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News & Features Discussion  » Star Wars: The Old Republic: Sex & Games & Rolling Dice

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241 posts found
  Banegrivm

Novice Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 202

8/25/11 11:44:07 AM#101

I agree where it was said earlier in this thread by someone that most people just aren't accepting of this. This is true. I for one do not and will not play games with homosexuality content in them because I'm straight and do not approve of said content for morality reasons as well as "religious belief" reasons, not to mention my own upbringing. I'm also not a fan of "well everyone else is doing it, so that makes it ok" mentality. I'm my own man, not everyone elses. I make my opinions for myself and I believe in right or wrong. I am not and have never been hateful towards people that are gay. As the saying goes, hate the sin, not the sinner. I am glad there isn't going to be any content like this in ToR. As it stands I've pretty much decided to stop purchasing any other Bioware games because I know they are putting in gay content into their future games, which is a shame since they have such great skill at telling a story.


Banegrivm
Leader of the 1st Fist of Light
www.1stfistoflight.com

  jedensuscg

Novice Member

Joined: 1/18/06
Posts: 212

8/25/11 11:48:23 AM#102

Originally posted by DarkPony



Either have both or leave them out entirely. If it's a development intensive aspect, and applying all those arcs on gay relationships would be too much of a hassle when compared to the gains (also making a certain minority of players happy), I can understand their choice, but I still think they should leave npc relationships out entirely.




If it's a choice made on cultural biass and bending to traditionalist, negative views on gay relationships I would be very disappointed in Bioware.



 


So they should force the majority of the game population to miss out on one of Biowares trademarks (deep relationships with companions) because they can't -either through Lucas Arts saying no or because of technical issues- include the minority in as well? Seems like one sided hypocracy. "If we can't have if they should not either".


  chbautist

Novice Member

Joined: 9/20/10
Posts: 51

8/25/11 11:51:39 AM#103

Originally posted by Scambug



Don't blame it on Bioware, blame it on the rating agencies (or whatever they're called) who see homosexuallity as a "mature" subject.


Bioware is targetting kids with SWTOR, they did what was needed to avoid the teen or mature rating.



 


probably the best explanation


  Incomparable

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/11/11
Posts: 736

8/25/11 11:54:05 AM#104
Originally posted by chbautist

Originally posted by Scambug



Don't blame it on Bioware, blame it on the rating agencies (or whatever they're called) who see homosexuallity as a "mature" subject.


Bioware is targetting kids with SWTOR, they did what was needed to avoid the teen or mature rating.



 

probably the best explanation

Should have the function /thread, and actually ends the thread.

I think I have said too much already.

Good luck, and hope you all the best.

“Write bad things that are done to you in sand, but write the good things that happen to you on a piece of marble”

  Normike

Novice Member

Joined: 6/24/07
Posts: 440

8/25/11 11:54:26 AM#105
Originally posted by Roin

I don't recall KOTOR1 or 2 having same-sex relationships.  Think the closest is KOTOR1 with that cat girl, Juhani (sp?).  And that was incomplete at best. If TOR is modeled on KOTOR1 and 2, neither of which had it.  Why put it in TOR, for the sake of appeasing a very small minority of people.

Hell if we are going to complain about that.  I guess as an african american, I should be complaining about the lack of black people in the SW universe. There are more black people in the world then homosexuals.  So hey why shouldn't I send a request to Bioware to have them put more black in it.  Oh and I know I'll give old Mr Lucas himself a call.  Tell him next time he re-releases the the Star Wars saga.  He better find a way to inject more black people into it.

Dude there are plenty of black people in the SWTOR. It's in character customization, NPCs, and the class story arcs. That's pretty much a standard in most Bioware games. No need to send any requests.

 

In KOTOR 1 the lesbian relationship with Juhani wasn't exactly minor. There are also gay characters in the Star Wars books. Lucas Arts has a policy stating that there are gay characters in the Star Wars universe. I don't think Bioware writes gay characters in their games "for the sake of appeasing a very small minority of people." For the same reason they don't put black characters in their games "for the sake of appeasing a very small minority of people."

