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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

PvE & Crafting  » Guild Wars 2 -> Huge Grind at level 80

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173 posts found
  Drachasor

Novice Member

Joined: 3/22/09
Posts: 2693

9/04/12 2:27:11 AM#121
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

It is possible that it is overtuned.

GW1 currently isn't the same games as prophecies was at release - getting the money and materials for max armor at droks wasn't as easy as people making it out (sup rune of absorptions was 100k and such).

On the other hand most of GW1 content was after level cap (especially after factions) while most of the GW2 content is before level cap.

Additonally we are talking about players that reached the level cap in less than a week, so they haven't been doing that many dungeons and/or crafting/gathering materials (both from nodes and mobs).

Excellent point.  I think getting too stressed out over things that may or may not be problems when you get to max level a mere week after release is a bit silly.

  aesperus

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4766

9/04/12 2:28:31 AM#122
Originally posted by littleXuro

To obtain 1 mere set of all available dungeon sets, you need to run explorable mode 60+ times atleast. Assuming you want to obtain several sets to have unique looks for all your characters, you have to do a few hundred runs, all lasting 2+ hours on average.

Last time I remember, ArenaNet said you would get a reward each run to prevent this kind of grind.

Words cannot describe how dissappointed I am, waited 4 years for it and again it's just another grind if I want to build unique characters.

 

Anyone else feels the same?

Your math is a bit off.

Each run yields ~15-20 tokens. Cheapest piece is around 20 tokens. I think the rough estimate was around 18 runs to get a full set. The weapons are more expensive, though.

Furthermore, you get a guarunteed piece of armor first run through, and can randomly get more on subsequent runs.

Unless of course by '1 mere set' you mean all different types of the same set (different stats), and all available weapon types, then yes.. that would be around 40 runs, not "60+ at least".

  Drachasor

Novice Member

Joined: 3/22/09
Posts: 2693

9/04/12 2:29:41 AM#123
Originally posted by aesperus
Originally posted by littleXuro

To obtain 1 mere set of all available dungeon sets, you need to run explorable mode 60+ times atleast. Assuming you want to obtain several sets to have unique looks for all your characters, you have to do a few hundred runs, all lasting 2+ hours on average.

Last time I remember, ArenaNet said you would get a reward each run to prevent this kind of grind.

Words cannot describe how dissappointed I am, waited 4 years for it and again it's just another grind if I want to build unique characters.

 

Anyone else feels the same?

Your math is a bit off.

Each run yields ~15-20 tokens. Cheapest piece is around 20 tokens. I think the rough estimate was around 18 runs to get a full set. The weapons are more expensive, though.

Furthermore, you get a guarunteed piece of armor first run through, and can randomly get more on subsequent runs.

Unless of course by '1 mere set' you mean all different types of the same set (different stats), and all available weapon types, then yes.. that would be around 40 runs, not "60+ at least".

Thanks, I was pretty sure the OP was off, but the wiki doesn't have information on this yet and I haven't done it myself.

  aesperus

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4766

9/04/12 2:37:53 AM#124
Originally posted by Drachasor
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

It is possible that it is overtuned.

GW1 currently isn't the same games as prophecies was at release - getting the money and materials for max armor at droks wasn't as easy as people making it out (sup rune of absorptions was 100k and such).

On the other hand most of GW1 content was after level cap (especially after factions) while most of the GW2 content is before level cap.

Additonally we are talking about players that reached the level cap in less than a week, so they haven't been doing that many dungeons and/or crafting/gathering materials (both from nodes and mobs).

Excellent point.  I think getting too stressed out over things that may or may not be problems when you get to max level a mere week after release is a bit silly.

I haven't seen an overtuned dungeon yet.

The main problem is that most people just don't know what they are doing. The only runs I haven't been able to clear yet are due to someone rage quitting because they never learned how to dodge properly. Furthermore, most people are running through the games on max power/precision, or max condition damage, complaining of how easy the game is. When they get to the dungeons, they never stop to consider that maybe speccing 100% into damage isn't the way to win all fights.

For example, my necro is an even split between conditions (curses) and vitality (blood magic). I'm almost almost always the last one alive in my groups, even though I'm focused mostly on damage.

You can't tank and spank your way through the dungeons (especially on explorable mode). There's always an encounter that forces you to either switch up your traits / skills a bit, or think quickly on your feet. For example, I can't remember how many people I've seen die to sniper fire. For 9/10 of those people, it never occurs to them to try and LOS the snipers. They just complain that they do so much damage. Same deal w/ traps, or dodging, or when bosses have a really nasty skill they like to use, and I'm literally the only one in the group who bothered to bring a stun / interrupt.

