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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

General Discussion  » See-ya trinity....see-ya grouping...

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183 posts found
  Rokurgepta

Novice Member

Joined: 8/15/08
Posts: 2208

9/25/12 3:13:27 PM#121
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

 Sorry but I find people talking in game all the time. Map chat is full of conversation.

 

Stop blaming the game design for the social misfits. Claiming the game is designed wrong because if does not FORCE social interaction is complete BS. It shows a lack of understanding. I CHOOSE to be social in game and by doing so it creates a social enviroment where others feel it is ok to engage in social activities. I am not forced to do it, but my nature encourages it and by doing so others join in. Social misfits on the other hand need a game to force them into groups or else they will not get involved.

 

Blaming the game for not forcing you just reinforces the fact that online games are the refuge of the socially inept.

  DavisFlight

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2604

9/25/12 3:13:38 PM#122
Originally posted by eggy08
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

Going to give you the same response since you basically posted the same post. There's no concequence to grouping. So the only reason you don't do it is your own fault, not the games. Loot isn't shared. So what do you have to lose to make a group?

 

Unless a game offers incentive for something, the bulk of people won't do it.

  DavisFlight

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2604

9/25/12 3:15:07 PM#123
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

 Sorry but I find people talking in game all the time. Map chat is full of conversation.

 

Stop blaming the game design for the social misfits.

I've played MMos for a long long time. The social atmosphere of a game is always a direct result of the design of the game.

When DAoC rewarded and encouraged grouping, it was incredibly social, people chatting and grouping constantly. As soon as soloing became better, it was an antisocial game.

And no one said anything about map chat, we'lre talking about actual player grouping and local chat. Stop derailing the topic.

  SteeJanz

Novice Member

Joined: 8/22/11
Posts: 346

9/25/12 3:15:37 PM#124

Just to clarify a point I am sure many already have made, GW2 still has the trinity (Healing, DPS, Mitigating Enemy damage), what it doesn't have is the "Holy Trinity" or dedicated roles. 

No player has to dedicate themselves to just one discipline but the group must still possess and utilize all three.

The OP's statements about the lack of the trinity and grouping is nothing more than a  rant.  It's to be expected in a new game.  I was not very impressed after my first successful completion of an explorable path as well but it wasn't the fault of the game.  It was the fault of the players.   We completed the dungeon with 5 dps instead of a a more trinity rounded group.  We died a ton and even though we finished it, it sucked because it wasn't fun. 

Heals are still needed in GW2 dungeons, damage mitigation/control is still needed in GW2 and DPS is still needed in GW2.  The difference is that all three are spread out over the entire group and not defined to a characters role.  The trinity is still alive and kicking in GW2 and they never said they were removing it, only the hard set defined roles. 

I think the confusion comes from the fact that there are rules defined in the holy trinity that people follow.  It appears that people have not identified rules to follow in GW2 yet.  If people took the time to understand them and learn how it works, I believe they will find the dungeons to be much more enjoyable and just as fun as a holy trinity based one.  Here are a few tips that might help those that actually what to give it a chance.

