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Forsaken World

Forsaken World 

General Discussion  » I Rage Quit over Cash Shop issues - the game is great but beware scams for your cash!!

19 posts found
  zWolf

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/08/05
Posts: 88

Your best or nothing!

 
OP  6/17/11 7:52:33 PM#1

 

So... I really liked this game!  it's AWESOME!  I played every spare minute, (And some not so spare minutes hehe,) over the past few days - I AM VERY impressed!
 
It was so good, I wanted to support it, so I started buying Leaves and using in game upgrades and such... even at level 10, I did the tutorial on how to upgrade weapons, went to the cash shop, bought the items I'd need, and I maxed out my cool new weapon!
 
as I was upgrading it failed a couple of times, but no biggy, I was just out the stones  I'd bought, and they really didn't cost 'too' much. (2 dollars ish.)
 
Once it got maxed out, it even had 2 Gem slots!  cool!
 
Sooooo, me wanting to learn all about upgrading my gear, figured that if I could put 2 Gem's in, I might as well level up the Gems, hah!  so, I went to the guy where you upgrade Gems... it looked pretty similar to the Weapon Upgrade Dialog... I went to the Store, and bought 3 of each Gem and the combination agents that I would need. ( a bit over 3$ total,)
 
 I figured I could buy more of the Combination agents if it Failed, I'd be out just a little Cash for the Agent, (about a .25) and the cost of attempting the upgrade, (another couple dimes or nickles...)  because that is how it works with the Armor and weapons upgrade who's tutorial I had just finished...
 
But NOooooooo, Surprise surprise!  Guess what boy's n girls THIS TIME, in a Tricky little maneuver that still has me reeling, IT EATS YOUR GEMS on a failure!
 
If you have played many of these games, losing an item on a failed upgrade attempt sounds reasonable,  But not so much if you just barely completed a tutorial that walks you through a similar upgrade mecanic where it DID NOT destroy the object you were attempting to upgrade. Not so much when there is NO indication that it is going to destroy your Gem's on a failure.
 
Had I known that there is NO WAY, I would have proceeded with a 50% chance of failure... I had just spent over $3 to do this, I'm not going to just go 'fifty fifty' on making it work or not!  of COURSE I'd have spent the extra $$'s to increase the odds of success.  
 
But since I thought it was like the weapon and armor upgrade, and you would just lose gold, and the combination reagent, I hit proceed. (35 cents on a 50 / 50 chance is ok, I'd have just had to spend another 35 cents and go 50 / 50 again ya know.)
 
Anyway....
 
Three bucks gone zippity split!  Honestly, it's not 'really' that much to lose... but there is the principle of the thing in there somewhere...
 
not to mention the question of how many other things am I going to find in the game that try to 'trick'  me out of money like that?
 
After a while, all this is going to add up... I mean to upgrade one weapon at level 10 I was apperantly willing to fork out 5 bucks. (2 upgrading the weapon, and 3 on the gems to put in the slots.)  - but - honestly - to pull the ole' Switcheroo like this  just to trick me out of the cost of a few Gems seemes beneath a game with such high production value.
 
I assumed that the lack of a warning that your Gems would be destroyed, Unlike in the Armor and Weapon Upgrade area where they are not, must  just be an oversight and that customer service would be happy that I  brought it to there attention.
 
Apparently I was wrong. Customer service politely thanked me for playing, hoped that I was enjoying the game, and then flipped me the bird... politely of course.  (:-P I exaggerate, the response was top notch and very professional, it's the policy that was waggling it's middle finger in my direction.)
 
So, I'm history, Leaving the game, "Finito para me", as they say in Spain... or Itally.. or maybe it just 'sounds' like something they would might say in Spain or Itally...
 
Anyway I just figured I'd post here about my experiance to warn other gamers of the 'scam-my' feel of that transaction.
 
This game plays great, but I really REALLY don't want to give financial support and help with the success with a game that has any 'scam' feel to it, and that little shenanigan REEKS of scam.... 
 
It would be different if when I brought it to customer services attention they appologized, and fixed it, but Nope...  it was more like:  
 
"That's Bussiness as usual here at PWE, thanks for playin n payin now leave us alone whilst we devise other ways to seperate fools from their pretend gold and leaves that cost 'real' money... muahahahahahaa...."
 
Me and my dollars will be spent on a game that doesn't try to rob you.  There are PLENTY of them out there.
 
