UPDATE: The Patherfinder Kickstarter Campaign has met its $50,000 goal and then some, however if the goal of 2,000 backers is reached, a speciall addition will be added for its backers. Click the link to learn more. http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1675907842/pathfinder-online-technology-demo/posts/225499

VIVA SANDBOX!

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For those so inclined, you can participate and help to fund Pathfinder Online.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1675907842/pathfinder-online-technology-demo

Yeah, it may only be the Tech demo, but that's a good chunck of the game mechanics, and that has to be done right to have a fun, launchable, and successful product.

Blog# 12: The Blog About Kickstarter

Kickstarter solves a huge problem for creative projects. With Kickstarter, a creative team can ask their audience to show their support based on the idea and the team. Each person who backs the Kickstarter takes a little bit of risk, but not so much that they're likely to be hurt if the project doesn't come to fruition. Yet in aggregate, those supporters can generate enough money to make it possible to get the project past the point where investors can evaluate it on its own merits, while simultaneously demonstrating their desire for the finished product.

Another Indie Dev doing a Sandbox MMO that need Kickstarter just to fund their Tech Demo.

And suddenly my expectations for this game sunk like a rock.

Originally posted by SuperXero89

And suddenly my expectations for this game sunk like a rock.

why?

Originally posted by Caldrin

Originally posted by SuperXero89

And suddenly my expectations for this game sunk like a rock.

why?

Because this is where we realize that Pathfinder is just another indie sandbox MMORPG backed by a company with large ambitions but small means.

Honest question... has anything good come from Kickstarter yet?

Originally posted by djmtott

Honest question... has anything good come from Kickstarter yet?

Well there is this,

http://forums.majorleaguegaming.com/topic/271065-new-shadowrun-game-is-officially-in-developement/

which has lead to this,

http://www.shadowrun.com/

Originally posted by SuperXero89

Originally posted by Caldrin

Originally posted by SuperXero89

And suddenly my expectations for this game sunk like a rock.

why?

Because this is where we realize that Pathfinder is just another indie sandbox MMORPG backed by a company with large ambitions but small means.

I know this partly marketing but nonetheless hear them out:

We’ve heard it our entire careers: “Are you crazy?” “It can’t be done.” “Nobody would buy that.” “It’s impossible.” Yet we have succeeded in doing the impossible, time after time after time. A roleplaying game where you play the monsters rather than the heroes? Are you serious?

 

Vampire: The Masquerade had its 20th anniversary last year.

 

---

 

Wait, you want to make a card game where you have to create your deck by buying booster packs of random trading cards? Nobody would buy that.

 

Magic: The Gathering is by far the most successful game ever in the history of tabletop gaming, and will celebrate 20 years in 2013.

 

---

 

You want to do WHAT? Make the Dungeons & Dragons game mechanics open source? That’ll kill the entire industry!

 

The Open Game License (OGL) revolutionized the RPG market in 2000, leading to hundreds of companies producing products compatible with the Third Edition of D&D.

 

--

 

Hold on—you’re going to create your own game to compete with Dungeons & Dragons? You’re wasting your time!

 

The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game is now the world’s best-selling tabletop RPG.

 

--

 

So when we told people we wanted to create a massively multiplayer online roleplaying game (MMO) for a fraction of the cost and development time of the big MMOs, you can imagine some of the responses we got.

 

It’s a pipe dream! Nobody can do that. It’s impossible.

 

Well, we’re the team that laughs in the face of impossible. Pathfinder Online is the project that will slay this dragon. And Goblinworks is the company that will make it happen. Impossible? We say nay!

 

Originally posted by djmtott

Honest question... has anything good come from Kickstarter yet?

Depends how you define "good". If you mean, have any titles come out that are demonstrably successful (popular/critical) then you're premature to ask*. To be sure the same will be said of "bad" or disappointing, but again not yet.

Some interesting projects imo:

1. Xenonauts (genre, extra polish offered)
2. Double Fine (genre, track-record)
3. Star Command (platform, indie start-up)
4. Shadowrun (popular IP)
5. The Banner Saga (genre, dev experience)

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/346275/Crowd-funding.html

Originally posted by SuperXero89

Originally posted by Caldrin

Originally posted by SuperXero89

And suddenly my expectations for this game sunk like a rock.

why?

