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Lord of the Rings Online

Lord of the Rings Online 

General Discussion  » LOTRO's F2P is more like an extended trial

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39 posts found
  ChickGeek

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/18/10
Posts: 62

 
OP  10/29/10 11:12:44 AM#1

There's nothing free in this life, you know. I wanted to tell this to everyone who i saw whining in this game about why they can't have everything for free but are forced to pay for it. Before you play, keep in mind what i have to say to you. Yes, in LOTRO theres a very limited content that they give “for free” – what they had for a “6 days trial” before had much more content in it, so being in your place i'd consider LOTRO f2p as a trial with no time limit or something like that. If you think of LOTRO f2p as of a long trial or something, there would be no misunderstandings between you, LOTRO, and your wallet.

When you start playing for free, you have a few character slots, a very limited inventory space, about 60% of normal inventory space – i’m speaking of those bags where you gather loot and store healing potions, etc., not the bank space. The bank space is limited too, and you have a gold cap, which is the worst. Also, you can’t do quests outside of the newbie area. You can go there, but there’s nothing for you to do, no quest would show up. So, if you want to progress further, do more quests, make another character, buy a horse, etc. – you eventually have to pay, and rather sooner than later.

This is where usual F2P games end – people are forced to go to the cash shop and buy stuff to progress further into game. Turbine developed their game with no F2P in mind, so they couldn’t just set up a cash shop and be done with the troubles. They had to come up with something different, and they did – you can play with a very limited “free” content at first, then you’d go to the cash shop and buy stuff, and *then* there’s the option to get everything in one package – to pay monthly fee.

As we all did before the game went F2P. (So, if you used to play as LOTRO subscriber and came along this post, i say nothing would change for you that much if you come back to play, except for a special bonus to Turbine – you too can buy things at the cash shop!)

And they made sure there are such thing that you’d like to buy, like special mounts otherwise available for limited time, or things that would buff your stats, or food to recuperate hp/mp, etc. At least they don't sell thing that would unbalance the game that much.

So, what i am saying is that LOTRO, being f2p, in the end magically comes back to p2p model, no matter being announced as f2p. LOTRO went out quite well because Turbine had kept subscription option for the players who wanted to pay as they were paying before, and offered “free” content to lure more people in who jump at every "free" stuff out there or who think the subscription-based games are too much for them.

And I am paying for a subscription, myself, btw.

Online Games in Girl's Eyes
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  snappydoo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/28/10
Posts: 11

10/29/10 11:19:26 AM#2

Well you can't really play without paying anything. But you don't need to sub. You can buy quest packs/bags etc to unlock them on your account. Then they are yours forever. Premium is a different way of paying , if you buy everything you wouldn't need a sub.

  Excession

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/16/06
Posts: 349

Political correctness is tyranny with manners

10/29/10 11:29:38 AM#3

Actually, you can play without paying anything, as completing quests and deeds earn you points to spend in the store.

It might take you a long time to get enough points to buy and unlock everything, but it can be done.

So yes, it IS Free to Play if you really want it to be.

A creative person is motivated by the desire to achieve, not the desire to beat others.

  TUX426

Inquisitor

Joined: 8/04/09
Posts: 1971

Always remember that you're unique. Just like everyone else.

10/29/10 11:35:21 AM#4

Wait...you mean they're actually trying to make money off F2P people? SWEET GEEZUS!!!

OP, I think there's a ton you can do as F2P.

Here's the chart.

PLAYER TIER VIP PREMIUM PLAYER FREE PLAYER
 
TURBINE POINTS 500/month Free
(can purchase more) or earn thru gameplay
Purchasable
or earn thru gameplay
Purchasable
or earn thru gameplay
 
CONTENT
World Access* Free Free Free
Epic Story* Unlimited Unlimited Unlimited
Races 4 4 4
Classes 7 7 7
Premium Classes* Purchasable Purchasable Purchasable
Level Cap* 50 50 50
Character Slots*/** 5/server
(can purchase more)
3/server
(can purchase more)
1/server
(can purchase more)
Quest Packs* Eriador Ered Luin, Shire, Bree-land
(can purchase more)
Ered Luin, Shire, Bree-land
(can purchase more)
 
