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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

General Discussion  » Down Leveling

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226 posts found
  Nadia

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11576

9/04/12 5:23:04 PM#121
Originally posted by Purutzil

 Biggest issue is it really kills the sense of progression to me. In GW2 I really didn't feel my character getting stronger which I think is part of the reason I wasn't so attached and got bored of the game far quicker then I usually do for most games.

you didnt think that having access to more skills, traits, elite skills at lvl 30+; gave a feeling of progression?

 

im only lvl 25 but my character has felt like its getting stronger due to unlocked skills and traits

 

even when you are scaled down, your gear/traits still outbalances the lower content

a level10  and level 80 being downscaled to 10 -- are not the same at all

  Badaboom

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/04/10
Posts: 2396

9/04/12 5:30:12 PM#122
Originally posted by laserit
Originally posted by Thillian

It kills the entire point of RPG system, i.e., improving your character and feeling the growth of your powers compared the environment and PvE. 

If the difficulty scales to your power, there is no need to have RPG system in place. 

People who like it are generally coming from the FPS games.

People who dislike it are generally coming from the RPG genre.

That's bologny

I've always hated the concept of level's, being able to one shot a troll or a dragon is just plain stupid. Stat and ability progression is much more important then some dumb arbitrary level number. The leveling system as far as I can recall, pretty much started with D&D and should have stayed there.

No doubt.  This is called evolution.  If people are going to complain about down scaling, I think they should also be complaining about node sharing, markers on map (or even having a map), world chat (actually, any chat beside the localized bubble chat), transmutable clothing, shared bank space, way points and so on and so forth.

  Badaboom

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/04/10
Posts: 2396

9/04/12 5:32:00 PM#123
Originally posted by Nadia
Originally posted by Purutzil

 Biggest issue is it really kills the sense of progression to me. In GW2 I really didn't feel my character getting stronger which I think is part of the reason I wasn't so attached and got bored of the game far quicker then I usually do for most games.

you didnt think that having access to more skills, traits, elite skills at lvl 30+; gave a feeling of progression?

 

im only lvl 25 but my character has felt like its getting stronger due to unlocked skills and traits

 

even when you are scaled down, your gear/traits still outbalances the lower content

a level10  and level 80 being downscaled to 10 -- are not the same at all

Not only that, but I bet you are also a much better player now than when you first started.

  Zuvielify

Novice Member

Joined: 12/07/11
Posts: 170

9/04/12 5:36:52 PM#124
Originally posted by SirFubar
Originally posted by loeslein

When you are down leveled and you are still having trouble with a quest you must go find better GEAR to get better STATS.

Everybody says gear doesn't matter in this game but it's actually quite important.  If you are a crappy geared lvl 10 player when you get down leveled to say lvl 5...  Well, you're still going to be a crappy geared lvl 5 player!

 

If you have trouble with a quest you just gotta grind out basically any area for some better gear and then tackle the quest again.

This is sooooooo not true. On my 43 elementalist, I'm still using the same gear that I had at my 20's and I don't have any problems whatsoever to do any quests. Sure I may die sometimes because I did a stupid move, but it wasn't because of my gear.

I think you can get by with poor gear; however, I found when I bought some gear (while the Auction house was actually working), my thief became soo much more badass. I have 50% crit (which I think is good for lvl 40) and it sure is fun making mobs explode in 3 hits.

It was also a very cheap investment. Less than 10 silver

  Maelzrael

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/15/12
Posts: 315

I like games.

