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General Discussion  » Real ES fans should be happy

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  NIII

Novice Member

Joined: 10/04/10
Posts: 114

5/14/12 1:08:18 AM#21

I stopped reading OP's post when he said it wouldn't work as an mmo with the single player game's features. (note these are just features found in the single player game, they do not make it a single player game)

 

I think I've touched on this topic before in a prior post, but here goes again;

 

There is ALWAYS a way to make it work, and breaking it does not fix it. Just because you can't comprehend how it could work, that doesn't mean someone else can't. Usually saying there is no way is just an excuse for being too lazy to make a way for it to work happen. This is why we are stuck with the same features/model of mmos.

 

Speaking about this game specifically, making it work would be as simple as having a better crime and punishment system, and a bit more time deving to increase player housing/city capacity.

I don't know if people like you assume we just say it can work, give one example, and then be done with it, but that's not true. Anyone that has strong opinions on game transitions like this is a fan of the game--obviously--as they want to experience the game they have fallen in love with. We don't just state our opinion and then be done with it, we often talk to others with the same opinion about ways that they could make it work.

However, I'd expect more often than not, these people do not post.

 

I have talked for hours with various people about how this game could work, and the conclusion is pretty much along the lines of;

More strict crime/punishment system, one that flags you when you attack/steal kill. The bounty will be harsh, so harsh that at some times you shouldn't be able to pay it. The alternative is an instanced jail cell where you sleep to pay for your crime, and lose stats, just like the other games of the series. No one in an mmo wants to lose stats, it puts them behind. Especially in a game like this.

Larger cities to allow player housing. There should be more houses for players, more for npcs to give the feel of an active population in the game world. Think like, 20ish player houses per city, and with the amount of cities in TES games, this could work. "Oh, but then everyone won't have a house!"? Everyone SHOULDN'T have a house. Think a housing auction system or something. There could also be a sort of 'apartment' house per each town, to allow for cheap, shitty housing for the low levels.

The next is kind of in depth, and elaborate;

One of the big things that would limit thieves in this game would be inability to break into another player's house. Before I even make my statements on this, I will say that this could be allowed only on open pvp servers, as I would imagine they would break the game up into open pvp servers and no pvp/flag pvp servers. Essentially, locks should be an upgrade you can purchase for your house, and the highest level lock should still be hard for the person with the best lockpicking to open. These should be expensive though, so you aren't always perfectly safe. Added onto that, I think it would be a nice feature to be able to hire a mercenary to guard your house. Not only does he attack who comes in if spotted, but he also tells the guards and the invading player gains a high bounty. These guards should also be tiered, and more expensive the better they are. An alternative we touched on when talking about this was the ability to use an alt character as a guard for your house, sacrificing exp/skill bonuses for being well rested.

 

As for the combat; anyone that says real time combat with a crosshair will not work with an rpg, obviously is just afraid of change. Even then it's retarded, as it has been done before. They could leave the combat exactly as it is, and I would be completely okay with it, all things considered. Who gives a shit if ranged attacks are overpowered? The game isn't about balance. The real world isn't balanced, why should a virtual one be? If you think someone is so entirely op, maybe you should think of a way to be MORE op. Remember; this combat system isn't based on percentages and gear.

 

Sorry for wall of text, but I just had to. I hope some people actually read it.

  Quesa

Novice Member

Joined: 6/16/04
Posts: 1265

5/14/12 1:11:42 AM#22

Awful arrogant of the OP to suggest that you're not a real ES fan if you don't like the game.

  Quizar1973

Novice Member

Joined: 8/27/09
Posts: 63

5/14/12 1:26:24 AM#23
Originally posted by tofke
Originally posted by Quizar1973

LOL...Yall are what is a one track Mind...you think somthing should stick to one road and never venture off to somwhere else...Thats Boring.....As a TRUE Fan...Ill follow Betheasda and Elder Scrolls Anywhere it wants to go...THAT A TRUE FAN...You think Dead Heads...TRUE Grateful Dead fans stopped following the band if they changed there style a little..HELLL NO..They followed that band through Fire and Brimstone..Slept on the STreets...Just to see a couple of hours of that band play there music....THATS a true Fan.   Jumping off the wagon becuase Bethesda and the Elder Scrolls change a little is NOT a TRUE FAN

A fan... Oh lord. And then they ask themselves why the industry is getting away with crap if people like that are around.

