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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Todd Howard not interested in Elder Scrolls MMO

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55 posts found
  Corehaven

Novice Member

Joined: 7/27/11
Posts: 1574

I swear by my pretty floral bonnet, I will end you.

9/02/11 12:24:10 AM#21
Originally posted by LisXia
Originally posted by Corehaven

Absolutely fantastic.  I totally agree with Howard.  I guess he feels about his game the same way I feel about his game.  Not everything has to be made into an mmo, and I really do feel taking Elder Scrolls and slamming the mmo sticker on it really does take something away from the game. 

 

Im a huge Elder Scrolls fan.  But Ive never wanted it transformed into an mmo and I never will.  The series runs as it should.  If it aint broken dont fix it. 

Cost of development aside, I do see no big harm from making an Elderly Scroll MMO.

The MMO will not take away anything from the existing series.  It can be from another era of the timeline or something, and so long as Bethesda has the manpower they can maintain both solo and MMO series.

If we have an elderly scroll MMO well made, if only.

I fear that once a long running series delves into the mmo space, they rarely return.  Have you seen another World of Warcraft RTS ?  Nope.  I doubt we'll get any more Kotor games after Swtor either. 

 

MMOs are fine.  But we dont have to convert every awesome single player game into an mmo.  If we do that, there wont be any other awesome single player games to be had, and they do have their value.  They can offer things no mmo really can. 

 

Theres a such thing as keeping an rpg IP in its roots and improving upon that.  It does not have to become an mmo.  You see no damage or hurt here, but I dont think another Elder Scrolls game would likely be made after that.  The mmo would be developed on instead.  You'd have expansions instead of new Elder Scrolls entries.  This would last for a very, very long time. 

 

Thats very damaging.  Especially for me and people like me who love the series for what it is.  Im just really pleased Howard seems to understand this.  When rumors of an Elder mmo began, I had worried Skyrim might be the last of its kind.  Thankfully thats not the case. 

  Brenelael

Guide

Joined: 10/19/06
Posts: 3986

Pointing out the Obvious to the Oblivious since 2006

9/02/11 12:46:58 AM#22
Originally posted by Corehaven
Originally posted by LisXia
Originally posted by Corehaven

Absolutely fantastic.  I totally agree with Howard.  I guess he feels about his game the same way I feel about his game.  Not everything has to be made into an mmo, and I really do feel taking Elder Scrolls and slamming the mmo sticker on it really does take something away from the game. 

 

Im a huge Elder Scrolls fan.  But Ive never wanted it transformed into an mmo and I never will.  The series runs as it should.  If it aint broken dont fix it. 

Cost of development aside, I do see no big harm from making an Elderly Scroll MMO.

The MMO will not take away anything from the existing series.  It can be from another era of the timeline or something, and so long as Bethesda has the manpower they can maintain both solo and MMO series.

If we have an elderly scroll MMO well made, if only.

I fear that once a long running series delves into the mmo space, they rarely return.  Have you seen another World of Warcraft RTS ?  Nope.  I doubt we'll get any more Kotor games after Swtor either. 

 

MMOs are fine.  But we dont have to convert every awesome single player game into an mmo.  If we do that, there wont be any other awesome single player games to be had, and they do have their value.  They can offer things no mmo really can. 

 

Theres a such thing as keeping an rpg IP in its roots and improving upon that.  It does not have to become an mmo.  You see no damage or hurt here, but I dont think another Elder Scrolls game would likely be made after that.  The mmo would be developed on instead.  You'd have expansions instead of new Elder Scrolls entries.  This would last for a very, very long time. 

 

Thats very damaging.  Especially for me and people like me who love the series for what it is.  Im just really pleased Howard seems to understand this.  When rumors of an Elder mmo began, I had worried Skyrim might be the last of its kind.  Thankfully thats not the case. 

