I've been trying to play TSW for the past week but the game is frustration in a bottle. If you don't have the right build for the right situation, good luck progressing.

I play games for fun and TSW isn't much fun. Great storyline and decent graphics but the combat and progression mechanics are damn right irritating. I think Funcom just threw a few hundred skills together for the status and wished everyone good luck as there is no balancing been done.

I can't wait to get back into GW2 again and have some fun again. Just give me my Charr character back and a greatsword to bash some skulls in in WvW :)

And to the OP. Yes GW2 will be very successful.

Originally posted by Reliique

Originally posted by The_Korrigan

Originally posted by Reliique

Kids can go play themeparks, let us oldies have fun in own sandbox.. From atari to sega from 286 to Pentium, from Pentium to 3DFX Voodoo, I still can't freaking figure out WHY THERE IS ONLY ONE GAME that made sandbox reality happend (EVE) ? 

Errr sorry, but you forget a few games, notably Ultima Online, the first mainstream MMORPG, still running today, and which is a sandbox...

Yes, I've mentioned it, but its oldschool. Eve is only one from 2000- 

Sorry didnt express myself well enough.. There was also Meridian 59 if you remember that :)

Ive should have said something like "from end of 90 there is still no true sandbox games, at least "alive" " 

I didn't play famous Star Wars Galaxies, but Ive heard it was really really great?

I think you'd be surprised if you found out the actual population spread of MMOs. Whether a game has an older or younger playerbase has almost nothing to do with whether or not it's a sandbox.

Shadowbane, & Darkfall show this rather well. As does Archeage (though it's still in beta). The reason why Eve has an older playerbase is not because it's a sandbox. It's because it's basically spreadsheet-online. And most kids just (not to mention adults) just have a really hard time getting excited for that.

Originally posted by Branko2307

Its AAA B2P MMO made by ArenaNet anyone thinking its not going to be extremely successful is fooling themselfs...

Yes, because posting this type of comment is not fooling oneself either.

Honestly, this topic is somewhat laughable. Just like the OP made fair points in his own right, i can come up with a huge amount of reasons why GW2 will be another flavor of the month mmo with huge drops over the following months and be pilled up with the rest of the "failed" mmorpg, which they aren't of course, just not "extremely sucefull".

Originally posted by Reliique

Originally posted by The_Korrigan

Originally posted by Reliique

Kids can go play themeparks, let us oldies have fun in own sandbox.. From atari to sega from 286 to Pentium, from Pentium to 3DFX Voodoo, I still can't freaking figure out WHY THERE IS ONLY ONE GAME that made sandbox reality happend (EVE) ? 

Errr sorry, but you forget a few games, notably Ultima Online, the first mainstream MMORPG, still running today, and which is a sandbox...

Yes, I've mentioned it, but its oldschool. Eve is only one from 2000- 

Sorry didnt express myself well enough.. There was also Meridian 59 if you remember that :)

Ive should have said something like "from end of 90 there is still no true sandbox games, at least "alive" " 

I didn't play famous Star Wars Galaxies, but Ive heard it was really really great?

SWG wasn't bad yeah, had a pretty bad buggy launch but became a good sandbox game before Sony ruined it by changing everything.

Originally posted by Syno23

I've done some research on this game for the past few years and wasn't planning on buying it until a few days ago. And I'm doing it because I know truly in my heart that this game is going to be successful.

Remember the days when Blizzard created those AWESOME games. Those games that weren't for the money, but was to please gamers throughout the world. Well that Blizzard is gone, and ArenaNet; the company behind Guild Wars 2 is the most successful studio that came outta Blizzard.

No contest here.

So there's one: AreanaNet a studio formed from a very successful company; Blizzard

Number 2: The Guild Wars franchise as a whole as already sold more than 7 million copies. So let's do the math. Let's say that the game sold 1 million copies and raised 50 million dollars from those 1 million copies. Now, the game went on to sell more than 6 million copies TOTAL. So 1 million + 6 million is 7 million. So 6 million copies worth of revenue is 300 million dollars. In subscriber numbers that's 300 million divided by 15 dollars divided by 7 years. That's an average of 2 MILLION subscribers per year! 

And yes, I know box sales and expansions. So let's even say, 1.5 million subs. That's a successful MMO.

(Guild Wars sales source: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/NCsoft )

EDIT: Between 2009 and 2012 the series did sell another million copies.

Not sure about your math here. You could get all 3 for $15 if you wanted at some point in time. It's surely not pure income.

