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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Combat: TERA v. GW2. Your thoughts?

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349 posts found
  Eir_S

Novice Member

Joined: 8/07/11
Posts: 4703

GW2 socialist.

5/02/12 7:42:58 PM#101
Originally posted by Jayaris
Originally posted by Eir_S
snip

 Not sure I could handle the irony, so I'm quite glad.

I appreciate the aptness of your portrait though, you are quite clearly blinded by personal emotions.

Don't invest yourself so heavily in an MMO dear.

Actually I was blinded by your hypocrisy and wasn't afraid to address it.  You're welcome.

  Eir_S

Novice Member

Joined: 8/07/11
Posts: 4703

GW2 socialist.

5/02/12 7:45:06 PM#102
Originally posted by Jayaris

I was honestly surprised TERA got so many votes, I suppose at least some people vote honestly.

What is it with Tera fans like you?  You're the second one that's suggested because YOUR favorite game is not winning on a poll, that people are lying?  And you call me emotionally invested.  I suggest you don't look if it bothers you quite so much.

  Nightverge

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/30/12
Posts: 216

5/02/12 7:58:41 PM#103
Originally posted by Eir_S
Originally posted by Jayaris
Originally posted by BadSpock

Let's see... have played both for about the same number of total hours in beta-

TERA - point at mob with mouse, use the exact same rotation of any typical fantasy MMO skills over and over and hit one button to dodge or block when the mob spends 2-3 seconds glowing telling you "hey, dummy, I'm going to hit you now."

All while being locked in place without being able to move while you are doing an over the top anime animation with a weapon 2-3 times your size.

Rely on gear, levels, HP potions, and pocket healers (especially for PvP.)

GW2 - nearly every attack can be done on the move (and most likely should be), you still have to aim yourself at the mob(s) and can hit multiple un-targetted enemies without tab-target with a lot of skills.

You don't get infinite dodge/block and have to choose when to use it tactically, as well as get traits/perks to make your dodge do different things to be more useful (stealth, heals, phantasms, buffs, debuffs, damaging attacks, etc.)

All classes (professions) are self suffient and can combo off of each other without having to be in a group, there are no pocket healers or tanks to hold aggro for you so you can face roll your DPS rotations.

So let's see...

Static, traditional trinity based combat with an action/aiming gimmick - TERA

Something new and different, a new model all together - GW2

You decide.

TERA is just your usual trinity based whack-a-mole health bar race (tanking, dps, healing) with a action/aiming gimmick designed to fool you into thinking combat revolves around anything other than grinding levels and gear.

Honestly when I read this I was just going to insult you for your narrow-mindedness - But, I'll just say that :

"You use the same rotation of skills in TERA"

You use an even smaller rotation of skills in Guild Wars.

Err.. I think his point was that you had to use them at all to be viable.  The fact that you use "smaller" rotations in GW2 is actually a PRO, not a con.  I believe you misunderstood... and even then, I was never required to do any rotations whatsoever in order to kick ass and take names, whether or not they will be discovered to be viable in the future.

"Trinity based combat"

Believe it or not, people like Trinity combat and it provides more meaningful PvP

In your opinion.  People are loving GW2 PvP just fine.

"Over the top animations, anime, animation lock"

Personal preference buddy, animation lock balances the game and it's how an action game is supposed to play - I'm sorry if you don't like it.

Oh I see where this is going already.  See further quotes in yellow as I dismantle your post.

"Rely on Gear, Levels, Potion"

I'm not that big a fan of Gear grind, but everybody has the same level cap I don't see how people are going to have a level advantage over other people in the end game - And potions? Does GW2 not have potions?

Umm.. no.  If you mean health and mana potions, no they don't.  Not at all.

GW2 also has gear, that give benefits - It's just less obvious.

What you mean is "I want it to be less obvious so it is.."  Only hey, it's not.  The only reason it's less obvious it's because it's less ACCURATE.

"Nearly every attack can be done on the move."

I prefer realism and balance in my games to being able to shoot lazers out my eyes as I'm sprinting.

Do you not say at the end of this post "Everything you've wrote is ... personally biased?"  Why did you even bother responding to this one if you're just countering a fact with an opinion?