"PLEASE SIR TAKE MY MONEY, JUST DO WHAT YOU WANT CUZ I BE FANZ!1!1!1!"

Btw that example of grateful dead... I think most people here wouldn't mind a little change to fit the MMO genre, but what most people feel of this is... gratefull dead going Dj tiësto or Pitbull (Or whatever radical style change) style. Wonder how those fans would react ;)

Anywho that being said, still doubting if you're serious or a troll. :p

Well..If Defending a Game weather it be an MMO or Single Player game  that I have played for years is a Troll..Then So be it.....Im sorry...But it dosent take much for people to jump off and Quit ya know...Some people Jump before they even Experiance what there on the wagon for in the First place...So there comin out with an MMO..And theres things in there that wasnt on the Single player game...Ok...Tell me a game that was as Deep as Elder Scrolls in the Single Player Version that was put in a MMO with Nothing at all changed...Gameplay included, Combat wasnt changed, All the Lore and enviorment was left in it....Was there ever one??? I will play or at least try out any Game Bethesda and the Elder Scroll games came out with...Im not arguing that it could be a bad game...Hell yea it could be...But im not gonna Judge a game that I have played for years without trying it out first...Im arguing over the fact that people call themselves Fans and Downing the Game and Developer that there suppose to be a fan of....

 

  Quizar1973

Novice Member

Joined: 8/27/09
Posts: 63

5/14/12 1:36:48 AM#24
Originally posted by NIII

I stopped reading OP's post when he said it wouldn't work as an mmo with the single player game's features. (note these are just features found in the single player game, they do not make it a single player game)

 

I think I've touched on this topic before in a prior post, but here goes again;

 

There is ALWAYS a way to make it work, and breaking it does not fix it. Just because you can't comprehend how it could work, that doesn't mean someone else can't. Usually saying there is no way is just an excuse for being too lazy to make a way for it to work happen. This is why we are stuck with the same features/model of mmos.

 

Speaking about this game specifically, making it work would be as simple as having a better crime and punishment system, and a bit more time deving to increase player housing/city capacity.

I don't know if people like you assume we just say it can work, give one example, and then be done with it, but that's not true. Anyone that has strong opinions on game transitions like this is a fan of the game--obviously--as they want to experience the game they have fallen in love with. We don't just state our opinion and then be done with it, we often talk to others with the same opinion about ways that they could make it work.

However, I'd expect more often than not, these people do not post.

 

I have talked for hours with various people about how this game could work, and the conclusion is pretty much along the lines of;

More strict crime/punishment system, one that flags you when you attack/steal kill. The bounty will be harsh, so harsh that at some times you shouldn't be able to pay it. The alternative is an instanced jail cell where you sleep to pay for your crime, and lose stats, just like the other games of the series. No one in an mmo wants to lose stats, it puts them behind. Especially in a game like this.

Larger cities to allow player housing. There should be more houses for players, more for npcs to give the feel of an active population in the game world. Think like, 20ish player houses per city, and with the amount of cities in TES games, this could work. "Oh, but then everyone won't have a house!"? Everyone SHOULDN'T have a house. Think a housing auction system or something. There could also be a sort of 'apartment' house per each town, to allow for cheap, shitty housing for the low levels.

The next is kind of in depth, and elaborate;

One of the big things that would limit thieves in this game would be inability to break into another player's house. Before I even make my statements on this, I will say that this could be allowed only on open pvp servers, as I would imagine they would break the game up into open pvp servers and no pvp/flag pvp servers. Essentially, locks should be an upgrade you can purchase for your house, and the highest level lock should still be hard for the person with the best lockpicking to open. These should be expensive though, so you aren't always perfectly safe. Added onto that, I think it would be a nice feature to be able to hire a mercenary to guard your house. Not only does he attack who comes in if spotted, but he also tells the guards and the invading player gains a high bounty. These guards should also be tiered, and more expensive the better they are. An alternative we touched on when talking about this was the ability to use an alt character as a guard for your house, sacrificing exp/skill bonuses for being well rested.