Not to mention they would have to tinker with almost every core mechanic in the game to make it work as a MMO. It wouldn't 'play' like an Elder Scrolls game. The Mechanics of the Elder Scrolls series may not be liked by everyone but it is what defines an Elder Scrolls game. A MMO made from the IP just wouldn't 'feel' like Arena, Daggerfall, Morrowind or Oblivion. Like I said before it would be a totally different type of game with an Elder Scrolls paint job... No thank you.

 

Bren

while(horse==dead)
{
beat();
}

  User Deleted
9/02/11 3:59:06 AM#23
Originally posted by Brenelael
Originally posted by Corehaven
Originally posted by LisXia
Originally posted by Corehaven

Absolutely fantastic.  I totally agree with Howard.  I guess he feels about his game the same way I feel about his game.  Not everything has to be made into an mmo, and I really do feel taking Elder Scrolls and slamming the mmo sticker on it really does take something away from the game. 

 

Im a huge Elder Scrolls fan.  But Ive never wanted it transformed into an mmo and I never will.  The series runs as it should.  If it aint broken dont fix it. 

Cost of development aside, I do see no big harm from making an Elderly Scroll MMO.

The MMO will not take away anything from the existing series.  It can be from another era of the timeline or something, and so long as Bethesda has the manpower they can maintain both solo and MMO series.

If we have an elderly scroll MMO well made, if only.

I fear that once a long running series delves into the mmo space, they rarely return.  Have you seen another World of Warcraft RTS ?  Nope.  I doubt we'll get any more Kotor games after Swtor either. 

 

MMOs are fine.  But we dont have to convert every awesome single player game into an mmo.  If we do that, there wont be any other awesome single player games to be had, and they do have their value.  They can offer things no mmo really can. 

 

Theres a such thing as keeping an rpg IP in its roots and improving upon that.  It does not have to become an mmo.  You see no damage or hurt here, but I dont think another Elder Scrolls game would likely be made after that.  The mmo would be developed on instead.  You'd have expansions instead of new Elder Scrolls entries.  This would last for a very, very long time. 

 

Thats very damaging.  Especially for me and people like me who love the series for what it is.  Im just really pleased Howard seems to understand this.  When rumors of an Elder mmo began, I had worried Skyrim might be the last of its kind.  Thankfully thats not the case. 

Not to mention they would have to tinker with almost every core mechanic in the game to make it work as a MMO. It wouldn't 'play' like an Elder Scrolls game. The Mechanics of the Elder Scrolls series may not be liked by everyone but it is what defines an Elder Scrolls game. A MMO made from the IP just wouldn't 'feel' like Arena, Daggerfall, Morrowind or Oblivion. Like I said before it would be a totally different type of game with an Elder Scrolls paint job... No thank you.

 

Bren

I am not Bethesda I do not speak for them, I was just hoping, wishing, daydreaming.

Skyrim is definitely the one I will buy as soon as I see one on my friend's shelf.  I will strangle him if he failed to reserve me a copy.  Yes I am that eager, I love arena, all the way to Morrowind.  Oblivion is great once we start having mods rolling in, and the huge user-made patches.

I was just hoping that Bethesda can find enough manpower to build 2 development teams, one maintaining the elderly scroll old series, and another exploring the option of making an MMO.  The 2 design team need never cross over.

Daydreaming and waiting for 11.11.11.

  Bigdavo

Novice Member

Joined: 1/21/06
Posts: 2092

9/02/11 4:30:29 AM#24
Originally posted by uohaloran
Originally posted by Corehaven
Originally posted by uohaloran

To be really fair, I don't think Bethesda could even handle multiplayer.  They're barely able to pull of single player anymore in my opinion.

In what possible way is this true?  Are you talking about Fallout New Vegas? 

 

Because that wasnt developed by Bethesda.  And I was kind of annoyed it wasnt.  If they are going to temporarily hand off the IP to another developer at least pick a more competent one.  Because that game was a buggy mess. 