  1. You can't run a holy trinity dungeon with 5 DPS so don't expect to be able to run a soft trinity dungeon with 5 dps.
  2. Bring support oriented skills and traits that help your team.  If your utility bar is full of damage skills that only help you, cross your fingers that the other 4 people brought skills to cover your weakness.
  3. This goes with #2,  remember your a tank, healper ,and dps.  Weapon swapping can switch your role instantly when the situation calls for it.  
  4. You can change you skills and weapons during the dungeon.  If you went through the whold dungeon and never adjusted your skills or build, that's a shame because you could have been much more affective.  There are times when the group should be DPS heavy or condition removal heavy, etc....
  5. Try to learn the bosses.  Bosses aggro for different reasons, learning them will help you understand what you should do.  Sometimes, you have aggro so it's your job to avoid the boss, yes that's right, run away.  Move to avoid the heavy damage that they do, it's your turn to control the boss and your main focus should be that and not dps.  I know you didnt ask for it but it's ok you can do it.  Knowing the boss and what they will do, makes the fight much less hectic.  Pulling the boss to a good spot can help make a fight managable.  You know that same stuff you did in the holy trinity dungeons, they work in soft trinity dungeons as well.
  6. Don't let people get defeated.  It takes less then half the time to get a downed player up from a downed state then it does to get them up from a defeated state.  In hard fights you will not be able to get a defeated player up.  If someone goes down get them back up before they are defeated.  It happens in a fight, get used to it.  People keep making the charge that some fights are a rez zerg.  If you notice most the time, it's because one or  two people seem to not get defeated while the rest keep going down.  If you keep running back and the fight is still going because some other guy keeps the fight going, you should be wondering what that guy is doing and what you are not.
  7. Use a tank.  Treating the dungeon like a holy trinity run helps alot.  Having one person that can mitigate some damage early should be your tank.  Their role may change a few seconds into the fight but having some one running point and pulling and starting the fights help the team be more organized.  And you don't get 4 different people opening the pods in TA.  This also helps establish a rule that is followed in the holy trinity runs that I don't see people doing in the soft trinity runs.  When everyone runs point in the a holy trinity based dungeon you get the same chaos.
  8. Gear matters.  Sorry but it does and I know that you got to level 35 so your ready to run AC explorable mode, but I can guarantee that your party will appreciate the fact that you upgraded your level 22 armor to 35 armor before you started the dungeon.  Also, if your gear is spec'ed for power and crit's, your support skills will be less effective.  If your going support, spec that way.  Once again, the rules of the Holy trinity says that a healer doesn't heal wearing tank gear.  One maybe two people can be spec'ed for DPS, the rest need to be spec'ed for support.  Well that is if you don't want to die alot.  Think of it this way, do we want to die more or less, then spec for your answer.
  9. Use your skills wisely.  I am an engineer and I use the elixir gun because it provides alot of group support.  During condition damage heavy fights I used to throw down my super elixir so that everyone could stand in the circle so that their attacks could removed conditions.  However, it's hard for the others in the party  to notice in the fight because they have to pay attention to other things.  So now I throw it down on the boss so that others just get the benefit without having to stand any place special.  The combo happens because they attack through it not in it.
  10. Don't stand in stuff. 

I think making the statement that the GW2 lacks the trinity is an absolutely false statement because it is easy to prove it's in the game so starting a discussion that claims it doesn't exist is pointless. 

However lacking a tool that makes it easy to adjust your build to fit the needs of a group is another story.  Right now, to run dungeons effectively in GW2 it requires people to take too much time to identify the team make up and to make changes that compliments the team.  It is a pain to go back to town to respec (especially since GW1 had a nice system for handling builds and allowed for quick changes).  Now that would be worthy of discussion.

  Rokurgepta

Novice Member

Joined: 8/15/08
Posts: 2208

9/25/12 3:16:00 PM#125
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eggy08
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

Going to give you the same response since you basically posted the same post. There's no concequence to grouping. So the only reason you don't do it is your own fault, not the games. Loot isn't shared. So what do you have to lose to make a group?

You obviously have no understanding of player mentality. I'm guessing you're new to MMOs?

 You are obviously stuck in believing there is only one player mentality available. You are the type who refuses to see anything that is not strictly forced on you by the game. Not everyone thinks or acts like you do. Not everyone needs forced social interaction in order to be socially active.

  kaiser3282

Tipster

Joined: 5/21/08
Posts: 2711

9/25/12 3:16:51 PM#126

I cant even remember the last time i played an MMO where you HAVE to group to do normal content, lik the majority of quests or just farming mobs. In fact, most of the time you avoid it because it just means youre going to have to split loot with someone else when youre perfectly capable of killing the stuff on your own.