Thanks for reading.. if you want WAY more details and dialogs of the customer service responces etc, feel freee to follow the link over to the boards.
 
here is the thread:
 
 
I  suppose that I'll go back to LOTRO or DDO... sigh.
 
have fun my fellow gamers, and consider your selfs warnned and advised... Fun game... watch out for sharks! let the Buyer Beware!!!!
 
DOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooooommmmmmmmmmmm. 
 
Wade (zWolf) -out.
zwolfman Xfire Miniprofile
  ultrastoat

Novice Member

Joined: 7/14/10
Posts: 183

6/17/11 8:04:38 PM#2

THe issue here is that you paid for a weapon upgrade when you were just at level 10. That's some serious "l33t" thinking right there. I spent about 20$ in Zen on FW and I still have a buttload left after buying a few things. You're complaining about 3$.

  zWolf

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/08/05
Posts: 88

Your best or nothing!

 
OP  6/17/11 8:14:20 PM#3
Originally posted by nhavas

THe issue here is that you paid for a weapon upgrade when you were just at level 10. That's some serious "l33t" thinking right there. I spent about 20$ in Zen on FW and I still have a buttload left after buying a few things. You're complaining about 3$.

 

Your point is similar to the sentement over on the official forums... here is my responce.. it's not the 3$... (read on)

 

Originally Posted by Shyren - Eyrda View Post
You shouldn't quit over 3 gems and now that you know you won't lose more, correct?

Correct, that's not the reason I'm quitting.. the cash is minuscule, 3 bucks, however, it is a mistake that most new players not familiar with the mechanic will make. not only that, it seems like your candy fed down a path that leads you right to that error... in other words, it looks like a deliberate attempt to cause new players to lose a minimal amount of money.. not enough to make a big deal over, just consider it a lesson learned and move on... 

The reason that I'm quitting is this looks like a Programmed error, designed specifically to trick a small amount of money out of each new player that pays as they learn the game... If that is the case, (and basically customer support confirms that it is, by not fixing the issue,) then this is NOT a game I'd like to play... that's one 'trick' are their more?

The game stands on it's own with out resorting to trickery. 

The reason that I'm quitting is that this error still stands, and looks designed to do exactly what it did. trick a nooby out of cash as they learn the game.

zwolfman Xfire Miniprofile
  quentin405

Novice Member

Joined: 11/26/06
Posts: 487

6/17/11 8:19:11 PM#4

 Yeah man, all perfect world games are exactly the same.. I wont lie some of them are really addictive and well designed in the idea of getting you so obsessed with upgrading that your willing to literally gamble your money like in a casino.

 

I feel yea.. theres too many good games, or even crappy games to play that dont require 1000's of US dollars to compete in PVP lol

 

I would never in my life play a perfect world game, even if they somehow were the only MMO in the world lol

  Onigod

Novice Member

Joined: 3/24/07
Posts: 692

6/17/11 8:20:59 PM#5

1 second of real looking on their website and you could have found out how it worked

 

your fault not fw

  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16715

6/17/11 8:38:16 PM#6
Originally posted by quentin405

 Yeah man, all perfect world games are exactly the same.. I wont lie some of them are really addictive and well designed in the idea of getting you so obsessed with upgrading that your willing to literally gamble your money like in a casino.

I feel yea.. theres too many good games, or even crappy games to play that dont require 1000's of US dollars to compete in PVP lol

I would never in my life play a perfect world game, even if they somehow were the only MMO in the world lol

Uhm, he lost a few bucks because he didn't check up how things works on the net first. That is a case of slightly bad instructions by the game, not a massive conspiracy.

I played it a lttle myself, 20 levels or so (took like 8 hours without any hurry). Actually a surprisingle good game but all F2P and freemium games want to take your precious money.

I can't say that I ever seen a "free" game where it doesn't cost anything to compete in PvP. It always cost a lot as long as you expect to have a chance. PvP players really should either pay those 15 bucks a month or play Guildwars, F2P PvP games are always P2win.

  quentin405

Novice Member

Joined: 11/26/06
Posts: 487

6/17/11 8:42:25 PM#7

 Yea man I mean I am NOT bashing them, I have lost countless hours in some of their games. I was just agreeing that as far as F2P mmos go, PW's seem to be extra "gamble" or really fishy chance system.  No conspiracy theories here thats just plain and simple my opinion.  I spent alot of money on one PW game along time ago. But used it for utility things and mounts and left the  8% chance to upgrade and loose 7 bucks and your weapon and your gems etc etc to the suckers and people with stolen CC numbers hahaha

 

Anyway yea not trying to bash anything, just saying.

  zWolf

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/08/05
Posts: 88

Your best or nothing!