 

Other Bethesda games have had their bugs, but not to that level.  I hope they dont do that again.  Bethesda should keep their IPs in house as far as Im concerned.  They did it to keep the Fallout franchise relevant while they worked on Skyrim, but if the game turns out to be a buggy mess then it sort of tarnishes the IP and its not worth it. 

Well it's my opinion.  I think almost everything save for aesthetics has been taking a wrong turn with each title and slowly opting in for an action game rather than what most would consider an RPG.

Also on an unrelated note since I wasn't talking about New Vegas, I thought New Vegas was a step up from Fallout 3 in every possible way -- something that I don't believe Bethesda has been able to say about their games in a long time (especially in the writing department). 

It's funny you mention that IPs should stay in house, though, since many of the guys at Obsidian have been involved with Fallout before Bethesda.  They seem a lot more qualified to handle the material than Bethesda.

Obsidian are notorious for their own games being buggy but again to be fair, Bethesda has always had pretty buggy games, too.  I don't know if you were around for the launch of Fallout 3 or Oblivion, but both of those games had a lot of very similar engine problems that you can also see in unpatched New Vegas.  While I'm not being an apologist for Obsidian, they weren't dealt a really good hand when it came to the short time frame they had to develop the game and the engine in which they were given.  I believe if Obsidian were given full work of the IP and realistic time constraints, then Bethesda could also focus their attention on their own series that I feel has been kind of neglected for a long time.

This is pretty much happening across the industry. RPG's are becoming hybrids.

O_o o_O

  Gabby-air

Tipster

Joined: 7/20/08
Posts: 3447

 
OP  9/02/11 4:47:43 AM#25
Originally posted by Bigdavo
Originally posted by uohaloran

Well it's my opinion.  I think almost everything save for aesthetics has been taking a wrong turn with each title and slowly opting in for an action game rather than what most would consider an RPG.

Also on an unrelated note since I wasn't talking about New Vegas, I thought New Vegas was a step up from Fallout 3 in every possible way -- something that I don't believe Bethesda has been able to say about their games in a long time (especially in the writing department). 

It's funny you mention that IPs should stay in house, though, since many of the guys at Obsidian have been involved with Fallout before Bethesda.  They seem a lot more qualified to handle the material than Bethesda.

Obsidian are notorious for their own games being buggy but again to be fair, Bethesda has always had pretty buggy games, too.  I don't know if you were around for the launch of Fallout 3 or Oblivion, but both of those games had a lot of very similar engine problems that you can also see in unpatched New Vegas.  While I'm not being an apologist for Obsidian, they weren't dealt a really good hand when it came to the short time frame they had to develop the game and the engine in which they were given.  I believe if Obsidian were given full work of the IP and realistic time constraints, then Bethesda could also focus their attention on their own series that I feel has been kind of neglected for a long time.

This is pretty much happening across the industry. RPG's are becoming hybrids.

I can't say I hate that they are, I mean I would consider the witcher series a hybrid along with mass effect. I mean ye It's doing bad to some games such as Dragon Age 2, but in general I believe they hybrids are only improving the RPG experience. 

  Ruinal

Novice Member

Joined: 11/17/08
Posts: 196

9/02/11 4:49:55 AM#26

Morrowind was Bethesda's best imho. Whilst they haven't released anything horrible, like Bioware's DA:2 mess, they've not managed to recapture that experience. I really hope Skyrim isn't a further dumbing down of the franchise, but indications are not so good... that said I'll still be happy to pre-order and play the hell out of it.

An Elder Scrolls mmo I could take or leave. As others have pointed out, there really isn't anything that would really make it stand out from the existing mmo crowd in terms of lore, possible gameplay or setting.

  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16846

9/02/11 4:51:49 AM#27
Originally posted by Ruinal

Morrowind was Bethesda's best imho. Whilst they haven't released anything horrible, like Bioware's DA:2 mess, they've not managed to recapture that experience. I really hope Skyrim isn't a further dumbing down of the franchise, but indications are not so good... that said I'll still be happy to pre-order and play the hell out of it.