Number 3: It doesn't compete with all the other MMOs out there. With each MMO that comes out that costs 15 dollars a month. Most people can only afford 2 MMOs at once per month. And others only pay for one. So if you play WoW you won't be playing other MMOs. But if you play other MMOs you won't be playing...you get the point.

Guild Wars 2 doesn't have to compete with that. Meaning that if it can WIN in the F2P market then it's already the WoW of F2P. Not that this game is going to be anything like WoW. Already the difference in revenue models is a good difference.

Maybe the king of B2P, it's not Free To Play at all. It will surely draw in people from P2P games that can chose to remain subbed if they want to. It will also draw from the F2P crowd, and I think heavily. Pay2Win cashshops can become a pain and with a AAA MMO it's really a no-brainer.

Number 4: The Guild Wars franchise is already a well known name. Why was Star Wars: The Old Republic so popular from the get go? Because Star Wars was well known. BioWare was well known. And together they created an EXTREMELY hyped game. Hopefully Guild Wars 2 does the same thing and it will instantly becaome successful.

The Guild Wars IP is nowhere near as well known as the Star Wars one. Star Wars is everywhere, Guild Wars is less known than WoW.

Number 5: The bad economy. Most of us including me just don't have jobs. So we can't afford a 15 dollar a month subscriber fee. And if we can we'll only afford to play one game. So with Guild Wars 2. Those who can come up with the 60 dollars will be able to play a game that won't cost them anything FOREVER! Well until the servers shutdown. In a bad economy, saving isn't such a bad thing.

Not sure if bad economy isn't going to drive more from P2P to F2P than to B2P. If the $15 a month are really a problem you may be better off doing something else ith your time than gaming.

Originally posted by JoeyMMO

Originally posted by Syno23

Number 2: The Guild Wars franchise as a whole as already sold more than 7 million copies. So let's do the math. Let's say that the game sold 1 million copies and raised 50 million dollars from those 1 million copies. Now, the game went on to sell more than 6 million copies TOTAL. So 1 million + 6 million is 7 million. So 6 million copies worth of revenue is 300 million dollars. In subscriber numbers that's 300 million divided by 15 dollars divided by 7 years. That's an average of 2 MILLION subscribers per year! 

And yes, I know box sales and expansions. So let's even say, 1.5 million subs. That's a successful MMO.

(Guild Wars sales source: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/NCsoft )

EDIT: Between 2009 and 2012 the series did sell another million copies.

Not sure about your math here. You could get all 3 for $15 if you wanted at some point in time. It's surely not pure income.

Just a heads up Joey, but GW1 also has a cashshop. Yes, you could get all 3 games now for ~15$ if you wanted, but that's been more than balanced by people buying costumes, custom skins, and mission packs from the cash shop. One of the reasons why Anet has been able to develope GW2 so smoothly, is because most of their development money came out of the revenue they generated from GW1. They funded most of the production themselves, and NCSoft made up the rest.

Originally posted by aesperus

Originally posted by JoeyMMO

Originally posted by Syno23

Number 2: The Guild Wars franchise as a whole as already sold more than 7 million copies. So let's do the math. Let's say that the game sold 1 million copies and raised 50 million dollars from those 1 million copies. Now, the game went on to sell more than 6 million copies TOTAL. So 1 million + 6 million is 7 million. So 6 million copies worth of revenue is 300 million dollars. In subscriber numbers that's 300 million divided by 15 dollars divided by 7 years. That's an average of 2 MILLION subscribers per year! 

And yes, I know box sales and expansions. So let's even say, 1.5 million subs. That's a successful MMO.

(Guild Wars sales source: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/NCsoft )

EDIT: Between 2009 and 2012 the series did sell another million copies.

Not sure about your math here. You could get all 3 for $15 if you wanted at some point in time. It's surely not pure income.

Just a heads up Joey, but GW1 also has a cashshop. Yes, you could get all 3 games now for ~15$ if you wanted, but that's been more than balanced by people buying costumes, custom skins, and mission packs from the cash shop. One of the reasons why Anet has been able to develope GW2 so smoothly, is because most of their development money came out of the revenue they generated from GW1. They funded most of the production themselves, and NCSoft made up the rest.

Yet so many people on these forums dismiss GW1 fans because "GW2 is not for them". But they were the ones who actually helped ArenaNet get GW2 out? Definitely not the guys who bought all 4 games for $10 just to try the HoM and give up 2 minutes later.

GW2 is bland, and whimsical at best. but if it floats your boat, right on.

Originally posted by Maitrader

GW2 is bland, and whimsical at best. but if it floats your boat, right on.