 
OP  6/18/11 12:49:05 AM#8
Originally posted by Onigod

1 second of real looking on their website and you could have found out how it worked

 

your fault not fw

Why spend time reading a web site when there is a fun game to play... and I'm gonna guess that your exagerating a bit with your '1 second' estimate.  To be fair, when you run the test, grab a new player that has only played the game a couple of hours and hasn't spent any time on their forums... then turn em loose and see how long it takes em to find it... 

 

Tell ya what, I actually havn't given this a try... so I'll do it now. A) I'm assuming that you are talking about their Web site, and not the forums... if I'm wrong on that account, I'd just argue that I don't think a player should have to got to forums to figure out game mechanics... especialy not in a game as well done as this one.

 

-- ok I took your challenge... in under 2 minutes I found their guide on their wiki:

 

http://fw-wiki.perfectworld.com/index.php/Gem_Combine

I was all prepared to come back and congradulate you on how effective that the web site was... unfortunately... the Wiki does NOT in any portion of the guide on it, mention that the Gem's are destroyed.

It once again re-afirms that this path is designed by them to guide new players into making the very mistake that I made, in an attempt to get real money from players as they learn 'the hard way' that this system destroys the thing your upgrading, which was not so in the system that they do a tutorial on where the gear stay's un-affected.

 

I'm going to head back and spend more time, trying to find where it states that Gems are destroyed on failure... if you have the place, feel free to post it here.

thanks,

 

by the way, what that guide DOES say is the following:

"You have to put:

Fusion Agent to upper slot (lv 1-3, depends on gems lv)
3-5 gems of the same type

Exotic gems cannot be combined. If any gem is bound, result gem will be bound too.
Success rate depends on amount of fused gems:

3 gems - 50%
4 gems - 75%
5 gems - 100%

You have to pay non-bound Gold Coins so, it's better to be very careful."

 

--- that last part, about the Gold Coins , implys that you have to 'be very careful' because you will lose your coins on a failure - Why on earth woudn't they add in there that the Gem's would be destroyed as well?  My guess is that they get a bit of Revenue over the players 'learning the hard way' so there's no financial motivation to eplain what happens.

 

-- hey guess what you can do on their Wiki?  you can EDIT the pages, imagine that -- so NOW when you go there, you do indeed learn that Gems are destroyed!  Woot !!

 

Now, I have helped your Claim, that a new player could QUICKLY find the answer to this question if they did a fast look at the webpage!

 

Hah, I helped prove you right - I award myself Champion Class points... lets say  100.... you can have 200 for wining. :-P

zwolfman Xfire Miniprofile
  Madimorga

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 1998

6/18/11 1:15:05 AM#9
Originally posted by quentin405

 Yea man I mean I am NOT bashing them, I have lost countless hours in some of their games. I was just agreeing that as far as F2P mmos go, PW's seem to be extra "gamble" or really fishy chance system.  No conspiracy theories here thats just plain and simple my opinion.  I spent alot of money on one PW game along time ago. But used it for utility things and mounts and left the  8% chance to upgrade and loose 7 bucks and your weapon and your gems etc etc to the suckers and people with stolen CC numbers hahaha

 

Anyway yea not trying to bash anything, just saying.

 

I don't like PWIs cash shop 'style' and this is why they've never gotten any money out of me, even though I have no issues with supporting free to play games that I enjoy. 

 

PWI also has a worse reputation than a lot of companies offering free to play games.  I think this is in part because a lot of the new free to play games are offered by Western companies and started out as pay to playin the Western market and so built up a reputation and customer following perceived as more 'respectable' than games like Perfect World.  But I also think it's partly because Perfect World International persists in keeping a high fail chance on so many of its cash shop items. 

 

On the one hand, you and I and everyone else can avoid these games entirely or play them without ever spending a dime in the cash shop.  On the other hand, there is a built in gambling drive in our species and I'm not entirely comfortable with games that take advantage of this.