 

As for the combat; anyone that says real time combat with a crosshair will not work with an rpg, obviously is just afraid of change. Even then it's retarded, as it has been done before. They could leave the combat exactly as it is, and I would be completely okay with it, all things considered. Who gives a shit if ranged attacks are overpowered? The game isn't about balance. The real world isn't balanced, why should a virtual one be? If you think someone is so entirely op, maybe you should think of a way to be MORE op. Remember; this combat system isn't based on percentages and gear.

 

Sorry for wall of text, but I just had to. I hope some people actually read it.

Ok...You do bring up some good points...But you might as well say you want a Single Player Elder Scrolls Game with Multiplayer capabilities...Not an MMO...

And it would be very complicated situation with the Breaking into House thing...You would have theives macroing day in and Day out to get there skills to the highest level just to break into other peoples houses...You think that would be a good thing??  Well you would if your one of the Thieves...lol...Hell I could play the game one night..Go to Work the next Morning and all the stuff that took a hell of alot of time to get was gone...All gone, and I was at work and couldent do nothin about it...LOL...To me that wouldent be fun...And I love PvP so i would have to be on a PvP server...Looting a dead body in PvP...yes i agree..But stealing there things while there not even there...No...I would hate that

Its alot easyer to make a Single Player game with Multiplayer functions than it is to make an MMO where thousands of people play at that same time...

  NIII

Novice Member

Joined: 10/04/10
Posts: 114

5/14/12 1:52:45 AM#25
Originally posted by Quizar1973
Originally posted by NIII

snip

Ok...You do bring up some good points...But you might as well say you want a Single Player Elder Scrolls Game with Multiplayer capabilities...Not an MMO...

And it would be very complicated situation with the Breaking into House thing...You would have theives macroing day in and Day out to get there skills to the highest level just to break into other peoples houses...You think that would be a good thing??  Well you would if your one of the Thieves...lol...Hell I could play the game one night..Go to Work the next Morning and all the stuff that took a hell of alot of time to get was gone...All gone, and I was at work and couldent do nothin about it...LOL...To me that wouldent be fun...And I love PvP so i would have to be on a PvP server...Looting a dead body in PvP...yes i agree..But stealing there things while there not even there...No...I would hate that

Its alot easyer to make a Single Player game with Multiplayer functions than it is to make an MMO where thousands of people play at that same time...

Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean the game should be changed to suit you. I don't want a single player game, I don't want a generic mmo. I want TES Online. If you gut the game, take out all of the innards, it isn't that anymore. It's a new game with a TES setting.

You SHOULD be afraid of losing all of your shit. The thieves SHOULD be afraid and have a hard time doing what they do. They are after all, commiting a crime, a large one at that. You think they aren't risking anything?

Don't take my text for only what it is, think of it with a more broad mindset. I'm not just stating ways it could work, I'm saying that it is possible to think of a way to make it work.

We could sit in this thread and debate back and forth on how to make what I said work, but that isn't the point.

In short, you're kind of missing the entire point.

 

--Edit--

And also; a single player game with multiplayer capabilities IS a multiplayer game, because it is playable by multiple people.

  Quizar1973

Novice Member

Joined: 8/27/09
Posts: 63

5/14/12 2:05:43 AM#26
Originally posted by NIII
Originally posted by Quizar1973
Originally posted by NIII

snip

Ok...You do bring up some good points...But you might as well say you want a Single Player Elder Scrolls Game with Multiplayer capabilities...Not an MMO...

And it would be very complicated situation with the Breaking into House thing...You would have theives macroing day in and Day out to get there skills to the highest level just to break into other peoples houses...You think that would be a good thing??  Well you would if your one of the Thieves...lol...Hell I could play the game one night..Go to Work the next Morning and all the stuff that took a hell of alot of time to get was gone...All gone, and I was at work and couldent do nothin about it...LOL...To me that wouldent be fun...And I love PvP so i would have to be on a PvP server...Looting a dead body in PvP...yes i agree..But stealing there things while there not even there...No...I would hate that

Its alot easyer to make a Single Player game with Multiplayer functions than it is to make an MMO where thousands of people play at that same time...

Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean the game should be changed to suit you. I don't want a single player game, I don't want a generic mmo. I want TES Online. If you gut the game, take out all of the innards, it isn't that anymore. It's a new game with a TES setting.

You SHOULD be afraid of losing all of your shit. The thieves SHOULD be afraid and have a hard time doing what they do. They are after all, commiting a crime, a large one at that. You think they aren't risking anything?

Don't take my text for only what it is, think of it with a more broad mindset. I'm not just stating ways it could work, I'm saying that it is possible to think of a way to make it work.

We could sit in this thread and debate back and forth on how to make what I said work, but that isn't the point.

In short, you're kind of missing the entire point.

 

--Edit--

And also; a single player game with multiplayer capabilities IS a multiplayer game, because it is playable by multiple people.

But its not an MMO....Its a Multiplayer Game...I dont consider Call Of Duty..Or Battlefield an MMO...And as i said in a previouse Post..Im not Arguing wither its gonna be a Bad game..I cant predict the future and no one else can either...Yall might be saying that its nothin like TES and about a year down the road everything changes...No One knows whats gonna happen..I always say...Dont beilive nothing you hear or read and only half of what you see...Im still gonna have high hopes for this game...Cause I love TES...I already have the Singleplayer Game..I wanna try somthing New....Yes I wanna see more Single Player games come out in the future...But I also wanna see what they can do that's not in the Norm of TES

  Kaisen_Dexx

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/06
Posts: 284

5/14/12 2:08:18 AM#27
Originally posted by MadnessRealm
Originally posted by Bainwalker

I'll stick by the single player games and Bethesda.  However I hate Bethesda right now for allowing this to happen in the first place.

I wouldn't blame Bethesda Game Studio there. Because they are owned by Zenimax, Zenimax owns the IP so they can do whatever they want with it (sort of an example, but the Activision/Infinity Ward case is a good example). Zenimax decided to go for the quick cash grab, not BGS. As for BGS, and as I've said in my previous post, they are taking subtle steps to distance themselves from TESO/Zenimax Online Studios.

Unfortunately, shit rolls downhill. And Zenimax is at the top of the hill...

  User Deleted
5/14/12 2:19:36 AM#28
Originally posted by Chrisbox

 If they kept the same combat, and same size area's, or same skills in the MMO it just wouldn't work as an MMO and would fail. 

You'e wrong..  They could of gone a combat route similar to Tera (which except for its rooting animations is fairly decent)  But the least they could of done is keep the 3rd person, exploration centric, layer housing and skill based character advancement.  All of which have been in MMO's as far back as 15 years ago.  Seriously Class Based Character system is not a TES game make.

 

My conclusion is based on 1 factor, The use of the Hero Engine as their engine of choice speaks volums to their overarchign design goals.  An engine that is abysmal for its track record in combining moe then a few characters on screen without producing serios lag.  Now when you see that ONE as the basis the rest of their incompetence shines through.

 

The reality is this isnt a TES MMO.  This is a Dark Age of Warcraft running on SWTOR failed engine.  SO not only do we not get a plausible TES MMO, we get a Clone of WoW using a shitty engine that cant support their aspirations of DAoC mass scale siege type combat.  Its astounding to me why anyone in their right mind can think this is a good game.

  Quizar1973

Novice Member

Joined: 8/27/09
Posts: 63

5/14/12 2:25:48 AM#29
Originally posted by Zylaxx
Originally posted by Chrisbox

 If they kept the same combat, and same size area's, or same skills in the MMO it just wouldn't work as an MMO and would fail. 

You'e wrong..  They could of gone a combat route similar to Tera (which except for its rooting animations is fairly decent)  But the least they could of done is keep the 3rd person, exploration centric, layer housing and skill based character advancement.  All of which have been in MMO's as far back as 15 years ago.  Seriously Class Based Character system is not a TES game make.

