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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

General Discussion  » [Poll] Human Naytheists: Should it be an option?

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85 posts found
  Dream_Chaser

Novice Member

Joined: 4/14/11
Posts: 1054

 
OP  9/09/11 4:09:29 PM#1

To describe a Naytheist in context to Guild Wars 2 I would say it would be someone who is capable of recognising the existence of powerful beings, but one that refuses to acknowledge them as 'gods,' and finds them unworthy of praise. Perhaps even someone, whom due to past transgressions, would even find these so-called 'gods' their foes, something to fight and slur at every opportunity they get.

In Nightfall I discovered that the gods are particularly horrible people and not so much worthy of any kind of respect, and everything seemed like a game to them, or at the very least beneath their notice. They could have taken a more active role in dealing with Abaddon at any point, but they did not, they were often aloof, moving pieces around a board, and seeing everything as something that happened for their entertainment. For example, Balthazar might have been watching a warrior, amused by his actions, and may have set his sword alight to see if that resulted in even more amusement for the god.

To me they seemed like purely selfish creatures, and they were pulling the strings of both the humans and the charr from day one. Those who've only played Prophecies might not realise this, but in Nightfall it becomes visibly true. In other words, the whole war between humankind and the charr, and all related hostilities, even the war between the three human nations, might not have happened if the gods weren't tampering with human destiny and encourating war for their amusement.

To that end, I think that people who choose to play as a human should have the right to forge their own destiny. I think that ArenaNet would have a larger amount of human players if every human player could have the option to spurn these so-called 'gods' and go their own way, being independent, and having no faith in any superior creature, only in their own peoples, their families, their friends, and their allies. I think that in limiting humans to needing to praise the gods in their personal storyline is a bit of a mistake, since I'm certain that not all human players will want to do that after Nightfall. In fact, to some it might even seem as though everything they did in Nightfall was in vain.

So thus I think there should be the option to have a human who stands independently and without faith in the gods, one whom forges their own path into the future, free of any such manipulations. I think that should be a personal storyline option for human characters, even if it does set development back a bit.

What do you think? Would you play as a Naytheist character?

(I've tried to create a poll here that should give everyone the sort of answer they'd desire.)

Would you play as a Naytheist character?

I would.
I would not.
I am uncertain.
I don't care.
My answer is nuanced.
Shenanigans/Bananas.
(login to vote)
  miceinblack

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/27/10
Posts: 122

9/09/11 4:17:06 PM#2

It would make sense for some humans not to believe in Gods especially if those humans feel that the Gods have failed them. Heh, I suppose Science could be a god.

  Arglebargle

Elite Member

Joined: 6/13/07
Posts: 1123

9/09/11 4:17:22 PM#3

Sounds like an interesting and clever path.   I'm not likely to play a human for awhile in GW2, so it might not be as easily applicable to me.   I do like the idea of 'acknowledgement of powerful beings unworthy of worship'.

If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.

  Exilor

Novice Member

Joined: 11/09/10
Posts: 394

Turn it up, turn it up, turn it up, up, adieu...

9/09/11 4:22:57 PM#4

You don't choose a god to believe in, but a god which other people felt you were blessed by when you were little. The character's personal beliefs is not involved.

 

BTW don't paint religious people as sheeple, in the game lore or in RL. The first because the gods of tyria do not "meddle" with or "dictate" humanity's fate or anything like that and don't demand adoration, and the second because it's quite the flame bait.

  Diovidius

Novice Member

Joined: 10/18/10
Posts: 1031

9/09/11 5:37:16 PM#5
Originally posted by Exilor

You don't choose a god to believe in, but a god which other people felt you were blessed by when you were little. The character's personal beliefs is not involved.

This.

  miceinblack

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/27/10
Posts: 122

9/09/11 5:43:28 PM#6

Hard to argue with that but those other people must be so judgemental :)

  gestalt11

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/17/06
Posts: 6176

9/09/11 8:43:35 PM#7

OP is laboring under a false premise.  If the gods exist and are powerful who is to say your character has any choice in the matter.  A god chooses to bless or curse you tough shit, deal with it you don't like it.

 

You could have gods interfering in your life constantly and resent the hell out of it.  In fact a few fantasy novels are based on the idea.