 

Luckily, I have a built in anti-gambling trait  I get my feelings hurt when I lose.  The Universe should like me more and I should be lucky and I deserve to win the lottery, so why didn't I, damn it!

 

Since I hate getting my feelings hurt, I usually avoid gambling.  It's why I rather suck at all forms of poker even though I have a decent understanding of the odds.  When the odds said I should have won and didn't, massive tilt would ensued.

 

But except in poker, I've found my self-centered, egotistical side quite handy.  It saves me a lot of money.

 

Meanwhile, if PWI ever wants any of my money, they'll have to offer something besides a chance of upgrading my gear!

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  zWolf

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/08/05
Posts: 88

Your best or nothing!

 
OP  6/18/11 2:50:49 AM#10



Originally posted by Madimorga



...Luckily, I have a built in anti-gambling trait  I get my feelings hurt when I lose.  The Universe should like me more and I should be lucky and I deserve to win the lottery, so why didn't I, damn it!

... except in poker, I've found my self-centered, egotistical side quite handy.  It saves me a lot of money.
 
Meanwhile, if PWI ever wants any of my money, they'll have to offer something besides a chance of upgrading my gear!

I loved your post! I wish I could give you kudo's or something... is that what the star's are? is there a way to 'rate up' some one's posts?

zwolfman Xfire Miniprofile
  kishe

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/28/04
Posts: 1964

firefighter lvl90

6/18/11 2:56:04 AM#11

Theres daily quest that gives you gems...ive never ever bought gems unless i got gold to buy them off other players.

 

and yeah, you shouldnt bother with gems at all untill you reach lvl30-lvl40 as you outgrow your gear way too fast before that

  Mimzel

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/08/07
Posts: 372

6/18/11 3:11:52 AM#12

I really liked FW too in the beginning. Then I really started to notice how the game play itself was programmed with hindrances that CLEARLY pointed the players to the cash shop. IE you can only harvest so many harvestables in a day. As a healer your MP is everything, and the spells take a large chunk of MP to use. So you need to spend alot of manapots in almost every instance (The light house = 50+ manapots, and I could make about 110 mp pots a day, you figure it out). You could of course buy more in the cash shop.

Then I had problems with the cash shop. I wanted to pay via paypal, and two times it failed. The money was sent from my bank to PWE, but PWE automated cash shop script didnt recognize my payment had been completed. The money was returned to me after a week (about 9 euros worth x 2). After a week I decided to try again, and again my paypal transfer didnt work (it is a payment option in their CS). I sent a petition, and after a few days i was told to report the problem to paypal. 

I reported the problem to paypal, explaining that three times my paypal payment failed. Paypal opened a dispute ticket with PWE, and PWE responded promptly to ban my account due to the dispute. After 3 weeks I got my money back and they finally lifted the ban. No "sorry" or anything. 

I just completely lost interest in FW. They hardly have any support, and it's so clear to me that it is a MACHINE that's been made for a single purpose: Get into your wallet.

I talked with a few higher level chars b4 I left, and they told me that they both had spent around 1500 euros in the cash shop getting maxed out. They had the coolest mounts (some sparkly horse with wings), the coolest armor and upgrades and stuff. But cmon..! 1500 euros for pixels? In a "free" game :P

  slim26

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/15/07
Posts: 666

6/18/11 3:16:31 AM#13

LMFAO ok I got mess over by EQ2 ex just now. I was able to create a class out of 3 races, human shadowknight as my choice, leveled him to level 10 with 9 points in advancement and then I camp off got an update and now my class is locked till I pay up hahaha np tho but I would have still been playing it now.

F2P my but, this F2P crap is hilarious.

  Madimorga

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 1998

6/18/11 4:27:10 PM#14
Originally posted by zWolf

 



Originally posted by Madimorga



...Luckily, I have a built in anti-gambling trait  I get my feelings hurt when I lose.  The Universe should like me more and I should be lucky and I deserve to win the lottery, so why didn't I, damn it!

... except in poker, I've found my self-centered, egotistical side quite handy.  It saves me a lot of money.
 
Meanwhile, if PWI ever wants any of my money, they'll have to offer something besides a chance of upgrading my gear!


 

I loved your post! I wish I could give you kudo's or something... is that what the star's are? is there a way to 'rate up' some one's posts?

 

I have no clue what the stars do, but glad you enjoyed it, thanks!  If I can't be super rationale at all times, I might as well try for any form of irrationality that keeps me from wasting money! 