I haven't seen a dungeon yet that doesn't have multiple approaches to every situation. It just takes a little bit of communication, and people being willing to switch up their setup a bit to accomodate a new tactic. If I can clear the first 3 dungeons on explorable mode with PUGs, you should be able to as well. Most of those times we didn't even have a guardian or much in the way of group heals, either.

  Scarlyng

Novice Member

Joined: 5/01/12
Posts: 160

Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. -- Mark Twain

9/04/12 2:38:39 AM#125

Game designers cannot win.

 

"I'm level 80 and there's nothing to do !"

"I'm level 80 and there's too much to do to get what I want!"

 

See the Catch 22?

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man. -- George Bernard Shaw

  aesperus

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4766

9/04/12 2:45:00 AM#126
Originally posted by Drachasor
Originally posted by aesperus

Your math is a bit off.

Each run yields ~15-20 tokens. Cheapest piece is around 20 tokens. I think the rough estimate was around 18 runs to get a full set. The weapons are more expensive, though.

Furthermore, you get a guarunteed piece of armor first run through, and can randomly get more on subsequent runs.

Unless of course by '1 mere set' you mean all different types of the same set (different stats), and all available weapon types, then yes.. that would be around 40 runs, not "60+ at least".

Thanks, I was pretty sure the OP was off, but the wiki doesn't have information on this yet and I haven't done it myself.

The wiki has some figures, but they're all wrong =/.

The amount of tokens needed has gone done since the BWEs as well. They are a lot more accessible now. It still takes a while (each run in explorable takes around 40-80 minutes (unless you have a REALLY terrible group), but I think once people know what they're doing more, or people start to have more dedicated groups, run times will probably get reduced to ~30mins

  aesperus

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4766

9/04/12 2:46:12 AM#127
Originally posted by Scarlyng

Game designers cannot win.

 

"I'm level 80 and there's nothing to do !"

"I'm level 80 and there's too much to do to get what I want!"

 

See the Catch 22?

Lol, put that next to:

"This game is way too easy, the combat is a joke!"

"These dungeons are way to hard, Anet clearly overdid it!"

  moosecatlol

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/25/10
Posts: 1176

9/04/12 2:47:46 AM#128

 

HUGE GRIND.

 

But let's be honest, most of the dungeon gear looks like shit anyways.

As for getting a full set of exotic gear, it would take me less than 5 hours with the market place up, and about 24 hours with the market place down. A soldier profession requires about 314 Orichalcum Ore, 72 Gossamer scraps, 25 Orbs, 65 Ectos, and 35-50 (Lv400) Trophies.

As far as dungeons are concerned, you really should'nt be taking more than an hour on them, even 30 minute runs are easily possible. Assuming that you have the dungeon on farm status.

I often times wonder if people honestly know what it means to work towards something, rather than it being handed to them on a silver platter.

Now I'm not saying that the dungeon gear is appropriate in the sense of time spent vs reward, as most of the dungeons not only have extremely bad loot tables, but also tend to be extremely boring with very few exceptions. But to complain that the skins you want are not immediately available is silly. Especially knowing that you have more than likely spent more time in WoW doing the exact same shit. In a sense, this is absolutely your fault for creating an air of success for such a boring gear acquisition method.

Personally I wish the means of which a player obtained rare skins was more skill based rather than farm based, but I supposed that would go against the casual aspect of the game. After all, Guild Wars was hardly known for its PvE, this game is no different.

  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16745

9/04/12 2:51:43 AM#129
Originally posted by Scarlyng

Game designers cannot win.

"I'm level 80 and there's nothing to do !"

"I'm level 80 and there's too much to do to get what I want!"

See the Catch 22?

Nah, the real catch 22 is from Wow.

You wont be invited to raids unless you have raid gear.

  IrishChai

Elite Member

Joined: 1/31/11
Posts: 529

9/04/12 2:54:18 AM#130
Originally posted by Scarlyng

Game designers cannot win.

 

"I'm level 80 and there's nothing to do !"

"I'm level 80 and there's too much to do to get what I want!"

 

See the Catch 22?

 

Yeah, my point exactly, just in a TL;DR version compared to my post. :) I love to hear that GW2 has hundreds of hours worth of play to get armor sets because it's better than being left with nothing when the story content is over. There's really only those two choices. You either get a 'game over' screen, or content specifically engineered to be endless progression possibilities. I'm glad Anet chose the latter. If they made it easy endgame progression than people would only beat it so quickly that there is no 'endgame' to speak of, and it's no different from a game over screen. Just goes to show there will always be complainers.

