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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Why is Raiding so unpopular to the MMO Community?

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319 posts found
  Wolfy2449

Novice Member

Joined: 3/22/10
Posts: 419

7/09/11 10:03:24 PM#41

Anything that can be defeated by a script its waste of time and only serves as to make humans feel better for an not adequetely justified reason.

 

And raid is nothing more than a line of predetermined commands. there is no challenge to it expect finding ppl who are gonna waste their time following and executing commands at correct time. sorry execution is not something that requires skill

 

But since you obviously DONT want to disapoint the player by comparing him to a better player aka pvp they had to make something to make the game more appealing

Woof!

  neum

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/15/07
Posts: 108

7/09/11 10:07:37 PM#42

I used to love to raid years ago the 54 man raid EQ had was great.  Even multi raid raids (like the sleeper).  I used to get a rush out of being in a guild getting server firsts.  To me that was the glory days of raiding.  Being a father now I just dont have time anymore and I see raids like 10 or 26 man in newer games just does not seem like a real raid.  I am to active IRL to sit for 8+ hours in front of the computer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OP3rKRh0h5k

  kalinis

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/11/10
Posts: 1444

7/09/11 10:08:54 PM#43

I actually love to do raids and dungeons. Sure once u have done them 100 times or so they may get boring but i really enjoyed doing icc raid. I did it on my tank pally and my healer shaman.

For me raiding was a blast and i really enjoyed doing it weather i got gear or not and at the end of it i had all my gear. So was running it just because i enjoyed it.

I like having to work together to get bosses down and enjoyed when we would finally get a boss down for first time. Was a blast. Sure some people are in it for gear and some are in it because they are " hardcore" I raid for fun not gear or any of the other reasons if i get bored i stop doing it.

I have no clue why some peope hate raiding but i for one enjoy it. I see some idiotic statments about how raids are easy and can be done by following a script but it takes team work and alot of coordination as well. Its not as easy as soem make it out to be.

I enjoyed the challenge . The comraderie and the feeling of joy when wed finally down a guy.

  brahmabull75

Novice Member

Joined: 5/04/06
Posts: 25

7/09/11 10:16:41 PM#44

I think the problem is that all current MMOs are based on a Player versus Time system. Your character's power is directly proprtionate to the amount of time you spend playing the game. Since the best gear tends to drop in raid encounters, this is inherently unfair to people who have more RL responsibilities, and are unable to commit 4-hour blocks of time several nights a week to sitting in front of the computer (but pay the same monthly sub as the people who raid 20 hours a week.)

This is also leads into games going F2P with cash shops. You only have to pay based on the amount of content you can / want to experience.

I like EVE's skill system, because it puts everyone on a level playing field. It takes the same amount of time for every single person to be able to pilot x ship, or equip x weapons, etc.

 

Edited for grammar/spelling.

  GreenHell

Novice Member

Joined: 11/27/05
Posts: 1342

7/09/11 10:19:53 PM#45

I am just sick of raiding. It bores the hell out of me.

  Emhster

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/28/09
Posts: 913

Played: Shadowbane, WoW, WAR, AOC, Aion, SWTOR, Rift, Tera

7/09/11 10:24:51 PM#46

Sometimes I feel like there is so much hype going on that the crowd would cheer at any annoucement.

I understand two things out of it, one positive and one negative:

  • Raiding receives a large share of attention from game sites and public forums which puts a lot of pressure on the dev team to deliver more and more content... Meanwhile, usually only a small share of players make it through, as observed by Blizzard's lead developper. So it could be a good thing to remove this aspect so the dev team can concentrate on open world features.
  • It removes one major aspect of MMORPGs, which makes it more of a niche where you may not find a portfolio of activities as varied as you would like.
  gaeanprayer

Novice Member

Joined: 8/06/08
Posts: 2360

7/09/11 10:25:39 PM#47
Originally posted by MMOExposed

I noticed the mmo community for some reason cheered Anet on, when they announced no Raid Dungeons in Guild Wars 2. Well I want to ask. Why is Raiding so unpopular now days to the MMORPG community?

Isnt Raiding, a Massively Multiplayer element of PvE combat?

Would you rather future MMO to be balanced for 1v1 PvE rather than 1v20+?

I want to know why the community doesnt like Raiding any more.

Note:
Wasnt calling out Guild Wars 2, that was simply an example.

Actually GW2 has raid dungeons, so not quite sure where you heard that but they're feeding you false information. The first time you do a dungeon it's about storyline, but every other time it's a challenging raid for loot like any other MMO (albeit one I'm looking forward to). The only difference is instead of getting loot to roll on, everyone gets a token of some sort which can be traded for loot of their choice to avoid the ninja looting issue.