Not sure exactly where you got the idea that grouping is a major part of most games. Its usually only required for dungeons, raids, etc. The few times you actually do group with people in most games it consists of a couple of words regarding what youre going to do, asking if people are ready / know what theyre doing, etc you finish up, leave party and go on your way. Its not social hour just because youre killing stuff together. Have you tried soloing a dungeon n GW2? Good luck witht that. Its no different than the majority of games when it comes to this aspect. What they did do different is make it so that wether or not youre in a group together, youre still benefitting together rather than worrying about killing eachothers mobs, etc. I hit a mob a couple times, someone else hits a mob a couple times.... we both get the same xp and loot we would have if we did it solo. Many games dont even offer you that when youre in a group and instead the best XP goes to the highest DPS.

The social part is your own fault, and I really dont get why everyone keeps whining about people not being social when youre incapable of being social yourself. OP said himself he hasnt so much as joined a guild or a group, yet claims people are anti-social. Do you expect people to just randomly start chatting you for no reason whatsoever? A ton of people playing the game already have pre-established guilds that they moved from other games to GW2. They socialize with eachother and are too busy killing stuff to worry about having a conversation with some random person they have no association with whatsoever who would likely have nothing remotely interesting to say anyway.

Ive got to wonder if some of you people complaining everyone doesnt talk to you  spend your days walking around just stopping random people on the street just to talk for the hell of it.  If someone did that to you, you would likely think they were a nut and be thinking to yourself "Why the hell is this guy bothering me? Why wont he shut up, Im trying to go do something."

Also Ive got to wonder at people talking about things like the game "not encouraging grouping and socializing". Do you need your hand held constantly IRL with someone telling you what to do, who to hang out with, who to talk to, when to do it, etc? Most likely not. You do those things on your own and find youre niche of people to do it with. Why do you want / expect a game to force it onto you? People choose to be social or anti-social. The game doesnt do it for them.

  Rokurgepta

Novice Member

Joined: 8/15/08
Posts: 2208

9/25/12 3:18:56 PM#127
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

 Sorry but I find people talking in game all the time. Map chat is full of conversation.

 

Stop blaming the game design for the social misfits.

I've played MMos for a long long time. The social atmosphere of a game is always a direct result of the design of the game.

When DAoC rewarded and encouraged grouping, it was incredibly social, people chatting and grouping constantly. As soon as soloing became better, it was an antisocial game.

And no one said anything about map chat, we'lre talking about actual player grouping and local chat. Stop derailing the topic.

 Map chat is the local chat in GW2. Thank you for not knowing what you are talking about. Map chat in GW2 is where people discuss grouping, events and the game. Its like general chat in most games, but its just the people in the same map as you. That is not derailing the topic IT IS THE topic. I am so tired of people not knowing anything but talking non stop.

  DavisFlight

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2604

9/25/12 3:20:01 PM#128
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

 Sorry but I find people talking in game all the time. Map chat is full of conversation.

 

Stop blaming the game design for the social misfits.

I've played MMos for a long long time. The social atmosphere of a game is always a direct result of the design of the game.

When DAoC rewarded and encouraged grouping, it was incredibly social, people chatting and grouping constantly. As soon as soloing became better, it was an antisocial game.

And no one said anything about map chat, we'lre talking about actual player grouping and local chat. Stop derailing the topic.

 Map chat is the local chat in GW2.

No.... it isn't. /say is the local chat of GW2. Next?

  User Deleted
9/25/12 3:21:04 PM#129
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eggy08
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

Going to give you the same response since you basically posted the same post. There's no concequence to grouping. So the only reason you don't do it is your own fault, not the games. Loot isn't shared. So what do you have to lose to make a group?

 

Unless a game offers incentive for something, the bulk of people won't do it.

Theres plenty of incentive to doing it.

1. Faster leveling.

2. Easier to do DEs.

3. Share items you pick up for other classes that you can't use and vice versa.

4. Meet people.

Incentives not to do it.

1. .... Nope. Cant really think of any.

  DavisFlight

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2604

9/25/12 3:22:29 PM#130
Originally posted by eggy08
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eggy08
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

Going to give you the same response since you basically posted the same post. There's no concequence to grouping. So the only reason you don't do it is your own fault, not the games. Loot isn't shared. So what do you have to lose to make a group?