"GW2 doesn't have infinite dodge/blocks like in TERA and we have traits/perks"

TERA has a traits system, it's called Glyphs less extensive than GW2 or most other MMO's to be sure. Infinite blocks? You mean the classes designed for melee combat, people can still attack you from behind and other classes do not have infinite amount of dodges.

*cough* "I prefer realism and balance in  my games" to being able to deflect swords like they're marshmallows if I'm not being struck from behind."

"No tanks, no healers, no DPS rotation"

So every Boss is gonna be limited, because there isn't a character that can take big hits and there isn't a character that can land big heals - So all the bosses will deal limited AoE damage and deal limited single target damage. This isn't the kind of PvE I want to play, but hey if that's what you like go for it. 

This is again, entirely an opinion of what is better than something else.  What happened to your stance against biased comments?  Not only that, but have you seen every boss.  Some of the ones already placed in the Ascalonian Catacombs go directly for certain players and it's up to the group to figure out how to keep everyone alive.  Did you play the beta?

I prefer Holy Trinity I prefer defined roles and I prefer proper teamwork being required to take down an epic boss, not a bunch of lone wolfs jumping about healing themselves while they spam out their skills.

So you prefer them, but it's not ok for Spock or anyone else to be biased?  When you yourself are?  Most of what he said was actually based on fact.  You responded with the intention of discrediting him, but never got to that part.  Also, in the absense of counter-facts to support your arguments, you actually provide misinformation about GW2.  Teamwork is actually a huge part of the game and I saw that more times than I could count just in one weekend in comparison to any Trinity based game I've played.

Everything you've wrote is either incorrect or personally biased

*cough*  *HACK*  Must be coming down with something!  I won't insult you for your narrow mindedness either since it's against the rules, but well...... you see what I'm getting at.

 

 OK, here we go. Gonna have to gear up before I dive in here.

     I never once used a rotation in my beta with GW2. I don't believe it has that kind of combat from my experience. Every skill that my thief had did not rely on using another skill first (except for skill on slot 1 to build up my initiative I guess). I never once felt like I was hitting the same buttons in any order. Especially given my utility skills. I only played a thief and a necromancer but from what I played you would probably die if you tried to stick with any given rotation. You must use the skills based on enemy positioning and timing. That being said, TERA, TO ME, felt pretty similar to typical MMO combat. I won't belittle it and say something like "THIS IS WAR 1.5!!!!" because that's obvious hyperbole. But it did bring the same feel back of when I played SWTOR except here I had to aim and had an active block. Then again all classes with a shield also have an active block in GW2 so that wasn't exactly missing from there. I didn't really enjoy my time with Tera and I felt I gave it a fair shake. I don't see TERA and GW2 as competing entities so I was hoping to play TERA in the meantime before GW2 came out. Despite that the game left me with a sinking feeling that I couldn't shake. I didn't really like the combat or the story and I can't say I even really liked the art direction. The game is pretty for sure but something about that asian style just doesn't click with me.

     I don't want to come across like I'm pulling the "majority opinion" card but if you look at the polls and the general concensuss most people actually don't like trinity combat more and most do enjoy playing with no holy trinity versus playing with it. You are an individual so your opinion is just as valid but be wary when making swooping statements like that. I understand your debating so of course your going to load your statements but currently here it is closer to the opposite. People actually DON'T like trinity combat is a closer statement to the truth although still equally just as swooping and generalizing. I hope I don't come across as trying to convince you because I'm not. Your opinion is fine as it is.  Just trying to point out that that is how the people are currently reacting right now.

     Personally I hate the trinity combat system. I loved going out in PvP with my roving band of thieves and I loved just going adventuring with whoever I happen to be partnering up with atm. I participated in over 35 man raids in the beta before level 8. (about six of them actually). They weren't actually RAIDS of course. The first one was at level 1 in my norn area when I fought a giant Ice worm for my hunting ritual. Players came in from every direction. I didn't have to stand around and organize for hours to get people to come do it with me. It just happened. Before long I was standing with guardians, necromancers, mesmers, and more to take down a giant Ice worm for our "great hunt". The second time I helped a shrine defend its cave from malicious intruders. The third time I helped raid a gnoll cave to kill one of their "gods" (in reality just a winged harpy). The fourth time I helped stop creatures from rebuilding their constructs (which we had destroyed in previous events). The fourth time I had hunted a malicious group of dragon followers with a pack of wolves. The fifth time I had helped defend a village from onslaughting bears. The sixth time I had killed a reserected Ice titan in frusenfell lake (an epic battle if there ever was one). Each of these scenarios had over 20 people in them.