Because this is where we realize that Pathfinder is just another indie sandbox MMORPG backed by a company with large ambitions but small means.

I thought that was pretty obvious from the start..

If they can get enough cash togeather to build up a tech demo then they could get some big money investors..

No big publisher will try and put cash into an MMORPG sandbox game as they think it wont make any cash all they will do is carry on putting out the same old themepark games with tiny changes to the way things work and call them next gen..

If we really want sandbox games then im sorry but we need to look at indie developers and try and support them as much as we can..

Also as for things like kickstarter putting out good games.. I think some of the best games in the next few years will come out of kickstarter projects..

One game that i can mention that did their own kickstarter type thing, infact are still doing it is called Endless Space.

http://endless-space.amplitude-studios.com/

The game in its current state is 10x better than any of the big space empire games that have been released recently..

Originally posted by SuperXero89

And suddenly my expectations for this game sunk like a rock.

At least going in we know its made by an Indie which means more likely to fail but on the other hand you have a AAA title like TESO with all the funding it needs and is also doomed to fail because its a Themepark WoW clone.  So which is worse? 

I am not that sure but shouldn't they put up the 50k to make their own dream game?

They are making a Tech Demo of a Sandbox MMO.

I just felt that they are milking Kickstarter thats all.

Originally posted by xmenty

I am not that sure but shouldn't they put up the 50k to make their own dream game?

They are making a Tech Demo of a Sandbox MMO.

I just felt that they are milking Kickstarter thats all.

Not many people just have 50k laying around to put into a project.. Its a lot safer to put it out to somthing like kickstarter to see if they can get the funds. At the end of the day they are not forcing people to pay they are asking people if they would like to support them :)

Originally posted by MumboJumbo

I know this partly marketing but nonetheless hear them out:

We’ve heard it our entire careers: “Are you crazy?” “It can’t be done.” “Nobody would buy that.” “It’s impossible.” Yet we have succeeded in doing the impossible, time after time after time. A roleplaying game where you play the monsters rather than the heroes? Are you serious?

Vampire: The Masquerade had its 20th anniversary last year.

 

Wait, you want to make a card game where you have to create your deck by buying booster packs of random trading cards? Nobody would buy that.

 

Magic: The Gathering is by far the most successful game ever in the history of tabletop gaming, and will celebrate 20 years in 2013.

 

You want to do WHAT? Make the Dungeons & Dragons game mechanics open source? That’ll kill the entire industry!

 

The Open Game License (OGL) revolutionized the RPG market in 2000, leading to hundreds of companies producing products compatible with the Third Edition of D&D.

 

Hold on—you’re going to create your own game to compete with Dungeons & Dragons? You’re wasting your time!

 

The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game is now the world’s best-selling tabletop RPG.

 

So when we told people we wanted to create a massively multiplayer online roleplaying game (MMO) for a fraction of the cost and development time of the big MMOs, you can imagine some of the responses we got.

 

It’s a pipe dream! Nobody can do that. It’s impossible.

 

Well, we’re the team that laughs in the face of impossible. Pathfinder Online is the project that will slay this dragon. And Goblinworks is the company that will make it happen. Impossible? We say nay!

 

It can be done and if they had a lead designer like Strain or Kaplan they could pull it off. The current lead designer however did some work on WoDO and not as lead designer so we are not only talking about low budget but also a rather inexperienced team.

Anything is of course possible and as a Pathfinder P&P player I have been checking out what I seen about the game and gets the newsletter.

However wont I get hyped for the game until I actually tried it, too much say that this will be another MO. On the other hand do I like if you guys (and gals) support the game and put some money in...;)

What I seen so far makes me wonder why Paizo didn´t get someone with a bit more resources to make the game. Pathfinder sells better than D&D nowadays and is probably the largest P&P RPG out there right now.

Big Companies seek to make big m oney.  A quick look at history will demonstrate that large companies have almost never produced anything truly innovative. It has always been the little guy, so to speak, who has truly pushed the boundires of what is possible. IF we as gamers really want a new, and innovative game to play, we will have to look to the "indie" develepoer for it. Helping to fund thier projects, whether they succeed or fail, will encourage others who might be "on the fence". Someone out there has got the idea for the AAA sandbox we're all waiting to play. And it isn't going to be EA, or Blizzard or anyone else like that that delivers it. IT'll be a little guy.