9/04/12 5:39:11 PM#125

@OP

Sorry about my previous response man. Just tired of seeing nothing but anti-gw2 threads everytime i come to my favorite forums. I was out of line to say your opinion was dumb though, esp after seeing you rethink it with the aid of some other perspectives. Again i apoligize. Peace

  StanlyStanko

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/28/11
Posts: 272

9/04/12 5:40:42 PM#126
Making it optional would be nice. Something like EQ2's.
  laserit

Elite Member

Joined: 3/24/10
Posts: 1567

Confusius say: Man who go to bed with itchy bum wake up with stinky finger

9/04/12 5:44:57 PM#127
Originally posted by banshe13
[mod edit]

I played pre expansion UO and I dont recall it having any levels

"If you make an ass out of yourself, there will always be someone to ride you." - Bruce Lee

  GeezerGamer

Elite Member

Joined: 4/03/12
Posts: 4940

9/04/12 5:47:04 PM#128

It's odd. What one person sees as immersion breaking, I see as immersion enhancing. No longer does the zone I'm in mean so much relative to my own character. Immersion breaking....Watching level 85s go to Booty Bay and kill every guard in the place over and over so they can get a hat. The world doesn't get weaker as I get stronger. Well, it does, but it stays relative.

It's the sad state of the genre. The next big title has as many threads discussing issues with it's business model than issues with the game itself.

  laserit

Elite Member

Joined: 3/24/10
Posts: 1567

Confusius say: Man who go to bed with itchy bum wake up with stinky finger

9/04/12 5:49:31 PM#129
Originally posted by GeezerGamer

It's odd. What one person sees as immersion breaking, I see as immersion enhancing. No longer does the zone I'm in mean so much relative to my own character. Immersion breaking....Watching level 85s go to Booty Bay and kill every guard in the place over and over so they can get a hat. The world doesn't get weaker as I get stronger. Well, it does, but it stays relative.

I'm with ya

Some people dont want to be a hero, they want to be a god

"If you make an ass out of yourself, there will always be someone to ride you." - Bruce Lee

  L0C0Man

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/30/09
Posts: 927

9/04/12 5:50:07 PM#130

Some people say that deleveling takes away their freedom to become much stronger than the mobs and should be optional... personally I love the way it works right now and don't think it would work if it was optional at all.

I started playing WoW a bit late when most people in the server were already level 60 (or so it felt), and one of the big things I remember is the stitches event at around level 30 when at the end of a long quest chain an elite mob spawns (first one you saw in the game) and slowly makes its way to the town, while you hear everyone around talking about something big coming from the graveyard, guards running down the road and stuff like that.. Stitches would walk down the road killing guards until he eventually reached town and wrecked havok on the place... or would have if a bored level 60 hadn't been passing by on his way to another zone and one shot it before it reached town.

That's what I love about the deleveling system, and how it prevents things like that. I'm a slow player, I like to think that if I create a human character (I'm playing a silvary now) in a month or two and get to fight the shadow behemoth in the starter area, it'll still be an epic event and somewhat of a challenging fight (for its level) without a bored level 80 walking by farming crafting materials and one shooting it.

What can men do against such reckless hate?

  Adiaris

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/08
Posts: 386

9/04/12 5:56:52 PM#131
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by KhinRunite
Originally posted by Mannish
They should have done what FFXIV Reborn is doing and thats giving you the option to down level when you want to down level. Good idea but like many others poorly executed.

Not sure I agree. A person who chose not to downlevel can still trivialize content for lowbies who are not inherently playing cooperatively with him. Unless FFXIV has a system in place to prevent this, it's still a poor execution.

 

In any mmo high levels can go to the low level area if they choose and trivialize content for lower levels but they dont do it. They dont because they gain nonthing from doing it. Having the choice is just better. Everquest 2's system is similar.

Lol? "oh guldies I can't kill this nasty elite, come help me!" 

your posts are a constant source of entertainment. Is there really no game you can go play instead of inhabiting the gw2 forums, a game you clearly don't like? I say this foryou, you'd probably be happier in the long run!

  Jockan

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/03/08
Posts: 4216

Playing Elder Scrolls Online and proving haters wrong one day at a time.

9/04/12 5:58:27 PM#132
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by KhinRunite
Originally posted by Mannish
They should have done what FFXIV Reborn is doing and thats giving you the option to down level when you want to down level. Good idea but like many others poorly executed.

Not sure I agree. A person who chose not to downlevel can still trivialize content for lowbies who are not inherently playing cooperatively with him. Unless FFXIV has a system in place to prevent this, it's still a poor execution.