     I felt a sense of true comradory when we all cheered after the death of the ice titan. We hooted and howled and even all went, in unison, to the local fort to celebrate. We crafted food and talked in /local to the zone about what we had accomplished. I made about 34 new friends in just that sitting. We even considered starting a guild together on release called the Titan Slayers in homage to how we all met as we were all complete strangers before our mighty deed. We then split into packs but kept relatievly close to each other on the WvWvW stage. We actually defended a fort, by working together, from two other servers. The Guardians and warriors stood directly behind the gates while the thieves and rangers poured hot oil over the intruders. The necromancers stood behind the warriors with the elementalists. The mesmers were our shock troops (I still feel sad about sending them to do our suicide runs) because they are so good at disorganizing groups. Send in a few mesmers and watch as all hell breaks loose when they start to duplicate and disorient. From there the warriors and guardians take the stage and rush in behind the mesmers to occupy the main hordes. Then it was our turn, the thieves and rangers snuck around back to flank the attackers. We then proceeded to snipe out the AoE damage dealers and spell slingers. Needless to say, I had a blast.

     The bosses are not limited at all. I theorycraft that you haven't actually experienced this because you are talking in future tense. My past tense experience informs me otherwise though. It actually gives bosses a wider range of what they can do without the holy trinity. Bosses aren't forced in GW2 to play by any game rule standard. Bosses have to work with the holy trinity in other MMO's for example. If they are not beatable with the holy trinity then they are not implemented or, in other words, they must fit perfectly into the holy trinity formula. In GW2 bosses have been extremely dynamic. Some are very AoE heavy requiring the lot of you to be on your toes and move around. Others are single damage heavy requiring you to dodge aptly or support your teammates with bubbles or revives, etc. Take my fabled and aptly named 'Tale of the Ice Titan' as noted above. That boss was so epic because it would change throughout the battle. In the beginning it had massive single target damage that you were expected to dodge. Later the attacks were faster and came with AoE which meant coordinating and everyone had to stand in pockets so as not to clump together and lose a majority in an off AoE spell. Then he summoned other creatures to help him. He, at one point, burrowed underground. The battle felt fresh and exciting because there was no holy trinity expectation. The creature could do anything and didn't have to fit into any formula. The bosses surely don't deal limited damage on any of the fronts you listed. With the dodge mechanic you are often expected to get out of the way of heavy hits. Guardians and warriors can also take pretty good damage, they can't tank the whole time but they can take a punch. There are also big heals, some classes  have larger heals than others. It all depends.

     All in all I found the lack of trinity to be invigorating and renewed my passion for boss battles. Previously it all became kind of a boring blurr. "Healer, check. Tank, check. Dps, check. Ok lets go and get this over with" more aptly described my time with traditional boss battles. If you had all of the spots filled you were good to go sense every monster was designed with that party setup in mind.

     Actually, if my ice titan experience was any indicator, the tough battles are anything but a bunch of lone wolves doing their own thing. Beyond that giving people roles hardly inspires real teamwork. I never even spoke to my party members on some RAIDS. We each knew what our role was and that's all we focused on. It was boring, all I had to do was heal the main tank and move out of the way of any AoE. I'm also not sure what your getting at with the spamming out their skill spart because that describes every game everywhere. You spam what your character can do. If your playing mario you jump, GoW you attack, what have you.

     I'd say not having a trinity system has inspired more teamwork than having one for me, thus far. We don't know what to expect and we must coordinate every encounter with the classes that we have rather than coming in, knowing what to expect. There is no luxury in GW2 that as long as you have x, y, and z in your party you are good to go. We DON'T fully understand our roles in battle until the battle begins, inspiring true teamwork (if the encounter is challenging enough) and coordination. I don't really consider joining a silent party and spamming heal on a guy up there to be true coordination. We all knew exactly what we were going to do before we got here because of our roles. What did we coordinate?