 

Unless a game offers incentive for something, the bulk of people won't do it.

Theres plenty of incentive to doing it.

1. Faster leveling.

2. Easier to do DEs.

3. Share items you pick up for other classes that you can't use and vice versa.

4. Meet people.

Incentives not to do it.

1. .... Nope. Cant really think of any.

1-3 aren't real reasons, because just being in the same area as someone is enough for those.

 

4 offers no tangible benefit to people who don't value meeting others.

 

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

9/25/12 3:24:07 PM#131
Originally posted by DavisFlight

Theres plenty of incentive to doing it.

1. Faster leveling.

2. Easier to do DEs.

3. Share items you pick up for other classes that you can't use and vice versa.

4. Meet people.

Incentives not to do it.

1. .... Nope. Cant really think of any.

1-3 aren't real reasons, because just being in the same area as someone is enough for those.

 

4 offers no tangible benefit to people who don't value meeting others.

 

aside from listed above content scales and becomes harder(which to me is more fun) and its more fun to do content in groups utilizing cross class combos

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  DavisFlight

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2604

9/25/12 3:27:33 PM#132
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by DavisFlight

Theres plenty of incentive to doing it.

1. Faster leveling.

2. Easier to do DEs.

3. Share items you pick up for other classes that you can't use and vice versa.

4. Meet people.

Incentives not to do it.

1. .... Nope. Cant really think of any.

1-3 aren't real reasons, because just being in the same area as someone is enough for those.

 

4 offers no tangible benefit to people who don't value meeting others.

 

aside from listed above content scales and becomes harder(which to me is more fun) and its more fun to do content in groups utilizing cross class combos

Are you talking about just standing next to someone, or actually grouping? I think you might be confusing the subject.

[mod edit]
  Rokurgepta

Novice Member

Joined: 8/15/08
Posts: 2208

9/25/12 3:27:35 PM#133
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

 Sorry but I find people talking in game all the time. Map chat is full of conversation.

 

Stop blaming the game design for the social misfits.

I've played MMos for a long long time. The social atmosphere of a game is always a direct result of the design of the game.

When DAoC rewarded and encouraged grouping, it was incredibly social, people chatting and grouping constantly. As soon as soloing became better, it was an antisocial game.

And no one said anything about map chat, we'lre talking about actual player grouping and local chat. Stop derailing the topic.

 Map chat is the local chat in GW2.

No.... it isn't. /say is the local chat of GW2. Next?

 /say is not used except for the people you can see. When I say thank you for a rez I use/say. /map is used as the general chat by anyone in game with a clue. For proof try going in game and using /map. You can be wrong and argue all you want, I wont stop you.

  User Deleted
9/25/12 3:27:44 PM#134
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eggy08
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eggy08
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

Going to give you the same response since you basically posted the same post. There's no concequence to grouping. So the only reason you don't do it is your own fault, not the games. Loot isn't shared. So what do you have to lose to make a group?

 

Unless a game offers incentive for something, the bulk of people won't do it.

Theres plenty of incentive to doing it.

1. Faster leveling.

2. Easier to do DEs.

3. Share items you pick up for other classes that you can't use and vice versa.

4. Meet people.

Incentives not to do it.

1. .... Nope. Cant really think of any.

1-3 aren't real reasons, because just being in the same area as someone is enough for those.

 

4 offers no tangible benefit to people who don't value meeting others.

 

How is 3 not a real reason? Honestly, do you just give away your gear to random people in the area, or would you rather share with people who you are leveling with.

1 and 2. Try doing quests without the group, try them with the group. With the group you know, who has a heart, how close are they to being done, you can talk about close by DEs, you can follow each other around and help each other out with each heart rather than just being a creeper and following them outside the group.

