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World of Warcraft

World of Warcraft 

General Discussion  » Poll should Ghostcrawler be sacked over MOP ?

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189 posts found
  jadedlevir

Novice Member

Joined: 7/10/09
Posts: 639

10/29/11 1:09:12 PM#41

I wish there was a "are you serious dude?" Option in this poll.

  User Deleted
10/29/11 1:23:38 PM#42
Originally posted by OkhamsRazor
Originally posted by idgarad
Originally posted by OkhamsRazor

Love it or hate it the facts are Mists of Pandaria has caused a huge amount of negativity on the internet . In the event the expansion underperforms in terms of units sold should Greg Street be fired from his job as lead systems designer of World of Warcraft .

The simple fact is that there are too many people involved in the expansion to single one out. If you think it is a bad idea then there are well over 20 people that need to be held accountable.

Making mistakes isn't something you fire people over, it's no learning from them that get's you fired. Everyone makes mistakes, from the CEO to the mail room. You invest a lot in employees, you don't toss them to the curb. Dozens of people were involved in the new expansion being green lighted. Those people were confident enough in the expansion to bring it to market.

Your opinion at this point does not outweight dozens, if not hundreds of professionals working on the expansion. When the expansion finally launches, then we'll see who deserves a paycheck and who is blowing hot air.

Yes actually it is something you fire people over if they are in charge . It depends on how big the mistake is and how damaging it is .

At the end of the day no one will probably fire Greg Street but if things go badly then pressure on him to resign will be such that he will have no other option . A bit like Richard Nixon in Watergate for example . He jumped before he was pushed .

Pandagate . (joke).


Everyone makes mistakes.  Admit them, correct them, and move on. The things he does are not just simple mistakes.  The fact that they reinforce an image of complete lack of understanding on his part is a very valid reason to fire him.  The fact that he will not concede them as wrong until an entire expansion later regardless of proof proves he still needs to grow up and act like a professional.  Which could also be said for several others working there as well.

  Laughing-man

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/23/09
Posts: 3373

I thought what I'd do is I'd pretend I was one of those Deaf-mutes.

10/29/11 1:28:46 PM#43
Originally posted by OkhamsRazor

Love it or hate it the facts are Mists of Pandaria has caused a huge amount of negativity on the internet .

Also I've seen a lot of positivity too...

I think you see what you wanna see...

I've had multiple friends start logging on again since MoP was announced BECAUSE of its features.

Had one friend start playing WoW for the first time in three years when they announced the pokemon fighting type system.

In short, no, MoP will be a great ex pack, you guys are in the vocal minority still, don't forget it, all of us are.

Forum goers ARE the vocal minority.

  OkhamsRazor

Novice Member

Joined: 7/08/10
Posts: 1066

 
OP  10/29/11 1:35:11 PM#44
Originally posted by Sovrath

No of course not. I don't believe in taking away a person's livelyhood for a mistake.

And regardless that he is the head of development, he is not the head of the company. I'm sure there are checks and balances so that he can't do anything he wants.

If it does poorly then they need to have a meeting and really discuss the direction of their game.

I highly suspect that it won't do as poorly as people would want. My guess is that the majority fo wow players won't care.

If your in charge and the mistake is so big its damaging to the company your work for then the buck stops with you .

Small mistakes by people further down the ladder are a totally different thing .

  User Deleted
10/29/11 1:36:18 PM#45
Forum goers ARE the vocal minority.

So wrong on so many levels.

That said, someone else said it best about the Pandas.  "They are no more ridiculous than any other WoW race."  I'm more concerned with their continued changes to talents that remove all choice when they say the opposite.  And by that I mean that what little choices they tried to add in Cat and MoP are not really a choice to begin with.  You can't choose things that have little to no impact on your character and feel good about it.  Having a choice in things that don't really matter is not a real choice.

