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News & Features Discussion  » Star Wars: The Old Republic: Is Fatigue Setting In?

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176 posts found
  elocke

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/15/04
Posts: 4080

9/21/11 9:35:59 AM#41

I'm fatigued.  Tired of waiting.  I think the big issue this year is the huge slow down on MMOs releasing.  While the last few years haven't seen stellar releases, they at least kept me busy.  While Rift was the only one worthwhile and even that is too small of a game to keep me longer than 6 months.  I think if I had a new MMO to play to hold me over I wouldn't feel any fatigue at all.  

Matter of fact, the developers of Tera have shot themselves in the foot on this one with a missed opportunity to fill the last few months before SWTOR and GW2 hit.  It would have been the perfect game to hold me over and later down the road something to step back into.  At this point though, they'll be lucky if I ever "try" their game.

Also, on a side note, I really hope this won't be par for the course come post launch content.  It's bad enough Blizzard has strung us along all these years with their ultra long development time on content patches, Bioware better not copy that bad habit.  I point at Trion as the company to mimick or take notes from.

http://www.twitch.tv/elockethemmoaddict

https://twitter.com/MMOAddicted

  BadSpock

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7682

Logic be damned!

9/21/11 9:36:28 AM#42
Originally posted by bumuscheekus

I have a shiny fat big 8 quid/15 dollars sitting in my piggy bank for a game worth the sub. Sadly I dont think a game where: being shot in the face 10 times with molten hot laser bolts has no effect on your fleshy mug; Consulars repeatedly pull the same identical ship engine out of the ground to bash peoples faces in or npcs can be clobbered over and over on the noggin with promethian lightsabres that have been presented from childhood to cut through reinforced ship hulls with little effort is not going to be it. 

Have you actually stopped and thought about how BAD of a MMORPG it would make to have all those things realistic in the game?

 

Now Playing: D3:RoS, Watch Dogs
Looking Towards: Destiny

  Gruug

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/03/08
Posts: 1139

The more you know, the more you know you don't know.

9/21/11 9:39:11 AM#43
Originally posted by Elidien

So let's look at Bioware's options:

Set a release date - Fail to meet release date - move date back = community upset

Set a release date - Launch - game not up to standards (it will never meet this community's expectations) = community upset

Don't set a release date - game launches well = community upset (because it took too long)

Don't set a release date - game launches poorly = community upset (because it wasn't finished)

-----

Point is, Bioware cannot win. So Bioware does what they need too - launch when its ready. People will still play it and nothing will change that. People, I do not think, are not running out canceling their pre-orders.

At this point, the game better launch well or their will be a lot of anger and rightfully so. Most people will tolerate the time it takes to release the game if it releases well. if not, it could get ugly for sure.

 

The only problem here is that at some point EA will step in and say "release it" whether ready or not. EA's track record in doing just that is well documented with buggy and half finished games that failed terribly. I am sure the folks at BW want to "release when its ready" but EA may not...no...won't allow it.

Let's party like it is 1863!

  BadSpock

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7682

Logic be damned!

9/21/11 9:40:25 AM#44
Originally posted by Gruug

The only problem here is that at some point EA will step in and say "release it" whether ready or not. EA's track record in doing just that is well documented with buggy and half finished games that failed terribly. I am sure the folks at BW want to "release when its ready" but EA may not...no...won't allow it.

I guess then you have to hope that EA learned their lesson from WAR.

I think they have.

Now Playing: D3:RoS, Watch Dogs
Looking Towards: Destiny

  User Deleted
9/21/11 9:41:10 AM#45

To me its not just the "wait".

 

They started pre-orders at midnight pacific time because of a show they were at.   I'm sure people that visit this site or sites like it knew because of the "leaks".   The vast majority of people probably don't come to forums like this and wake up to find that pre-orders started while they were asleep and they had no idea...

 

As I said that doesn't affect people like us who come to a site like this.   However, it does piss off people who don't...

 

They shouldn't have started those pre-orders until they had a release date to announce.   Retailers letting you pre-order is a different thing than "official pre-orders". 

 

Add in the wait...

 

Then they announce September beta weekends.. which was their choice to do so.   This of course gets a bunch of people (who aren't in beta) excited.   So they bring in a relatively small batch (dev post on official site more or less called it a small batch) on Sept 2nd..  

 

So the following week they talk about how well the beta weekend went and how positive the feedback was on it.