 

In both cases it makes sese they put them there because their games are about story and choices and portraying an honest real world. Hard to make a personal story with a character you identify with when you have no choices to make a character you can identify with. 

Bioware has also stated that making same gender content is not expensive or time consuming, which would also be the same for making charcters with dark skin tones.

  hardicon

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/23/10
Posts: 355

8/25/11 12:01:37 PM#106

two threads on this and I still dont understand why people are upset, and nobody has explained it other than they feel they have been discriminated against.  why, wow didnt have it, there was no complaint.  ac didnt have it, no complaint, no other mmo had it and there was no complaint.  true bioware included it in some of their other games, not even all of their other games but some, but maybe those games were an anomaly, maybe they were doing it for laughs, maybe they were doing it to make fun of that type of community, maybe they are all secretly homosexual and did it for that reason.  In swtor they decided not to put those types of relatinships in the game, for whatever reason, it dont really matter what reason, its not their, its their game, their money, their choice.


I could go into reasons I dont like the act of gay sex but that aint the point of this thread so I wont.  for those that are upset about this just slow down, take a few breaths and realize, this is a video game, not life.  im sure bioware isnt trying to be homophobic or hating on gay people. maybe ea or lucas made the decision not to have it, maybe they thought it wasnt worth the time, maybe they had to cut it out because they wanted to get the game out the door at a certain point and this was one thing they could cut out to make that happen and it really is minor that would only affect a small percentage of the population that would be playing the game.  we dont really know what their reasons are and until we do there is no point in getting upset about the decision.

  Shadanwolf

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/13/10
Posts: 1865

8/25/11 12:05:05 PM#107

Including same sex marriage is promting an agenda. I refuse to  facilitate that agenda. I have left games that have added it to their game.


  Leoghan

Novice Member

Joined: 12/27/03
Posts: 611

8/25/11 12:06:25 PM#108
Originally posted by Shadanwolf

Including same sex marriage is promting an agenda. I refuse to  facilitate that agenda. I have left games that have added it to their game.

Yeah that whole agenda of being treated like a human being *rolls eyes* 

  Ceridith

Novice Member

Joined: 11/24/09
Posts: 3001

The more you hype an upcoming game in your mind, the more it will fail to meet your expectations.

8/25/11 12:13:00 PM#109
Originally posted by Shadanwolf

Including same sex marriage is promting an agenda. I refuse to  facilitate that agenda. I have left games that have added it to their game.

Do you also support murder and genocide? Just asking, because if you play any violent games then your logic would suggest that.

I guess that also means that WoW has a pro racially driven hatred and genocide agenda.

  P2PGamer

Novice Member

Joined: 6/30/11
Posts: 125

8/25/11 12:32:19 PM#110
Originally posted by CujoSWAoA

Star Wars is for children, they decided that Gay and Lesbian relationships aren't for children.  Thats ONE reason... there's so many possible and plausible reasons to go along with it.  For instance... they didn't want to have to write MORE script and record MORE audio for alternate homosexual story-arcs. 

And the list goes on

Take that as you wish.

(Sidenote: In the original KOTOR, Juhani was the first lesbian to make an apperance in the SW mythos, though there was no actual romance story-line with her character.  It was merely a vague declaration at the end of the game, if I'm not mistaken.  Exact facts may be distorted by many years of time.)

 

Sorry there, Cujo.  Your logic of "this is a game for children" left the building with the direction of the dark side and with the ability to have sexual relationships in the first place.  If this game was for children, you wouldn't be given a choice to kill a child's father.   I agree with SB here, either include all the relationship types or remove the NPC relationship mechanic from the game.  George Lucas and Star Wars has a long history of including gay/lesbian relationships even raising money for different organizations causes.

