Originally posted by Randallt3mp

Originally posted by Sameer1979

Originally posted by heartless

Originally posted by cutthecrap

@heartless: Shrug. I think you haven't really grasped a number of TSW features yet, I mean I could make the same kinda statement of GW2 being not really different and being a standard themepark at its core if you want to put it that extreme, because it does have (character based) levels, classes, armor based stats, a huge number of the same generic quests only delivered a bit differently, typically lame themepark crafting, a whole lot of instancing and so on and so on.

Of course there are similarities if you want to find them with other themepark MMO's, for GW2 as well as TSW. But each also has its own distinctions, more than other themepark MMO's have that are far, far closer to the standard.

 

I could only rehash what I've already said, that classless, levelless, a lot of mission types, Minecraft inspired crafting, statless clothes, skill synergies etc etc aren't seen like that in other themepark MMO's of which most are WoW based. But I've already said that, so if you refuse to acknowledge that, well, to each their own, I wish you luck and fun with GW2, no biggie

The fact is that the game is not really classless(decks) and it's not really levelless (Quality Levels). The missions, despite their types are the same kill, click, deliver and the investigation missions, albeit great, can be counted on one hand. This is a themepark game, through and through. It has a very facinating lore and setting but otherwise it's not that much different than any other WoW clone out there.

Also, let's stay on topic with TSW and not bring in other games. Whether or not GW2 is a themepark is absolutely irrelevent to TSW.

No it is very relevant because if you can make comparisons so can others. But hey atleast Funcom didn't design TSW for mass consumption or with an aim to beat WOW, i doubt same can be said for GW2.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/johngaudiosi/2012/04/23/arenanet-founder-mike-obrien-will-be-satisfied-when-guild-wars-2-is-the-most-successful-mmo-period/

“We’re in it to win it this time,” said O’Brien. “We were number two to World of Warcraft with Guild Wars, now we want to beat them. We’ll be satisfied when the Guild Wars 2 is the most successful MMO.

 

Really? That old quote? cmon....that was obviously said to grab attention.  It doesnt mean he wants GW2 to be a better wow, he means he wants it to be a better MMO and still appeal to alot of people.

The Secret World and GW2 are both steps in the right direction for MMO's as far as I'm concerned.  You may be able to technically classify them as themeparks, but they still have alot more openness and player choice than many recent mmos.

I never said he wants to make GW2 a better WOW but beat WOW in sales and numbers which can be only done if you aim for mass consumption. Those are the words right out of the mouth of head honcho. I will take his word over yours anyday ;)

Originally posted by Xstatic912

This game better not need a lot big sub number to stay open, becuase if it fails or go FTP, i think i know why..  It's a bit too different for the masses (masses meaning a large sub-base), that's why i'm hoping they ddon't need a large sub base to stay open, like SWTOR needs..

See i for one love it, as it makes you think and research real world incidents (investigate missions)... But so far in the beta weekends i see diversion forming... When persons ask for help almost everyone says use the in-game browser and look it up..  

Now, i don't mind doing a bit or searching etc, but question is looking up stuff FUN (subjective non the less) enough, or just cool that its implemented in the game.. Seems these dev's want to implement thinking puzzles but can't think of a FUN way to do it..  Also, seems like most in the game need a tutorial on the crafting system..

Lets here the thoughs of person who have played for a good amount of time...  THX!!

I have to say, I am enjoying the quests quite a bit in this game (when they work). The investigative nature is definitely refreshing, and having them require a bit of thought is a nice touch.

However, I wouldn't say that this alone is what's creating a fracture in the community. While some of the quests are quite clever, the game overall is actually pretty simple, once you get down to it. And here is where (i think) the problem lies:

The game's design seems to contradict itself. There are some really cool mechanics in TSW, but many of them seem at odds with one another. Going on the questing example you talk about, they design the quests to give you hints, but rarely tell you exactly what needs to be done (the main quests, not the kill / collect quests). Which is great, except they also add an ingame browser to allow people to look things up and basically 'cheat' ingame. They then make it a bannable offense to answer questions about what to do in quests in general chat.