 

Followed by "Oh by the way Euro's we are delaying your beta invites because we have a new build" and then... *drum roll*  as was obviously coming... "beta weekends are on hold because of the new build"

 

Followed by:   "We are going to re-invite the Sept 2nd beta weekend people because their weekend wasn't optimal.."  <- Um what?   After that weekend you said how smooth it went and how positive the feedback was.. somehow these things do not mesh together to form logic.

 

So now its Sept 21st and as far as I'm aware no official announcement on anything...  So outside of an announcement today and a test this weekend.. September was "beta weekend"

 

Now the important thing here is they said the beta weekends were mostly to help them simulate a "launch condition" in other words heavily populated newb zones...  they need to have that done in order to launch.

 

Add in the wait again...

 

people who pre-ordered and how that was handled..

 

More or less really for a while there haven't been "new" announcements... just rehashes of the same announcements

 

Obviously something went wrong around Sept 2nd

 

Obviously they knew they had a "new build" coming but started beta weekends anyway.  

 

To me the wait like everything else is a path of decisions that BioWare has made.   It seems like there is a lack of actual leadership and/or communication within the company.   I gotta say at this point I didn't stick with Rift very long.. but Rift was Trion's "first MMO" as much as TOR can be BioWares first MMO... official pre-orders for Rift I think started about 3 months before release... and there just seemed to be a lot more communication and progress.. even if the game was lacking various things (my opinion) it was very smooth.

 

TOR's biggest issue from my perspecitve.. as I said.. is BioWare and they way they have handled things.

 

If nothing else:

 

1) Pre-Orders going "live" should have been made much more public so the vast majority of potential customers knew to camp the pre-order page.

 

2) Pre-Orders should not have started until they had a firm internal launch date of more or less 3 months from official pre-order start.

 

3)  Beta Weekends should not have been announced until they could run more than 1 in a 30 day period (they might get 2 but magic 8 ball seems to think its unlikely).   Unlike us they had to kinow there was a major new build about to go to testing etc

 

4) They have handled their European customers very badly (along with many other regions).   They should have had firm agreements in place so that they could support more areas when pre-orders were announced.   Even hollywood has figured out the concept of "world wide release" these days.   Euro market is likely larger than NA market.. among other things.

 

5) They keep hinting at a delay which most likely the game needs.. just announce the delay.   Beyond that if the game is released and shouldn't have been it won't be EA or the "fans" it will be the stockholders saying.. "dudes you have spent almost a billion dollars to buy this company and however, many more tens of millions on development.. and all this money was ours that we let you borrow.. time to start paying it back."  

 

most of this list isn't anything that affects *me* I just think it all adds up to ... meh

  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6495

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

9/21/11 9:41:17 AM#46
Originally posted by Gruug

The only problem here is that at some point EA will step in and say "release it" whether ready or not. EA's track record in doing just that is well documented with buggy and half finished games that failed terribly. I am sure the folks at BW want to "release when its ready" but EA may not...no...won't allow it.

True, but it's also possible that they learned something from the debacles at Funcom and Mythic.

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  User Deleted
9/21/11 9:41:55 AM#47

I've been watching people bitch on this site about titles being rushed out before they were ready for the last few years here, and here finally a company wants to take it's time and do things right and you're STILL bitching????

There's no pleasing you guys!!!

SWTOR can take as long as it NEEDS to come out.....I look foreward to a well-rounded, polished, content-laden product.

 

 

  Elikal

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/09/06
Posts: 8067

“No path is darker then when your eyes are shut.” -Flemeth

9/21/11 9:43:06 AM#48
Originally posted by Gruug
Originally posted by Elidien

So let's look at Bioware's options:

Set a release date - Fail to meet release date - move date back = community upset

Set a release date - Launch - game not up to standards (it will never meet this community's expectations) = community upset

Don't set a release date - game launches well = community upset (because it took too long)

Don't set a release date - game launches poorly = community upset (because it wasn't finished)

-----

Point is, Bioware cannot win. So Bioware does what they need too - launch when its ready. People will still play it and nothing will change that. People, I do not think, are not running out canceling their pre-orders.

At this point, the game better launch well or their will be a lot of anger and rightfully so. Most people will tolerate the time it takes to release the game if it releases well. if not, it could get ugly for sure.

 

The only problem here is that at some point EA will step in and say "release it" whether ready or not. EA's track record in doing just that is well documented with buggy and half finished games that failed terribly. I am sure the folks at BW want to "release when its ready" but EA may not...no...won't allow it.

*cough* Ultima IX  *cough*

Oh the pain still hurts!