  GrayGhost79

Novice Member

Joined: 8/30/08
Posts: 4888

10/29/11 1:36:32 PM#46
Originally posted by adderVXI

Im wondering if the amount of losses in the EU NA market will be made up for in the Asian market.  As a person thats spent some time there, they love te hell out of pandas!

Meh, not sure honestly. China has legislation in place to prohibit and limit the explotation of pandas. 

People think "Omg China loves anything panda related" but the reverence that they have for the panda is more akin to the reverence India has for cows. Not quite to the extreme of India but it's close. 

  Laughing-man

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/23/09
Posts: 3373

I thought what I'd do is I'd pretend I was one of those Deaf-mutes.

10/29/11 1:37:59 PM#47
Originally posted by paroxysm
Forum goers ARE the vocal minority.

So wrong on so many levels.

That said, someone else said it best about the Pandas.  "They are no more rediculous than any other WoW race."  I'm more concerned with their continued changes to talents that remove all choice when they say the opposite.  And by that I mean that what little choices they tried to add in Cat and MoP are not really a choice to begin with.  You can't choose things that have little to no impact on your character and feel good about it.  Having a choice in things that don't really matter is not a real choice.

Your opinion doesnt' change facts?

Sorry ...

This has been a well known fact for a long long time that the people who log into the forums ARE the vocal minority.  If you have been paying attention to any blog posts or forum posts or frankly been active in the community you'd know how little we have an effect on it, and how our opinions are VERY RARELY inline with the main stream players.

Notice, WoW is WAAAAY down on the populairty list on this website, yet some how its the most played MMO of all time?

Gee, I wonder if thats because of the audience of this site?

 

Edit: Also you are entitled to your opinion on the talent trees, however saying they dont' provide actual choice is just wrong... factually incorrect...

sorry.

  scragcat

Novice Member

Joined: 8/23/04
Posts: 94

10/29/11 1:40:44 PM#48

why would Blizzard sack someone who is gonna be helping them make a cool few million $ profit?? (and thats prolly only the first month of MoP).

If Blizzard went in the direction the 1% (or whatever low percentage it is) of their customers who come to boards like this to state why their opinions are right then  WoW would have probably gone f2p around Burning Crusade time due to lack of subs.

 

  OkhamsRazor

Novice Member

Joined: 7/08/10
Posts: 1066

 
OP  10/29/11 1:43:02 PM#49
Originally posted by Laughing-man
Originally posted by OkhamsRazor

Love it or hate it the facts are Mists of Pandaria has caused a huge amount of negativity on the internet .

Also I've seen a lot of positivity too...

I think you see what you wanna see...

I've had multiple friends start logging on again since MoP was announced BECAUSE of its features.

Had one friend start playing WoW for the first time in three years when they announced the pokemon fighting type system.

In short, no, MoP will be a great ex pack, you guys are in the vocal minority still, don't forget it, all of us are.

Forum goers ARE the vocal minority.

Then why did Blizzard feel a need to come out and defend this expansion ?

Also forum goers are just as likly to the ardent fanboy with a possative view as someone with a negative view so it is a pretty even mix and a good barometer of whats going on .

From friends in WoW I hear the views of the community seam to be  pretty much split down the middle in regards to MOP . If thats true then its unpresidented in WoW and it means a large chunk of thier playerbase isn't happy .

  OkhamsRazor

Novice Member

Joined: 7/08/10
Posts: 1066

 
OP  10/29/11 1:47:24 PM#50
Originally posted by scragcat

why would Blizzard sack someone who is gonna be helping them make a cool few million $ profit?? (and thats prolly only the first month of MoP).

If Blizzard went in the direction the 1% (or whatever low percentage it is) of their customers who come to boards like this to state why their opinions are right then  WoW would have probably gone f2p around Burning Crusade time due to lack of subs.

 

This really refers to what I said earlier . At what point will it considered to be a error of judgement . The expansion itself will make money but if it signifcantly underperforms compared to the last one and leads to a drop in the number of subs over a year following its release then it will be deamed a faliure .