Most of the quests seem like they were designed around a single-player game, then shoved into a multiplayer world & expected to behave the same way. It just doesn't. Add in the fact that a lot of quests are still bugged / broken, and it almost forces people to ask for the answers if they get stuck. In a lot of cases it's just too hard to tell whether or not something is intentional, a glitch, or whether you are doing it wrong.

For example, I took a quest to find some security cameras around town and collect them. I went over to the gas station and couldn't find the first camera at first. I then looked up. Finding out how to get over to it, I then tried clicking on it to collect it. Nothing happened. I asked around, to see if I was doing something wrong and the general response was something along the lines of 'check the roof dumbass', assuming that I wasn't just up there clicking on the thing. Turns out the quest was glitched. I went back later, and was able to complete it. Still not sure as to why it wouldn't work the first time.

A second quest had me trying to learn about a woman who had burned down in a house. I had to uncover a number of different things, and for the most part it seemed fairly straight forward. However, at the end of the quest I was supposed to find one last item, and I just couldn't find it. I looked at the clue, didn't seem to help much. Finally, I gave up and asked in general chat. Surprise surprise, I was in the right spot, the quest was just bugged.

- Now, I know it's beta, and these things are to be expected. I really do hope they iron out all of these issues, as it adds too much uncertaintly to the mystery of the game. I know I don't like to spend a lot of time figuring out a quest, only to learn that I had wasted my time trying to do the impossible (complete a broken / bugged quest).

As for the game needing a lot of subs to survive.. I would think not. The majority of this game's content really does play out like a single player game. It's also gear based, so most of the earlier quests u can go back & faceroll once you get better gear. I have no idea how many of the zones this will stay true with, though. The only content that really seemed to demand a healthy population for are dungeons & pvp. We'll have to wait till the last BWE to see how the PvP is, but based on the combat so far, I'm guessing that the dungeons will be drawing more of the attention of players. As long as they don't fracture the game into too many shards, I think it will have enough people to get through the content for the first few months.

Originally posted by Kenze

Originally posted by Aeolron

Originally posted by Xstatic912

 

 

 

This game better not need a lot big sub number to stay open, becuase if it fails or go FTP, i think i know why..  It's a bit too different for the masses (masses meaning a large sub-base), that's why i'm hoping they ddon't need a large sub base to stay open, like SWTOR needs..

See i for one love it, as it makes you think and research real world incidents (investigate missions)... But so far in the beta weekends i see diversion forming... When persons ask for help almost everyone says use the in-game browser and look it up..  

Now, i don't mind doing a bit or searching etc, but question is looking up stuff FUN (subjective non the less) enough, or just cool that its implemented in the game.. Seems these dev's want to implement thinking puzzles but can't think of a FUN way to do it..  Also, seems like most in the game need a tutorial on the crafting system..

 

Lets here the thoughs of person who have played for a good amount of time...  THX!!

 

 

All I gotta say is, " Thank you " Because you ead my mind :P

Very well said, I couldn't have said it any better! I agree with your points but there is ONE thing I find weird, maybe you guys can help me out here, it's a technical issue really.

I have a desktop with a 8150 chip, 12 gigs of ram a gtx580 super overclocked 3 gigs Vram, windows 7 64, and every driver is updated, now, when I run the secret world on direct x11 the game crashes and I get a video driver crash because of the client ( this has never happened to me before ) now here's the real kicker, my laptop is a MSI GT70 ONC 16 gigs of ram,GTX670m dedicated video card windows 7 64 core i7 3rd gen, so I go to start TSW on my laptop and I am greeted by a messgae stating that my video card driver is out of date, I realize this because nvidia hasn't made any updates for my laptop card yet , so I proceed to play the game on ultra and what do you know LOL The game runs flawlessly on ultra and I was getting average of 38-60 FPS weird? I think maybe that they didn't optimize the game client to accomodate the newer more powerful desktop video cards that exceed 1024mb, my question is this ,

have you guys had this similar issue?

sorry to ramble but I really wanna play TSW on my desktop when it launches :P

under options, try turning Tessellation off

LOL I did!

still nothing,I even lowered some of my graphics, still nothing.