  RizelStar

Novice Member

Joined: 8/12/11
Posts: 2823

We all breathe and we all die.

9/04/12 2:58:57 AM#131
Originally posted by Weretigar

I don't understand you want to look super amazing with many different tyles and variety, but you dont want to work for any of it? Running dungeons 60+ times might get repetative but I ran dungeons on Swtor like 200 times on the same one just to farm rep for my companions. 

This is the price you pay for fashion and looking amazing in video games, and it always has been. anyone remember the Doppleganger card drop rate 00.01% it meant you could kill him over 1,000 times and never get his card which was the best card in the gme for agi fighters.

Also the dungeon gear stats only go up so high so the only real reason you would want thema ll is for braging rights, since you can only wear one at a time. You'll apreciate it more if you have to work for it. You already made to lvl lvl 80 so I know you have the time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95SYdjRVCR0

I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.

I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.

P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)

Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.

  loulaki

Novice Member

Joined: 12/20/11
Posts: 810

9/04/12 3:31:13 AM#132
Originally posted by littleXuro

To obtain 1 mere set of all available dungeon sets, you need to run explorable mode 60+ times atleast. Assuming you want to obtain several sets to have unique looks for all your characters, you have to do a few hundred runs, all lasting 2+ hours on average.

Last time I remember, ArenaNet said you would get a reward each run to prevent this kind of grind.

Words cannot describe how dissappointed I am, waited 4 years for it and again it's just another grind if I want to build unique characters.

 

Anyone else feels the same?

those are just visuals what you expected ??? there must be content and for grinders ...

  Drachasor

Novice Member

Joined: 3/22/09
Posts: 2693

9/04/12 4:29:10 AM#133
Originally posted by Scarlyng

Game designers cannot win.

 

"I'm level 80 and there's nothing to do !"

"I'm level 80 and there's too much to do to get what I want!"

 

See the Catch 22?

Saying you don't want a grind to get things is different than saying you don't want things to do.  Being able to do a lot of different things rather than the same few over and over and over is important.  So there is a legitimate point to the concerns.

  IrishChai

Elite Member

Joined: 1/31/11
Posts: 529

9/04/12 5:12:12 AM#134
Originally posted by Drachasor
Originally posted by Scarlyng

Game designers cannot win.

 

"I'm level 80 and there's nothing to do !"

"I'm level 80 and there's too much to do to get what I want!"

 

See the Catch 22?

Saying you don't want a grind to get things is different than saying you don't want things to do.  Being able to do a lot of different things rather than the same few over and over and over is important.  So there is a legitimate point to the concerns.

 

There are a ton of different things to do in GW2, more than I have seen in any MMO in a long time. Are you implying GW2 doesn't have enough different things to do, or just speaking in general terms of all games? Still sounds like some people expecting way too much from the devs to me.

  Macecard

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/03/10
Posts: 146

9/04/12 5:24:04 AM#135
Originally posted by Weretigar

I don't understand you want to look super amazing with many different tyles and variety, but you dont want to work for any of it? Running dungeons 60+ times might get repetative but I ran dungeons on Swtor like 200 times on the same one just to farm rep for my companions. 

This is the price you pay for fashion and looking amazing in video games, and it always has been. anyone remember the Doppleganger card drop rate 00.01% it meant you could kill him over 1,000 times and never get his card which was the best card in the gme for agi fighters.

Also the dungeon gear stats only go up so high so the only real reason you would want thema ll is for braging rights, since you can only wear one at a time. You'll apreciate it more if you have to work for it. You already made to lvl lvl 80 so I know you have the time.

This; Don't go saying your job and home and family needs your time so you can't waste 120 hours getting these sets when you have clearly skipped a hella lot of content and ground you way up to 80 in less than 2 weeks after launch. Anyone lvl 80 before the end of September can't complaing about anything because your not palying the game the way Arenanet made the game to be played.

And don't go saying "I can play it however I want" because of course you can, doesn't mean that the designers made it for you to pay it that way and have fun. I can go play a world pvp mmo and try to gank ppl in the high level zones at level 1 if I want to. Will I have fun? Will it be difficult? Will I comaplain to the designers for not allowing me to play their game in a rediculous way successfully?

