Originally posted by InFaVilla

Originally posted by Blackrayn

 

You contradict yourself in so many ways! So then with that statement right there, you will be playing this game for a long time! Why? Cause the majority of these votes are at 7+ Not 5 or passable on this scale (but yet still the average of 1-10) and since you will not stay in a game that grand majority will vote it as passable, then you have nothing to worry about, cause the grand majority is voting it higher then just passable!

I see that I was not clear enough in making a distinction between who thinks it is passable.

 

If I find the game, according to my opinion, to just be passable, I can consider playing it for some time, but probably not pay for it and keep on playing it after a few months. 

 

If many people are giving it 7+ votes, then that is a sign for me to at least try it out unless another game has captured my attention. 

Then why didn't you just say that in your first post instead of throwing around inacurate numbers! I'm sorry but, I will never agree with you using 7 and below as a average number for the game being bad in a poll on a 1-10 scale.

Originally posted by InFaVilla

Originally posted by Blackrayn

Lol, well alright then. So that means everything over 5 is great. And when you run the numbers like that, the numbers blow up even higher! It don't matter really I guess everyone has there own views on how a 1-10 scale works. But, I can tell you that not being a MIT educated person here, that I do know that the "average" between 1-10 is 5!

Yes, but that was not the average I was refering to. I was under the impression that people thought that the ideal average MMORPG is worth 5 in all categories; which I think is a wrong assumption. 

 

So to reitirate:

if we only look at the numbers of 1-10 scale, then that average X of the numbers in that scale is 5.

if we look at the scores from all modern MMORPG in  1-10 scales, where does the average Y of those scores land? My guess is significantely above 5.

 

Two different averages, X and Y, where one is far more interesting than the other one. 

You're getting waayyyy to sophisticated and mathmatical here. I've read a lot of your previous post. You like to throw your education around in arguments by using words and theories that make you feel superior..which is fine.. to each their own. Btw, I shouldn't be reported here, as I didn't call you a name, or flame, just pointing out the obvious. I respect your opinion... when you eventually get around to it. I don't typically agree, but I can respect it. 

It seems that the orignal poster was trying to get a feeling of where the community stood on the game, not whether or not people should buy the game using a "great" "not that great" scale. I picked up on your first post appearing to be biased and it was then pointed out by numerous others. You have said you don't particularytiy like the MMO genre, though you tried. So why hang around?

I'm happy that the polls are speaking for themselves.. there is no reason for anyone to sum them up. 

Originally posted by Alalala

Originally posted by InFaVilla

Let me summarize the poll results so far (200+ votes when I write this):

 

Story: 69.3% voted "Great or better" (8+) and 30.7% voted "Good or worse" (7-)

Combat/Gameplay: 50.4% voted 8+ and 49.6% voted 7-

Graphics/Character Design: 34.1% voted 8+ and 65.9% voted 7-

Group Content/World Content: 54.2% voted 8+ and 45.8% voted 7-

Companions/Crew Skills: 64.8% voted 8+ and 35.2% voted 7-

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As you can see from the numbers, there is a large amount of people, although not a majority, who think that SWTOR is currently not that great. 

 

We can also see that SWTOR gets high points in Story in Companions/Crew skills categories. Which is what is expected. Far from perfect scores, but nonetheless good ones.

 

We also see that a majority didn't think the Graphics/Character design was that great. 

 

What utter nonsense.   I'm not particularily fond of this game, but this is such a poor post that I had to comment.

I tried to put together a snarky and biting reply, but this is such a horrible attempt to rip a game and so poorly constructed, that there's nothing that I could add, as even the even the most mentally-challenged individual could see this post for the time-wasting garbage that it is.

Regarding the graphics, I would hope that most people who follow MMOs would instantly recognize Bioware/EA's decision to put the graphics at a lower point in order to maximize the number of potential customers (some of which simply cannot invest in a high-end machine).  Just smart business.

To the OP: Simply say the game doesn't appeal to you and be done with it.

 

It seems like what I intended to say did not reach the readers. I've tried to clarify in posts after that post. Specially feel free to comment my lastest post above and point out whether or not that's nonsense too.

Good idea maskedweasel! I'm wondering if the current 7.2% that chose "show results" are the ones that skipped the story so they have no opinion on it. I wished that option wasn't even included in the polls but oh well.

Can we get this stickied?

Originally posted by Praetalus

Originally posted by InFaVilla

Originally posted by Blackrayn

Lol, well alright then. So that means everything over 5 is great. And when you run the numbers like that, the numbers blow up even higher! It don't matter really I guess everyone has there own views on how a 1-10 scale works. But, I can tell you that not being a MIT educated person here, that I do know that the "average" between 1-10 is 5!

Yes, but that was not the average I was refering to. I was under the impression that people thought that the ideal average MMORPG is worth 5 in all categories; which I think is a wrong assumption. 