Power to the Sheeple

  reillan

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/01/07
Posts: 231

8/25/11 12:36:06 PM#111

Since we have had no response from Bioware on the subject, let me provide a few scenarios:


Scenario 1: Bioware made the decision specifically to omit homosexual relationships, while specifically including heterosexual relationships, because they were worried about backlash from conservatives.


Scenario 2: Bioware made the decision to include both kinds of relationships, but ran out of time in story development to have them available to meet their current release target and had to prioritize relationship arcs based on which ones people would most likely choose.


Scenario 3: Bioware authors got locked into their own storytelling - when they decided how to tell the stories of your companion characters, those stories may have precluded any possibility of a same-sex romance.  That is an error in foresight and preparation, rather than judgment.


Only in one of those do we say "Bioware is clearly at fault."  In the others, there's still the probability of future changes that include those romance options.


Also understand this: the male same-sex option in Dragon Age 1 was not exactly well-crafted.  The character seemed thrown in at the end, and was horribly stereotypical in many ways...


  hoshey

Novice Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 4

8/25/11 12:46:25 PM#112

To me  this is not a big deal at all, still trying to fig out why there is even love relationships in a game anyway, who will have time to build a relationship when we are to busy stabbing and shoot and healing and all that jazz.. and if your  jedi you cant love anyways its agents the rules and if your sith your suppost to hate everyone so. again I just do get the point of having this feature and why even complain about it in the first place, but then again i did take the time to put in my two cents.....ok maybe 1 cent.


  Atlan99

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/07/08
Posts: 1355

8/25/11 12:50:00 PM#113

Bravo MMORPG Bravo. If you want to get attention and get people talking take a shot at SWTOR.


3 articles in the last week and they'll probably end up being the most viewed in awhile. Hey if it works, why stop?


I think this bodes well for SWTOR. Love it or hate it. People care one way or the other.


  Corehaven

Novice Member

Joined: 7/27/11
Posts: 1574

I swear by my pretty floral bonnet, I will end you.

8/25/11 12:54:48 PM#114
Originally posted by Atlan99

Bravo MMORPG Bravo. If you want to get attention and get people talking take a shot at SWTOR.


3 articles in the last week and they'll probably end up being the most viewed in awhile. Hey if it works, why stop?


I think this bodes well for SWTOR. Love it or hate it. People care one way or the other.

Honestly man, I dont think this is necessarily the type of plublicity you really want for Swtor.  I also dont think its that great of a sign when everyone is going nuts over a subject like this and not really discussing the game itself or the real game mechanics.  

 

It doesnt really impress me with the community in general. 

 

Id have a lot more respect if they went back to discussing why it would be or not be a good GAME, and stop using it as some sort of social crusade. 

  User Deleted
8/25/11 12:58:07 PM#115

This is a non issue. If you want relationships the game does not prohibit you from finding another player also if you want to play house go play sims or real world or some lame game like that. This is a waste of time and resources for a game that is going to be great. I dont ever remember reading or hearing that people are only going to play this game because they get to hook up with the same sex only to be told now they cant. Get over it and you dont have to play it. Geesh


  Atlan99

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/07/08
Posts: 1355

8/25/11 1:04:47 PM#116

Originally posted by Corehaven



Originally posted by Atlan99


Bravo MMORPG Bravo. If you want to get attention and get people talking take a shot at SWTOR.




3 articles in the last week and they'll probably end up being the most viewed in awhile. Hey if it works, why stop?




I think this bodes well for SWTOR. Love it or hate it. People care one way or the other.


Honestly man, I dont think this is necessarily the type of plublicity you really want for Swtor.  I also dont think its that great of a sign when everyone is going nuts over a subject like this and not really discussing the game itself or the real game mechanics.  


 


It doesnt really impress me with the community in general. 


 


Id have a lot more respect if they went back to discussing why it would be or not be a good GAME, and stop using it as some sort of social crusade. 



 

Thats this site though.