 

In any mmo high levels can go to the low level area if they choose and trivialize content for lower levels but they dont do it. They dont because they gain nonthing from doing it. Having the choice is just better. Everquest 2's system is similar.

 They dont? Please people have been griefing low level players since the day I started Ultima Online. To say people do not go and do it is ignoring reality. In games where it can be done it has been done. Its the reason i quit Lineage 2 the first week I started. I could not even play in the starter area without being griefed by higher level characters.

 

This system is great for me because when I want to join my brohter I am not forced to keep a character at his level. All my characters can be his level.

 

 

You are talking about an Open PVP game and thats the way they should be and always have been. Guild Wars 2 is a PVE game and like I have said over and over if you make it to were high level players gain nonthing from killing low level mobs then thats all there is to it. Is this really that hard to understand?

  Rokurgepta

Novice Member

Joined: 8/15/08
Posts: 2208

9/04/12 6:02:38 PM#133
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by KhinRunite
Originally posted by Mannish
They should have done what FFXIV Reborn is doing and thats giving you the option to down level when you want to down level. Good idea but like many others poorly executed.

Not sure I agree. A person who chose not to downlevel can still trivialize content for lowbies who are not inherently playing cooperatively with him. Unless FFXIV has a system in place to prevent this, it's still a poor execution.

 

In any mmo high levels can go to the low level area if they choose and trivialize content for lower levels but they dont do it. They dont because they gain nonthing from doing it. Having the choice is just better. Everquest 2's system is similar.

 They dont? Please people have been griefing low level players since the day I started Ultima Online. To say people do not go and do it is ignoring reality. In games where it can be done it has been done. Its the reason i quit Lineage 2 the first week I started. I could not even play in the starter area without being griefed by higher level characters.

 

This system is great for me because when I want to join my brohter I am not forced to keep a character at his level. All my characters can be his level.

 

 

You are talking about an Open PVP game and thats the way they should be and always have been. Guild Wars 2 is a PVE game and like I have said over and over if you make it to were high level players gain nonthing from killing low level mobs then thats all there is to it. Is this really that hard to understand?

 No its not hard to understand, but you think high levels would not go there if they got nothing from kills and I think you are living in a fantasy. High levels would go and ruin low levels because griefing losers are in every game.

 

Open PvP games that allow top levels in low level starter areas are stupid to me. There is nothing worse than a PVE and PVP game where you cant leave town to the low level area because high levels want to gank level 3s.

  Jockan

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/03/08
Posts: 4216

Playing Elder Scrolls Online and proving haters wrong one day at a time.

9/04/12 6:04:14 PM#134
Originally posted by Adiaris
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by KhinRunite
Originally posted by Mannish
They should have done what FFXIV Reborn is doing and thats giving you the option to down level when you want to down level. Good idea but like many others poorly executed.

Not sure I agree. A person who chose not to downlevel can still trivialize content for lowbies who are not inherently playing cooperatively with him. Unless FFXIV has a system in place to prevent this, it's still a poor execution.

 

In any mmo high levels can go to the low level area if they choose and trivialize content for lower levels but they dont do it. They dont because they gain nonthing from doing it. Having the choice is just better. Everquest 2's system is similar.

Lol? "oh guldies I can't kill this nasty elite, come help me!" 

your posts are a constant source of entertainment. Is there really no game you can go play instead of inhabiting the gw2 forums, a game you clearly don't like? I say this foryou, you'd probably be happier in the long run!

 

Another clueless poster thats on rage mode against a person that has a different opinion. I never said that down leveling was a bad idea. I said the player should choose to down level when he wants to. As for the High Level helping low level kill the elite here you go. Example: In Lineage 2 if you are fighting a boss mob and a high level player attacks it he gets a curse that turns him to stone where he can not move or attack. If a mage tries to attack he gets a curse to were he is silenced and cant do anything. This is not rocket science people.