I can run BF3 Ultra res to 1924-1080 and that game runs great at 60-70 FPS np, I'm sure its a issue with their client not recognizing higher end video cards that have more then 1024 MB then inturn causes a crash, heck I even lowered my settings to medium then low LOL!

The game's design seems to contradict itself. There are some really cool mechanics in TSW, but many of them seem at odds with one another. Going on the questing example you talk about, they design the quests to give you hints, but rarely tell you exactly what needs to be done (the main quests, not the kill / collect quests). Which is great, except they also add an ingame browser to allow people to look things up and basically 'cheat' ingame. They then make it a bannable offense to answer questions about what to do in quests in general chat.

Most of the quests seem like they were designed around a single-player game, then shoved into a multiplayer world & expected to behave the same way. It just doesn't. Add in the fact that a lot of quests are still bugged / broken, and it almost forces people to ask for the answers if they get stuck. In a lot of cases it's just too hard to tell whether or not something is intentional, a glitch, or whether you are doing it wrong.

For example, I took a quest to find some security cameras around town and collect them. I went over to the gas station and couldn't find the first camera at first. I then looked up. Finding out how to get over to it, I then tried clicking on it to collect it. Nothing happened. I asked around, to see if I was doing something wrong and the general response was something along the lines of 'check the roof dumbass', assuming that I wasn't just up there clicking on the thing. Turns out the quest was glitched. I went back later, and was able to complete it. Still not sure as to why it wouldn't work the first time.

A second quest had me trying to learn about a woman who had burned down in a house. I had to uncover a number of different things, and for the most part it seemed fairly straight forward. However, at the end of the quest I was supposed to find one last item, and I just couldn't find it. I looked at the clue, didn't seem to help much. Finally, I gave up and asked in general chat. Surprise surprise, I was in the right spot, the quest was just bugged.

- Now, I know it's beta, and these things are to be expected. I really do hope they iron out all of these issues, as it adds too much uncertaintly to the mystery of the game. I know I don't like to spend a lot of time figuring out a quest, only to learn that I had wasted my time trying to do the impossible (complete a broken / bugged quest).

As for the game needing a lot of subs to survive.. I would think not. The majority of this game's content really does play out like a single player game. It's also gear based, so most of the earlier quests u can go back & faceroll once you get better gear. I have no idea how many of the zones this will stay true with, though. The only content that really seemed to demand a healthy population for are dungeons & pvp. We'll have to wait till the last BWE to see how the PvP is, but based on the combat so far, I'm guessing that the dungeons will be drawing more of the attention of players. As long as they don't fracture the game into too many shards, I think it will have enough people to get through the content for the first few months.

The single player feel of the game is a nice aspect in that, a majority of people end up playing MMO's by themselves anyways until there is a need/reason to group with other people.  So technically, why shouldn't a game go off of a strong point of feeling like you are immersed into the story as an individual without having to rely on other people to do all the thinking and work for you.  It also supports the MMO style where you can play with friends, new or old or even just random people on the same quest with you.  You can discuss the hints together, or what needs to be done etc. 

If the game has you stumped, Good! that just means you are a normal human being capable of making decisions and are doing fine.  People everywhere are complaining so much about the quests being too hard or in depth.  I for one commend it and it is probably the most interesting fact about this game, and the fact that I can do it with others and friends all alike.

I literally spent an hour doing the investigation mission from Madem Roget, she gives you the visions of stuff she's hearing as a psychic, and tries to lead you to the spots on the map where she speaks of.  I couldn't have been happier and well rewarded after finishing the quest, even after spending an hour doing it.  It was the best hour spent in any game I've played thus far.

Along the lines of you claiming the quests just being bugged or glitchy.  In retrospect, I haven't come across 1 quest that was bugged, and I completed every single Kingsmouth quest possible.  The camera that you needed to collect on the roof... not bugged, you were most likely just out of grabbing range of it, which it tells you in the chat box, "you are out of range to do that".

In regards to your closing paragraph, let me ask you.  What game isn't gear based?  Every MMO I've ever played revolved around gear, stats and skills that you obtain through questing and the like to progress.  Of course you'll be able to go back and easily kill stuff that you should have already had to do in the first place to get ahead to begin with.  I don't see how you can see this as a problem because it is in every game.