Most people here are burned out on the themepark model. So they will take any excuse to bash the game that they can. I bet you most people don't give a rat's ass about the issue one way or the other. They are just using it to put their spin on SWTOR. Just like these last three articles are more about generating hype for the site than personally held beliefs.


It's also been said "There is no such thing as bad press." So while I think Bioware wishes they were talking more  about game mechanics, they are probably happy people are talking.


  GrumpyMel2

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/24/09
Posts: 1789

8/25/11 1:25:23 PM#117

I think the issue is probably due to the fact that Bioware made a pretty big issue of including such options in thier previous SPRPG....so thier absence in TOR is rather conspicious.


I didn't mind thier presence in the SPRPG's as I could simply avoid the dialogue choices that would trigger such content....and I think the same sort of dynamic would be fine in an MMO offering as well. I don't mind such content existing as long as I can avoid participating in it myself.


I think the best solution is just to provide some sort of toggle in a setup/preferences panel. That way a player doesn't even have to worry about accidentaly choosing the wrong dialogue choices (although they seemed pretty obvious in the other titles) that would trigger such content. Problem solved.


  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 18726

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

8/25/11 1:31:52 PM#118
Originally posted by Atlan99

Originally posted by Corehaven



Originally posted by Atlan99


Bravo MMORPG Bravo. If you want to get attention and get people talking take a shot at SWTOR.




3 articles in the last week and they'll probably end up being the most viewed in awhile. Hey if it works, why stop?




I think this bodes well for SWTOR. Love it or hate it. People care one way or the other.


Honestly man, I dont think this is necessarily the type of plublicity you really want for Swtor.  I also dont think its that great of a sign when everyone is going nuts over a subject like this and not really discussing the game itself or the real game mechanics.  


 


It doesnt really impress me with the community in general. 


 


Id have a lot more respect if they went back to discussing why it would be or not be a good GAME, and stop using it as some sort of social crusade. 



 

Thats this site though.


Most people here are burned out on the themepark model. So they will take any excuse to bash the game that they can. I bet you most people don't give a rat's ass about the issue one way or the other. They are just using it to put their spin on SWTOR. Just like these last three articles are more about generating hype for the site than personally held beliefs.


It's also been said "There is no such thing as bad press." So while I think Bioware wishes they were talking more  about game mechanics, they are probably happy people are talking.

Wait a minute, as the OP noted, "I’d rather be worried about the unannounced “Legacy” end-game system, and the world PvP info we’ve yet to hear squat about"

so you're correct, it is EA/Bioware's fault after all since their Developer decided to discuss this same sex content issue with some folks rather than share more details on the above said topics which would be more interesting I'll grant you.

Stop being so defensive about discussions regarding SWTOR, the title doesn't need a defense attorney.

"In these forums 'honest' seems to be a symonym for 'hates the game just like I do'" - ohioastro
Kyleran - Bitter Vet ™ since 2006
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  teakbois

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/06/06
Posts: 2190

8/25/11 1:35:07 PM#119

Originally posted by EvesmanObi



I guess I don't understand why it's that big a deal that they didn't include it in the game. When it is included in the game, there isn't an uproar. Why is that?



 


Most games dont have relationship content.  This is extra content.  The only MMO I can think of with perks for having a relationship is Runes of Magic, which DOES allow same sex marraiges and there indeed WAS a public outcry because of it.  But after the initial outburst no one seemed to care I dont think.


 


Really its poor game development on Bioware's part.  If you are going to have content centered around relationships, then you should include same sex relationships.  If you dont want to do the right thing, then dont have the relationship content at all.


  ZoeMcCloskey

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/14/05
Posts: 1117

INTJ, fun is fun except when it's not

8/25/11 1:42:06 PM#120

Well written, I agree with you completely.  This to me is a situation of include everything or include nothing.  Personally I'd go with the former, why not have the options there for all the various romance arcs that could occur.  It will only make the game deeper and give it more options.  For my part I 99% likely would never play out any romance arc in the game anyways but I think they should be there for people.


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