  Drachasor

Novice Member

Joined: 3/22/09
Posts: 2693

9/04/12 6:06:10 PM#135
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by KhinRunite
Originally posted by Mannish
They should have done what FFXIV Reborn is doing and thats giving you the option to down level when you want to down level. Good idea but like many others poorly executed.

Not sure I agree. A person who chose not to downlevel can still trivialize content for lowbies who are not inherently playing cooperatively with him. Unless FFXIV has a system in place to prevent this, it's still a poor execution.

 

In any mmo high levels can go to the low level area if they choose and trivialize content for lower levels but they dont do it. They dont because they gain nonthing from doing it. Having the choice is just better. Everquest 2's system is similar.

 They dont? Please people have been griefing low level players since the day I started Ultima Online. To say people do not go and do it is ignoring reality. In games where it can be done it has been done. Its the reason i quit Lineage 2 the first week I started. I could not even play in the starter area without being griefed by higher level characters.

 

This system is great for me because when I want to join my brohter I am not forced to keep a character at his level. All my characters can be his level.

 

 

You are talking about an Open PVP game and thats the way they should be and always have been. Guild Wars 2 is a PVE game and like I have said over and over if you make it to were high level players gain nonthing from killing low level mobs then thats all there is to it. Is this really that hard to understand?

People DO go to lower level zones and kill the mobs there.  It definitely happens.  I've done it in WoW and I've seen lots of other people do it.  I mean heck, if people didn't do it, why would they complain about being deleveled?  It would NEVER significantly affect them if they weren't going to lower level zones and slaughtering the mobs.

More importantly, it would muck up the entire balance and fun of encounters for lower level players in GW2.  A DE comes along, someone one shots all the bad guys.  This would be even more likely to happen against big bosses in those zones.  They are the only ones that get credit because he did too much damage too quickly.  It would open an avenue of griefing (intentional or not) that is simply not desirable.  And even if others did manage to get credit, it still ruins the challenge which ruins fun.

It also certainly messes with immersion if you have people that can make difficulties in all lower zones trivial.

There's no reason to let high level players keep their level and then start designing methods to keep them from ever using the fact they keep their level.  What the heck is the point of that from a game design perspective?  It's shooting yourself in the foot, that's what.

  Drachasor

Novice Member

Joined: 3/22/09
Posts: 2693

9/04/12 6:07:23 PM#136
Originally posted by Mannish

Another clueless poster thats on rage mode against a person that has a different opinion. I never said that down leveling was a bad idea. I said the player should choose to down level when he wants to. As for the High Level helping low level kill the elite here you go. Example: In Lineage 2 if you are fighting a boss mob and a high level player attacks it he gets a curse that turns him to stone where he can not move or attack. If a mage tries to attack he gets a curse to were he is silenced and cant do anything. This is not rocket science people.

Why the heck even bother which such immersion-breaking "fix" mechanics that make no sense when you can avoid the whole problem?

  Rokurgepta

Novice Member

Joined: 8/15/08
Posts: 2208

9/04/12 6:07:37 PM#137
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by Adiaris
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by KhinRunite
Originally posted by Mannish
They should have done what FFXIV Reborn is doing and thats giving you the option to down level when you want to down level. Good idea but like many others poorly executed.

Not sure I agree. A person who chose not to downlevel can still trivialize content for lowbies who are not inherently playing cooperatively with him. Unless FFXIV has a system in place to prevent this, it's still a poor execution.

 

In any mmo high levels can go to the low level area if they choose and trivialize content for lower levels but they dont do it. They dont because they gain nonthing from doing it. Having the choice is just better. Everquest 2's system is similar.

Lol? "oh guldies I can't kill this nasty elite, come help me!" 

your posts are a constant source of entertainment. Is there really no game you can go play instead of inhabiting the gw2 forums, a game you clearly don't like? I say this foryou, you'd probably be happier in the long run!