 

  User Deleted
10/29/11 1:50:30 PM#51
Originally posted by Laughing-man
Originally posted by paroxysm
Forum goers ARE the vocal minority.

So wrong on so many levels.

That said, someone else said it best about the Pandas.  "They are no more rediculous than any other WoW race."  I'm more concerned with their continued changes to talents that remove all choice when they say the opposite.  And by that I mean that what little choices they tried to add in Cat and MoP are not really a choice to begin with.  You can't choose things that have little to no impact on your character and feel good about it.  Having a choice in things that don't really matter is not a real choice.

Your opinion doesnt' change facts?

Sorry ...

This has been a well known fact for a long long time that the people who log into the forums ARE the vocal minority.  If you have been paying attention to any blog posts or forum posts or frankly been active in the community you'd know how little we have an effect on it, and how our opinions are VERY RARELY inline with the main stream players.

Notice, WoW is WAAAAY down on the populairty list on this website, yet some how its the most played MMO of all time?

Gee, I wonder if thats because of the audience of this site?


There is way more to consider.  The amount of people still playing is also relative to the amount of people who don't stop paying for a game while they are paying for and playing several others.  It's also relative to the amount of "good" choices in the mmo market at this time.  People are still waiting for new games.  Those numbers show who is paying at the moment, but are not a good prediction of tomorrow.  They aren't even a good indicator for the true population of a game at any given time. 

I think you underestimate what feedback is given in comparison to how they try to belittle the value of the forums, the amount of emails you never see, the amount of people who quit without a word and leave Blizz guessing as to why, and the people who agree or disagree but realise no one is listening and posting so would have no impact on the people making the decisions because they straight up tell you that your opinion is not valued.  Blizz treats the forums as step children.  They prefer blogs where you can't question their egos.

This site is more of an unbiased site in that negative comments are not removed as trolling.  You get both opinions as long as it's thought out.  Meanwhile negative posts are deleted on the WoW forums as trolling while leaving pages of "umadbro" "QQ" is encouraged. 

 

[edit] reworded for clarity [/edit]

  rojoArcueid

Elite Member

Joined: 8/13/09
Posts: 5317

"It is double pleasure to deceive the deceiver". - Niccolo Machiavelli

10/29/11 1:51:51 PM#52

troll poll....

i voted no

people complained that Wotlk screwed up WoW, then cata came out and ppl changed their minds saying that cata screwed WoW and Wotlk was great.... Now MoP will come out and ppl say WoW was perfect until the MoP announcement..... ppl has nothing to cry about anymore.... and now they want Ghostcrawlers head lol.... pity...

i bet all the whiners will sub to MoP at least for 1 month, unless they have never played WoW and like to troll around like....[insert adjective here]..... yeah, like that.

you can always give your opinion and then move on... thats it....  if WoW is getting worse with each expansion then blame the other game devs for not being good enough to beat WoW...  and move on

:)

My endgame begins with character creation and ends with a new mmorpg

  User Deleted
10/29/11 2:33:09 PM#53
Originally posted by Laughing-man
Originally posted by paroxysm
Forum goers ARE the vocal minority.

So wrong on so many levels.

That said, someone else said it best about the Pandas.  "They are no more rediculous than any other WoW race."  I'm more concerned with their continued changes to talents that remove all choice when they say the opposite.  And by that I mean that what little choices they tried to add in Cat and MoP are not really a choice to begin with.  You can't choose things that have little to no impact on your character and feel good about it.  Having a choice in things that don't really matter is not a real choice.

 

Edit: Also you are entitled to your opinion on the talent trees, however saying they dont' provide actual choice is just wrong... factually incorrect...

sorry.

Ok.  I'm 100% fine with you having a differing opinion, but to call your opinion fact with nothing to back it up as evidence is kind of ironic.  So, please feel free to provide this factual proof.  I'm very curious to see it.

  User Deleted
10/29/11 2:37:05 PM#54

Now we're at "off with their heads"? If only the other MMOs out now were such a failure. 