Anyway, I actually love raiding. I think people hate it because they've burned out on it, but I never played WoW. Like...ever...and that seems to be the biggest source of burnout on raiding material. To me, raids are like the ONLY time people get together and work towards a common goal. I LOVE working with people, even though sometimes they're terrible at it, to take down some huge boss. I've been doing Thor/Titan runs every night in Vindictus for well over a month now and I still look forward to doing it the next day.

When I played Rappelz, dungeon raids were the primary source of exp past level 60 or so, and I loved it. Got my cleric to 110 before I gave up on the game, but that was only because it was stupidly expensive.

Also, I think some of it has to do with your gameplay style. I always play healers/support characters, so dungeons are always a challenging/hectic experience for me. Either I'm working hard to keep my teamates alive, or I'm working hard to keep myself alive when I get boss aggro from spell casting. I notice people who are more DPS oriented, once they've maxed out their gear and are 'uber', seem to get bored at the lack of challenge. Whereas for me, my gear rarely makes healing any less involving, so I don't have a chance to be bored.

"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."

  Axehilt

Novice Member

Joined: 5/09/09
Posts: 7213

7/09/11 10:26:13 PM#48

Give me 5-man content and you've given me team-based gameplay.  That's fun.

Give me 25-man content, and you haven't given me any noticable increase in teamwork -- yet you have given me a substantial increase in irritations (scheduled gameplay, frequently losing when it's not your fault, etc)  That's not as fun.

  Kain_Dale

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/06/06
Posts: 380

7/09/11 10:26:29 PM#49

Raiding = time consuming

 

Thats why Freedom is important aspect of the game.   I personally hate raiding for many many reason.  I rather fight on my own to obtain same kind of loot in anywhere from monster level than waiting hours and hours for getting team together.  Asheron's Call has best pve feature/design, combat system, skill level up system and such.  Thats why mmorpg games sucks nowadays.... its very sad.

ultrainfinita Xfire Miniprofile
  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16712

7/09/11 10:27:14 PM#50

Raiding isn't a problem in itself. What most people are tired of is that once you reach certain point in the endgame raiding is really the only thing to do and that sucks.

Doing the same thing over and over in hope to get thta rare drop gets boring after a while, MMOs needs to offer more endgame options.

  Eladi

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/23/06
Posts: 1062

7/09/11 10:29:32 PM#51

Raiding was orginal supose to be that epic thing you -could- do for fun, these days its a repeative act you -must- do in order to stay on pair whit gear and stuff.

Raiding has become very boring and a cheap way of adding "content" to a game and to work around artifical group limets the developers cant get thier head around in the open world gameplay.

its someting that will mark the end road for me in sw:tor , unfortunate once i played true the story lines and thats all whats left to do it be the day I leave the / a game

I'm not paying to get into a vitural line to repeat the same thing over and over again coz their is nothing else to do.

  MMOExposed

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/17/10
Posts: 6042

 
OP  7/09/11 10:29:37 PM#52
Originally posted by gaeanprayer
Originally posted by MMOExposed

I noticed the mmo community for some reason cheered Anet on, when they announced no Raid Dungeons in Guild Wars 2. Well I want to ask. Why is Raiding so unpopular now days to the MMORPG community?

Isnt Raiding, a Massively Multiplayer element of PvE combat?

Would you rather future MMO to be balanced for 1v1 PvE rather than 1v20+?

I want to know why the community doesnt like Raiding any more.

Note:
Wasnt calling out Guild Wars 2, that was simply an example.

Actually GW2 has raid dungeons, so not quite sure where you heard that but they're feeding you false information. The first time you do a dungeon it's about storyline, but every other time it's a challenging raid for loot like any other MMO (albeit one I'm looking forward to). The only difference is instead of getting loot to roll on, everyone gets a token of some sort which can be traded for loot of their choice to avoid the ninja looting issue.

Anyway, I actually love raiding. I think people hate it because they've burned out on it, but I never played WoW. Like...ever...and that seems to be the biggest source of burnout on raiding material. To me, raids are like the ONLY time people get together and work towards a common goal. I LOVE working with people, even though sometimes they're terrible at it, to take down some huge boss. I've been doing Thor/Titan runs every night in Vindictus for well over a month now and I still look forward to doing it the next day.

When I played Rappelz, dungeon raids were the primary source of exp past level 60 or so, and I loved it. Got my cleric to 110 before I gave up on the game, but that was only because it was stupidly expensive.

Also, I think some of it has to do with your gameplay style. I always play healers/support characters, so dungeons are always a challenging/hectic experience for me. Either I'm working hard to keep my teamates alive, or I'm working hard to keep myself alive when I get boss aggro from spell casting. I notice people who are more DPS oriented, once they've maxed out their gear and are 'uber', seem to get bored at the lack of challenge. Whereas for me, my gear rarely makes healing any less involving, so I don't have a chance to be bored.