KEY FEATURES
Inventory 5 bags 3 bags
(can purchase more)
3 bags
(can purchase more)
Gold Limit Unlimited 5 Gold
(can purchase cap removal)
2 Gold
(can purchase cap removal)
Priority Login Priority High Standard
Chat Unlimited Limited Limited
Auction Unlimited Limited Limited
Mail Unlimited Limited Limited
Rest XP Automatic Not available Not Available
Shared Bank** Purchasable Purchasable Purchasable
Skirmishes* 9
(More in Mirkwood Expansion)
4
(can purchase more)
4
(can purchase more)
Legendary Items* Requires Moria Expansion Requires Moria Expansion Requires Moria Expansion
Traits All 1 or 2 slots per trait type
(can purchase more)
1 or 2 slots per trait type
(can purchase more)
Crafting* Tier 1-5 available Tier 1-5 available Tier 1-5 available
Crafting Guilds Unlimited Limited
(can purchase more)
Limited
(can purchase more)
Housing Available Available Available
Music Unlimited Unlimited Unlimited
Hobbies Unlimited Unlimited Unlimited
Cosmetic System Unlimited Unlimited Unlimited
Wardrobe 20 slots
(can purchase more)
Purchasable Purchasable
Destiny points Can earn and spend Can earn but cannot spend Can earn but cannot spend
Monster play Unlimited Not available Not available
Community Features Unlimited Unlimited Limited
Customer Service Full access Full access for 30 days following the purchase of Turbine points Self-service online
  Rhoklaw

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/12/04
Posts: 2970

$500 Backer to 2014's Top New MMO... The Repopulation!

10/29/10 11:46:52 AM#5

After canceling my 3 WoW accounts, I convinced my wife and our Aussie partner in crime to try out LOTRO. I already had 2 accounts and my wife started a new one as did our friend. Before the first month went by, my wife decided LOTRO was a far better game than WoW ( She liked AoC after all which falls under the realistic MMO in terms of graphics ). Once we got to level 20, we decided it was worth spending $10 at Amazon and acquiring the Mines of Moria expansion. Thats correct, $10 which was $5 cheaper than subscribing and $15 cheaper than MoM expansion through LOTRO Store.

Basically, that gave each of us access to all 7 classes, playable to level 60, 5 inventory bags for each character we made and 500 Turbine Points, plus a month of Monster Play. So, even if we decide not to subscribe, we still have 7 character slots, 7 classes, 5 bags and 500 points plus a level 60 cap. In my opinion, thats $10 worth spending.

Can you get all of the above for free? Yes, with 0 cost to you. All you need is a lot of patience.

  dnarris

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 8/06/08
Posts: 272

"In comic strips, the person on the left always speaks first." ~ George Carlin

10/29/10 11:48:40 AM#6

Heh, you're one of the few people that didn't realize that Free to Play is a money trap?

 

Listen, Free to Play is great if you're content with what they give you to play for free. If you aren't content with what they give you then you are better off finding a game that you're willing to pay a flat $15 subscription fee.

I mean in a year you spend $180 on a subscription plus the price of the boxed game which is between $40 and $60. So, $240 for the first year isn't that bad, especially if you really enjoy the game you invested in.

The sneaky thing about Free to Play is that they try to make the majority of people unhappy with just what they get for free. Then they nickel and dime you for as much as they possibly can. Someone not paying attention can end up spending a lot more than $15 a month.

Pretty much Free to Play is a big cash grab. What Free to Play does is it allows the company to reach players that normally couldn't or wouldn't pay a $15 subscription. This allows them to get more money from people with a high disposable income and more from those with a lower disposable income.

Say all the players that were paying a subscription for LOTRO kept playing and get a VIP account. Just for the sake of the example, lets say that's the standard $15 a month. Turbine then gets as many people as they normally would paying the subscription, but now they also get players that are spending anywhere from, lets say $3 is the minmum, up to just below the maxium of the $15 subscription. So now they have players that couldn't pay the $15 playing and paying whatever they can to the company. So they end up actually making more money then they would have just charging $15 flat to everyone.

Not to mention those that not only pay the $15 a month and then go crazy spending tons of extra money in the cash shop meaning they end up spending a lot more than $15 every month.

Free to play give players very little advantage and is more of a cash grab for the MMO company than anything else.

The only way Free to play turns out to be a good thing for the customer is if they are willing to be content with what they get for free.

  User Deleted
10/29/10 11:53:17 AM#7

I'm finding it to be a 'pay at your own pace' sort of deal. Which I have found to be more convient for me, compared to a monthly fee.

I've been in about 3 weeks now and I have 2 characters to level 18. I've crafted up to the 3rd tier already and each have mounts, and now holiday gift mounts. I keep about 2 gold on each from selling crap I found and gathered resources. My captain is my favorite, but the class seems pretty saturated at the moment so I have a dwarf champion that I'm now ready to pay for the next batch of content and probably take my sweet time (3 to 6 months probably since I'm busy with projects until the end of this year) to explore.