If you continue to make sweeping statements like you know what everyone everywhere thinks about a certain topic then I am going to shout at you.
It easy to type 'I think this is the worst game ever'
Rather than the 'This is the worst game ever'

  fenistil

Novice Member

Joined: 9/22/11
Posts: 3016

9/04/12 5:36:58 AM#136
Originally posted by Scarlyng

Game designers cannot win.

 

"I'm level 80 and there's nothing to do !"

"I'm level 80 and there's too much to do to get what I want!"

 

See the Catch 22?

If designers want to do game 'for everyone'.  Then nope - they cannot win. Never.

Since diffrent people judge things diffrently and some design decisions will be liked or even loved by some players groups / niches and disliked or hated by other player groups / niches.

 

Only way for designers to 'win' is to make niche game with certain solutions and show middle finger to people outside those niche. (ofc some niches are preety damn big and some not).

 

================

 

More stricly on-topic.

Yeah GW2 have grind.

Every single mmorpg will have one.

If there will be single mmorpg without grind - that have everything attainatble FAST - then 80% + players will leave fast and game will die.

 

LoL @ people who wrote endless posts and topics about how GW2 will have no grind.

  Raekon

Novice Member

Joined: 3/05/04
Posts: 552

9/04/12 5:52:54 AM#137
Originally posted by Drachasor
Originally posted by Scarlyng

Game designers cannot win.

 

"I'm level 80 and there's nothing to do !"

"I'm level 80 and there's too much to do to get what I want!"

 

See the Catch 22?

Saying you don't want a grind to get things is different than saying you don't want things to do.  Being able to do a lot of different things rather than the same few over and over and over is important.  So there is a legitimate point to the concerns.

- exact same dungeon in wow for 700+ hours to get a set together because of the dice system, only to be competitive because of the stats.

- 3 different routes in a dungeon that rewards you coins for certain for a gear you don't need to be competitive because of it's stats but rather want for its looks

Hmm.... I think I would take the later at any day because:

-  I can at least run the dungeon through  3 different paths that need a different approach making it more diverse and fun.

- the garanty that I will definately get coins I can use to get my set together instead of hoping that "lady luck" will smile upon me so that my dice roll is better than the one from my teammates so I can actually get a part of the gear I need is there

-  no matter if I get this gear in GW2 or not, I can still be good in spvp and WvsWvsW as also in PvE.

The icing on the cake?

- No one would care if I have this certain set or not if I wanna join a group or a team or guild activity and they will bid me welcome to join the fun

- "NO, you need this type of gear" before they kick me out of the group while I'm forced to spend half of my life before I can join them is not an option

So what is concerning about it?

As about those that say "not enough materials, karma, coins":

I'm around level 37,5 have random gear on me that I'm using for the buffs and stats it has at the moment that I got through drops in the dungeon and outside of it.

Everything I do in the game rewards me with XP, influence for my guild and depending on the activity with Karma and Coins, while I can gain materials through gathering, salvage items and by salvaging old gear that is not worth selling or I don't care selling(mostly white gear and partially blue one too).

So all one needs to do is indeed play the game and gather stuff while doing it. 

  someforumguy

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/07
Posts: 3498

9/04/12 5:59:33 AM#138
Originally posted by loulaki
Originally posted by littleXuro

To obtain 1 mere set of all available dungeon sets, you need to run explorable mode 60+ times atleast. Assuming you want to obtain several sets to have unique looks for all your characters, you have to do a few hundred runs, all lasting 2+ hours on average.

Last time I remember, ArenaNet said you would get a reward each run to prevent this kind of grind.

Words cannot describe how dissappointed I am, waited 4 years for it and again it's just another grind if I want to build unique characters.

 

Anyone else feels the same?

those are just visuals what you expected ??? there must be content and for grinders ...

This is a very persistant myth. Exotic armour has the best stats, its not just visuals.

Anyway, Arenenet's manifesto down the drain. They turned endgear stat grind in some silly treadmill.

  Zzad

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/14/11
Posts: 1294

9/04/12 6:03:29 AM#139

OP forgot to say the grind is OPTIONAL.

You don´t need to grind for your gear in order to be competitive.

Anet just threw in the optional grind for those who are willing to invest time on those rares armors.

  grapevine

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/17/04
Posts: 1940

9/04/12 6:07:02 AM#140
Originally posted by Zzad

OP forgot to say the grind is OPTIONAL.

You don´t need to grind for your gear in order to be competitive.

Anet just threw in the optional grind for those who are willing to invest time on those rares armors.

 

Thats not entirely true.  Gear still gives an advantage, so it is in one's interest to grind for them.

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