 

My conclusion is based on 1 factor, The use of the Hero Engine as their engine of choice speaks volums to their overarchign design goals.  An engine that is abysmal for its track record in combining moe then a few characters on screen without producing serios lag.  Now when you see that ONE as the basis the rest of their incompetence shines through.

 

The reality is this isnt a TES MMO.  This is a Dark Age of Warcraft running on SWTOR failed engine.  SO not only do we not get a plausible TES MMO, we get a Clone of WoW using a shitty engine that cant support their aspirations of DAoC mass scale siege type combat.  Its astounding to me why anyone in their right mind can think this is a good game.

Wait...Dont you mean you find it Astounding that Anyone in there right mind can think this "COULD BE" a good game?....Its not out yet...No One know if it "IS" a good game or not...Things could change...They could see all the Bitc....Well, see all the forum posts and change a few thing's based on what people are sayin...

  MikeJT

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/28/09
Posts: 83

5/14/12 5:43:49 AM#30
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by SEANMCAD

The only thing good about TES Online is that it actually makes Darkfall look better.

Morrowind and Skyrim are very likely two of my top 5 favorite games and everything I have read about this new game so far are complete deal breakers to me every paying them money for it.

How so? Darkfall is in no way a better game because Zenimax decided against going with FPS combat. Darkfall does not offer an Elder-Scrolls-esque experience. It's a FPS, FFA, PVP game... One that very few who try it have any desire to stick around. IF they want Darkfall 2.0 to see a different fate they had better gut Darkfall 1.0 entirely and build a different game. Even then I doubt it will be a TES experience in the least bit. You can dislike TESO all you want, but please give this Darkfall nonsense a rest.

If Darkfall is what you crave from a TES experience, by all means continue the mindless grind, and endless PVP. It sounds like you have your game, enjoy it....

Whilst I don't exactly agree with the way SEANMCAD put it, I do understand where he's coming from. I've spoken to a lot of people who decided to start playing Darkfall because they were looking for something like TES with a multiplayer component.

I was one of those people. I found Darkfall because people were describing it as "Oblivion Online", and at the time I was looking to see if an online Elder Scrolls games was in the works (this was back in 2009). When I couldn't see an Elder Scrolls Online game in the foreseeable future I decided to try Darkfall, and have been subscribed ever since (since August 2009).

I had always thought that when an Elder Scrolls Online game came out, I would cancel my subscription to Darkfall and play it instead. But now I've been presented with what is essentially another WoW-clone with an Elder Scrolls universe setting, I can no longer see any game on the horizon which would pull me away from Darkfall.

You also seem  to assume that players looking for a multiplayer The Elder Scrolls experience don't want PvP. For me, part of desiring a multiplayer The Elder Scrolls experience is the desire to compete against other players - players who are smarter, less predictable and much more challenging than AI opponents. This 'everyone is maxed out' PvP in limited areas which TESO has presented just isn't meaningful.

The fact that Zenimax has decided to take this route just shows me how they're bending to the carebear gamer market. They're taking one of the least forgiving single player experiences and carebearing it up for an audience who can't handle getting their asses handed to them but a mob or player more powerful (or in some cases, simply more skilled) than them.

You also talk about 'mindless grind' in Darkfall like you know what the 'grind' in TESO will be like. The brilliant thing about Darkfall is that it's not the type of game where someone 2 or 3 'levels' ahead of you is an impossible opponent. In Darkfall a good player (ie. a player with good player skills, not character skills) can defeat someone with a superior character.

I was very much hoping, when I first heard about TESO, that this would be the case in this game as well. But as they've decided to go with the typically first-generation Tab targetted combat system, I fail to see how player skill is actually going to factor in to the PvP (good thing the PvP is going to be relatively meaningless).

  Vannor

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 2997

5/14/12 5:47:50 AM#31

I feel the real reason for people being interested in RPG's went out of the window years ago. It used to be about the setting, theme, lore, charcters, story, those IP's we geekily love etc. TESO will offer loads of that sorta stuff no matter the gameplay style. Gameplay was always important but it wasn't the major factor. Times have changed.