 

So to reitirate:

if we only look at the numbers of 1-10 scale, then that average X of the numbers in that scale is 5.

if we look at the scores from all modern MMORPG in  1-10 scales, where does the average Y of those scores land? My guess is significantely above 5.

 

Two different averages, X and Y, where one is far more interesting than the other one. 

You're getting waayyyy to sophisticated and mathmatical here. I've read a lot of your previous post. You like to throw your education around in arguments by using words and theories that make you feel superior..which is fine.. to each their own. Btw, I shouldn't be reported here, as I didn't call you a name, or flame, just pointing out the obvious. I respect your opinion... when you eventually get around to it. I don't typically agree, but I can respect it. 

 

It seems that the orignal poster was trying to get a feeling of where the community stood on the game, not whether or not people should buy the game using a "great" "not that great" scale. I picked up on your first post appearing to be biased and it was then pointed out by numerous others. You have said you don't particularytiy like the MMO genre, though you tried. So why hang around?

 

I'm happy that the polls are speaking for themselves.. there is no reason for anyone to sum them up. 

 

 

I think it simply comes down to which average people are talking about. I wrongly assumed that people were talking about the "average" in the context where we only look at "AAA MMORPGS" or "AAA MMORPGs and other modern MMORPGS".

I believe polls like the one in the start in this thread, are missguiding in the sense that they do not say anything about how other "AAA MMORPGS and modern MMORPGS" do in those categories.  Which I think is an extremely relevant question.

A person who is new to the scene may think that a "good or great" in that poll automatically means that is "good or great" in comparison with other "AAA MMORPG and modern MMORPG" alternatives on the market. That is though a flawed assumption. 

The poll is based on the merits of the game not relative to other games. I would have thought you would get that by now.

Originally posted by mmoguy43

The poll is based on the merits of the game not relative to other games. I would have thought you would get that by now.

Then my initial division into groups of 0-7 and 8-10 is one that can be used to get a feel about how it compares relatively to other games. 

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Originally posted by mmoguy43
Good idea maskedweasel! I'm wondering if the current 7.2% that chose "show results" are the ones that skipped the story so they have no opinion on it. I wished that option wasn't even included in the polls but oh well.
Can we get this stickied?

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Originally posted by lizardbones

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Originally posted by mmoguy43
Good idea maskedweasel! I'm wondering if the current 7.2% that chose "show results" are the ones that skipped the story so they have no opinion on it. I wished that option wasn't even included in the polls but oh well.
Can we get this stickied?

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What if "Show Results" was "Muffins"? Would that be OK? You'd be competing with Muffins, but I think most people would vote how they felt about the game.

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Lizard, not sure why I quoted you too, but now I am too lazy to correct it, sorry. :)

Originally posted by lizardbones

 

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Originally posted by mmoguy43
Good idea maskedweasel! I'm wondering if the current 7.2% that chose "show results" are the ones that skipped the story so they have no opinion on it. I wished that option wasn't even included in the polls but oh well.
Can we get this stickied?

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What if "Show Results" was "Muffins"? Would that be OK? You'd be competing with Muffins, but I think most people would vote how they felt about the game.

 

No if muffins was an option that would be horrible! It would skew the results in favor of voters that haven't eaten breakfast yet which would be very hard to get accurate results based on timezone or time of day or people's eating habits!

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Originally posted by mmoguy43
The poll is based on the merits of the game not relative to other games. I would have thought you would get that by now.

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Originally posted by mmoguy43

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Originally posted by lizardbones
 

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Originally posted by mmoguy43
Good idea maskedweasel! I'm wondering if the current 7.2% that chose "show results" are the ones that skipped the story so they have no opinion on it. I wished that option wasn't even included in the polls but oh well.
Can we get this stickied?

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What if "Show Results" was "Muffins"? Would that be OK? You'd be competing with Muffins, but I think most people would vote how they felt about the game.

 

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No if muffins was an option that would be horrible! It would skew the results in favor of voters that haven't eaten breakfast yet which would be very hard to get accurate results based on timezone or time of day or people's eating habits!

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Originally posted by Herodes

The "show results" is a good thing, because else people who didn´t play it would vote something random, just to see the results.

Lizard, not sure why I quoted you too, but now I am too lazy to correct it, sorry. :)

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With the exception of a few things this is just about everything I am looking for in an MMO.

Originally posted by Charas

I gave a 7+ to everything except companions. I already can't stand them and I refuse to ever use one again. Seeing everyone running around with their stupid cloned companion is a severe immersion breaker for me, and where the hell is the option to mute their useless ramblings???

Also wtf is up with sending them on errands?? Click a button, wait 3 minutes, click another button...profit. That's one of the most uninspired features I've seen in an MMO in a long while...

 

I am going to have to disagree on this one, no disrepect meant towards your comments, but I feel the companions make things a little more interesting. I mean sneding them to go sell my crap loots while I go take care of business with a trainer, for example, is pretty nice and saves me from needing to visit a vendor just to off load my crap. Not to mention it makes them feel more, I don't know, a part of the envirnment and not just some mindless tag along.