It sucks that I can't find a regular group to play with due to my lack of play time, but it's nice having a batch of interesting enough quests to pill through when I have the time. I've had MMOs where I'd pay 30 bucks or more to log in but a few hours here and there, and still be expected to pay more.

It's hardly a free trial in my case. I'm going to stick with the game and I see myself buying content regularly. I don't feel as tho' it's free to play, but it's subscription free which helps me out in the long run.

For people who like to rush through content and have everything now just paying the fee opens up the game nice-like and really it's content is at least on par with everything out there.

NOW if only there was a way to have meaningful pvp, but considering the lore and content they did it the best possible way they could.

  Odysses

Novice Member

Joined: 4/11/05
Posts: 582

10/29/10 1:40:31 PM#8

Lotro's f2p is so much easier to get content then say DDO which I have played both.  My GF has a pure ftp acct and hasn't spent a dime.  I have a lifetime account since the game launched.   With us playing together she has acquired enough points to buy the lonelands, north downs and evendim quest packs without spending a dime.  She has close to 800 pts built up again and with another higher level content pack sale should have 2 more.

I think the real key is to not waste your pts on anything besides content because that opens up more traits and deeds to earn more points.  Make sure you buy the content packs when they go on sale and this game is alot of gaming for little to no money.

Unlike DDO, my GF hasn't had to replay any content yet.  And the deed part is a little grindy but they are things you would do anyways to build up your characters stats so it is even more incentive to do them.

Now if she can find one of those cheap Moria boxes she will be set to the level cap easy.

  TUX426

Inquisitor

Joined: 8/04/09
Posts: 1971

Always remember that you're unique. Just like everyone else.

10/29/10 1:53:22 PM#9
Originally posted by theartist

I'm finding it to be a 'pay at your own pace' sort of deal.

That's actually a really good way to describe it. If you're REALLY casual, you'll never need to pay for anything. If you're hardcore, you'll probably want to pay for VIP right away. If you're kinda in the middle, pick and choose what you want and when you want it.

  dnarris

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 8/06/08
Posts: 272

"In comic strips, the person on the left always speaks first." ~ George Carlin

10/29/10 2:50:31 PM#10
Originally posted by TUX426
Originally posted by theartist

I'm finding it to be a 'pay at your own pace' sort of deal.

That's actually a really good way to describe it. If you're REALLY casual, you'll never need to pay for anything. If you're hardcore, you'll probably want to pay for VIP right away. If you're kinda in the middle, pick and choose what you want and when you want it.

 Free to play is great for those that can moderate themselves, but I think from all of our experience I think we can safely say that the majority of the gamer world is anything, but moderate.

  User Deleted
10/29/10 3:38:47 PM#11
Originally posted by dnarris
Originally posted by TUX426
Originally posted by theartist

I'm finding it to be a 'pay at your own pace' sort of deal.

That's actually a really good way to describe it. If you're REALLY casual, you'll never need to pay for anything. If you're hardcore, you'll probably want to pay for VIP right away. If you're kinda in the middle, pick and choose what you want and when you want it.

 Free to play is great for those that can moderate themselves, but I think from all of our experience I think we can safely say that the majority of the gamer world is anything, but moderate.

Yeah but wouldn't you say the most grevious of cash abuse comes from games that are pretty much "pay2win"? I've played those too because I like pvp heavy games and, love'em hate'em, the Korean model of MMO generally has good massive pvp. There I'd limit myself and never really made it to the top. I'd gain ground, I'd have fun with my crew, but obviously the people who could pay the honorate monthly rate and drop 50 bucks for endless heal potions and the like stood out.

For pve heavy games treating each tier of content and the perks as mini expansions doesn't feel like I'm being ripped off. It doesn't feel FREE any more, that's for sure. But I think that's just a generalization that the industry and the community has agreed to.

  TUX426

Inquisitor

Joined: 8/04/09
Posts: 1971

Always remember that you're unique. Just like everyone else.

10/29/10 4:43:16 PM#12
Originally posted by dnarris
Originally posted by TUX426
Originally posted by theartist

I'm finding it to be a 'pay at your own pace' sort of deal.

That's actually a really good way to describe it. If you're REALLY casual, you'll never need to pay for anything. If you're hardcore, you'll probably want to pay for VIP right away. If you're kinda in the middle, pick and choose what you want and when you want it.