Originally posted by Loke666

Originally posted by MumboJumbo

I know this partly marketing but nonetheless hear them out:

We’ve heard it our entire careers: “Are you crazy?” “It can’t be done.” “Nobody would buy that.” “It’s impossible.” Yet we have succeeded in doing the impossible, time after time after time. A roleplaying game where you play the monsters rather than the heroes? Are you serious?

Vampire: The Masquerade had its 20th anniversary last year.

 

Wait, you want to make a card game where you have to create your deck by buying booster packs of random trading cards? Nobody would buy that.

 

Magic: The Gathering is by far the most successful game ever in the history of tabletop gaming, and will celebrate 20 years in 2013.

 

You want to do WHAT? Make the Dungeons & Dragons game mechanics open source? That’ll kill the entire industry!

 

The Open Game License (OGL) revolutionized the RPG market in 2000, leading to hundreds of companies producing products compatible with the Third Edition of D&D.

 

Hold on—you’re going to create your own game to compete with Dungeons & Dragons? You’re wasting your time!

 

The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game is now the world’s best-selling tabletop RPG.

 

So when we told people we wanted to create a massively multiplayer online roleplaying game (MMO) for a fraction of the cost and development time of the big MMOs, you can imagine some of the responses we got.

 

It’s a pipe dream! Nobody can do that. It’s impossible.

 

Well, we’re the team that laughs in the face of impossible. Pathfinder Online is the project that will slay this dragon. And Goblinworks is the company that will make it happen. Impossible? We say nay!

 

It can be done and if they had a lead designer like Strain or Kaplan they could pull it off. The current lead designer however did some work on WoDO and not as lead designer so we are not only talking about low budget but also a rather inexperienced team.

Anything is of course possible and as a Pathfinder P&P player I have been checking out what I seen about the game and gets the newsletter.

However wont I get hyped for the game until I actually tried it, too much say that this will be another MO. On the other hand do I like if you guys (and gals) support the game and put some money in...;)

What I seen so far makes me wonder why Paizo didn´t get someone with a bit more resources to make the game. Pathfinder sells better than D&D nowadays and is probably the largest P&P RPG out there right now.

The business model of:

" Since Goblinworks won't have to pay off a huge theme park mortgage, our focus will instead be on making our virtual world as engaging as possible and sustaining that virtual world as the population grows over years of time,"

Sounds like a viable approach. As for the CTO, Mark Kalmes all I could glean from a quick search: "Software Director for the World of Darkness MMO project at CCP" as well as, & "worked on City of Heroes at Cryptic Studios"? Ref: https://goblinworks.com/blog/

The current Kickstarter is to drum up investment interest in accessing the preferred middleware options. And no idea how that will determine things, but hopefully the Tech Demo will clarify such things a lot, when it releases (~34K atm)?

I approve of Kickstart and I approve of the design objectives and general philiosophy of the production.

I also approve of Paizo, a lot.

oh, and I DEFINITELY approve of that collection of books he was showing...

I'm watching this one and it might well be the second Kickstarter I help with.

Ah, milking on bulliable and naive people has began :)

Not only they are bragging about how they are planning to let people pay for beta but seems like they want your money for even less...

Originally posted by Gdemami

Ah, milking on bulliable and naive people has began :)

Not only they are bragging about how they are planning to let people pay for beta but seems like they want your money for even less...

lol, scepticism is a useful stance for these sorts of things. For this token donations would be one of my "don't break your own rules" approaches. Yet, perhaps a few things mitigate here:

1. Design: A sandbox mmorpg with documented design (for sure next step is what's the tech like/who's invested already/show me the money)
2. Experience: Strong IP backing, goblinworks have some AAA mmorpg, pnp rpg experiences & connections.
3. Backing: Crowd funding is still flush (no kickstarter fatigue just yet) and useful to "spread the vibe".

----

As to the rewards they don't really do much for me, but subjectively that's a value judgement, for some RP parties look at the tiers: Objectively the tiers are a sign of a well-thought out project:

• $5 - token suppot
• $15 -  pdf of that thornkeep book + design docs of pathfinder online + supporting the game
• $30 - basically signing on for being there at T=0; release is going to be batch start not continious (note the difference) which also factors somewhat + closer ties to the developers over the dev cycle (years).
• $50 - the physical book; if you compare to amazon it's not THAT far off a similar rulebook published by Pazio? + all below...