Originally posted by Greyhooff

Originally posted by mrgrimrpr

Originally posted by Greyhooff

Originally posted by mrgrimrpr

Originally posted by Greyhooff

Originally posted by mrgrimrpr

So, do you two want to join my GW2 clan? its gonna be soooooo boss

Given your inability to understand basic game mechanics, I doubt it would be "soo boss" as you describe it.

As for lifetime subscriptions, yeah, those are purely reserved for people who lack a grasp of economics.

 

Given the fact that you have to explain these "basic game mechanics" over multiple pages, to many people who are not as dumb as you think, perhaps you'd like to explain what type of progression you would create to avoid a level/skill/whateveryouwanttocallit type MMO. Please?

As I said before, so far levelling has been integral to the MMO genre, as it is in TSW - and it's really not my job to come up with something different, nor did I state I would.

As for having to explain basic game mechanics to people who are in fact dumber than they think, well, that's self-explanatory.

You are making the case that there is something wrong with the progression. Please make me understand, boss?

Wait, what? All I was saying is that TSW has levels. I never made the case that there is something wrong with level-based progression.

Are you just making stuff up now?

As your boss, I find that very unprofessional.

You're fired.

If you want to call it a yellow brick road of progression, you can. Nobody's stopping you, so... whats the issue?

Originally posted by Greyhooff

Originally posted by Sameer1979

Originally posted by Greyhooff

Originally posted by Sameer1979

Originally posted by Greyhooff

Originally posted by mrgrimrpr

So, do you two want to join my GW2 clan? its gonna be soooooo boss

Given your inability to understand basic game mechanics, I doubt it would be "soo boss" as you describe it.

As for lifetime subscriptions, yeah, those are purely reserved for people who lack a grasp of economics.

I tend to play games for a year and more with a month or two breaks in between. I would rather pay 200 bucks for lifetime and play it for 2 years than paying 15 bucks a month for those 2 years and beyond.

I mean i have been paying sub for EQ 2 for 6 years now..jeeez.

So i think you need to step down from your high horse because i don't think one needs a grasp of economics to make logical decisions like this one.

 

So you've played EQ2 every month for the last 6 years? How many months in a year have you played EQ2?

Think it through. It takes 2 clicks to deactivate and reactivate a payment method.

Let's say I'm subscribing to a dog kennel for when I'm on holiday. Do I pay them all year round, when I have my dog at home? No, I just pay them for the time when I'm on holiday and I have to put my dog in the kennel.

And let's not get into the economics of opportunity cost and deferred payments, in slang terms, why a dollar today is worth more than a dollar in a year (discounting inflation and exchange rate based changes).

Also, in 2012, the whole MMO industry is going F2P. Hell, Funcom was one of the first major players going F2P with AOC.

How you think lifetime subs, especially to a Funcom game, are a good idea when the whole industry is going F2P is baffling.

Yes EQ2 is the only MMO which i have sub running for 6 years. EVE second which i paid regularly for 3 years. Why is it so surprising? people have been running subs for WOW for years now. it is all about finding that one MMO which sticks.

And after playing CB for TSW for 3 months i know it is going to be another long run for me like EQ2.

It has only bene recently with games like Rift and SWTOR that i started taking 2 to 3 months break because it couldn't hold my attention.

I don't think lifetime subs are good idea just for FUNCOM but it is a good idea for just any MMO.

Granted buying STO was an impulse decision but do i regret it? nope. I can hop in any day i like and play while my guildies have to pay a monthly sub to get access to full content.

All MMOS that offer lifetime subs even if go F2P still offer same benefits to lifetime subscribers. That is why i regret not buying a lifetime sub for games like LOTRO which are rich in content and can be played for years.

I have also played multiple MMOs for years. But usually not 4 at the same time.

What I do is I deactivate the ones I'm not playing, and activate the ones I am playing.

I'm not saying I need to save the money as they are quite cheap, but it takes under a minute to do so, so why would I throw away money into a product I'm not using to save 1 minute of time a month?