Originally posted by Agrias34

The single player feel of the game is a nice aspect in that, a majority of people end up playing MMO's by themselves anyways until there is a need/reason to group with other people.  So technically, why shouldn't a game go off of a strong point of feeling like you are immersed into the story as an individual without having to rely on other people to do all the thinking and work for you.  It also supports the MMO style where you can play with friends, new or old or even just random people on the same quest with you.  You can discuss the hints together, or what needs to be done etc. 

Didn't say the single player feel was a bad thing. Only that a lot of the features seemed designed for single player play, and then crammed into the MMO format. And that I don't think is a good thing. While the post-apocalyptic setting does very much cater to solo play, I think some of the features could've been designed for more of a social setting inmind, or they should've made it a single-player game with multiplayer features.

If the game has you stumped, Good! that just means you are a normal human being capable of making decisions and are doing fine.  People everywhere are complaining so much about the quests being too hard or in depth.  I for one commend it and it is probably the most interesting fact about this game, and the fact that I can do it with others and friends all alike.

 I do like that some of the quests are challenging. Some are quite clever, and do require some thought (ie. some of the quests require you to investigate parts of them while dead). However, in order for this to work properly, the quests basically have to be flawless. I don't like constantly having to wonder if a quest is completable, or if i'm doing it wrong. I want to know that if I can't complete a quest, it's because of my own error and not the game's.

I literally spent an hour doing the investigation mission from Madem Roget, she gives you the visions of stuff she's hearing as a psychic, and tries to lead you to the spots on the map where she speaks of.  I couldn't have been happier and well rewarded after finishing the quest, even after spending an hour doing it.  It was the best hour spent in any game I've played thus far.

 Aye, that was a good one. Just wait until you get further into the game. This passed BWE I got up through the 2nd island. There's some pretty cool quests that dwarf the ravens one (some in that very same island). My favorite quest from the starter island would probably be the one you have to investigate partiall when dead. I believe it's the chain which has you investigating a series of murders involving a bunch of dead girls.

Along the lines of you claiming the quests just being bugged or glitchy.  In retrospect, I haven't come across 1 quest that was bugged, and I completed every single Kingsmouth quest possible.  The camera that you needed to collect on the roof... not bugged, you were most likely just out of grabbing range of it, which it tells you in the chat box, "you are out of range to do that".

Aye, I had at least 6 people telling me the same thing. However, I was literally standing right on top of the camera. Again, dunno what the problem was. I got the little gear icon to interact with it. I clicked on it.  I got a progress bar. Nothing happened. There's a few quests like this that I've come across. The Black House on the Savage Coast is also a fairly buggy one. I know I wasn't alone in this, because I saw a lot of people asking about whether or not various quests were bugged, or if they were doing it wrong. A lot of these quests did turn out to be bugged, and were stated as much by the some of the beta veterans.

In regards to your closing paragraph, let me ask you.  What game isn't gear based?  Every MMO I've ever played revolved around gear, stats and skills that you obtain through questing and the like to progress.  Of course you'll be able to go back and easily kill stuff that you should have already had to do in the first place to get ahead to begin with.  I don't see how you can see this as a problem because it is in every game.

Well, to be honest that is the majority, but I'd much rather get away from that. First off, let me just clarify by stating, when I mean 'gear based' I don't mean that the gear contributes to your overall strength, but rather that the game is dictated by it. Believe it or not, there are games out there that aren't gear based. I know this will probably make you cringe, but GW1 & 2 are both non-gear based. I mean this in the sense that gear makes the least amount of different when compared to your skills, and stat distribution. Another one would be APB, which also seems to rely more on what playstyle you pick, over having the best gear. I could hold my own on missions in that game with having just the starter rifle if I wanted to. Spellborn was another one, though that game didn't get a lot of popularity. Planetside 1 & 2 are also good examples.