And that's an incentive, not everyone will value it of course. But does it matter? It's still an incentive to do it, as opposed to not.

  mikuniman

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/28/06
Posts: 292

9/25/12 3:27:48 PM#135
Originally posted by Lathial
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by Clocksimus
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by Thorbrand
You can enjoy the game solo but your topic is off. I think GW2 proved that there needs to be a trinity and there needs to be grouping. There is no socialization to the game outside Hi Thank you and have a good day. I hate playing solo even if I can play solo and given this game is all about soloing most people don't want to group and a lot of players are not doing dungeons becuase they find it to hard without roles in the party.

that's WAY more than I get in most themeparks these days.. at least GW2 has a system to bring people together and actually want to fight along side eachother in every quest. Lack of communication is soley on the person behind the keyboard.. sure you could make a game with tons of group only content but as long as there's a route you can take without much interaction a good number of people will go that route.. just how these games are these days

The social in older MMO's  were often bad.

The social in GW2 is a different kind of bad.

Bad is still bad. GW2 community  imo is actually worse than any MMO out currently but the difference is, no one talks in GW2 so it defaults to the illusion of a nice community. In reality it should default to it has none. Lack of social doesn't make social better or good.

i'd rather actually play along side other people in an online game whether they talk or not.. at least in GW2 i play alongside others almost the entire time unlike most other recent MMOs

You are entitled to your opinion! 

However, I would rather play "with" people than "alongside" them.  Seems to me just knowing other people are playing the game does not make me feel like im playing with other people.  

 

And there is nothing stopping you from doing just that. On my daily adventures and passive grouping people generally say only what needs to be said and do what needs to be done and most likley end with a friendly note, it's so damn refreshing to see. So whatever Anet is doing I feel it's in the right direction. The last 6 mmo's it's the usual crap chat with tolls spending their day picking a chat fight.

  Rokurgepta

Novice Member

Joined: 8/15/08
Posts: 2208

9/25/12 3:30:49 PM#136
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eggy08
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by eggy08
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

Going to give you the same response since you basically posted the same post. There's no concequence to grouping. So the only reason you don't do it is your own fault, not the games. Loot isn't shared. So what do you have to lose to make a group?

 

Unless a game offers incentive for something, the bulk of people won't do it.

Theres plenty of incentive to doing it.

1. Faster leveling.

2. Easier to do DEs.

3. Share items you pick up for other classes that you can't use and vice versa.

4. Meet people.

Incentives not to do it.

1. .... Nope. Cant really think of any.

1-3 aren't real reasons, because just being in the same area as someone is enough for those.

 

4 offers no tangible benefit to people who don't value meeting others.

 

 So you dont value meeting others and you complain the game does not force socializing? Seriously you have started to sound absurd with your posts. You deny any reason to be social unless the game FORCES it. Yet you want to be forced. When being social is an option it is clear that you are incapable of handling it. Your posts and lack of knowledge on using /map tell me all I need to know about why you struggle to find friends in game. Its not them.

  DavisFlight

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2604

9/25/12 3:30:55 PM#137
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

 Sorry but I find people talking in game all the time. Map chat is full of conversation.

 

Stop blaming the game design for the social misfits.

I've played MMos for a long long time. The social atmosphere of a game is always a direct result of the design of the game.

When DAoC rewarded and encouraged grouping, it was incredibly social, people chatting and grouping constantly. As soon as soloing became better, it was an antisocial game.

And no one said anything about map chat, we'lre talking about actual player grouping and local chat. Stop derailing the topic.

 Map chat is the local chat in GW2.

No.... it isn't. /say is the local chat of GW2. Next?

 /say is not used except for the people you can see. When I say thank you for a rez I use/say.

No kidding. That's what we're all talking about. Welcome to 2 pages of posts ago.

What we're saying is, nobody uses /say to talk to anyone around them, no one responds to local chat or group requests, because the game is inherently antisocial. Other players feel like bots.

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

9/25/12 3:31:21 PM#138
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by DavisFlight

Theres plenty of incentive to doing it.

1. Faster leveling.

2. Easier to do DEs.

3. Share items you pick up for other classes that you can't use and vice versa.

4. Meet people.

Incentives not to do it.

1. .... Nope. Cant really think of any.

1-3 aren't real reasons, because just being in the same area as someone is enough for those.

 

4 offers no tangible benefit to people who don't value meeting others.