 

Another clueless poster thats on rage mode against a person that has a different opinion. I never said that down leveling was a bad idea. I said the player should choose to down level when he wants to. As for the High Level helping low level kill the elite here you go. Example: In Lineage 2 if you are fighting a boss mob and a high level player attacks it he gets a curse that turns him to stone where he can not move or attack. If a mage tries to attack he gets a curse to were he is silenced and cant do anything. This is not rocket science people.

 I would rather be downleveled and still be able to play any content any time then the examples you just gave.

 

 

  Doomedfox

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/01/10
Posts: 697

9/04/12 6:08:23 PM#138
Originally posted by Adiaris
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by KhinRunite
Originally posted by Mannish
They should have done what FFXIV Reborn is doing and thats giving you the option to down level when you want to down level. Good idea but like many others poorly executed.

Not sure I agree. A person who chose not to downlevel can still trivialize content for lowbies who are not inherently playing cooperatively with him. Unless FFXIV has a system in place to prevent this, it's still a poor execution.

 

In any mmo high levels can go to the low level area if they choose and trivialize content for lower levels but they dont do it. They dont because they gain nonthing from doing it. Having the choice is just better. Everquest 2's system is similar.

Lol? "oh guldies I can't kill this nasty elite, come help me!" 

your posts are a constant source of entertainment. Is there really no game you can go play instead of inhabiting the gw2 forums, a game you clearly don't like? I say this foryou, you'd probably be happier in the long run!

So beeing able to choose how to overccome the Elite is a bad thing?

I think freedom of choice always wins over a forced playstyle. 

  Jockan

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/03/08
Posts: 4216

Playing Elder Scrolls Online and proving haters wrong one day at a time.

9/04/12 6:10:07 PM#139
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by Rokurgepta
Originally posted by Mannish
Originally posted by KhinRunite
Originally posted by Mannish
They should have done what FFXIV Reborn is doing and thats giving you the option to down level when you want to down level. Good idea but like many others poorly executed.

Not sure I agree. A person who chose not to downlevel can still trivialize content for lowbies who are not inherently playing cooperatively with him. Unless FFXIV has a system in place to prevent this, it's still a poor execution.

 

In any mmo high levels can go to the low level area if they choose and trivialize content for lower levels but they dont do it. They dont because they gain nonthing from doing it. Having the choice is just better. Everquest 2's system is similar.

 They dont? Please people have been griefing low level players since the day I started Ultima Online. To say people do not go and do it is ignoring reality. In games where it can be done it has been done. Its the reason i quit Lineage 2 the first week I started. I could not even play in the starter area without being griefed by higher level characters.

 

This system is great for me because when I want to join my brohter I am not forced to keep a character at his level. All my characters can be his level.

 

 

You are talking about an Open PVP game and thats the way they should be and always have been. Guild Wars 2 is a PVE game and like I have said over and over if you make it to were high level players gain nonthing from killing low level mobs then thats all there is to it. Is this really that hard to understand?

 No its not hard to understand, but you think high levels would not go there if they got nothing from kills and I think you are living in a fantasy. High levels would go and ruin low levels because griefing losers are in every game.

 

Open PvP games that allow top levels in low level starter areas are stupid to me. There is nothing worse than a PVE and PVP game where you cant leave town to the low level area because high levels want to gank level 3s.

 

If you think high levels going to low level areas in pvp games is stupid then dont play open pvp games. Thats not what I am talking about here. There is no mmo out there to where high level players go to low level areas and kill mobs that they dont get anything from. If they are show me a forum post from any game to where people have brought this up as being a problem.

  Celusios

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/06/10
Posts: 352

9/04/12 6:10:17 PM#140

The system isn't bad, it's just the fact its forced. Many of us enjoy outleveling an area and killing mobs there with the swing of our sword. While others find this lame and boring and as such respect this scaled leveling system. I happen to be someone who likes to outlevel a dungeon and be able to 1 man it or help a group of players (AC is overpowered as hell!!!) that need it.

 

So in short, i'd propose to ANet to make it fully optional. There is no world PVP so I do not see this being an issue besides events which would STILL benefit lower level players because its not based on who gets the last shot in.

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