  User Deleted
10/29/11 2:49:55 PM#55
Originally posted by nblitz

Now we're at "off with their heads"? If only the other MMOs out now were such a failure. 

With great success comes even greater expectations.  Failing to meet those expectations leads to endless scorn.

If you've never found great success, expectations do not follow that demand such greatness.

 

I still miss the old Blizzard.

  Sinaku

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/07
Posts: 461

10/29/11 2:53:06 PM#56

I dont think he should be fired for this but for a number of other things

  kalinis

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 1444

10/29/11 2:57:07 PM#57

hell no is what i vote. Lets start with i truly believe blizzard strives to make wow the best game they can in there eyes. I love the direction mop is taken.

No big baddie just like vanilla wow focus on horde vs alliance i9nstead of both sides killing a big bad. pet battle system is a good idea for collectors of pets like my gf.

She will spend so much time doing that at max level. Then the revamp of a talent system that never has had any choice since the cookie cutter build was neeeded to do anything at max level. 

And i like pandaran race. And asian themed new areas and im hoping there updated character models make it into mop.

I wasnt that happy with cata but that was due to the changes to tanking and healing i think they went to far in there changes. 

That said i loved the new ravamp of the old areas and the new areas like uldum they added were cool. archeology didnt really work out in my opinion was boring as all get out .

While most of my freinds left in cata and as such i ended up not playing as much as usual i hope they coem back for mop and if not ill enjoy leveling my pandaran monk. 

And seeing the new areas  they are adding for mop.

  Drekker17

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/01/11
Posts: 291

10/29/11 3:09:57 PM#58

No. However, if MoP does bad (unlikely), he might be the one getting punished even though I'm positive others have a stronger role in how MoP will be. I mean I can't think of any other big name in Blizzard that would be punished as nobody else is more hated than Ghostcrawler...Metzen is highly praised, everyone else is neutral...so if they mess up they would use his firing as a publicity stunt to reassure people.

When it comes to the success of MoP, I doubt it would be worse than Cataclysm. Cataclysm came after two highly praised expansions, so its expectations were higher than it will be for MoP. Also, I was never there for the BC release, but for Wrath and Cata release, Blizzard sounded like they could do no wrong, while when talking about MoP,  they are mostly positive, but seemed more aware that they've messed up somewhere.

"Great minds talk about ideas, average minds talk about events, and small minds talk about people." - Eleanor Roosevelt
"Americans used to roar like lions for liberty; now we bleat like sheep for security." -Norman Vincent Peale

  Faelsun

Novice Member

Joined: 6/23/07
Posts: 482

10/29/11 5:47:41 PM#59

He should have been sacked at WOTLK before his bad ideas became unrepairable and the game unredeemable.

  User Deleted
10/29/11 6:08:37 PM#60
Originally posted by OkhamsRazor

Love it or hate it the facts are Mists of Pandaria has caused a huge amount of negativity on the internet . In the event the expansion underperforms in terms of units sold should Greg Street be fired from his job as lead systems designer of World of Warcraft .

Not only should he be sacked for this idiotic idea he should be sacked for the following:

 

- right after taking office, not separating the pvp and pve skills of the classes so as to keep pvp balance and make it never affect pve again

- placing absolutley NO importance on crafting in the end game and hardly releasing anything of value 6 months after starting Cata for raid gear

- observing favoritism for one class, only someone who lives in la la land would believe that magic missiles do more damage then bullets and arrows.

- requiring in this newest installment that all players return to the ground mounts until they reach 90

- forcing countless players to play cookie cutter expansions and mini patches like 5 new reputations 1 temporary reputation related to raids just for blues etc etc.

 

He is single handedly the reason why i left the game so there is no love for him in my house. The man's a Marine Biologist, seriously, don't put scientists in charge of a game. The underwater areas of Cata were pretty don't get me wrong but they quickly became completely useless at end game.

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