Why is my shuttle faster than my cruiser?

/nerd on  - smaller objects(mass)  are easyer to move true time-space then large objects- /nerd off

well thats how they tend to trow it at us in games and movies, in "real" size or mass should not matter at all since star travel would be based on space folding and mass does not matter since time-space folding/travel will always be at the same speed (or should I say has no speed.. )  and is limeted by the energy output you are able to preform. more energy output = bigger folds =more mass movement.

well someting like that..

Because Cryptic doesn't know what they are doing?

Because in a game, whose physics are derived from Champions Online, size does in fact effect your speed, even though it shouldn't.

Yep, because Cryptic doesn't know what they are doing. ;)

Originally posted by C_Carmichael

Because in a game, whose physics are derived from Champions Online, size does in fact effect your speed, even though it shouldn't.

Yes it should.  The shuttle is much smaller and lighter than a Star Cruiser or Odyssey.  There is an enormous difference in mass between the two.

What does mass have to do with anything when propulsion systems scale up in power?

A sheer difference in maneuverability is understandable, but speed?

Originally posted by MMOarQQ

What does mass have to do with anything when propulsion systems scale up in power?

A sheer difference in maneuverability is understandable, but speed?

What goes faster, a cigar boat or a nuclear powered aircraft carrier?  The latter certainly has a larger propulsion system and more available power.

Whether mass should affect objects in space that are using "magic" to travel is another story, but in general most space fiction treats space combat more along the lines of surface based navel combat (or fighter mechanics) rather than using real life space physics.

Originally posted by Kyleran

Originally posted by MMOarQQ

What does mass have to do with anything when propulsion systems scale up in power?

A sheer difference in maneuverability is understandable, but speed?

but in general most space fiction treats space combat more along the lines of surface based navel combat (or fighter mechanics) rather than using real life space physics.

 

I believe that was the OP's contention. I suppose there are greater sins being commited in the name of gameplay.

There is no drag in sapce, nothing to cause a large mass object to monuver slower then a smaller one, remember space is a vacum....everthing from a shuttle to a Sovereign class starship weighs the same, nothing, the closer u get to a planetary body or other space phenomenen that has gravity probebly effects a vessel but not buy alot, except a star or a black hole.

Originally posted by Knight121198

There is no drag in sapce, nothing to cause a large mass object to monuver slower then a smaller one, remember space is a vacum....everthing from a shuttle to a Sovereign class starship weighs the same, nothing, the closer u get to a planetary body or other space phenomenen that has gravity probebly effects a vessel but not buy alot, except a star or a black hole.

Maybe if there was no plants or suns or anything with a gravitational pull then yeah but space is not like that.

Mass will play a part in space just as it does on the earth no exactly the same of course.. So yes bigger objects are a lot harder to move and stop.

Ummm, none of my shuttles go faster than my Cruiser, so I guess I can't help you out.

game balance. large ships get more damage and tank. small ships get maneuverability and speed. newtonian (much less relativistic) physics is "hard" on games.

Are you saying that shuttles have a higher warp/impulse speed than your cruiser? 

Impulse engines can effect top speed at impulse, but not warp, but they pretty clearly state what speed bonus you get.

Originally posted by Kyleran 

What goes faster, a cigar boat or a nuclear powered aircraft carrier?  The latter certainly has a larger propulsion system and more available power.

Whether mass should affect objects in space that are using "magic" to travel is another story, but in general most space fiction treats space combat more along the lines of surface based navel combat (or fighter mechanics) rather than using real life space physics.

There are also those fast boats the navys using that are several times the size of a speedboat and still faster than most.

But all that does not matter here, what is important is how fast the ships go in Star trek. Adding real life physics that goes against the iP is still wrong.

Size only matter relatively to the power of the engine. A spaceshuttle is faster than a Fokker dreidecker even if the Fokker is a lot smaller.

Originally posted by Knight121198

There is no drag in sapce, nothing to cause a large mass object to monuver slower then a smaller one, remember space is a vacum....everthing from a shuttle to a Sovereign class starship weighs the same, nothing, the closer u get to a planetary body or other space phenomenen that has gravity probebly effects a vessel but not buy alot, except a star or a black hole.