Is 1 minute of your time worth more than 10 bucks? I would get that if you were a billionaire but even billionaires don't have to be wasteful.

I never said i played 4 MMOS at the same time.

2..yes, because it is still dirt cheap compared to other expenses for entertainment. But i already canceeld my sub to EQ2 last month and i am going to put all free time into playing TSW.

What you don't understand is that value of lifetime sub differes from person to person that is why i disagree with 'lack of grasp on economic' comment.

Originally posted by mrgrimrpr

If you want to call it a yellow brick road of progression, you can. Nobody's stopping you, so... whats the issue?

Erm.... have you read the thread title?

Originally posted by aesperus

Originally posted by Sameer1979

Yes EQ2 is the only MMO which i have sub running for 6 years. EVE second which i paid regularly for 3 years. Why is it so surprising? people have been running subs for WOW for years now. it is all about finding that one MMO which sticks.

And after playing CB for TSW for 3 months i know it is going to be another long run for me like EQ2.

It has only bene recently with games like Rift and SWTOR that i started taking 2 to 3 months break because it couldn't hold my attention.

I don't think lifetime subs are good idea just for FUNCOM but it is a good idea for just any MMO.

Granted buying STO was an impulse decision but do i regret it? nope. I can hop in any day i like and play while my guildies have to pay a monthly sub to get access to full content.

All MMOS that offer lifetime subs even if go F2P still offer same benefits to lifetime subscribers. That is why i regret not buying a lifetime sub for games like LOTRO which are rich in content and can be played for years.

You may want to double check your math there, bud. EQ2 launched November of 2004.

Just out of curiosity, what part of TSW do you think is going to hold you that TOR failed to? Those games have alot in common when you break them down. I enjoyed TSW, but 1/4th of the game's content was able to be completed in a weekend. I'm not sure the other 3/4s will be able to hold up for 6 years.. Unless they add some really beefy expansions (as in, big enough to be completely new games).

I am sorry why do i need to check my math? i didn' even start playing EQ till 2007 and EVE i started playing in 2009.

What is common in TSW and TOR may i ask? story based quests and cutscenes? what else is similar? 

The unlocking of all skills on one character alone will keep me busy for a very very long time.

I doubt you were able to complete 3/4 of contant of TSW just on weekend. I have been running on caffine for two days now and i am decked in QL 10 stuff from Fate Merchant and even i couldn't do that.

Can you exaggerate some more?

Originally posted by aesperus

Originally posted by mrgrimrpr

If you want to call it a yellow brick road of progression, you can. Nobody's stopping you, so... whats the issue?

Erm.... have you read the thread title?

Yeah, and my answer is that levels is a relative term for any kind of player progression. The word "Levels" is not part of the game, yet in fact does has levels, because if it didn't there would be no progression.

Is there a number next to your character that says "Level=x"

Nope, therefore, there aren't any levels. Period. This can't can't be discussed because there isn't one. Deal with it. Now, are there hidden levels and restrictions? Yes, there are. How close are they to you enough to call them levels is a matter of personall opinion.

To me, the game does have hidden levels, but most "level-less" games tend to anyway, so it's no big deal. To me, a proper level-less game would not have restriction in terms of both pve or pvp content and i could take on most of said content right from the start, which, as i said, is really rare even in "level-less" games.

Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

Is there a number next to your character that says "Level=x"

Nope, therefore, there aren't any levels. Period. This can't can't be discussed because there isn't one. Deal with it. 

Except that there is.

It's called QLx, where x is your level number in TSW.

It's actually funny how ironically wrong your post is.

Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

Is there a number next to your character that says "Level=x"

Nope, therefore, there aren't any levels. Period. This can't can't be discussed because there isn't one. Deal with it. Now, are there hidden levels and restrictions? Yes, there are. How close are they to you enough to call them levels is a matter of personall opinion.