Wait, GW2 has Raid Dungeons?

  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16712

7/09/11 10:31:49 PM#53
Originally posted by MMOExposed

Wait, GW2 has Raid Dungeons?

Both Eric and Jeff Grub have stated that it don't, they said they wanted the massive bosses in the open world instead. 

  gaeanprayer

Novice Member

Joined: 8/06/08
Posts: 2360

7/09/11 10:35:45 PM#54
Originally posted by Loke666
Originally posted by MMOExposed

Wait, GW2 has Raid Dungeons?

Both Eric and Jeff Grub have stated that it don't, they said they wanted the massive bosses in the open world instead. 

The Ascalon  dungeon video says differently. They may not end in a stereotypical giant boss battle, but it's still a dungeon that you're raiding for loot. A rose isn't any less a rose because you painted the petals blue.

It's a dungeon that you're killing all the crap in to get an item that you trade in for dungeon gear. The only thing really missing is the giant boss at the end.

"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."

  just1opinion

Smart-Alek

Joined: 8/14/07
Posts: 4933

7/09/11 10:37:10 PM#55
Originally posted by Golelorn

Unpopular?? I wish.

The most popular games are based of raiding. What are you talking about?

 

Personally, I've never liked raiding. Its repetitive, and unadventurous.

 

Ditto. About the tenth time I run a raid dungeon I am SOOOOO over it.  I cannot think of anything LESS compelling to do at max level than be stuck repeatedly running raid dungeons.....no rather, the SAME raid dungeons over and over and over.  I don't see what is so "fun" about that, so to me the raiders are the strange ones.  I'm pretty sure that a good lot of them, IF they had the choice of getting the highest level gear some other way.....would opt to take a different route. Some, of course, love raiding and LIKE doing it that way, but I am indeed not to be counted among them. (And I don't think I'm alone with that sentiment.)

President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club

  psyclum

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/10
Posts: 800

7/09/11 11:12:09 PM#56

EQ1 is really the ONLY game that has REAL raids.  WoW tried, but failed in captureing the raiding crowd.(20 people in a raid really cuts down on the complexity of the script that designers CAN put into a raid)  most real raiders are retired, and, the post WoW generation MMOer's dont know what a REAL raid is...  

so yah it's "unpopular" because most people never really know what a real raid is like (only about 10% of EQ1 players were actually raiders back in the day anyway)  and the "so called" raids of today (5 man raid?:D) holds no interest for real raiders.   it doesn't build comradery or reputation for raiders and takes little to no coordination/strategy/tactics to beat it.... 

what most people dont understand is that real raiders are masochistic in nature.  the harder the fight the better.  so it's not something that these new wannabe raids can satisfy.

  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16712

7/09/11 11:15:58 PM#57
Originally posted by gaeanprayer

The Ascalon  dungeon video says differently. They may not end in a stereotypical giant boss battle, but it's still a dungeon that you're raiding for loot. A rose isn't any less a rose because you painted the petals blue.

It's a dungeon that you're killing all the crap in to get an item that you trade in for dungeon gear. The only thing really missing is the giant boss at the end.

It is a 5 person dungeon. Raids are massive and have several groups of players working together.

So the only thing missing is 15+ players in it.

  psyclum

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/10
Posts: 800

7/09/11 11:54:49 PM#58
Originally posted by Loke666

So the only thing missing is 15+ players in it.

here lies the problem:D   what he meant to say is 60+ players in it:D

  khamul787

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/20/11
Posts: 187

7/10/11 12:03:11 AM#59

I don't really feel that there's much more to add to this. People generally go on raids because that's what the endgame of modern MMOs is geared towards. I personally find this raiding treadmill to be horribly tedious and boring, with almost no feeling of satisfaction, few rewards, and a huge amount of time lost. 

As to the example of GW2, I really like that they've moved this large group content to the open world. This way, you can't just schedule a raid, they don't take long, and people can participate in the content in a myriad of ways. I feel that this should more than make up for the raid mentality. Seems like a win/win to me :D

  khamul787

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/20/11
Posts: 187

7/10/11 12:03:58 AM#60
Originally posted by gaeanprayer
Originally posted by Loke666
Originally posted by MMOExposed

Wait, GW2 has Raid Dungeons?

Both Eric and Jeff Grub have stated that it don't, they said they wanted the massive bosses in the open world instead. 

The Ascalon  dungeon video says differently. They may not end in a stereotypical giant boss battle, but it's still a dungeon that you're raiding for loot. A rose isn't any less a rose because you painted the petals blue.

It's a dungeon that you're killing all the crap in to get an item that you trade in for dungeon gear. The only thing really missing is the giant boss at the end.

I think when the OP says raids, he means tons of players and multiple groups ^ ^

Edit: Missed Loke's post. Beat me to it XD

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