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by Knight121198

There is no drag in sapce, nothing to cause a large mass object to monuver slower then a smaller one, remember space is a vacum....everthing from a shuttle to a Sovereign class starship weighs the same, nothing, the closer u get to a planetary body or other space phenomenen that has gravity probebly effects a vessel but not buy alot, except a star or a black hole.

 

You are confusing mass and weight, weight is a combination of mass affected by gravity, objects in a vacuum with minimal gravity affects still have mass, and to convert that mass into movement requires power, more mass needs more power.

Also, confusing Star Trek Online with a game that would give a crap about physics in space.  ;)

Originally posted by Robsolf

Originally posted by RefMinor

Originally posted by Knight121198

There is no drag in sapce, nothing to cause a large mass object to monuver slower then a smaller one, remember space is a vacum....everthing from a shuttle to a Sovereign class starship weighs the same, nothing, the closer u get to a planetary body or other space phenomenen that has gravity probebly effects a vessel but not buy alot, except a star or a black hole.

 

You are confusing mass and weight, weight is a combination of mass affected by gravity, objects in a vacuum with minimal gravity affects still have mass, and to convert that mass into movement requires power, more mass needs more power.

Also, confusing Star Trek Online with a game that would give a crap about physics in space.  ;)

Originally posted by Loke666

But all that does not matter here, what is important is how fast the ships go in Star trek. Adding real life physics that goes against the iP is still wrong.

Size only matter relatively to the power of the engine. A spaceshuttle is faster than a Fokker dreidecker even if the Fokker is a lot smaller.

It does not go against the IP.  There have been several episodes of the various Trek TV shows that reference this.  An example off the top of my head is the TNG episode "Relics".  Scotty comments on the U.S.S. Jenolin (sp?) being something to the effect of an "old bucket of bolts/junk".  Geordi replies that while old, the ship could "fly circles around the Enterprise at impulse speeds".  IIRC, this was mentioned quite a few times on Voyager with regard to the Delta Flyer.  The Defiant was able to out manuever / out run much larger ships.  Watch the Dominion War battle scenes and you will clearly see the smaller ships and fighter craft outmanuevering the larger capital ships.

I am sure there are many explanations of this in the various technical manuals produced as well in explaining systems like RCS thrusters, inertial dampeners etc.

Originally posted by ShardWarrior

Originally posted by Loke666

But all that does not matter here, what is important is how fast the ships go in Star trek. Adding real life physics that goes against the iP is still wrong.

Size only matter relatively to the power of the engine. A spaceshuttle is faster than a Fokker dreidecker even if the Fokker is a lot smaller.

It does not go against the IP.  There have been several episodes of the various Trek TV shows that reference this.  An example off the top of my head is the TNG episode "Relics".  Scotty comments on the U.S.S. Jenolin (sp?) being something to the effect of an "old bucket of bolts/junk".  Geordi replies that while old, the ship could "fly circles around the Enterprise at impulse speeds".  IIRC, this was mentioned quite a few times on Voyager with regard to the Delta Flyer.  The Defiant was able to out manuever / out run much larger ships.  Watch the Dominion War battle scenes and you will clearly see the smaller ships and fighter craft outmanuevering the larger capital ships.

 

I am sure there are many explanations of this in the various technical manuals produced as well in explaining systems like RCS thrusters, inertial dampeners etc.

Good explanation, but the OP is talking about faster, not more manuverable. My newest cruiser turns like a turtle in peanut butter, but it will still outrun my shuttles. The Defiant is a full-fledged ship, small yes, but a ship not a shuttle.

Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but I thought the original comment was about faster, like at full impulse or warp; i.e. getting from here to there.

Originally posted by WhiteLantern

Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but I thought the original comment was about faster, like at full impulse or warp; i.e. getting from here to there.

Which if this is the case, I would agree with your earlier comment.  None of my shuttles go faster than any of my other ships either.   The OP needs to clarify.