A forum is a place where people can discuss about different opinions. So what I don't get is, how people react offended when they come to a forum and then find... well different opinions. If a different opinion offends you, what are you even doing here?

  Soki123

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/10/08
Posts: 1275

9/21/11 9:45:47 AM#49

Why are there so many people needing the game to be released now. If it needs more time to be a good, polished product, let it be. I get the feeling you re also the ones that will rush to end game and bitch you re bored. Patience is a great thing.

  User Deleted
9/21/11 9:46:16 AM#50

EA GREED folks, EA GREED. Get used to this.

Pretty sure EA pushed this pre-order and Bioware ain't quite ready. Now you're all left hanging.

Nutshell they spoke to soon, i wouldn't be surprised if it's pushed to next year, maybe holiday next year. Errr ya what am i thinking EA is involved, prolly be next week and you can all beta test it while PAYING  for the next year!!! These are the AWESOME IDEA's EA comes up with. Stupid me for thinking they'd do the proper thing. lol

 

  BadSpock

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7682

Logic be damned!

9/21/11 9:47:40 AM#51
Originally posted by Elikal
Originally posted by Gruug

The only problem here is that at some point EA will step in and say "release it" whether ready or not. EA's track record in doing just that is well documented with buggy and half finished games that failed terribly. I am sure the folks at BW want to "release when its ready" but EA may not...no...won't allow it.

*cough* Ultima IX  *cough*

Oh the pain still hurts!

And UO2, UXO... oh what could have been...

Point is - you have to ask yourself if you believe whether or not EA has learned their lesson from these obvious failures/impatience, the biggest one being their pushing WAR out the door way, way too early.

I think they have, I honestly think EA has learned their lesson and will let Bioware decide when this game is ready to release.

Might suck for us, but in the end it'll such a LOT less then a bad game.

Now Playing: D3:RoS, Watch Dogs
Looking Towards: Destiny

  Elikal

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/09/06
Posts: 8067

“No path is darker then when your eyes are shut.” -Flemeth

9/21/11 9:49:07 AM#52
Originally posted by Antarious

To me its not just the "wait".

 

SNIP...

most of this list isn't anything that affects *me* I just think it all adds up to ... meh

Well said. It just shows a severe lack of professionalism here, alas. In August 2011 they said Sept. is going to be a big beta for many. I guess that failed.

I wish I had this Vader voice. "Don't fail me again, Admiral!"

A forum is a place where people can discuss about different opinions. So what I don't get is, how people react offended when they come to a forum and then find... well different opinions. If a different opinion offends you, what are you even doing here?

  User Deleted
9/21/11 9:50:47 AM#53
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by bumuscheekus

I have a shiny fat big 8 quid/15 dollars sitting in my piggy bank for a game worth the sub. Sadly I dont think a game where: being shot in the face 10 times with molten hot laser bolts has no effect on your fleshy mug; Consulars repeatedly pull the same identical ship engine out of the ground to bash peoples faces in or npcs can be clobbered over and over on the noggin with promethian lightsabres that have been presented from childhood to cut through reinforced ship hulls with little effort is not going to be it. 

Have you actually stopped and thought about how BAD of a MMORPG it would make to have all those things realistic in the game?

 

I have indeed badspock. What I propose (and this would work in both the normal universe and the evil alternative universe where badspock lives) is that they cover the bases through a modicum of creative thinking.

 

a) Gunfights: Instead of taking bolts to the face, you and npcs duck, weave and dodge behind cover to give a sense that things are not autmatically hit when you shoot them, not in a whack a mole sense but in a form that realistically represents the movies, even the main characters don't hit stormtroopers with every shot. Lower the percentage chance to hit, make cover more essential and increase the consequences for being hit. If outside cover it should be something akin to a fast draw type thing. Was this promised? Yes. Did they deliver? No, except for one class and even in that case cover is self-evidently not necessary

b) Variety in Consulars item pulling: really, no variety in items, what about having things come not out of the ground but from distance way off screen where not even other players behind you can see where it's coming from. It would work and it wouldn't ruin the immersion

c) Lightsabres: ok this is admittedly tough but I guess ducking a weaving and cover might help here too. Who knows it's worth a try and it might make the combat more believeable and less slapstick

 

It's not nitpicking btw, it's just a few examples of general issues with combat that ruins the immersion for me personally

  User Deleted
9/21/11 9:51:47 AM#54

It's entirely possible that the combined clout of both Lucas Arts and Bioware will be enough to keep EA in line here.