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  Renoaku

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/10/07
Posts: 959

6/22/11 9:25:03 AM#15

I Agree that games like Forsaken World, Let alone almost any MMORPG, or so called FREE 2 Play MMORPG what is not made in the USA is starting to become really screwed up with nothing but Greed, and Micro Transactions, nothing but developers who want to empty your pockets, and take cash at the cost of fun to the players let me explain a bit about PWI/ Forsaken World.

1. If I want to buy a full costume set from my Calculation if I got it right it is over 480 Leaves, and $10 USD is 400 Leaves, so I basically have to put in $20 to their game no matter what for an entire costume.

2. If I make a mistake on my talent points and want to change it I have to buy a talent reset from their store.

3. PWI in general for example Perfect World, in order to re customize a character you have to pay for Cosmetic Scrolls to make any changes, and this is what made me leave Perfect World as soon as I saw I had to pay to make changes.

4. I think that if more F2P MMO game titles offered subscription plans that offered perks like Unlimited Talent Point changes, Max Bag Space, More Banking Space, Free basic Mount, Unlimited Character Customization, and had pay as you go content, as well as of course giving boosts, and possibly a few free zen per month as long as you are a subscriber or points to be used in game that they would have more subscribers.

If I were you who paid for a service, or product, for example you purchased Zen, and you converted it into Gem's, and the company screwed up by not telling you that your Gem's would be lost, I would always pay with PayPal, and a Debit Card, and company you trust, and try to contact the company for example PWI, and if they do not respond within 72 hours I would file a complaint with the the BBB.org, and file a complaint with your Credit Card, or paypal of their failure to deliver what you paid, although your account would more than likely get banned that is what to do if you want your money back, and remember that Google, and the search engines with exposing things like this will go all over google, and that helps too when a company rips you off like this.

And Yes It was their fault they did not tell you that you would loose what you paid for if the upgrade failed, and they should replace it.

Here is a question you should ask yourself?

Why don't MMO companies give you as Real Price of the actual item in their Item Shop, and let you pay with Paypal, or Visa, that is simple because they want to confuse people with the actual cost, and PWI for example makes you buy Zen, and convert it at wierd exchange rates for each of their games when they could simply have PWI points, although some may not see it this way I do.

I am honestly sick and tired of the whole Genre of Free 2 Play MMO, and Micro Transaction games all together, PWI is just one of them that doesn't care about its customers, but does nothing but try to lure people into its games to spend money, and that is all. I mean like honestly Micro Transaction games were not that popular back in the day it was just a small monthly subscription Fee, but after all these Korean MMORPG games, and International Games came into the business they really screwed up the industry, and now it seems like every game company even the U.S Based companies have to add Micro Transactions to all their games simply because they can, and we as gamers have the right to say no, and by not paying for their services as a whole we could and can put an end to Micro Transactions although the current generation of gamers is like willing to spend money and lots of it on games like this anyways so it won't be so easy.

If you honestly ask me I think that Forsaken World could be a great game, but when you get events that occur like this, and people who can't market any F2P mmo well with items that should be included free of charge, and keep its customers happy then you are going to have major issues with lack of money and players, sure not everyone is going to pay anything, but the point is to keep them happy they bring more friends and someone pays something, and those Subscription packages do work well if you know how to market them into a F2P MMO, but the developers are just lazy half the time and don't want to add extra lines of Code to the game, or resources to handle such.

  Seinaru

Novice Member

Joined: 3/27/11
Posts: 109

6/22/11 9:14:45 PM#16
Originally posted by Renoaku

1. If I want to buy a full costume set from my Calculation if I got it right it is over 480 Leaves, and $10 USD is 400 Leaves, so I basically have to put in $20 to their game no matter what for an entire costume.

2. If I make a mistake on my talent points and want to change it I have to buy a talent reset from their store.

3. PWI in general for example Perfect World, in order to re customize a character you have to pay for Cosmetic Scrolls to make any changes, and this is what made me leave Perfect World as soon as I saw I had to pay to make changes.

4. I think that if more F2P MMO game titles offered subscription plans that offered perks like Unlimited Talent Point changes, Max Bag Space, More Banking Space, Free basic Mount, Unlimited Character Customization, and had pay as you go content, as well as of course giving boosts, and possibly a few free zen per month as long as you are a subscriber or points to be used in game that they would have more subscribers.