  AdamTM

Novice Member

Joined: 5/05/05
Posts: 1395

I'M PUNCHING YOUR SALAD!!!!

5/14/12 6:09:26 AM#32
Originally posted by Vannor

I feel the real reason for people being interested in RPG's went out of the window years ago. It used to be about the setting, theme, lore, charcters, story, those IP's we geekily love etc. TESO will offer loads of that sorta stuff no matter the gameplay style. Gameplay was always important but it wasn't the major factor. Times have changed.

When was that and why did i miss it?

  MikeJT

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/28/09
Posts: 83

5/14/12 6:19:05 AM#33
Originally posted by Quizar1973

If you are a true Fan of Anything...you wouldent put what your a Fan of down and ridicule it...As is Sports...If your team loses a game or even the championship would you say forget that team and never root for them again???  Any so called "Fan" of Elder Scrolls would stick by that game no matter what....Some of you people dont know what it is to be a Fan..And dont need to call yourself a fan of the Elder Scrolls...I on the other hand are a Fan of Elder Scrolls and will stay hopefull of the game no Matter what...Cause I am a Fan....

 

 

Enough Said

What a ridiculous statement.

You're saying that because I like Dagger, Morrowind, and Oblivion, that I should automatically like and stick by a game that is an Elder Scrolls game in name and lore only, despite how good it bad it is on its own standing?

That's like saying that because I like Fallout and Fallout 2, I should automatically like Fallout 3, even though it's a completely different type of gameplay.

Or its like saying that because I like Command and Conquer, I should automatically like Command and Conquer: Renegade (the FPS/TPS they made in 2002).

Sorry, but you don't know what it means to be a fan. Being a fan of something doesn't mean sucking up whatever crap they feed you because they slapped a particular title on it. Being a fan doesn't mean you accept the complete distortion of everything that made you a fan, just because its released under the same title.

What you are describing is not being a fan, I think it's called being an idiot. Just like 14 year old girls go bat shit crazy over the latest boyband sensation, no matter what they actually release, or how little boys on their Xbox's beg their parents for the latest Call of Duty title, regardless of it being no better than the last and having only an emphemeral single-player experience which is closer to an expansion pack than a new release. What you are describing is infact juvenile.

  MikeJT

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/28/09
Posts: 83

5/14/12 7:11:37 AM#34
Originally posted by Quizar1973
Originally posted by NIII
Originally posted by Quizar1973
Originally posted by NIII

snip

Ok...You do bring up some good points...But you might as well say you want a Single Player Elder Scrolls Game with Multiplayer capabilities...Not an MMO...

And it would be very complicated situation with the Breaking into House thing...You would have theives macroing day in and Day out to get there skills to the highest level just to break into other peoples houses...You think that would be a good thing??  Well you would if your one of the Thieves...lol...Hell I could play the game one night..Go to Work the next Morning and all the stuff that took a hell of alot of time to get was gone...All gone, and I was at work and couldent do nothin about it...LOL...To me that wouldent be fun...And I love PvP so i would have to be on a PvP server...Looting a dead body in PvP...yes i agree..But stealing there things while there not even there...No...I would hate that

Its alot easyer to make a Single Player game with Multiplayer functions than it is to make an MMO where thousands of people play at that same time...

Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean the game should be changed to suit you. I don't want a single player game, I don't want a generic mmo. I want TES Online. If you gut the game, take out all of the innards, it isn't that anymore. It's a new game with a TES setting.

You SHOULD be afraid of losing all of your shit. The thieves SHOULD be afraid and have a hard time doing what they do. They are after all, commiting a crime, a large one at that. You think they aren't risking anything?

Don't take my text for only what it is, think of it with a more broad mindset. I'm not just stating ways it could work, I'm saying that it is possible to think of a way to make it work.

We could sit in this thread and debate back and forth on how to make what I said work, but that isn't the point.

In short, you're kind of missing the entire point.

 

--Edit--

And also; a single player game with multiplayer capabilities IS a multiplayer game, because it is playable by multiple people.