An Elder Scrolls mmo I could take or leave. As others have pointed out, there really isn't anything that would really make it stand out from the existing mmo crowd in terms of lore, possible gameplay or setting.

No way. Daggerfall were better, the largest game I ever played.

  firefly2003

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/16/08
Posts: 2585

9/02/11 5:24:55 AM#28
Originally posted by uohaloran
Originally posted by Corehaven
Originally posted by uohaloran

To be really fair, I don't think Bethesda could even handle multiplayer.  They're barely able to pull of single player anymore in my opinion.

In what possible way is this true?  Are you talking about Fallout New Vegas? 

 

Because that wasnt developed by Bethesda.  And I was kind of annoyed it wasnt.  If they are going to temporarily hand off the IP to another developer at least pick a more competent one.  Because that game was a buggy mess. 

 

Other Bethesda games have had their bugs, but not to that level.  I hope they dont do that again.  Bethesda should keep their IPs in house as far as Im concerned.  They did it to keep the Fallout franchise relevant while they worked on Skyrim, but if the game turns out to be a buggy mess then it sort of tarnishes the IP and its not worth it. 

Well it's my opinion.  I think almost everything save for aesthetics has been taking a wrong turn with each title and slowly opting in for an action game rather than what most would consider an RPG.

Also on an unrelated note since I wasn't talking about New Vegas, I thought New Vegas was a step up from Fallout 3 in every possible way -- something that I don't believe Bethesda has been able to say about their games in a long time (especially in the writing department). 

It's funny you mention that IPs should stay in house, though, since many of the guys at Obsidian have been involved with Fallout before Bethesda.  They seem a lot more qualified to handle the material than Bethesda.

Obsidian are notorious for their own games being buggy but again to be fair, Bethesda has always had pretty buggy games, too.  I don't know if you were around for the launch of Fallout 3 or Oblivion, but both of those games had a lot of very similar engine problems that you can also see in unpatched New Vegas.  While I'm not being an apologist for Obsidian, they weren't dealt a really good hand when it came to the short time frame they had to develop the game and the engine in which they were given.  I believe if Obsidian were given full work of the IP and realistic time constraints, then Bethesda could also focus their attention on their own series that I feel has been kind of neglected for a long time.

--

To be a little more on topic instead of just commenting, I don't think an Elder Scrolls MMO is the right thing to do right now but I do think that cooperative play is absolutely something that would benefit the series right now.  Essentially after you're done with the main quest you're just roaming.  I'd rather be roaming with a friend, I think.

Perhaps after dabbling into any form of multiplayer, Bethesda could then consider the idea of how an Elder Scrolls MMO would even work.  It's kind of the problem that I think Bioware was faced with -- they could've done so many interesting mechanics and systems with what they've done with their previous games, but I feel that they're kind of just slapping the themepark template onto their IP and taking the easy route out.  I just don't see how many KotOR fans would be very thrilled with how they've decided to take their game.

It's kind of funny that there is a common link between Bethesda and Bioware and that's Obsidian.  Perhaps Obsidian wont be nearly as freelance as they once were, though, considering how succesful New Vegas was for Bethesda and Zenimax.

Don't forget Star Trek Legacy, that was one buggy game.........and a piece of crap till the modding community got a hold of it......

  Dibdabs

Elite Member

Joined: 5/29/08
Posts: 2513

9/02/11 7:04:34 AM#29
Originally posted by Gabby-air

"I like this kind of game better," he said. "You know, it's what most of us are into. I'm not really an MMO guy. I respect them, I look at them, but I don't play them. It feels more real to me when I'm the hero and it's crafted for that. A community aspect to it, I recognize a lot of people would want that in a game like this, but it changes the flavor for me."

http://www.joystiq.com/2011/08/31/todd-howard-on-skyrims-worthwhile-glitches-mmos-and-when-big-i/

 

I guess that puts the rumours of a elder scrolls MMO in development to rest and since fallout MMO rights are with Interplay I'm guessing the MMO at work at Zenimax is going to be a new IP. 

