wizardry Online

 

Didn't realize they were far enough along to offer beta sign-ups, thanks for posting that.

I'm on the list, let's see what happens.

 

Arrogant, Condescending, Dismissive, Elitist, "Meany", you speak as if these are bad things?
"People can do with their money what they want. But... that doesn't make it smart" - COORS
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  delete5230

Elite Member

Joined: 8/15/07
Posts: 2647

 
OP  9/29/12 7:57:49 AM#9
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

To the OP...

 

The majorrity of MMO players is actually very happy with things like dungeon finders, instance quests crossrealm interaction and such

 

 

So dont say We need, but refer to me and my friends, or even the very lonely I.

 

When do people like the OP start to realise they are currently a very small minority.

Well we have true mmo's and we have what we have now. Non social games, lots of features, people next to you but your playing alone. You know, the non-mmo's.

Maybe you fall into the other than catagory that I was talking about.

This is more for the mmo player, You know the Multi player type player. 

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 19494

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

9/29/12 8:00:16 AM#10
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

To the OP...

 

The majorrity of MMO players is actually very happy with things like dungeon finders, instance quests crossrealm interaction and such

 

 

So dont say We need, but refer to me and my friends, or even the very lonely I.

 

When do people like the OP start to realise they are currently a very small minority.

If a majority of players are happy with these features, why do they leave most MMO's so quickly.

What are they looking for to keep them playing for longer than 2-3 months?

 

Arrogant, Condescending, Dismissive, Elitist, "Meany", you speak as if these are bad things?
"People can do with their money what they want. But... that doesn't make it smart" - COORS
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  Fondel

Novice Member

Joined: 3/19/05
Posts: 99

9/29/12 8:03:06 AM#11
Darkfall Unholy Wars anyone?
  Connmacart

Novice Member

Joined: 2/24/12
Posts: 693

9/29/12 8:22:28 AM#12
Originally posted by Kyleran
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

To the OP...

 

The majorrity of MMO players is actually very happy with things like dungeon finders, instance quests crossrealm interaction and such

 

 

So dont say We need, but refer to me and my friends, or even the very lonely I.

 

When do people like the OP start to realise they are currently a very small minority.

If a majority of players are happy with these features, why do they leave most MMO's so quickly.

What are they looking for to keep them playing for longer than 2-3 months?

 

You are assuming that they might want to stay longer, for which there is no indication they do.

To the OP: People can't even agree on what a "true" MMO is. Let alone get one made. 

The thing I want most in an MMO is a living world and I got that in GW2 at the moment. Is there room for improvement, yes, but I'm more than satisfied for now. 

  austriacus

Novice Member

Joined: 8/28/07
Posts: 626

9/29/12 8:31:30 AM#13
Originally posted by Kyleran
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

To the OP...

 

The majorrity of MMO players is actually very happy with things like dungeon finders, instance quests crossrealm interaction and such

 

 

So dont say We need, but refer to me and my friends, or even the very lonely I.

 

When do people like the OP start to realise they are currently a very small minority.

If a majority of players are happy with these features, why do they leave most MMO's so quickly.

What are they looking for to keep them playing for longer than 2-3 months?

 

Thats the thing, they are not looking for anything to hook them up for years. I though this was clear already.

  User Deleted
9/29/12 8:43:28 AM#14
Originally posted by austriacus
Originally posted by Kyleran
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

To the OP...

 

The majorrity of MMO players is actually very happy with things like dungeon finders, instance quests crossrealm interaction and such

 

 

So dont say We need, but refer to me and my friends, or even the very lonely I.

 

When do people like the OP start to realise they are currently a very small minority.

If a majority of players are happy with these features, why do they leave most MMO's so quickly.

What are they looking for to keep them playing for longer than 2-3 months?

 

Thats the thing, they are not looking for anything to hook them up for years. I though this was clear already.

 

None of us are. When we pick up a game, we arent "looking" for a game to play for years. It just happens.

  David_Lopan

Novice Member

Joined: 9/07/10
Posts: 815

"There is no progress. Everything is the same as it was. Form changes. The essence does not." RLS

9/29/12 8:47:43 AM#15
Originally posted by Sylvarii

Their is one but you are obviously not playing it.

Vanguard is not quite as harsh as EQ but it really isn't a walk in the park,it's a thinking mans old time MMO.It also has a vast non instanced world which has depth and mystery.

  +1

  Lowcaian

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/01/11
Posts: 267

9/29/12 8:49:38 AM#16

The ADD mindset is too strong now. The majority no longer want to find a home, they want fast food. After 2 weeks they come here and post "I'm booored" Look at any gaming forum, be it mmorpgs or singleplayer games. People start discussing the sequel before the game has even launched.

Yet when some game tries to do something new they don't like it either because it doesn't conform exactly to their image of what a game should be. It doesn't even have to be gamebreaking issues, just annoying details.