 Free to play is great for those that can moderate themselves, but I think from all of our experience I think we can safely say that the majority of the gamer world is anything, but moderate.

So?! Then they pay $15. What's the big deal?!

The beauty of F2P is that it allows players to always keep their account ACTIVE! Nothing kills an MMO faster than a plunge in players - F2P ensures that people can ALWAYS come back if they want.

Personally, once I uninstall a game, I seldom (never) go back. Keeping lotro on my PC is paramount to Turbine ever getting some $ outta me. F2P makes sure I keep it installed.

  ChickGeek

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/18/10
Posts: 62

 
OP  10/29/10 5:29:32 PM#13
Originally posted by snappydoo

Well you can't really play without paying anything. But you don't need to sub. You can buy quest packs/bags etc to unlock them on your account. Then they are yours forever. Premium is a different way of paying , if you buy everything you wouldn't need a sub.

I am pretty sure that paying for a subscription is cheaper than buying everything for cash, because i can have everything for 15 bucks for a month. Yes, whatever you've got for cash stays forever, but it costs more, and when i don't play i don't need these things anyway. This is just my opinion.

Originally posted by Byrhofen

Actually, you can play without paying anything, as completing quests and deeds earn you points to spend in the store.

It might take you a long time to get enough points to buy and unlock everything, but it can be done.

So yes, it IS Free to Play if you really want it to be.

Oh, come on, what kind of a game would that be? A sorry non-stop grinding to open another few quests? That's no fun at all... I know some people love grind, but that's boring... That's like saying people can have free food by growing it - wouldn't be an easy task while living in apartment, but still possible.

Originally posted by dnarris

Heh, you're one of the few people that didn't realize that Free to Play is a money trap?

If you'd read carefully what i wrote, i said first thing "There's nothing free in this life, you know. I wanted to tell this to everyone who i saw whining in this game about why they can't have everything for free but are forced to pay for it.". Doesn't that indicates i already know there's nothing free in this life and want to tell it to other people, who (as i have seen in LOTRO) are still naive to think F2P games are really free?

Actually, now that you mention it, i did not spent 15/month, i was a long-time subscriber so i used a discount program, $9/month, so that would be only $108 per year (without the addons).

Originally posted by TUX426
Originally posted by theartist

I'm finding it to be a 'pay at your own pace' sort of deal.

That's actually a really good way to describe it. If you're REALLY casual, you'll never need to pay for anything. If you're hardcore, you'll probably want to pay for VIP right away. If you're kinda in the middle, pick and choose what you want and when you want it.

I don't think that grinding for points to open up stuff for free is "casual", and that's the only way you can get stuff without paying for them - a lot of time-cunsuming grinding.

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  SideTraKd

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/28/06
Posts: 101

10/29/10 5:46:38 PM#14
Originally posted by ChickGeek    I am pretty sure that paying for a subscription is cheaper than buying everything for cash, because i can have everything for 15 bucks for a month. Yes, whatever you've got for cash stays forever, but it costs more, and when i don't play i don't need these things anyway. This is just my opinion.
It depends upon your game progress, really.  By the time my low level toon was ready for the Lone-lands (which is the lowest level quest pack that they sell), I had already accumulated enough Turbine Points to buy that zone.  I may not have enough Turbine Points for the next zone by the time I'm ready to move on, but I have the option to sub for a month for $15, get everything during that time (Including 500 more TP for subbing, which is almost enough to buy a complete zone by itself), and then quest without restriction for that month.  Once my month is up, I will be able to lapse back to premium if I want to, and have plenty of points to buy another zone, or even two or three.  There really aren't that many zones to buy.   Also, once I have bought the zones, they are permanently on my account, allowing me to run other alts through them with no charge at all.  Lotro's F2P model is quite generous, in that regard, and even their sub rates are only $10 a month if you get a three month block.  Anyone complaining about how Turbine's F2P is a "money trap" isn't really being honest.  They've set up one of the most balanced F2P systems in the genre.
  dnarris

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 8/06/08
Posts: 272

"In comic strips, the person on the left always speaks first." ~ George Carlin

10/29/10 5:47:11 PM#15
Originally posted by TUX426
Originally posted by dnarris

 Free to play is great for those that can moderate themselves, but I think from all of our experience I think we can safely say that the majority of the gamer world is anything, but moderate.

So?! Then they pay $15. What's the big deal?!

The beauty of F2P is that it allows players to always keep their account ACTIVE! Nothing kills an MMO faster than a plunge in players - F2P ensures that people can ALWAYS come back if they want.