  Meowhead

Tipster

Joined: 1/31/09
Posts: 3728

9/09/11 8:52:42 PM#8

Since there's no personal story option to specifically state you believe in human gods, I'm not sure what the point to this is.

  grimm6th

Novice Member

Joined: 10/22/10
Posts: 978

9/09/11 10:04:57 PM#9

In tyria, gods exist.  This idea sounds like a particually badly designed enemy faction.

I used to TL;DR, but then I took a bullet point to the footnote.

  xm522

Novice Member

Joined: 3/23/09
Posts: 116

9/09/11 10:17:24 PM#10

i am very inclined here to agree with the OP. for w/e reason, players should have the option to not worship any god, or have any god's blessing. player choice is very important to me

  AKASlaphappy

Novice Member

Joined: 7/01/06
Posts: 812

9/09/11 10:41:12 PM#11
Just role-play that you are part of the white mantle, problem solved! :)
  Diovidius

Novice Member

Joined: 10/18/10
Posts: 1031

9/10/11 3:19:25 AM#12
Originally posted by grimm6th

In tyria, gods exist.  This idea sounds like a particually badly designed enemy faction.

The gods exist, yes, but are they gods? Being an atheist in Tyria would not be doubting their existance but doubting their divinity and the need to worship them like the Charr do. We know gods can be killed, we know at least some of them are ascended mortals (Abbadon, Grenth and Kormir), we know the Elder Dragons predate the gods (at least on the world of Tyria) and we know the Elder Dragons rival the gods in power. What is to say that they aren't just powerful spellcasters?

And even doubting their existance would be feasible in the world of GW2 since the gods went even more silent after Nightfall than they were before that. I think there will be humans wondering why the gods are so silent now in a time where Elder Dragons (amongst other things) threaten humanity's very survival.

  andre369

Elite Member

Joined: 8/06/06
Posts: 797

9/10/11 6:53:08 AM#13

The question aint if they actually believe in them, because they are "real", unlike in the real world. But sure, I would not mind being able to have options that I did not want to be assosiated with any of the gods and choose to rely on technology and the human spirit itself. So why not?

  Exilor

Novice Member

Joined: 11/09/10
Posts: 394

Turn it up, turn it up, turn it up, up, adieu...

9/10/11 6:54:25 AM#14

 

Originally posted by xm522

i am very inclined here to agree with the OP. for w/e reason, players should have the option to not worship any god, or have any god's blessing. player choice is very important to me

 

Again, they don't ask you what your character believes or doesn't believe. You're asked the opinion of other people around you.

 

Originally posted by gestalt11

OP is laboring under a false premise.  If the gods exist and are powerful who is to say your character has any choice in the matter.  A god chooses to bless or curse you tough shit, deal with it you don't like it.

 

You could have gods interfering in your life constantly and resent the hell out of it.  In fact a few fantasy novels are based on the idea.

 

 

There is no indication that the gods actually blessed the player. Or that they do bless anyone like that, without a reason.

 

Originally posted by Diovidius
Originally posted by grimm6th

In tyria, gods exist.  This idea sounds like a particually badly designed enemy faction.

The gods exist, yes, but are they gods? Being an atheist in Tyria would not be doubting their existance but doubting their divinity and the need to worship them like the Charr do. We know gods can be killed, we know at least some of them are ascended mortals (Abbadon, Grenth and Kormir), we know the Elder Dragons predate the gods (at least on the world of Tyria) and we know the Elder Dragons rival the gods in power. What is to say that they aren't just powerful spellcasters?

And even doubting their existance would be feasible in the world of GW2 since the gods went even more silent after Nightfall than they were before that. I think there will be humans wondering why the gods are so silent now in a time where Elder Dragons (amongst other things) threaten humanity's very survival.

 

That gods in tyria do not work like god in the bible does not mean they're fakers. In egyptian mythology, Osiris died and then was resurrected by Isis. In gw2, the power of a god can't be destroyed (that's why Kormir had to contain it in her body). 

 

------------------------------------------------------

 

And again, YOUR CHARACTER'S BELIEFS ARE NOT ASKED NOR EXPLORED. IT'S GOSSIP, IT'S OPINION AND IT'S OTHER PEOPLE'S SUBJECTIVITY.