But its not an MMO....Its a Multiplayer Game...I dont consider Call Of Duty..Or Battlefield an MMO...And as i said in a previouse Post..Im not Arguing wither its gonna be a Bad game..I cant predict the future and no one else can either...Yall might be saying that its nothin like TES and about a year down the road everything changes...No One knows whats gonna happen..I always say...Dont beilive nothing you hear or read and only half of what you see...Im still gonna have high hopes for this game...Cause I love TES...I already have the Singleplayer Game..I wanna try somthing New....Yes I wanna see more Single Player games come out in the future...But I also wanna see what they can do that's not in the Norm of TES

The difference between a multiplayer game and a massively multiplayer game is the massively part, and persistence. What's considered "massively" changes from game to game.

For example, Dungeons and Dragons Online is called an MMORPG, but each public area of the game is instanced to allow only so many people at once. People over that number are put into a new instance of the same area. And quests are limited to 6 or 12 players. Is this really an MMORPG game? Really, its more like a co-op multiplayer game with a fancy 3D lobby and a persistent auction house, but it's still called an MMORPG. Its really the persistence that makes it an MMORPG, not the massively part.

So how do you make a single player game into an MMO? Well first you add persistence. When a player logs off, does the world keep going on without him? Does time pass equally for all players? Regardless of what they're doing? Add those those two things and you're half-way to making an MMO. Then you add the massively part. What exactly is massively? Thats really up to the game developers to determine, but generally the answer is 'unlimited'. Even then, most MMORPG's do not have 'unlimited' numbers of players in the same area, whether they achieve that by instancing areas to limit the total number of players, or even limit servers to support only a finite amount of players.

The brilliant thing about the 'MMORPG' genre is that it really doesn't specify anything beyond "Massively Multiplayer Online" and "Role-Playing Game". How the developer achieves that is up to them.

So why has Zenimax Online Studios decided to make an MMORPG based in The Elder Scrolls universe, yet have it play nothing like a single player Elder Scrolls game? Its not like there was some major technical hurdle stopping them.

All they've managed to do is alienate hundreds of thousands (I dare say millions) of loyal The Elder Scrolls fans who've been waiting for a TES MMORPG for a very long time (I first imagined it and discussed it with friends when playing Daggerfall, so I've been waiting for this for over 15 years), and who expected that the MMO version would stay loyal to the single player games in more than just lore and name.

  SEANMCAD

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 3/22/09
Posts: 5327

5/14/12 8:35:39 AM#35
Originally posted by Distopia
Originally posted by SEANMCAD

The only thing good about TES Online is that it actually makes Darkfall look better.

Morrowind and Skyrim are very likely two of my top 5 favorite games and everything I have read about this new game so far are complete deal breakers to me every paying them money for it.

How so? Darkfall is in no way a better game because Zenimax decided against going with FPS combat. Darkfall does not offer an Elder-Scrolls-esque experience. It's a FPS, FFA, PVP game... One that very few who try it have any desire to stick around. IF they want Darkfall 2.0 to see a different fate they had better gut Darkfall 1.0 entirely and build a different game. Even then I doubt it will be a TES experience in the least bit. You can dislike TESO all you want, but please give this Darkfall nonsense a rest.

If Darkfall is what you crave from a TES experience, by all means continue the mindless grind, and endless PVP. It sounds like you have your game, enjoy it....

I didnt say it IS better. I said TES Online makes Darkfall LOOK better.

Its called contrast.

why does it make Darkfall look better? Becuase everything that they are saying is not possible Darkfall does and everyone knows those items are NOT the reason Darkfall is not popular. That is a reality that people can try to verbalize away but its still the reality. People are not choosing to leave Darkfall because of housing, nor because there are not classes, nor because FPS combat is bad.

Correlation does not imply causation

  pmaura

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/11/06
Posts: 515

5/14/12 8:39:38 AM#36

yeah the game would be so fail if they created 10 zones all the size if not bigger then skyrim. 

would be so fail if  they let you have player housing

would be even worse fail to allow you a  classless system

would even be worse if instead of only letting you join 3 factions you could join any you wanted.