1. Costumes are completely optional as the armor in this game doesn't look bad or anything. And at least the costumes are permanent... for example in Maplestory you have to pay that much for a costume and they only last 90 days.

2. You get a free compass from the level 20 box, which you can save for a month and then use once you have your build figured out. You get another free one from getting a certain amount of achievement points (I forget how much, but it's easy to get), which you can save for if you accidently mess up.

3. This is true for almost every (if not every) f2p game. The idea is to get your character looking how you want it to at character creation. If you have a serious problem with how your character looks you'll be willing to pay real money to change it.

4. A subscription like that would be nice for us, but the developers know that they can make more money by not offering them.

In response to most of your points, you can buy leaves with ingame money, so I don't see how the cash shop is a huge problem.

I agree with what you're saying about companies being miserly. They try to maximize profits just like any other company, and this is the business model that they choose. If you don't like microtransactions in the first place then don't touch f2p games, because you won't find very many ones that are truly friendly.

  B1mble

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/04/10
Posts: 151

6/28/11 8:22:44 AM#17
Originally posted by zWolf

 

So... I really liked this game!  it's AWESOME! ........et etc
 
Wade (zWolf) -out.

So, if there is a chance of failure and taking that risk involves parting with cash, this would be construed as gambling.

As far as I am aware (and I could be wrong about this) a company that wishes to run games of chance such as dice, cards, bingo, upgrading your weapon, improving your armour would need a gambling license otherwise they would be breaking the law...

 

Hmmm *wanders off to investigate out of curiosity* :P

  jihashi

Novice Member

Joined: 12/03/10
Posts: 141

Bah...

7/14/11 11:45:15 AM#18

 You made two mistakes, which seems common in any PWI game.

 

1. You bought from the cash shop to early to upgrade your gear way to soon.

2. You posted about it in their forums. Beware of 12 year olds responding to your posts, you will get flamed hard core.

 

 I'm not saying don't buy leaves to help support the game, just be smart about it. I bought leaves as well, but only for the cosmetics. I'm just one of those that can't stand my gear clashing when it doesn't match, and would rather look good. Not that fassion sence makes any difference in combat.

  User Deleted
8/06/11 9:23:58 PM#19
Originally posted by Renoaku

 

1. If I want to buy a full costume set from my Calculation if I got it right it is over 480 Leaves, and $10 USD is 400 Leaves, so I basically have to put in $20 to their game no matter what for an entire costume.

Bingo!

This here is something I've tried to explain to people, about how F2P companies stagger the price of cash shop items against the quantities provided in the point packs. You will almost always have to buy the higher priced point-pack to get an item you want. And then the amount you're left with is seldom ever enough to purchase something else you want (key words: something else you want), so you end up having to buy yet *more* points... or settle for a lesser version of what you really wanted to get. When "it's only $10" or whatever, people will seldom 'settle' and will dish out the cash for more points.

I've never been able to remember specific examples to illustrate it. So it's cool that you have one here.

This is also why they hide everything behind "cash shop points" instead of just using up-front $ amounts. It's easier to obfuscate what they're actually doing when they eliminate absolute monetary values from the picture.

Oh sure, there are cheaper items you can get, but they're seldom worth the purchase. They know people are going to want the better version of items like health pots, etc.. so they make sure those items are always priced at a point where you have to shell out more $$$ for a more expensive point package.

This is one of those less obvious methods F2P/Cash Shop MMOs use to get people to spend more money. Most people, in my experience,  never even realize it. Most people, again in my experience, simply say "oh well... the game is free, so it's no big deal". Meanwhile they could easily be spending far more on the cash shop than they ever would on a sub-based game.

The quote in my sig does a great job of summing up the game design aspect of it. Obstacles deliberately built into the game with the sole purpose of making the corresponding, "conveniently available" cash shop items more appealing.

My main issue with F2P/Cash shop MMOs, and why I think they're a thinly veiled sham, comes down to their fundamental design. Instead of developing interesting, fun gameplay that makes people want to continue playing and paying month after month... they base the entire design around getting people to buy more points as often as possible.

F2P MMOs are designed, first and foremost, to get people to spend as much money as they can, as often as they can. Period.

Since I know someone's going to say it, whether or not people "can play without spending a dime" is not the point. The point is that this game model is not designed for those people, but rather for those who will spend freely.