SWG is still a sore spot for Lucas....I doubt they would want yet another Star Wars MMORPG to "fail".

(disclaimer: not saying SWG was a failure....I loved it and played it for years....but it failed to meed LA's wow-like expectations.

 

  BadSpock

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7682

Logic be damned!

9/21/11 9:55:46 AM#55
Originally posted by bumuscheekus

I have indeed badspock. What I propose (and this would work in both the normal universe and the evil alternative universe where badspock lives) is that they cover the bases through a modicum of creative thinking.

a) Gunfights: Instead of taking bolts to the face, you and npcs duck, weave and dodge behind cover to give a sense that things are not autmatically hit when you shoot them, not in a whack a mole sense but in a form that realistically represents the movies, even the main characters don't hit stormtroopers with every shot. Lower the percentage chance to hit, make cover more essential and increase the consequences for being hit. If outside cover it should be something akin to a fast draw type thing. Was this promised? Yes. Did they deliver? No, except for one class and even in that case cover is self-evidently not necessary

b) Variety in Consulars items from groung: really, no variety in items, what about having things come not out of the ground but from distance way off screen where not even other players behind you can see where it's coming from. It would work and it wouldn't ruin the immersion

c) Lightsabres: ok this is admittedly tough but I guess ducking a weaving and cover might help here too. Who knows it's worth a try and it might make the combat more believeable and less slapstick

They have all of these things in the game already bumuscheekus, just apparently not to the point where you'd like it to be?

Cover and dodging and blocking/parry of blades/sabers - check.

Ground objects from Consulars - I do not know I have only ever seen the one thing - you may be right there.

If the player toons just dodged/missed/parried/blocked everything and then BAM went from full health to dead, what would the point be in having health? In having stats that raise health and levels and gear and resistances etc.?

All systems in a MMO are connected, you can't just change one thing and expect the game to still function properly.

What you propose requries a complete and total combat redesign.

Or would you be happy if heatlh bars still dropped but visually there were not "hits" till a person died?

Now Playing: D3:RoS, Watch Dogs
Looking Towards: Destiny

  DeathTouch

Novice Member

Joined: 8/19/05
Posts: 522

9/21/11 9:56:02 AM#56

Originally posted by udon


Originally posted by Thekandy



Originally posted by BadSpock


 



 



If each of the story lines are really 100+ hours long and of the same quality as ME2's I can see keeping myself occupided for sometime just on those while Bioware flushes out more content and better end game systems (If it even needs more than it already has, I don't know yet).  


The key for SW:TOR long term will be keeping the new content (solo, group, PVP, and raid) coming over time.  And not just a few new group/raid zones every few months, it needs to be a stream of new and interesting things for players to do being added to the game.  That's something no other game has managed to maintain after launch so we will see if Bioware and EA can keep the resources focused on the right areas here.



 


Um, Trion has done this with Rift and will continue to do this, and the game isnt even 6 months old yet. 


  agriffin85

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/03/07
Posts: 67

9/21/11 10:01:13 AM#57

I couldn't agree more.  I've been excited and hopeful for ToR for the last 2 years and I've been following it avidly since it was announced.  But, it's come to the point over the last couple month that I just can't bring myself to even check the website for the weekly updates anymore.  It just seems like they are making little to no progress to me.


I will definately be playing the game if it is ever released but at this point it's getting rediculous and I feel numb to the entire game.  Nothing Bioware says will get me excited about this game until I see a set-in-stone release date or open beta.


So for now all I can do is try to forget the game is even being developed (wich is admitedly easy considering that the game seems more like a myth at this point).  After 2 long years, it's just too painful to hope...











 




 

  User Deleted
9/21/11 10:02:27 AM#58

Much like is already written, I plan to play, but it's like everything else in life, gets de-prioritized as it should be. That's alot of the problem with "hype", it's a let down for some people, as for myself, whatever, will just play something else for the time being and give it a shot when it comes.





 

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17010

9/21/11 10:03:08 AM#59

I think people need to learn how to manage their expectations. Some players approach these games with the zeal of an 8 year old kid and react in a similiar fashion when things don't go as they want.

It's ok to be excited but perhaps cutting back on some of the energy they invest in these announcements/games would be a more healthier way to live.

  nomss

Novice Member

Joined: 7/21/10
Posts: 1488

9/21/11 10:03:35 AM#60

Fatigue.


Guild Wars 2's 50 minutes game play video:
http://n4g.com/news/592585/guild-wars-2-50-minutes-of-pure-gameplay
Everything We Know about GW2:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/287180/page/1

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