OP you realize the MMO they are describing is SWTOR which is mainly a RPG COOP. 

  eyeswideopen

Tipster

Joined: 5/24/09
Posts: 2503

5/14/12 12:21:51 PM#37
Originally posted by AdamTM
Originally posted by Vannor

I feel the real reason for people being interested in RPG's went out of the window years ago. It used to be about the setting, theme, lore, charcters, story, those IP's we geekily love etc. TESO will offer loads of that sorta stuff no matter the gameplay style. Gameplay was always important but it wasn't the major factor. Times have changed.

When was that and why did i miss it?

Back during the days of Planescape: Torment, Baldur's Gate, Fallout, etc.

-Letting Derek Smart work on your game is like letting Osama bin Laden work in the White House. Something will burn.-
-And on the 8th day, man created God.-

  AdamTM

Novice Member

Joined: 5/05/05
Posts: 1395

I'M PUNCHING YOUR SALAD!!!!

5/14/12 2:25:25 PM#38
Originally posted by eyeswideopen
Originally posted by AdamTM
Originally posted by Vannor

I feel the real reason for people being interested in RPG's went out of the window years ago. It used to be about the setting, theme, lore, charcters, story, those IP's we geekily love etc. TESO will offer loads of that sorta stuff no matter the gameplay style. Gameplay was always important but it wasn't the major factor. Times have changed.

When was that and why did i miss it?

Back during the days of Planescape: Torment, Baldur's Gate, Fallout, etc.

If those games had shitty gameplay i wouldn't have touched them, and neither would have anyone else.

  Quizar1973

Novice Member

Joined: 8/27/09
Posts: 63

5/14/12 5:30:30 PM#39
Originally posted by MikeJT
Originally posted by Quizar1973

If you are a true Fan of Anything...you wouldent put what your a Fan of down and ridicule it...As is Sports...If your team loses a game or even the championship would you say forget that team and never root for them again???  Any so called "Fan" of Elder Scrolls would stick by that game no matter what....Some of you people dont know what it is to be a Fan..And dont need to call yourself a fan of the Elder Scrolls...I on the other hand are a Fan of Elder Scrolls and will stay hopefull of the game no Matter what...Cause I am a Fan....

 

 

Enough Said

What a ridiculous statement.

You're saying that because I like Dagger, Morrowind, and Oblivion, that I should automatically like and stick by a game that is an Elder Scrolls game in name and lore only, despite how good it bad it is on its own standing?

That's like saying that because I like Fallout and Fallout 2, I should automatically like Fallout 3, even though it's a completely different type of gameplay.

Or its like saying that because I like Command and Conquer, I should automatically like Command and Conquer: Renegade (the FPS/TPS they made in 2002).

Sorry, but you don't know what it means to be a fan. Being a fan of something doesn't mean sucking up whatever crap they feed you because they slapped a particular title on it. Being a fan doesn't mean you accept the complete distortion of everything that made you a fan, just because its released under the same title.

What you are describing is not being a fan, I think it's called being an idiot. Just like 14 year old girls go bat shit crazy over the latest boyband sensation, no matter what they actually release, or how little boys on their Xbox's beg their parents for the latest Call of Duty title, regardless of it being no better than the last and having only an emphemeral single-player experience which is closer to an expansion pack than a new release. What you are describing is infact juvenile.

I never once said that i would "LIKE" The Elder Scrolls Online...Hell I might not like it at all...But im not gonna say forget it just becuase of what Ive read....If you down somthing your a FAN of before you even try it...Wether you like it or not,  then No...Your not a Fan....I will try it when it comes out becuase I am a Fan of TES.....But im not gonna down a game I have loved to play for years..Damn people....At least give it a try and dont be so critical over a game you have loved for years without givin it a Try first...Then after I give it a try then i might be in the boat yall are in and and dislike the game myself....But i will still be a fan of the game...And Always will

  Quizar1973

Novice Member

Joined: 8/27/09
Posts: 63

5/14/12 5:34:34 PM#40

So...How about that Diablo 3...Whoot..Cant wait...LOL...

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