To me, the game does have hidden levels, but most "level-less" games tend to anyway, so it's no big deal. To me, a proper level-less game would not have restriction in terms of both pve or pvp content and i could take on most of said content right from the start, which, as i said, is really rare even in "level-less" games.

You realise how completely contradictory your statement is. So because they are hidden it means they don't exist. If you put an elephant in front of a blind man. The blind man can deny the elephants existance all he wants, but it is still there.

Originally posted by Greyhooff

Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

Is there a number next to your character that says "Level=x"

Nope, therefore, there aren't any levels. Period. This can't can't be discussed because there isn't one. Deal with it. 

 

Except that there is.

It's called QLx, where x is your level number in TSW.

It's actually funny how ironically wrong your post is.

Not really. A pure level like the one i stated, carries character statas and it's permanet, even when all gear is removed. It's the indicator to your power.

In TSW, there's no character statas. If i remove all my gear, i'm level 0. Also, what happens if i use QL10 weapons and QL5 talismans? What level am i? 10 or 5 or in between?

My example is simply an indication that there is no hard value equal no level games. Call it progressions, hidden levels, ranks, whatever you want. They're there, yes, but they're not a pure simple value or number.

Also, i can distort words too. Imagine a game with only level 1, but over 1000 different skills that are also level 1. Each time you get a skill, you get a level. So, max level is 1000, despite every skill being on the same plane.

EDIT: Wait. Why am i responding to a troll. I know you don't like the game, which is cool. You have the right to enjoy and not enjoy what you want. But posting negative comments over and over and over again is trolling, because it shows you clearly don't want to discuss anything. Being criticalof games, like many have been, is fine, since TSW is far from perfect, but you haven't. Soooooooooo... yeah

Originally posted by Connmacart

Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

Is there a number next to your character that says "Level=x"

Nope, therefore, there aren't any levels. Period. This can't can't be discussed because there isn't one. Deal with it. Now, are there hidden levels and restrictions? Yes, there are. How close are they to you enough to call them levels is a matter of personall opinion.

To me, the game does have hidden levels, but most "level-less" games tend to anyway, so it's no big deal. To me, a proper level-less game would not have restriction in terms of both pve or pvp content and i could take on most of said content right from the start, which, as i said, is really rare even in "level-less" games.

You realise how completely contradictory your statement is. So because they are hidden it means they don't exist. If you put an elephant in front of a blind man. The blind man can deny the elephants existance all he wants, but it is still there.

UO had levels disguised as skill points. LMFAO

Rotary argument is rotary. TSW has levels, congrats. Levels=Advancement.

Originally posted by blognorg

Originally posted by stranger911

Originally posted by blognorg

From what I can tell, you still need to kill monsters for exp to fill a bar. And when that bar fills, you get a skill point. That kind of sounds like leveling to me... except it doesn't keep track of the number. Is that actually how it works, or am I missing something?

 

 

 

Explained in other threads.  Do some research on the game.

This IS my research. I got an answer much more quickly than if I had actually put effort into it. Thank you for sublly answering my question and promoting my apathy. Win/win for me. And in return, I will leave you with some knowledge. You don't need to double-space after a sentence; in fact, it's actually incorrect to do so. If you want to be pretentious, you only need one space. I know, I know... it doesn't stand out in the way you like, but you can take solace in knowing that it's the right way. Perhaps you should think about performing some research as well.

 

 Also, that looks more like a llama. 

You're wrong on all counts.  Good job.

Maybe the "N" key doesn't work on some peoples keyboards.

You have to press "N" to see this.

Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

Originally posted by Greyhooff

Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

Is there a number next to your character that says "Level=x"

Nope, therefore, there aren't any levels. Period. This can't can't be discussed because there isn't one. Deal with it. 

 

Except that there is.

It's called QLx, where x is your level number in TSW.

It's actually funny how ironically wrong your post is.

Not really. A pure level like the one i stated, carries character statas and it's permanet, even when all gear is removed. It's the indicator to your power.