  ZombieKen

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/30/10
Posts: 4410

Zombie - Dead but still moving.

9/10/11 7:00:19 AM#15

One doesn't often find religious positioning as a character option.

 

My characters?  They worship the Daedra.  Problem solved.  Now where'd I put that skooma?

MSOTSG with PPE : Massively Single-player Online Task-driven Storyline Game with Purchasable Performance Enhancements *grin*

  Diovidius

Novice Member

Joined: 10/18/10
Posts: 1031

9/10/11 7:16:48 AM#16
Originally posted by Exilor
Originally posted by Diovidius
Originally posted by grimm6th

In tyria, gods exist.  This idea sounds like a particually badly designed enemy faction.

The gods exist, yes, but are they gods? Being an atheist in Tyria would not be doubting their existance but doubting their divinity and the need to worship them like the Charr do. We know gods can be killed, we know at least some of them are ascended mortals (Abbadon, Grenth and Kormir), we know the Elder Dragons predate the gods (at least on the world of Tyria) and we know the Elder Dragons rival the gods in power. What is to say that they aren't just powerful spellcasters?

And even doubting their existance would be feasible in the world of GW2 since the gods went even more silent after Nightfall than they were before that. I think there will be humans wondering why the gods are so silent now in a time where Elder Dragons (amongst other things) threaten humanity's very survival.

That gods in tyria do not work like god in the bible does not mean they're fakers. In egyptian mythology, Osiris died and then was resurrected by Isis. In gw2, the power of a god can't be destroyed (that's why Kormir had to contain it in her body). 

But how do we know they aren't fakers? What exactly is the difference between the Mursaat and the human gods, other than the fact that the later have more power? What makes them divine instead of mortal? What makes them worthy of worship compared to other beings (such as Mursaat and Titans)?

  semantikron

Novice Member

Joined: 11/26/07
Posts: 260

9/10/11 7:32:14 AM#17

Well, it could be interesting if individuals of one race could grow up as a member of one of the others, which sounds like what you are asking for.

I am a human, and this is my story:  I was raised by the Charr/Norn/Asura/Sylvari as one of their own.

Charr: Outta my way.
Human: What's your problem?
Charr: Your thin skin.

  User Deleted
9/10/11 7:47:53 AM#18

 Does this thread remind anybody else of this poster?

{mod edit}

I think I'm going to resist the urge to continue a religious debate on what constitutes a god which will probably result in the thread getting locked.  I'm just going to say I'm with Exilor on this one.  The question is only asking what people said when you were young, not what actually happened or what your character believes. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSM8UqNxODI&feature=player_detailpage#t=456s

  Dvalon

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 8/10/07
Posts: 320

9/10/11 8:02:44 AM#19

{mod edit}

As for religion in games I feel it has no place at all, to many people relate it to real world religions and all sorts of strife tends to follow, seen it happen in other games, WOW took the right path by making neither horde nor alliance evil, simply different, GW2 and any other Future mmo should do the same.

  Unlight

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/08
Posts: 2586

9/10/11 8:23:36 AM#20
Originally posted by Dvalon

{mod edit}

As for religion in games I feel it has no place at all, to many people relate it to real world religions and all sorts of strife tends to follow, seen it happen in other games, WOW took the right path by making neither horde nor alliance evil, simply different, GW2 and any other Future mmo should do the same.

I don't actually disagree with you about evolution, but this is flamebait.  Just so you know.

But I completely disagree with you about the place of religion in games.  The added context that religious worship can bring can often deepen the experience.  For instance, I've been tabletop RPing one game for the past 20 years in which the role of religion is absolutely paramount and forms the underpinnings of everything in that world.  When I play a character, indeed, when any one of my buddies plays a character, it is almost always as a devout worshipper of one deity or another.  In fact, the more zealous you are in promoting the tenets of your faith, the more likely it is that you excel.  This is one of the reasons why we, as a group, have been devoted to this one game for decades.

In RL, I'm an unapolegetic atheist.  In RPGs, I'm a believer.  And in GW2, I will follow Lyssa faithfully, even if she's no longer speaking to us.  The charr are free to dismiss the gods if they want, but I know they are still listening.  No apostacy for me.  I only wish they had an even bigger part because I would love to have been able to partially define my characters according to a sacred cult role, as well as all the rest.

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