Originally posted by lizardbones

 

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Originally posted by mmoguy43
The poll is based on the merits of the game not relative to other games. I would have thought you would get that by now.

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I voted relative to what I thought Bioware could have or should have done with the features mentioned. Everything I've seen up to this point is included in that vote, including what I've seen other games do or not do. Even games that aren't MMORPG. If someone played Mass Effect or one of the other Bioware story driven games, they would be comparing SW:ToR's story system with Mass Effect's story system. Same thing with the graphics, combat, etc. Everyone who voted used their past experience as a baseline, unless they never played a video game.

 

Alright, I see what you are saying. So if you've never played a video game before this would be a perfect 10. If you played every MMO in the past 3 years the vote may be "Very good". Or only sandbox MMOs in 10 years you'd vote a "Bad". Now I realize it is much more complicated for the 0-7 8-10 system to work.

Originally posted by jlhamilton06

Originally posted by Charas

I gave a 7+ to everything except companions. I already can't stand them and I refuse to ever use one again. Seeing everyone running around with their stupid cloned companion is a severe immersion breaker for me, and where the hell is the option to mute their useless ramblings???

Also wtf is up with sending them on errands?? Click a button, wait 3 minutes, click another button...profit. That's one of the most uninspired features I've seen in an MMO in a long while...

 

I am going to have to disagree on this one, no disrepect meant towards your comments, but I feel the companions make things a little more interesting. I mean sneding them to go sell my crap loots while I go take care of business with a trainer, for example, is pretty nice and saves me from needing to visit a vendor just to off load my crap. Not to mention it makes them feel more, I don't know, a part of the envirnment and not just some mindless tag along.

I agree.  I really liked being able to send my pet to sell my crap items in Torchlight so I'm glad they added it to SWTOR.

Having played the latest beta weekend I can finally give my thoughts from what I experienced.

Story - I voted 9, played the Imperial Agent into the early twenties and a Sith Warrior to nineteen and felt thoroughly engrossed in the story. Bioware knows story well and made the weekend fly right by.

Combat/Gameplay - I voted 8, very much enjoyed the overall combat system. The cover system for the IA was pretty cool the animations for sliding into cover and firing really sold me on "sniper" feel of the class. While it isn't something we haven't seen before It in no way detracted from the experience and was exactly what I hoped it would be.

Graphics/Character Design - I voted 7, I didn't have any problems with the overall graphics art style in fact I rather enjoyed it, the world really sold me and only helped pull me into the story (absolutely loved Kaas City, really captured what I imagined an Imperial Capital should look like) . I do think they should have more options for character creation without a doubt, with that said it didn't stop me from creating a character that I liked so I really can't say anything all that negative about it except it needs more options.

Group Content/World Content - I voted 8, Loved what they did with the flashpoints. Played through Black Talon twice and a little of Hammer Station and I really enjoyed the choices that were given and how they effected the mission. I remember with one group in BT we killed the Captain and in another we spared him and how that decision alone literally changed the direction of the mission. World Content was pretty good, plenty of missions and scattered heroic group quests in different areas. Being low level worlds I didn't expect any PvP elements just yet and didn't have any negative experiences with Korriban/Hutta, Dromaand Kaas or Balmorra.

Companions/Crew Skills - I voted 9, I absolutely loved the companions that I had with both the IA and the SW. Vette and Kaliyo were so different from each other and very entertaining to mess with (Vette) and listen to (Kaliyo) that Its the one thing besides the story that nailed what I hoped for from the game.

Being able to shock Vette during cutscenes or when ever you want really just took me by complete surprise and really weighed on the kind of relationship I wanted my character to have with that companion. Crew Skills were pretty good, very straight forward and to the point. Having the ability to send my characters on missions while I was busy in PvP or a Flashpoint was very cool and really gave my companions that "lackey" feel but at the same time helped me even more connect with them in that they were really companions and not just "an npc that just follows you around".

I could have gone into more detail but I just want to keep it simple and to the point.

This sort of thing is always going to be biased toward the people that enjoy it, as that's the people who'll mostly frequent the forum. There are so many games on these forums that people who don't like certain ones aren't going to be going to those forums, there's just not enough hours in the day.

So, as we've seen so far, the majority of the results are going to be in the high area, some 'on the fence' voters will be in the middle, while you'll get a couple of trolls wandering through who vote 1 for everything.

Interesting results, gave is an 8.

I may be there at the start, not playing any other MMO atm, only single player games.

I hope the game delivers, no reason not to wish it.

It's been a while since i did my market research courses, but i believe that if you're going to be totalling this stuff up, you want to drop the top rank (everyone that voted 10) and the bottom rank (everyone that voted 1-3) and then just average it based on 6 possible ranks for a more true indication.  You can probably be more exact than that, but given that you lumped 1,2 and 3 together, it's kinda difficult.