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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

PvP  » PVP. whats the point?

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92 posts found
  BeansnBread

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/19/06
Posts: 5544

9/05/12 8:37:22 PM#81

I'll use WoW as an example since I've played it a lot in the past and it is probably the easiest for many people to relate to.

 

So... in WoW, I would gear up at the beginning of every season and almost everyone I played against in arenas almost always had the same level of gear the entire time. I basically played on an even playing field (at least in arenas 2k+).

 

The only people that got left behind in WoW were the people that didn't start at the beginning of the season or were the people that didn't have the network or skill to get the gear fast enough to stay caught up. This created an artificial disparity. 

 

Skilled players were being held back for no reason that I could see. I could never figure out why people thought this was an acceptable system if the goal was to encourage having a competitive environment to play in. I felt like arenas were designed with pure competition in mind from the ground up. But then they had this wonky gear system that insured people were occasionally not matched up gear-wise. It might have been the least well thought out part of arenas in my opinion.

 

GW2 removes the gear disparity from sPvP. They are looking to promote true competition between players. Build/strat/class mix/skill all matter far more than obtaining better gear. Obviously this is not the type of PvP you are really looking for judging by a lot of your comments. You prefer a sort of tiered gear system were you can work towards having stronger gear than other players. But that really goes against the idea of competitive gameplay. Since competitive gameplay is their intended goal, adding some tiered gear system would fly in the face of their intended goal.

 

On a side note, there is gear progression and gear disparity in WvW. So there is something to work toward for people like you there. You can build your character and grind out the gear and work for something and dominate in WvW. sPvP is meant to be a sort of arena a la WoW. Competition is king, not time spent grinding gear.

SWTOR is the greatest mmo ever!

  eAzydaman

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/21/07
Posts: 220

9/06/12 12:18:05 AM#82
Originally posted by gieger808
I see your point. No character progress gives you no other reason to log in. Once the novelty wears off, you're done. But that crowd are the ones who are in love with the pvp. It's plug and play pvp. They'll stay til something else comes out. They aren't looking for a mmorpg home, just quick fun.

No, I got a real home with wife and kids. When I play games I do it for FUN. Am pretty competetive too so tournaments is amazing for that purpose. Can't wait for spectator mode.

  User Deleted
9/06/12 12:31:27 AM#83

I also like the pvp because sometimes I want open world pvp. In the pvp zones I can gather, kill mobs, and there is pvp going on all around me.

 

In addition, I can get a lot more karma points for my character to get gear leveling up than I can just doing hearts and DEs -- seems to me that way, anyway.

  PaRoXiTiC

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/11/08
Posts: 462

9/06/12 12:46:12 AM#84

There is a gear grind if you play World vs World. I've been playing a little bit and when I run up against someone who hasn't played much PvE content I basically 1 hit them with bolas/hundred blades. Yes you get up leveled to 80, but the higher lvl you actually are the better. Your gear still goes into power, precision, vitality, ect. ect. if a level 1 comes into W orld vs World right off the bat he isn't gonna have the armor stats/weopon stats/accessorie stats that I have so clearly I have the advantage. Also skill points into power/precision/vitality ect ect. 

 

So to answer your question there is a gear grind. Now when EVERYONE who plays World vs World hits level 80 in PvE and gets all the same gear then the grind will end. But I can guarantee that will never happen. There will always be new players or people who don't play PvE.

  AI724

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/30/08
Posts: 193

9/06/12 1:04:07 AM#85
Originally posted by Sciva
Life. What's the point when you're just gunna die in the end?

lol I hear you brother!

 

So lets just relax and enjoy every moment of it.

  fivoroth

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 11/10/06
Posts: 2630

9/06/12 1:35:56 AM#86
Originally posted by Sciva
Life. What's the point when you're just gunna die in the end?

Yep, that's exactly the same as what the OP is talking about.

While GW1 didn't offer much in terms of gear progression, there was a lot to its PvP. It was supposed to be balanced and competitive. Arena-style PvP. Why you would do it? For factions to unlock skills/item upgrades/runes etc? Also GvG was about being the top guild in the world. HA gives you fame and you can get some nice drops from the HoH chest.

 

Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.

  loulaki

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/20/11
Posts: 797

9/06/12 2:54:04 AM#87
Originally posted by Hrimnir
blah/

hey did you tried WvWvW ? there you can see progression through PvP

at sPvP you just play the game like playing CounterStrike or TeamFortress ^^

  Gurpslord

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/22/09
Posts: 372

You can't be a hero hiding underneath your bed.

9/06/12 3:01:38 AM#88
Originally posted by Hrimnir
Originally posted by ShakyMo
Op:
You have been conditioned by a thing called a skinner box. Get help. That way you can do things for the fun of it rather than as a gambling like loot addiction.