I'd be perfectly happy if it was only possible to play a co-op game with a friend or two.  While I'd like an Elder Scrolls MMO, I also like being the main hero and not one of a crows of wannabe heroes.  I'm getting tired of games where, as in LotRO, places which were eerie and deserted in the book, such as the Barrowdowns, are crammed so full of players running around it's like a shopping mall.  It ruins the immersion when you have to run about trying to grab a Wight before the next guy!  Another game I love, but which would be ruined by being made into an MMO would be The Witcher.

As an aside, a week ago I started playing Oblivion again after a gap of a few years and was blown away all over again.  The mods for the game are incredible (just Google the Youtube video of the mod called Highwood) and new mods are released every day, keeping the game permanently fresh.  The Nature Overhaul mod really improves the "everything is shades of brown" original graphics, too.  I can't praise this game highly enough.

  Nerf09

Novice Member

Joined: 3/14/04
Posts: 3008

9/05/11 12:53:09 AM#30

Don't need an elder scrolls MMO, someone just needs to copy the left mouse shield/right mouse swing concept.  Yes folks, non-autolock can work in fantasy too; with melee characters to boot.

  Venekor

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/12/10
Posts: 62

9/05/11 2:29:46 AM#31

That's good and I agree with him, Elder Scrolls should stay what it is, like what KOTOR should have done.

  Adamantine

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/07/08
Posts: 3394

War is not the ultima ratio, but the ultima irratio - Willy Brandt

9/05/11 8:50:21 AM#32

I played Morrowind and Oblivion so far.

There are differences - but overall I would say its pretty much the same game.

Oblivion overdid the part with the leveling of mobs though. Bandits in best armor of the game are an obvious target for jokes.

I read rumors that Skyrim does some pretty drastic changes in the rulesystem. We'll see.

 

 

Originally posted by Nerf09

Don't need an elder scrolls MMO, someone just needs to copy the left mouse shield/right mouse swing concept.  Yes folks, non-autolock can work in fantasy too; with melee characters to boot.

Err ... WHO cares for THAT one ... ???

  Kalfer

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/09/11
Posts: 791

9/05/11 8:52:49 AM#33

do not want elder scrolls mmo. New MMO experiences please.

  alakram

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/02/06
Posts: 2240

9/05/11 9:03:21 AM#34

But they are talking about Skyrim and why it doesnt have an online or mmo component, that doesnt mean that in another studio owned by bethesda or zenimax (parent company) it may be an elder scrolls MMO in development.

With all the growing Skyrim has done and will continue to do in DLC, it seems that Bethesda has omitted the most obvious opportunity for evolution: An online component. We asked Howard why Dovahkiin is a lone wanderer in a gaming industry that seems to be increasingly obsessed with finding a foothold in the MMO market.

-=AlaKraM=-
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  Adamantine

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/07/08
Posts: 3394

War is not the ultima ratio, but the ultima irratio - Willy Brandt

9/05/11 9:10:13 AM#35
Originally posted by Venekor

That's good and I agree with him, Elder Scrolls should stay what it is, like what KOTOR should have done.

This statement makes no sense whatsoever.

KotOR was a short series of two games that was long dead years ago.  KotOR1 was created by Bioware, Canada. KotOR2 was created by Obsidiant Entertainment. Neither of these companies has any control over the question if KotOR3 is produced.

TOR has, at best, a certain similarity in the name. As a game, its completely different. The company that creates it is a THIRD company, Bioware Austin.

The only true link between KotOR1+KotOR2 and the new TOR is Lucas Arts and the Star Wars setting. But there are tons of Star Wars games out there.