     I don't know if you've played GW2 but I did give Tera a shake. It's not my cup of tea but if you try and dislike GW2 then I hope Tera provides many moons of happiness. Actually, regardless of what you think about GW2 I hope you find fun in Tera. We aren't here to compete; however, from my experience I thoroughly enjoyed GW2 over Tera.

  Nightverge

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/30/12
Posts: 216

5/02/12 8:07:50 PM#104
Originally posted by Eir_S
Originally posted by Jayaris

I was honestly surprised TERA got so many votes, I suppose at least some people vote honestly.

What is it with Tera fans like you?  You're the second one that's suggested because YOUR favorite game is not winning on a poll, that people are lying?  And you call me emotionally invested.  I suggest you don't look if it bothers you quite so much.

     I must admit it is somewhat unattractive for someone to suggest that just because it is not in tune with your own personal experience it is either lying or wrong. Normally I'd not comment but this kind of thing urks me somewhat. Why would people have any incentive to lie about their experience with GW2? Not only that but HOW can someone lie about their experience exactly? They had a bad time but decided to tell everyone they had a good time? Despite popular belief it is not human nature to be in denial about video games. There is nothing to gain. Not to say people always act rationally but the argument is similar to saying "You didn't actually like that movie that you liked". It's borderline absurd when people do this.

     Your telling me that something I experienced was different than how I experienced it. I was there too...and it was exactly how I remember. The more rational possibility is that we are different people. Believe it or not there are only certain outlined situations that people lie in. Its actually quite a fascinating study.  It is far more common for someone to come to the forums in bitter rage upon experiencing a dissapointing game than it is for them to come to the forums and lie about their experience.

  Eir_S

Novice Member

Joined: 8/07/11
Posts: 4703

GW2 socialist.

5/02/12 8:10:03 PM#105
Exactly.  What most people don't understand is that I was looking forward to Tera, that is before I played it.  If GW2 had disappointed me in the same way, I would have said so, but it didn't and it won't.  I had no incentive not to enjoy both games if it were possible but I didn't and apparently saying so makes me "dishonest".  Well whoever believes that has their own issues but I don't need them projected onto me.
  Deron_Barak

Novice Member

Joined: 3/14/06
Posts: 1139

5/02/12 8:14:20 PM#106

 The two are totally different aside from active dodge and block functions.  Might as well bring DDO into the conversation.  If you want to put the two head to head I would say GW2 would be a more popular system because it retains a familiar tab tagetting functionality.  On the other hand I think you are more enganged with TERA's combat system.

 

 TERA.  I know the term "True Action Combat" In TERA has been scoffed at since there are animations delays (I woudn't call them locks across the board since some abilities actively move you) but simply put your actions matter a great deal.  In most cases there is no rip cord on your abilities and as you play and become familiar with the "cast" time and "delay" time of each of your abilities you find there is no magical ability kill sequence for every fight, you must adapt to what your enemy is doing in real time.

 

 The other thing to consider is TERA has full collision.  When a boss is about to crash down on you there is no run through it so it misses you.  You better get used to moving horizontal or backwards at the same time you are timing your abilities.  I play a Warrior so class milage may vary as each has it's own fighting style.

 

GW2.  No I was not in the BWE though I might pick it up after my close friend has played it a few months.  I did like the fact that half your skills are tied to your weapon which with the variety you can wield has a very realistic feel to it.  I like the fact each class has an avoidance mechanic along with, of course, their profession skills which you can use in conjunction with weapon attacks (elemental damage).  Chain skills are great as you have to weigh options on the fly, this made Aion king of combat for me until recently, and it adds depth to each fight.

 

 I think GW2's combat system is a great evolution to the tab target system without going to the lengths TERA does.  The point of combat should be how active you are required to be and there is no excuse for lazy combat.  In total attention needed TERA wins out IMO though GW2 seems to give you more variety.