 

aside from listed above content scales and becomes harder(which to me is more fun) and its more fun to do content in groups utilizing cross class combos

Are you talking about just standing next to someone, or actually grouping? I think you might be confusing the subject.

 

[mod edit]

how is passive grouping such as in Rift and differn't? what is required of you to BE in a group.. because you have to click join party? you are fighting WITH people either way to complete a goal... how is this any differn't again? I'm still playing with them if I see their little portait or not.. We are enjoying the game together how is that any differn't?

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  Greymantle4

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/27/07
Posts: 802

9/25/12 3:32:25 PM#139
Originally posted by SteeJanz

Just to clarify a point I am sure many already have made, GW2 still has the trinity (Healing, DPS, Mitigating Enemy damage), what it doesn't have is the "Holy Trinity" or dedicated roles. 

No player has to dedicate themselves to just one discipline but the group must still possess and utilize all three.

The OP's statements about the lack of the trinity and grouping is nothing more than a  rant.  It's to be expected in a new game.  I was not very impressed after my first successful completion of an explorable path as well but it wasn't the fault of the game.  It was the fault of the players.   We completed the dungeon with 5 dps instead of a a more trinity rounded group.  We died a ton and even though we finished it, it sucked because it wasn't fun. 

Heals are still needed in GW2 dungeons, damage mitigation/control is still needed in GW2 and DPS is still needed in GW2.  The difference is that all three are spread out over the entire group and not defined to a characters role.  The trinity is still alive and kicking in GW2 and they never said they were removing it, only the hard set defined roles. 

I think the confusion comes from the fact that there are rules defined in the holy trinity that people follow.  It appears that people have not identified rules to follow in GW2 yet.  If people took the time to understand them and learn how it works, I believe they will find the dungeons to be much more enjoyable and just as fun as a holy trinity based one.  Here are a few tips that might help those that actually what to give it a chance.

  1. You can't run a holy trinity dungeon with 5 DPS so don't expect to be able to run a soft trinity dungeon with 5 dps.
  2. Bring support oriented skills and traits that help your team.  If your utility bar is full of damage skills that only help you, cross your fingers that the other 4 people brought skills to cover your weakness.
  3. This goes with #2,  remember your a tank, healper ,and dps.  Weapon swapping can switch your role instantly when the situation calls for it.  
  4. You can change you skills and weapons during the dungeon.  If you went through the whold dungeon and never adjusted your skills or build, that's a shame because you could have been much more affective.  There are times when the group should be DPS heavy or condition removal heavy, etc....
  5. Try to learn the bosses.  Bosses aggro for different reasons, learning them will help you understand what you should do.  Sometimes, you have aggro so it's your job to avoid the boss, yes that's right, run away.  Move to avoid the heavy damage that they do, it's your turn to control the boss and your main focus should be that and not dps.  I know you didnt ask for it but it's ok you can do it.  Knowing the boss and what they will do, makes the fight much less hectic.  Pulling the boss to a good spot can help make a fight managable.  You know that same stuff you did in the holy trinity dungeons, they work in soft trinity dungeons as well.
  6. Don't let people get defeated.  It takes less then half the time to get a downed player up from a downed state then it does to get them up from a defeated state.  In hard fights you will not be able to get a defeated player up.  If someone goes down get them back up before they are defeated.  It happens in a fight, get used to it.  People keep making the charge that some fights are a rez zerg.  If you notice most the time, it's because one or  two people seem to not get defeated while the rest keep going down.  If you keep running back and the fight is still going because some other guy keeps the fight going, you should be wondering what that guy is doing and what you are not.
  7. Use a tank.  Treating the dungeon like a holy trinity run helps alot.  Having one person that can mitigate some damage early should be your tank.  Their role may change a few seconds into the fight but having some one running point and pulling and starting the fights help the team be more organized.  And you don't get 4 different people opening the pods in TA.  This also helps establish a rule that is followed in the holy trinity runs that I don't see people doing in the soft trinity runs.  When everyone runs point in the a holy trinity based dungeon you get the same chaos.
  8. Gear matters.  Sorry but it does and I know that you got to level 35 so your ready to run AC explorable mode, but I can guarantee that your party will appreciate the fact that you upgraded your level 22 armor to 35 armor before you started the dungeon.  Also, if your gear is spec'ed for power and crit's, your support skills will be less effective.  If your going support, spec that way.  Once again, the rules of the Holy trinity says that a healer doesn't heal wearing tank gear.  One maybe two people can be spec'ed for DPS, the rest need to be spec'ed for support.  Well that is if you don't want to die alot.  Think of it this way, do we want to die more or less, then spec for your answer.
  9. Use your skills wisely.  I am an engineer and I use the elixir gun because it provides alot of group support.  During condition damage heavy fights I used to throw down my super elixir so that everyone could stand in the circle so that their attacks could removed conditions.  However, it's hard for the others in the party  to notice in the fight because they have to pay attention to other things.  So now I throw it down on the boss so that others just get the benefit without having to stand any place special.  The combo happens because they attack through it not in it.
  10. Don't stand in stuff. 