I wouldn't call bland the best questing in an MMO to date

Actually I remember two of the 3 blizzard employees have left the company on good terms. 

Originally posted by Maitrader

GW2 is bland, and whimsical at best. but if it floats your boat, right on.

Why do you think that GW2 is bland?

Originally posted by seridan

Originally posted by Maitrader

GW2 is bland, and whimsical at best. but if it floats your boat, right on.

I wouldn't call bland the best questing in an MMO to date

GW2 will be a big success i don't think anyone could doubt that it caters to the masses that enjoy MMOs nowadays and does not have a monthly sub so i don't see a reason why it would not be a big success.

The game is easy enough to not frustrate the masses and the few who would welcome a challenge have the big pvp part to go wild.

It also seems as if everyone is willing to just forgive or ignore anything that is not too good about the game like the Questing

For some reasons ppl like Seridan really believe it is the best questing i for one found the quests horrible the Heart quests hub areas (and it is nothing but a quest hub) had some of the most boring and repetitive quests i ever had to play in an MMO i mean seriously how often can you have a quest where you feed an animal or click on a trap or just gather items and bring them to a npc that certainly is not the best questing in an MMO to date even less so since there is not even a good story to motivate you to do this repetitive tasks.

That so many are willing to not only forgive this bad quests hubs but go as far as praise it the best ever only further shows that the game will be a big hit i for one am looking forward for some pvp from time to time i don't think there is any MMO out right now that can offer a similar pvp experience but the bad graphic quality (not art style thats beautiful tho) and the slow feeling of combat will stop me from using it anymore than as a game ill pick up from time to time.

But thats ok since there are no monthly subs so its perfect for that and will be able to entertain me for as long till one of the better game manages to deliver a similar pvp experience and that could take some time lol.

Originally posted by Doomedfox

For some reasons ppl like Seridan really believe it is the best questing i for one found the quests horrible the Heart quests hub areas (and it is nothing but a quest hub) had some of the most boring and repetitive quests i ever had to play in an MMO i mean seriously how often can you have a quest where you feed an animal or click on a trap or just gather items and bring them to a npc that certainly is not the best questing in an MMO to date even less so since there is not even a good story to motivate you to do this repetitive tasks.

First you can avoid doing anything you find boring unlike all the other MMOs you can choose how you fill the hearts and secondly the Dynamic Events are far superior to anything seen in an MMO, at least it's a cooperative, multiplayer experience not some silly single player quest where everybody does their own thing, disregarding all other people around them. That's what being in an "alive" world means and that's why the questing in Guild Wars 2 is better than the crap we see in other MMOs

I hope it does, for everyone's sake.

But I have no faith left in any developer after seeing the amount of blatant, horrible, ineptitude most are cranking their products out with.

The other failures' many cries of "It'll be great!" and "It'll be fixed at release, the game is just in beta!" have left me jaded.

Originally posted by aesperus

*snip*

Just a heads up Joey, but GW1 also has a cashshop. Yes, you could get all 3 games now for ~15$ if you wanted, but that's been more than balanced by people buying costumes, custom skins, and mission packs from the cash shop. One of the reasons why Anet has been able to develope GW2 so smoothly, is because most of their development money came out of the revenue they generated from GW1. They funded most of the production themselves, and NCSoft made up the rest.

 Of course, and I'm not claiming GW isn't/wasn't a success. But between that basic financial and reality, I'm sure quite a few other numbers come into play as well. I'm glad it's working out for ArenaNet and I'm sure GW2 will be a smash hit. I can't imagine not buying it, if BWE3 is what I'm thinking it will be.

A AAA MMORPG, B2P, non-P2W cash shop, no gear threadmill and emphasis on having fun without the need to slow down the players or bore people to pieces simply because there's no need to leave the players craving simply to get the players to fork over that next sub.

Just had to correct a line: "Remember the days when Blizzard COPY and POLISHED all these AWESOME games they introduced as their own?." :p

Other than that you have some valid points but you forget some of the main points of them:

- GW1 and GW2 had/have great lore behind them

- GW2 has a very alive world in it

- No more hand holding from the beginning  to the end of the game might put some people off that are too used to have only linear mmos but for that it will draw all the people that are fed up of the same linear approach over and over in other games in it.

Many more reasons to post but I'll leave it on that since most of us already know them. :)

Originally posted by seridan

Originally posted by Doomedfox

For some reasons ppl like Seridan really believe it is the best questing i for one found the quests horrible the Heart quests hub areas (and it is nothing but a quest hub) had some of the most boring and repetitive quests i ever had to play in an MMO i mean seriously how often can you have a quest where you feed an animal or click on a trap or just gather items and bring them to a npc that certainly is not the best questing in an MMO to date even less so since there is not even a good story to motivate you to do this repetitive tasks.