Just not worth my time anymore.

  rojoArcueid

Elite Member

Joined: 8/13/09
Posts: 5786

"It is double pleasure to deceive the deceiver". - Niccolo Machiavelli

5/02/12 8:20:20 PM#107
Originally posted by Vunak23

Tera's combat destroys GW2.

 

No tab targeting, completely aim based (aside from VERY few lock ons, that you have to aim to lock on).

The animation lock in TERA is one of the single greatest things about its combat. You can't faceroll your way through the game like you can in GW2. You have to think about every skill you use all the time. Can I use my big hitting attack, or is the mob gonna activate its quicker big hitting attack thus one shotting me? Should I stun the mob now, or hold off for later.

 

You cant go through a rotation in TERA because everything is extremely situational. You have a preferred rotation if everything goes perfect (never does).

 

People that are hating on TERA's combat are those that are either clickers (cant click in TERA its impossible), or are just extremely bad.

Are you that blind to accept the combat limitations of TERA are actually the greatest thing ever and that it really! requires skill to play it?.... TERA is a good game but the developers made such horrible limitations to combat and then called it True action combat where you cant fight freely as you should do in a combat focused game. Also, You say that TERA has no tab target which is true, but you say it like pretending GW2 is tab targeting or click based. I never used target or clicks to fight in GW2 Beta weekend, Just FYI. TERA plays amazingly with a gamepad. If i want to play an mmo dont stick my mouse to the camera because i want to move my camera freely when i want, not when i move the mosue. Of course that is just about people's preference. FPS aim in an mmo is not the best thing (tab target either) so i guess GW2 got it right not forcing you to be fps nor tab targeting.

You dont need a rotation in GW2 either. By the way, rotations are actually made by players. I can have a rotation in every game including TERA and GW2. But theres no need to do that and you can easily suck on both games if you follow rotations.

SO, people that are hating TERAs combat some of them are just haters and some of them have a point (like me).

 

 i dont know what you mean by saying you cant faceroll your way through the game like in GW2. But if understood correctly what you said, then taht is just a sad excuse to hate free and non limited combat like TERA.

I got a refund from TERA after playing some betas for many reasons and flaws, and Combat was the first one. I still like the game but wont pay monthly for it.

  Vaultar

Novice Member

Joined: 4/25/08
Posts: 342

5/02/12 8:22:35 PM#108

Wow...the stats are impressive considering that it was GW2 first ever beta event compared to TERA which was out for 1.5 years in Korea and was just recently released in the west.

I voted "GW2, but both games are good" as there was no option for "here to look up the stats". TBH, I haven't played TERA though, but from what I read and watched, I can see TERA being great for those who enjoy more of the same. The big GW2 fan in my says "GW2 easily!" but that would be too biased with no foundation. Though I can easily see myself enjoying GW2 over TERA, just because I am sick of seeing exclamation marks above NPCs, but also enjoying TERA's combat :P.

 

EDIT: o wait...I totally stuffed up here. Didn't read the OP and the heading of the poll lol... :/

O well..:(

Please add "here to check up the poll" option next time >.>.

Looking forward to EQL and EQN.

  Eir_S

Novice Member

Joined: 8/07/11
Posts: 4703

GW2 socialist.

5/02/12 8:30:18 PM#109
Originally posted by Thralia
anyone who played TERA and GW2for atleast a few hours know the answer for sure. its just MMORPG.com is full with GW2 fanboys so there is really no point in this Poll since it will not really show what is better but what game has more fanboys.

Actually this site seems to have far fewer GW2 fans than most, it's just a great game that people enjoy.  Don't be sad.  No one's stopping you from playing anything, it's just a stupid internet poll.

  Master10K

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/18/10
Posts: 3086

5/02/12 8:35:08 PM#110

No matter how amazing people say TERA's combat is or becomes at later levels, it simply doesn't change the fact that I was bored out of my mind when I played it. The game's PvE levelling was super easr, with no threat of death, that I would pull as many mobs as I could and I simply stopped dodging. Don't think I even died during the beta... not even through my own incompetence.