In TSW, there's no character statas. If i remove all my gear, i'm level 0. Also, what happens if i use QL10 weapons and QL5 talismans? What level am i? 10 or 5 or in between?

My example is simply an indication that there is no hard value equal no level games. Call it progressions, hidden levels, ranks, whatever you want. They're there, yes, but they're not a pure simple value or number.

Also, i can distort words too. Imagine a game with only level 1, but over 1000 different skills that are also level 1. Each time you get a skill, you get a level. So, max level is 1000, despite every skill being on the same plane.

What kind of bizarro-world logic is this? Levels can only be a non-imaginary positive integer applied to your naked character? Who invented that rule? If you're naked in TSW you have 0 stats so you're level 0? What? Mixing talismans makes you a decimal fraction of a level? Eh?

Your post is utter nonsense. If levels are hidden they don't exist? What? If you change levels from 1-2-3-4 to A-B-C-D, they are no longer levels? Eh?

There are levels in TSW. They aren't even hidden.

Seriously, what are you on about.

Originally posted by mrgrimrpr

Originally posted by Connmacart

Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

Is there a number next to your character that says "Level=x"

Nope, therefore, there aren't any levels. Period. This can't can't be discussed because there isn't one. Deal with it. Now, are there hidden levels and restrictions? Yes, there are. How close are they to you enough to call them levels is a matter of personall opinion.

To me, the game does have hidden levels, but most "level-less" games tend to anyway, so it's no big deal. To me, a proper level-less game would not have restriction in terms of both pve or pvp content and i could take on most of said content right from the start, which, as i said, is really rare even in "level-less" games.

You realise how completely contradictory your statement is. So because they are hidden it means they don't exist. If you put an elephant in front of a blind man. The blind man can deny the elephants existance all he wants, but it is still there.

UO had levels disguised as skill points. LMFAO

Rotary argument is rotary. TSW has levels, congrats. Levels=Advancement.

Oh dear you can't come up with a decent argument so you resort to ridicule. This thread is dedicated to the fact that TSW does have levels. You being the blind man from my analogy doesn't change that fact. So please keep denying it all you want.

Levels does equal advancement, though advancement does not always equal levels. Had TSW truly been levelless it would have allowed people to go anywhere they wanted to from the start.

Originally posted by mrgrimrpr

Originally posted by aesperus

Originally posted by mrgrimrpr

If you want to call it a yellow brick road of progression, you can. Nobody's stopping you, so... whats the issue?

Erm.... have you read the thread title?

Yeah, and my answer is that levels is a relative term for any kind of player progression. The word "Levels" is not part of the game, yet in fact does has levels, because if it didn't there would be no progression.

Interesting..

You do know that 'levels' is actually a mechanic right? A very specific mechanic used to regulate progression. While there are pleanty of variations on the mechanic, I don't see what is 'relative' about it. It would be like saying a game has skill points is a relative term. It's an objective, mathematical system.

And actually 'levels' are part of the game. You have gear quality level, you also have levels for each of the weapon & talisman types. Not to mention faction rank, which is another form of lvling. The mechanic is there, period. So it's called a 'rank' instead of a level. Does this mean that WAR isn't lvl based either?

Btw, there are other types of progression aside from lvls. Levels aren't necessary for progression, but they are familiar, so most people still prefer them. GW1 is mainly a lvl-less form of progression, as is Eve. These games also have a lvl system in place as well, as do most online games, even if it's not the primary mechanic determining progression. Again, it's a familiar system, so most people prefer to have it in there. Zelda would be a good example of an RPG w/ out any lvl progression, but it's not an MMO =/.

Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

Not really. A pure level like the one i stated, carries character statas and it's permanet, even when all gear is removed. It's the indicator to your power.

In TSW, there's no character statas. If i remove all my gear, i'm level 0. Also, what happens if i use QL10 weapons and QL5 talismans? What level am i? 10 or 5 or in between?