Basically, the reason you don't see many MMOs that aren't gear-based, is because it requires non-conventional combat. TSW seems to be trying to do that a bit, but they don't quite take it far enough. The anima system is really nice, but I've never once felt like I had the 'wrong build' for a situation. It was always a case of either being undergeared, or overgeared. I really wish the skill builds in this game made more of an impact on how difficult the content was. In solo play, the hardest decision I had to make was going between a single target heavy, or a build with some AoE. Most of the time it didn't really seem to matter. When it came to dungeons, things always fell into a tank - damage - healer setup, whether we had an official 'tank' or not. 

maybe I missed something but following a little tag that floated around omn my screen giving me the distance to the quest objective did not seem really different. But then I only messed with it for a few hours, game was just not "fun" in my opinion

Originally posted by Jackdog

maybe I missed something but following a little tag that floated around omn my screen giving me the distance to the quest objective did not seem really different. But then I only messed with it for a few hours, game was just not "fun" in my opinion

Ya.. sounds like you didn't really make it far enough to see the real strengths of this game. The majority of the quests are your standard 'kill X, collect Y'. However, the game also has quite a few investigation quests, and these are quite fun (if you enjoy quests that require you to figure things out in order to progress). These play a lot more like scavenger hunts (think Da Vinci code,  but with zombies, demons, & ghosts), and are very rewarding to pull off (both literally, and figuratively).

The downside is, there aren't enough of those types of quests to completely avoid the standard 'kill x / collect y' quests, unless you don't play very often, and don't mind repeating a lot of quests. Most of the quests require you to kill something at some point, and if you aren't doing a majority of the quests in the area, you will just not have good enough gear to handle that.

Ok on what server did someone get banned for answering a question about a quest?  I played on all of them for a fair amount of time and never got any warning or heard of anyone getting banned for helping people with quests.  Hell half the chat was people not using their noggins and wanting the easy answer.   So much so that people started to chat about spoilers to books, movies and other games because of being annoyed by these people.  Pretty much ruined "The Sixth Sense" for anyone that hasn't seen it yet.

If you think the answers to the puzzle quests won't be up on a wiki a week after launch you're stuck in 2001 or something.

Originally posted by GamerUntouch

If you think the answers to the puzzle quests won't be up on a wiki a week after launch you're stuck in 2001 or something.

And that's different from spaming chat how? Guides, they're everywhere.

Originally posted by heartless

I have to be honest here. I see this "the game is too different" being thrown around in TSW's defense but it really is not. It's your standard themepark MMO with a bit more choice as far as skill trees go and a tiny number of investigation quests that may require you to use your brain. Even then the investigation quests are not required to advance the story and can be ignored completely. They don't even give an decent rewards to warrant the waste of time. And if you absolutely must do every single quest, you can always google the solution--the browser is built into the client.

The game is not different, only the setting is. Which, by the way, is TSW's only saving grace. The setting and the stories are interesting. Everything else is sub par at best.

Edit: also, the game is absolutely not finished and will not be finished in 2 weeks left before release. This is another game with great potential that is going to get Funcomed and go F2P with an invasive cash shop in a year or so.

 I pretty much agree with your assessment although I had fun with the game. So while I don't think it is unique like some throw around I do think it is still entertaining.

Problem I have is what you wrote at the end. The game doesn't feel finished. I'm real curious to see what condition Egypt and Transylvania are in.

Originally posted by aesperus

Originally posted by Jackdog

maybe I missed something but following a little tag that floated around omn my screen giving me the distance to the quest objective did not seem really different. But then I only messed with it for a few hours, game was just not "fun" in my opinion

Ya.. sounds like you didn't really make it far enough to see the real strengths of this game. The majority of the quests are your standard 'kill X, collect Y'. However, the game also has quite a few investigation quests, and these are quite fun (if you enjoy quests that require you to figure things out in order to progress). These play a lot more like scavenger hunts (think Da Vinci code,  but with zombies, demons, & ghosts), and are very rewarding to pull off (both literally, and figuratively).

The downside is, there aren't enough of those types of quests to completely avoid the standard 'kill x / collect y' quests, unless you don't play very often, and don't mind repeating a lot of quests. Most of the quests require you to kill something at some point, and if you aren't doing a majority of the quests in the area, you will just not have good enough gear to handle that.

probably . I played through most of the Kinstree quests. I really tried to like the game becasue I love the games world setting and ability wheel. But I simply could not take the combat and animations, both were sub par in my opinion. Lets face it, combat and animations are "in your face" 100 percent of the time and if they don't feel right nothing else really matters.