 

However during GW2's recent beta I died quite a lot and it was fun and exciting being forced to pay attention, so early on in my PvE experience. As for actual combat mechanics, I can't really judge which is best, cause I simply was too bored of TERA to level in it and the server lag in GW2's beta really hampered on my experience. Although once they fix the issues then I'll likely say that GW2 has better, more rewarding combat. Especially in PvP.

  Aethaeryn

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/14/10
Posts: 1915

5/02/12 8:48:10 PM#111
I liked the combat in TERA and found it very refreshing.  I thought that the combat in GW2 was "better" than other games but not as "fun" as Tera.  Overall I decided to go with GW2 though for other reasons.

Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

  Eir_S

Novice Member

Joined: 8/07/11
Posts: 4703

GW2 socialist.

5/02/12 8:57:48 PM#112
You make Tera fans look really bad.  Kudos.
  Amjoco

Elite Member

Joined: 9/15/10
Posts: 4096

5/02/12 9:02:11 PM#113

This thread is starting to take an ugly, ugly turn and I see some personal jabs at one anothers.  I'm sensing a lock pretty soon....

Anyway, these are video games. I just wanted to remind you guys. :D

Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.

  Derpybird

Novice Member

Joined: 4/02/12
Posts: 1006

5/02/12 9:04:49 PM#114
Originally posted by Amjoco

This thread is starting to take an ugly, ugly turn and I see some personal jabs at one anothers.  I'm sensing a lock pretty soon....

Anyway, these are video games. I just wanted to remind you guys. :D

I'm surprised it took this long, this is an ugly topic to begin with and threads like this don't really serve a purpose IMO.

"Loading screens" are not "instances".
Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.

  Stimos8

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/14/09
Posts: 173

5/02/12 9:04:51 PM#115
dont care if anyone forms there "opinions" they turn into knowledge, thus becomming facts. And i was never talking about opinions in the first place, i was talking about common knowledge. Does runescape have better graphics then guild wars 2? there. Does guild wars 2 have better combat then TERA? obviously not. Thus forming the absolute answer.
  Amjoco

Elite Member

Joined: 9/15/10
Posts: 4096

5/02/12 9:10:44 PM#116
Originally posted by Charlizzard
Originally posted by Amjoco

This thread is starting to take an ugly, ugly turn and I see some personal jabs at one anothers.  I'm sensing a lock pretty soon....

Anyway, these are video games. I just wanted to remind you guys. :D

I'm surprised it took this long, this is an ugly topic to begin with and threads like this don't really serve a purpose IMO.

Hehe. Well I'm watch The Big Bang theory following parts of this mess. I don't think even Sheldon Cooper could figure this crap out. ;D

Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.

  Kehdar

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/28/08
Posts: 445

5/02/12 9:15:27 PM#117
Originally posted by Charlizzard
Originally posted by Amjoco

This thread is starting to take an ugly, ugly turn and I see some personal jabs at one anothers.  I'm sensing a lock pretty soon....

Anyway, these are video games. I just wanted to remind you guys. :D

I'm surprised it took this long, this is an ugly topic to begin with and threads like this don't really serve a purpose IMO.

This is so true, i'm asking myself why moderators are letting this continue tbh.

  terabestgame

Novice Member

Joined: 5/02/12
Posts: 6

5/02/12 9:16:18 PM#118

this is sad i voted for gw2

 

but tera only 20% :(

 

o well, tera is gonna fail eventually

  Amjoco

Elite Member

Joined: 9/15/10
Posts: 4096

5/02/12 9:19:29 PM#119
Originally posted by terabestgame

this is sad i voted for gw2

 

but tera only 20% :(

 

o well, tera is gonna fail eventually

Oh man your name in itself is trouble! This forum is better than a Stephen King novel.

Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.

  SonicTHI

Novice Member

Joined: 11/06/07
Posts: 158

5/02/12 9:19:36 PM#120

I played both betas and they both have good combat systems, much better than most other MMOs.

Personally i prefer TERAs at least for melee characters since it gives you direct control over your actions. Even with casters i think TERA comes out ahead but by a much smaller margin. Its also a bit less twitchy and more tactical form what i ve seen.

 

That said IMO in general GW2 is a much better game with all the necessary features and lack of nuisances such as grind, rng and monthly fees.

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