My example is simply an indication that there is no hard value equal no level games. Call it progressions, hidden levels, ranks, whatever you want. They're there, yes, but they're not a pure simple value or number.

Also, i can distort words too. Imagine a game with only level 1, but over 1000 different skills that are also level 1. Each time you get a skill, you get a level. So, max level is 1000, despite every skill being on the same plane.

EDIT: Wait. Why am i responding to a troll. I know you don't like the game, which is cool. You have the right to enjoy and not enjoy what you want. But posting negative comments over and over and over again is trolling, because it shows you clearly don't want to discuss anything. Being criticalof games, like many have been, is fine, since TSW is far from perfect, but you haven't. Soooooooooo... yeah

Increasing your skill points will increase some character stats.  I guess you didn't mouse over what spending those skill points actually gives.

I believe it's Head Talismans gives a boost to physical protection, Major Talismans increase hit rating, and Minor Talismans increases magic protection. I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong here.

The weapon skills increase damage and either healing or survivability depending on the weapon.

So a naked character with QL10 skills will have higher amounts in these stats than a QL0 player.

That is levelling.

Now admitidly there are only 10 levels in skills so you max these out pretty quickly and half the game you are at max level.

Eh, call it what you want, but if I don't have to choose a set class or see "level up!" on my screen, I could care less.

I'm tired and drunk, so I apoligise for the incoherantness. But, I honestly think this is closest to a skillbased progression system in a themepark i've seen. Gotta give Funcom props for doing something different after the many WoW clones.

Originally posted by DanitaKusor

Originally posted by FredomSekerZ

 

Increasing your skill points will increase some character stats.  I guess you didn't mouse over what spending those skill points actually gives.

I believe it's Head Talismans gives a boost to physical protection, Major Talismans increase hit rating, and Minor Talismans increases magic protection. I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong here.

The weapon skills increase damage and either healing or survivability depending on the weapon.

So a naked character with QL10 skills will have higher amounts in these stats than a QL0 player.

That is levelling.

Now admitidly there are only 10 levels in skills so you max these out pretty quickly and half the game you are at max level.

The stat bonuses from skilling up a weapon is really minimal. It was implemented to give players an ''extra good feeling'' when skilling up, it has minimum effect on your character.

It really depends on how you define levels.

If you mean levels is progressing through the game doing harder content to an extent, then yes the game has levels.

If you mean levels as in a measurement on how strong your character is, then no it doesn't have levels.

By the definition on wikipedia the game has levels, as it was originally used in older games, but when many people talk about levels today in a mmorpg that's not exactly what they mean.

Also Greyhoof calling names really makes you look immature.

I really dont understand waht the issue is here..

As i said every rpg needs character progression thats part of what an rpg is about..

TSW does not have levels as such, your chacter does not start off at lvl 1 and then move up.. you have skill points to spend in different things.. its just a different way of progressing your character..

Darkfall also does it different.. each time you use a weapon to hit somthing i slowly lvls up that skill... its character progression..

Levels are character progression as well..

So yes at the end of the day TSW has character progression amazing.. this thread can be closed now..

After seeing all the crap posted about TSW on these forums I finally felt I had to say something. I've been in the closed beta since january and I think I should have an idea how this game works.

No, you don't have "levels" in the same sense, but that doesn't mean that there's no progression. So is progression the same thing as levels? Not really. In a reagular game a class (like the decks in this game) means that if you get all the skills/abilities for that class you've maxed out your character. That is not the case in The Secret World! If you max out one deck, you can still get your butt kicked by other players with other abilities, so then you would need to adapt to that, and unlock OTHER abilities. Imagine an advanced game of rock/paper/scissors and you get the idea.

If this game was Diablo 2, you would be able to instantly mix and match all skills from all the classes whenever you wanted, as long as you have unlocked them. You could be a Barbarian and equip a couple of summons spells from Necromancer and the Fireball from Sorceress at the same time. As long as you have unlocked them of course. And to unlock them you have to use skillpoints and abilitypoints which you get from gaining exp.