First you can avoid doing anything you find boring unlike all the other MMOs you can choose how you fill the hearts and secondly the Dynamic Events are far superior to anything seen in an MMO, at least it's a cooperative, multiplayer experience not some silly single player quest where everybody does their own thing, disregarding all other people around them. That's what being in an "alive" world means and that's why the questing in Guild Wars 2 is better than the crap we see in other MMOs

Oh you mean like Rift and the Invasions where everyone was joining public pts and really felt like they were fighting together where ppls talked to each other to get the tanks healers CC and so on set up that kind of multilayer experience?

Yeah thats great and i love it just zerging without communication like in GW2 (at least thats how it went down so far) is not that great.

Also i do not understand how the fact that i can ignore the boring quests hubs make them being good?

The DE are somewhat fun and if you have them pop up while you feed cows its a nice change but all they are (most of them it seems at least) is a few troops attacking or 1 bigger mob attacking and the players just zerg them down.

I am sure you could say now again that i could just ignore them and only do the better DE (and i know there are a few more interesting one) but what is left if i have to ignore most of the quests and DE just because they are not that good....i just have a hard time labeling something as the best if there is so much that is just terrible the fact that i can ignore these quests and only do the better ones do not matter at all.

Btw i think you did not play too many MMOs if you really believe that GW2 is the only one which allows you to choose how to lvl as a matter of fact you can always choose in MMOs how to lvl up (most of them anyway FF11 would be hard to lvl without grinding in pts) do quests or pvp just grind or maybe even lvl just by crafting you always had choices they may not have been the best ways but you always were able to pick.

I do not try to say GW2 is a bad game i can see how its so appealing for the masses and i honestly wish it to become a huge success but i will not just blindly praise everything about it just because. Thats not happening, if you truly believe that GW2 quests are awesome than thats cool like i pointed out in my earlier post that is part of why the game will become a huge success. But for me it is how it is if you go down to the core the quests are some of the most boring ever.

That is of course only my opinion and i do not try to tell you i am right or wrong..... of course i do believe i am right tho lol 

Originally posted by Doomedfox

Originally posted by seridan

Originally posted by Maitrader

GW2 is bland, and whimsical at best. but if it floats your boat, right on.

I wouldn't call bland the best questing in an MMO to date

 

GW2 will be a big success i don't think anyone could doubt that it caters to the masses that enjoy MMOs nowadays and does not have a monthly sub so i don't see a reason why it would not be a big success.

The game is easy enough to not frustrate the masses and the few who would welcome a challenge have the big pvp part to go wild.

It also seems as if everyone is willing to just forgive or ignore anything that is not too good about the game like the Questing

For some reasons ppl like Seridan really believe it is the best questing i for one found the quests horrible the Heart quests hub areas (and it is nothing but a quest hub) had some of the most boring and repetitive quests i ever had to play in an MMO i mean seriously how often can you have a quest where you feed an animal or click on a trap or just gather items and bring them to a npc that certainly is not the best questing in an MMO to date even less so since there is not even a good story to motivate you to do this repetitive tasks.

That so many are willing to not only forgive this bad quests hubs but go as far as praise it the best ever only further shows that the game will be a big hit i for one am looking forward for some pvp from time to time i don't think there is any MMO out right now that can offer a similar pvp experience but the bad graphic quality (not art style thats beautiful tho) and the slow feeling of combat will stop me from using it anymore than as a game ill pick up from time to time.

But thats ok since there are no monthly subs so its perfect for that and will be able to entertain me for as long till one of the better game manages to deliver a similar pvp experience and that could take some time lol.

Actually you can:

- do anything you want after the tutorial (no linear hand holding)

- the heart quests are repeatable quests you can do if you want to do them

- you can level up alone by exploring the areas, finding interesting points or hidden areas

- you can immediately jump into the WvsWvsW pvp as a level 2 after the tutorial and only level up there till 80

- you can just participate in dynamic events and enjoy the details and aftermaths of them that many unfortunately overlooking by leaving too early, missing follow ups or just nice details like the NPC going to the town and talking about your heroic battles (or similar)

Crafting, World Events, Skill Quests, mindless mob hunting if you choose to do so for yourself and many other things you can do without being forced to but rather by your own choice.

Would It matter if it was a universal success? if you have fun and enjoy the game then that would qualify as it being a hit with you. people still play games that people have declared a failure and they still enjoy them.