So yeah, what the hell are you talking about. Its like saying that Dungeons and Dragons Online killed Baldurs Gate 3. Nope, thats not what happened.

  4getting2009

Novice Member

Joined: 1/01/11
Posts: 172

9/05/11 2:33:24 PM#36
Originally posted by Hicks2006

i agree TES was a fantastic series i only just got morrowind and im loving it. Oblivion is amazing too though i dont like the fast travel idea. I have skyrim preordered and im totally excited.

 

Now one thing i would have liked is if oblivion support a minor multiplayer. not like team deathmatch or arena and stuff no no just like a local lan game or internet where two players can join together and play the campaign together. Me and my best friend would have loved it if that were possible. but thats just me and him. We like doing coop no matter the game. If coop is available.

DaggerFall was the first. Might want to give it a try. Buggy as all hell though.

  LordKyellan

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/17/03
Posts: 160

9/05/11 2:37:47 PM#37
Originally posted by 4getting2009
Originally posted by Hicks2006

i agree TES was a fantastic series i only just got morrowind and im loving it. Oblivion is amazing too though i dont like the fast travel idea. I have skyrim preordered and im totally excited.

 

Now one thing i would have liked is if oblivion support a minor multiplayer. not like team deathmatch or arena and stuff no no just like a local lan game or internet where two players can join together and play the campaign together. Me and my best friend would have loved it if that were possible. but thats just me and him. We like doing coop no matter the game. If coop is available.

DaggerFall was the first. Might want to give it a try. Buggy as all hell though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Elder_Scrolls:_Arena

Good luck finding a playable copy, though.

--------

"Give a man a fire, and he is warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he is warm for the rest of his life."

  Sagasaint

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/25/11
Posts: 474

I don't always play MMOs, but when I do, I play sandboxes

9/05/11 2:40:36 PM#38

I agree with the good old Todd, Im not interested in a TES MMO either.

neither in the offline ones since Daggerfall, to be honest...

  4getting2009

Novice Member

Joined: 1/01/11
Posts: 172

9/05/11 2:40:56 PM#39
Originally posted by Adamantine
Originally posted by Venekor

That's good and I agree with him, Elder Scrolls should stay what it is, like what KOTOR should have done.

This statement makes no sense whatsoever.

KotOR was a short series of two games that was long dead years ago.  KotOR1 was created by Bioware, Canada. KotOR2 was created by Obsidiant Entertainment. Neither of these companies has any control over the question if KotOR3 is produced.

TOR has, at best, a certain similarity in the name. As a game, its completely different. The company that creates it is a THIRD company, Bioware Austin.

The only true link between KotOR1+KotOR2 and the new TOR is Lucas Arts and the Star Wars setting. But there are tons of Star Wars games out there.

So yeah, what the hell are you talking about. Its like saying that Dungeons and Dragons Online killed Baldurs Gate 3. Nope, thats not what happened.

 You would be wrong on the point of  real connections. You realise Revan, Malgus, and the descendants of Bastilla (and possibly Revan)  Are all driving plot points in TOR right? This is KOTOR Online. KOTOR 3 is extremely unlikely. While developed by different bodies they are all portraying the same continuity. (KOTOR1 > TOR being the strongest link). Lucas Arts will decide if KOTOR 3 is produced.

Also of Note:

Obisdian Entertainment (formerly Black Isle Entertainment) has a history on working with Bioware's engines (Icewindale using the Baldur's Gate Engine)

  Gabby-air

Tipster

Joined: 7/20/08
Posts: 3447

 
OP  9/05/11 6:25:08 PM#40

I like the idea of co-op people brought up, to be honest I only recently played oblivion and wasn't a huge fan but I respect the game for what it is and if I perhaps had a couple of my friends with me with content tailored for co-op I think the game will be a lot more fun. I mean these games are huge and people spend lots of time in them developing their characters and it just feels lonely, if you have people to run some dungeons with or maybe hunt some dragons in skyrim that would be huge. 

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