Good luck to those that enjoy the game though and kudos to FC for doing something other than just another fantasy game with a skill tree.

I finished the entire Kingsmouth zone and I found the "puzzles" to not require much thought or research ingame. I'm guessing that the puzzles are harder later on?

I like the skill wheel, but I think people are going to grief others for not choosing the "best" like in Tera.

The crafting is good enough. I've already conceded to the fact that no game is ever going to have a crafting system close enough to SWG.

I really don't care about the storyline in any game. I do like zombies though.

If the pvp is great, then I might give this game a buy. Otherwise, I'll wait for the F2P model.

I'll feel really bad if I "give" Funcom my money and the game turns out to be 20% complete like AOC was at launch.

Originally posted by Touc

I finished the entire Kingsmouth zone and I found the "puzzles" to not require much thought or research ingame. I'm guessing that the puzzles are harder later on?

I like the skill wheel, but I think people are going to grief others for not choosing the "best" like in Tera.

The crafting is good enough. I've already conceded to the fact that no game is ever going to have a crafting system close enough to SWG.

I really don't care about the storyline in any game. I do like zombies though.

If the pvp is great, then I might give this game a buy. Otherwise, I'll wait for the F2P model.

I'll feel really bad if I "give" Funcom my money and the game turns out to be 20% complete like AOC was at launch.

I can say that most of the latter areas are even more polished than Kingsmouth

Originally posted by Jackdog

maybe I missed something but following a little tag that floated around omn my screen giving me the distance to the quest objective did not seem really different. But then I only messed with it for a few hours, game was just not "fun" in my opinion

You've never had anything good to say about a FunCom game, biased opinions are just that, and as such as completely invalid.

Originally posted by rpgalon

I can say that most of the latter areas are even more polished than Kingsmouth

 I find that very hard to believe considering The Savage Coast isn't even as polished as Kingsmouth.

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

Originally posted by rpgalon

I can say that most of the latter areas are even more polished than Kingsmouth

 I find that very hard to believe considering The Savage Coast isn't as polished as Kingsmouth.

What did you find less polished? (You have to look away from the fact of the missing investigation missions - they were removed on purpose).

Originally posted by Blackbrrd

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

Originally posted by rpgalon

I can say that most of the latter areas are even more polished than Kingsmouth

 I find that very hard to believe considering The Savage Coast isn't as polished as Kingsmouth.

What did you find less polished? (You have to look away from the fact of the missing investigation missions - they were removed on purpose).

 Jack's Back - Killed all of the wisps several times. No Jack

Black House - Ashes were apparently taken by Tango to whatever dimension he runs around in

Hellriftwhatever - Can't remember the name of this one but it is the one where you use the detector to find the rifts. Kept turning off on me for some annoying reason

I didn't even make it very far into this zone and found three bugged or problematic quests. Don't get me wrong. Not trashing the game. I enjoyed myself, but I don't get the sense this game is necessarily ready for launch.

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

Originally posted by rpgalon

I can say that most of the latter areas are even more polished than Kingsmouth

 I find that very hard to believe considering The Savage Coast isn't even as polished as Kingsmouth.

Your are joking right, SC was very very smooth, questing was a blast there. From reading your post seems like you did not know how to finish the quests.

Jack does spawn, Tango never even entered my quest for black house just go behind it to the GY and sort it out and never had that issue with Hellraiser.

Originally posted by Saxonblade

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

Originally posted by rpgalon

I can say that most of the latter areas are even more polished than Kingsmouth

 I find that very hard to believe considering The Savage Coast isn't even as polished as Kingsmouth.

Your are joking right, SC was very very smooth, questing was a blast there. From reading your post seems like you did not know how to finish the quests.

 No

They were bugged. As they were for several people. Next time try to come with a more unique childish retort. Your choice was very cliche

Jack did not spawn for me or several others since I asked in chat if people were having trouble with him.

The ash thing with Tango was a joke. Since many had problems with him as well far as being around. The ashes respawn timer is ridiculous. There's a problem when you have six people waiting around for an item. That never seemed to appear anyways....