It's over.

 

  syntax.error

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/27/04
Posts: 2982

C64 Cracked Warez Intros FTW

9/29/12 8:53:08 AM#17
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

To the OP...

 

The majorrity of MMO players is actually very happy with things like dungeon finders, instance quests crossrealm interaction and such

 

 

So dont say We need, but refer to me and my friends, or even the very lonely I.

 

When do people like the OP start to realise they are currently a very small minority.

 

No offense LB, but whether a minority of players that want a mmorpg and not another candyland themepark lobby mmo, we are out here waiting for a real immersive, persistent and econmic player driven world.

I too am tired of these mmo's that last only for a month or two of interest. Folks like you that like the mmo's we got now, thats good for you, we just don't need another mmo that will follow the same mindless formula.

  zakiyawow

Novice Member

Joined: 2/28/10
Posts: 631

9/29/12 8:54:31 AM#18
Originally posted by delete5230

What we need is an old school mmo.  In other words we need an mmo that is hard.

 

 We DON'T need.  Dungeon finders, cross realm nothing,Dynamic events with auto group, story telling that other social people can't get involved,cinematic that pulls players away from the game for 3  minutes when in groups....This stuff is bull crap...Bottom line.

 

We DO need.  A somewhat hard mmo.  One that relays on the guy next to you having a hard time soloing too.  A game that joining a guild means something, and helps the players progress as a team.  Make a friend that you click with?....Add him to your friends list....It's all about survival in a hard world.

How do you define "Hard" ?

SOMETHING THAT MAKES YOUR HART POUND, BUT WITH FRIENDS,IT CAN BE DONE.  This is an mmo !....I don't know what you call all this crap we have now.  GuildWars 2 in a nice game.  Well made, tons of features.  BUTT is still a  disappointment as a sociable mmo.  It's too easy, no chatting, no social, no guild or friends dependent.  It's almost hard to call it an mmo depending on how you look at it ( yes and no ).

There is nothing to stop you from chatting and social in current game. You can still depend on your guild and friends if you so choose. Just hanging out with guild and friends are social activity too.

 

 

I for one would like ( my opinion ) An old school mmo with no auto features, yet nice graphics.  An mmo where the developers promise to not ever screw it up and make it easy mode.  A game where developers can concentrate on making the world larger, more exploration, more dungeons and raids . Always working on coding to make the game run better.  What I would like to see ( my opinion ) is the opposite of SWTOR, with its shallow game play yet a bunch of crap cintamatics and cut seens that takes away from grouping and game play.

Money talks wether you like it or not. If there are a huge demand, you bet there will be changes.

 

NOW THIS IS IMPORTANT :

People here will bash anyone that brings up old school here on mmorpg.com.  BUT understand this:

What we have now is something other than true mmo's, mixed in with mmo's.  New people are here on this site.  I would guess half like auto everything solo based games with others around them, and half would like a social dependent hard mmo.

It would be nice to separate the distinction between the two and call one something different.  However, we no longer have true mmos so maybe there is no point in doing this.

 

What we have now are 30 day fun to play games.

 Without social dependence there is no reason to log in day after day, month after month, year after year.....Community is what keeps players playing.  For me, once I learn all the thousands of features of this newer style of mmo's I get tired of it.  But if you add a very social dependent environment I could play for years,but thats for me, how about you?

There is a market for old school,Why did things even change ?.....I know ! World of Warcraft changed there formula to easy mode,NO ONE ASKED FOR THIS, BLIZZARD DID THIS ON THERE OWN. Now every mmo follows the big dog,because they think this is what players all like......Did your game go F2P ?

There is a market for sure. Just not big enough for AAA developer and investor. As someone metioned, unless there is a indie sleeper hit, it will not change.

 

 

  Wizardry

Elite Member

Joined: 8/27/04
Posts: 7002

Perhaps tomorrow will be better.

9/29/12 9:00:47 AM#19

If you played FFXi the old school way and it is totally possible even with all the changes,it would be 10x harder than the hardest game you ever played.

No hand holding,no markers,no free xp for doing simple quests.

better yet try not using the internet for  answers,this is the way i had to play this game on launch,no other game came even close and i plaeyd all the major titles.Oh yes and even though there is a lot of level caps removed,try and play it at the level caps we had to follow,i bet LOTS of DEATh !.

this was a TRUE MMO,built around grouping and team work.Getting content done was very tough and felt reqarding just because of the effort needed.Other games you follow quests around with no care about any of them,just a simple "Where is the next marker to follow?".

 

IMO people don't want a true MMO,they want fast easy rewards ,nothing too difficult to play.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Napolianboo#p/u/15/rCYLLQCNc1w
Samoan Diamond

  Muke

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/04/07
Posts: 1638

9/29/12 9:06:13 AM#20
go play EVE.

"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

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