Personally, once I uninstall a game, I seldom (never) go back. Keeping lotro on my PC is paramount to Turbine ever getting some $ outta me. F2P makes sure I keep it installed.

 Yeah, I see the point you're making.

Many players end up being implusive and spend way more than they ever intended. You can say "So what" or "That's thier problem", but that's what free to play for most games is about, making you want to buy things from the cash shops and taking advantage of impluse.

There are many players out there that have no clue how much money they've spent on a Free to play game this year. There are also tons of them that ended up paying more than a subscription fee every month. 

But most people don't say "Oh, I'm impulsive I better go play a subscription game." However, people are more likely to say, "Ah, I'm not like that". then find they spend $300's in stupid cash store stuff a few months later.

More often than not Free to Play is better for the company than it is for the consumer. That just seems to be the trend.

 

  sentry13

Novice Member

Joined: 12/11/05
Posts: 114

10/29/10 8:19:34 PM#16
Originally posted by dnarris

 Yeah, I see the point you're making.

Many players end up being implusive and spend way more than they ever intended. You can say "So what" or "That's thier problem", but that's what free to play for most games is about, making you want to buy things from the cash shops and taking advantage of impluse.

There are many players out there that have no clue how much money they've spent on a Free to play game this year. There are also tons of them that ended up paying more than a subscription fee every month. 

But most people don't say "Oh, I'm impulsive I better go play a subscription game." However, people are more likely to say, "Ah, I'm not like that". then find they spend $300's in stupid cash store stuff a few months later.

More often than not Free to Play is better for the company than it is for the consumer. That just seems to be the trend.

 

Thats pretty much it right there.

  ThomasN7

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/17/07
Posts: 6636

"Had to be me. Someone else might have gotten it wrong.” - Mordin Solus

10/29/10 8:24:40 PM#17

I remmeber before this went f2p people were saying how great lotro was going to be now all fo a sudden we are hearing a different tune. DiD they not think that Turbine was going to make you  pay for everything ? Just goes to show be careful what you ask for because you make just get it.

  snappydoo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/28/10
Posts: 11

10/30/10 5:22:55 AM#18
Originally posted by SaintViktor

I remmeber before this went f2p people were saying how great lotro was going to be now all fo a sudden we are hearing a different tune. DiD they not think that Turbine was going to make you  pay for everything ? Just goes to show be careful what you ask for because you make just get it.

F2P is better. If you want to play a P2P game..... you can still play LOTRO and pay a sub and get everything ^_^

Originally posted by sentry13
Originally posted by dnarris

 Yeah, I see the point you're making.

Many players end up being implusive and spend way more than they ever intended. You can say "So what" or "That's thier problem", but that's what free to play for most games is about, making you want to buy things from the cash shops and taking advantage of impluse.

There are many players out there that have no clue how much money they've spent on a Free to play game this year. There are also tons of them that ended up paying more than a subscription fee every month. 

But most people don't say "Oh, I'm impulsive I better go play a subscription game." However, people are more likely to say, "Ah, I'm not like that". then find they spend $300's in stupid cash store stuff a few months later.

More often than not Free to Play is better for the company than it is for the consumer. That just seems to be the trend.

 

Thats pretty much it right there.

So true. That's why every F2P should have an option to sub like LOTRO and get everything. Turbine's so successful because they are doing things differently than the other F2P MMOs. Though all the other F2P MMOs are eastern pos which I would never play. I wouldn't play anything that's from Asia.

  User Deleted
10/30/10 6:07:46 AM#19
Originally posted by SaintViktor

I remmeber before this went f2p people were saying how great lotro was going to be now all fo a sudden we are hearing a different tune. DiD they not think that Turbine was going to make you  pay for everything ? Just goes to show be careful what you ask for because you make just get it.

This tiered payment method Turbine introducted is amazing imo.

A player can play a AAA mmo  all the way to level cap without paying one red cent.

However if you want to actually buy every zone, skirmish and expansion you can play one lump some and turn Lotro into a B2p game like Guild wars.

Or if you want to completely avoid the shop you can pay a 15 buck sub.

 

This model keeps Lotro packed with players in turn keeping the VIPs and Premiums playing in a well populated game that requires a decent amount of grouping to experience all the pve content.

I honestly think Turbine stumbled on a way to keep populations high. Games like Vanguard, SWG, AoC & WAR suffer because they havent opened their games up to this type of model.

  nyxium

Novice Member

Joined: 3/15/09
Posts: 1198

Tumbling down the rabbit hole?

10/30/10 6:09:36 AM#20

There's no free lunch. Nom nom nom.

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