I think making the statement that the GW2 lacks the trinity is an absolutely false statement because it is easy to prove it's in the game so starting a discussion that claims it doesn't exist is pointless. 

However lacking a tool that makes it easy to adjust your build to fit the needs of a group is another story.  Right now, to run dungeons effectively in GW2 it requires people to take too much time to identify the team make up and to make changes that compliments the team.  It is a pain to go back to town to respec (especially since GW1 had a nice system for handling builds and allowed for quick changes).  Now that would be worthy of discussion.

Nice write up. Just thought I would bump it since you spent the time to post it. 

  Rokurgepta

Novice Member

Joined: 8/15/08
Posts: 2208

9/25/12 3:33:33 PM#140
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Creslin321
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by Lathial

 

 

 

It’s really a bummer cause I like the game and the pace of combat.  However, I have 8 toons, one of each class and, most of them post 40, and I have never talked to anyone in the game.  I don’t even really remember any person’s name that I have seen or grouped with for dungeons.   Its like im playing a single player game with some goofy AI named "deesnutz" and "drizzt" who will occasionally join me for a veteran or champion kill.  

 

Summed up the biggest, most universal problem with the game.

 Have you guys tried to join a guild?  Tried to do a dungeon?  Tried to do WvW or SPvP?

The game lets you solo if you want to, and it lets you group if you want to.  You seem to be choosing just to solo the entire time and then complaining that there is no grouping or socialization...irony?

Nice assumptions there bud. The game doesn't encourage grouping or socializing, so people don't do either. I shouldn't have to join a guild to find a group, I haven't had to do that in any properly designed MMO.

I've gone around in every zone trying to talk to people in local and after 2 weeks, only got ONE response, it was a "ty' after rezzing someone. That's it. No on wanted to group, no one talked. It felt like I was playing with bots. I'm talking about the main game, not RvR.

 Sorry but I find people talking in game all the time. Map chat is full of conversation.

 

Stop blaming the game design for the social misfits.

I've played MMos for a long long time. The social atmosphere of a game is always a direct result of the design of the game.

When DAoC rewarded and encouraged grouping, it was incredibly social, people chatting and grouping constantly. As soon as soloing became better, it was an antisocial game.

And no one said anything about map chat, we'lre talking about actual player grouping and local chat. Stop derailing the topic.

 Map chat is the local chat in GW2.

No.... it isn't. /say is the local chat of GW2. Next?

 /say is not used except for the people you can see. When I say thank you for a rez I use/say.

No kidding. That's what we're all talking about. Welcome to 2 pages of posts ago.

What we're saying is, nobody uses /say to talk to anyone around them, no one responds to local chat or group requests, because the game is inherently antisocial. Other players feel like bots.

 Thats because /say is TOO local. In game people use /map to talk and find groups. Instead of trying to use that you will continue to harp on a point that is already dead. /say is simply not used the way /map is. People like you are antisocial not the game itself. You are blaming the game for a people problem instead of the people.

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