I remember when someone found out about this and started posting it on game forums and all the regurgitation kiddies started passing it off as if they actually knew what they were talking about.  And FYI operant conditioning is just as big a part of instanced PVP and WvWvW as it is of a PVE progression grind treadmill as you all like to call it.

The difference here is i am aware of the carrot and the stick, i just know and accept that for me its fun and i know where my tolerance level for such things ends.  Its amazing to be that self aware instead of just accepting that something is fun and not trying to look for the bigger picture.

And im also getting sick of this "FUN" argument.  Its a load of crap.

Some kid in an eastern bloc country who doesn't have access to running water, electricity, is probably starving most of the time, etc, probably would think kicking a rock around a street is fun.  Does that mean its actually fun? No.  He just doesn't know any better.  To him its fun because he hasn't say experienced a rollercoaster or something like that.  Do you think after having gone to six flags or went snowboarding or something like that, that all of sudden he would go back to kicking a rock around a park and consider that fun?  No.  Wouldnt happen.

If you all really are doing it for the "FUN" of it, then who won the round wouldnt matter, which side took which sides castle would have no meaning.  Only that you took "A" castle. Things like glory ranks you shouldnt care one lick about.  What your armor looks like shouldnt matter, because remember its about the fun of pure skill based pvp.  Hell, why even have character models.  Just have blue and red orbs floating around in an area and you press the requested buttons for said abilities and may the most skilled person win.

Actually even on that point, if its about pure skill, then why are there more than 1 class?  Hrmm?  Are you going to sit and argue that things are perfectly balanced and that one class is not better than another?  So you don't like knowing you lost because of a gear advantage, but its ok knowing you lost because that class has an OP ability that hsnt been fixed yet and now its being abused?

Come on people.

Here's the thing pal, then please.  shush and go away cus you've lost this attempt.  If that lil' kid in some corner of the globe without power and what not is in FACT enjoying kicking that rock around, then he's having fun.  You saying that it's NOT fun, is your opinion.  In his opinion, he just had the time of his life.  Deal with it, the world doesn't have to share your opinion.  End thread pls?

  pags411

Novice Member

Joined: 4/10/12
Posts: 99

9/06/12 12:56:09 PM#89
It'll take some time but eventually people will understand the game.  No one buys Halo and then asks the Halo community what the point of the game is.
  SethDrone

Novice Member

Joined: 5/23/11
Posts: 5

9/07/12 1:40:50 PM#90
Originally posted by pags411
It'll take some time but eventually people will understand the game.  No one buys Halo and then asks the Halo community what the point of the game is.

 

Pretty much this, GW2 is a themepark game with themepark pvp, its like calling counterstrike PvP.  If you enjoy that then great, it just doesn't match the defintion of MMO pvp from the earlier games (UO, AC, etc) that had risk/reward and pvp had the potential to actually impact the game.

 

I find it fun just to mess around in and it should be entertaining for a few months, much like I enjoyed CS back in the day.  Just accept it for what it is and you'll be fine, start comparing it to a substantial pvp game and it will never match up.

  dzoni87

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/23/08
Posts: 553

9/07/12 1:50:28 PM#91
To Win the match. :)

Main MMO at the moment: Guild Wars 2
Waiting for: Pathfinder Online

  Uhwop

Elite Member

Joined: 3/20/10
Posts: 1630

9/07/12 1:59:21 PM#92

OP is under the impression that:

1) There is some defined rule that every MMO must abide by.  IE: It MUST have gear progression.

2) OP thinks that his idea of what an MMO must do is the correct way of doing things.

OP is simply wrong, and seems to have trouble looking outside the box or expanding his view to accept that just because he prefers "grinding", he uses that word an awful lot, for gear that an MMO must have that in order to be an MMO.

Even worse, OP is of the opinion that gear equals character development, because he prefers "grinding", Op really does use that word a lot, for gear. 

OP is under the impression that because his DnD sessions must have had a lot of focus on gathering stuff that that must be what an RPG is about.  I guess I always played PnP RPG's wrong, or the ones I played weren't really PnP RGP's because pretty much all of them had next to no emphasis on getting better gear.  In fact, I knew many DnD gamemasters that rarely ever allowed their players to get better gear, because they felt that it should be rare and something that you had to really earn.

Heroes unlimitted, never played that and thought I needed to improve my gear, because there was none.  Rift, sure wasn't a gear game.  TMNT, ninjas and supersspies, nightbane, palladium.  Goodness, I can go on and on with the multitude of RPG's I played, none of which had anything to do with gear. 

RPG has nothing to do with advancement, it only means that you play a character in a game.  How that game works is entirely up to the creator of the ruleset.  If the creator wants you to focus on gathering items or gaining XP then they put it into the game, otherwise they don't.

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