So... since my attempt at one thread saying what people like about STO got shot down (though I can't understand how people can pick apart what I enjoy, since I still enjoy it!) and the other thread I started (more news/informational) got roundly slated as well then lets try something more up this forums' alley....

What do you specifically not like about STO? Plus, more importantly, what would you do differently?

For me....

1. Klingon Faction - Common complaint, but the Klingong Faction is poorly implemented. Not enough PvP or PvE content for them to really survive outside of grinding. To fix things... Short-term I would rearrange sector space so that Romulan and Cardassian space is adjacent and have existing Fed missions opened up to KDF (with some small dialogue changes to suit). Long-term, I'd do full re-writes of the Fed missions to suit KDF plotlines and make a free-for-all Sector Space area (where opposing faction players act like DSE's) with PvP Goals in each system, and overall faction-wide rewards for "winning"
2. Ship Interiors - Things have happened on this front, but we need more functionality! Short-term I'd remove replicators from the inventory interface and put them directly into the ship interiors. Foodstuffs in the Lounge, Hypos in the Med Bay, Shield Charges in Engineering, and a new Cargo Bay (pulled for existing tilesets) with an industrial replicator that does Commodities. Long-term, well I reckon Cryptic have this on the radar, but add in functional medbays and engineering (Injury System), internal ship quest givers, ship-wide uniform options and anything and everything they can cram in that makes the ship seem alive!
3. Existing Questlines - For the most part these are fine (Fed), but there is a lack of replayability. A long-term one this, but add in 1-3 entire new questlines that are level gated, so you can't do everything first time around. Make people want to play a secondary character just to see what they missed.

shut sto down and give the ip rights to a competent developer.

Add content to the game and adopt eves space gameplay.

Originally posted by raistalin69

shut sto down and give the ip rights to a competent developer.

QFT!!!

Originally posted by raistalin69

shut sto down and give the ip rights to a competent developer.

 Took the words right out of my mouth.  I appreciate what you are trying to do OP, but I dont think any suggestions us "haters" have will make any sence to the "quellers" as they have made it their mission to oppose and critisize any opinion we give.  I would suggest posting something like this over on the STO forums.... but you might need a stronger flame suit.

You just can't make a MMO in 2 years.

Either they should completely revamp the game for the people who should have been the original focus group: Trekkies.

Or they should add a lot more content (at least 3 times the current one), revamp space combat and steal ideas from the old C-64 game Elite.

Get the devs in a room with 25 Trekkies, ask how they want the game to be. Is that too much to ask for a Star trek game?

Originally posted by Loke666

You just can't make a MMO in 2 years.

Either they should completely revamp the game for the people who should have been the original focus group: Trekkies.

Or they should add a lot more content (at least 3 times the current one), revamp space combat and steal ideas from the old C-64 game Elite.

Get the devs in a room with 25 Trekkies, ask how they want the game to be. Is that too much to ask for a Star trek game?

Yes it is too much to ask :P this is Craptic we are talking about...err Cryptic.

Buy ask points in the c-store.

Originally posted by Loke666

You just can't make a MMO in 2 years.

Either they should completely revamp the game for the people who should have been the original focus group: Trekkies.

Or they should add a lot more content (at least 3 times the current one), revamp space combat and steal ideas from the old C-64 game Elite.

Get the devs in a room with 25 Trekkies, ask how they want the game to be. Is that too much to ask for a Star trek game?

 your right about the dev time, but imho cryptic allready has trekkies letting them know what they want in the game. the issue isnt the knowing what needs to be changed, its cryptic cherry picking what is asked for. they are adding item after item to the c-store that people ask for, while ignoring the big picture. allthough if you beleive dstahl and jack "doesnt get it" emmert's latest pr they plan on addressing some of these.  i personally put zero faith in what cryptic says anymore. they may accomplish what they say they are going too, but for me they have to do it first.

Originally posted by raistalin69

shut sto down and give the ip rights to a competent developer.

Tens of thousands (hundreds of thousands if we were to believe Cryptic's spin just after release) of people that got ripped off when they bought STO approve of this message.

The overuse of instancing, the lack of variety in missions, 2 factions, the fact pvp means nothing, sector space, content in the c-store instead of game, no functioning interior, ground combat, cant even sit in your capt seat without having to do some stupid emote (i mean lol wut?), lack of end game that means something, the fact skills are so damn cryptic so you have to guess, and the last and the most annoying it is nothing like star trek we all know, the fire now ask questions later is far from what it should be, i could go on and on and on.

How i would have envisiond STO is this, get rid of all instances, space would be much like EVE big and you know space like. Most traveling would be done from your bridge/ship interior, when you get near the edge of a system you would then get one of your offices asking you if you want to jump to the next system at which point if you say yes you jump, you then see a small cinematic of your capt saying engage and of you go into warp (maybe one loading screen), no instances.

I would have a fully functioning ship interior, where you can interact with the crew and diffrent ship systems. Id have crafting that matters. Id have systems that are fought over (like the neutral zone) where both factions fight over bases and other objectives, where the front line between the 2 fighting factions is always moving, pvp that matters.

Id have end game raids for end game players to sink there teath into, end game that matters somewhat.

To put it in a few words id put the massive back into this so called mmo that much more plays like a single player game.

It was too much to expect constructive post. Funny thing is that none of the big MMO developers wanted/want to deal with Star Trek, so it is moreless this or wait for 10 years.

To answer the OP, I think the problem is about what kind of game they envisioned beyond the actual IP. From what I got, it is pretty much a fun themepark with decent but not great space combat and controversial ground combat.

1. Ground combat should have a bit more versatile.

2. Balance faction content

3. Some elements of sandbox should be added to implement diplomacy at some degree.

Originally posted by Cacaphony

Originally posted by raistalin69

shut sto down and give the ip rights to a competent developer.

 Took the words right out of my mouth.  I appreciate what you are trying to do OP, but I dont think any suggestions us "haters" have will make any sence to the "quellers" as they have made it their mission to oppose and critisize any opinion we give.  I would suggest posting something like this over on the STO forums.... but you might need a stronger flame suit.

 theres not really any point in posting such a thread on the official forums imo. theres allready hundreds if not thousands of posts listing all the many sub-standard parts of sto and some truly great ideas on how to improve them.

the issue is not the lack of good ideas on how to improve the game, the problem is cryptic's ability/willingness to implement the needed changes.

even if you assume that cryptic is able and willing (both of which i doubt), you then come to the issue of time. how long will it take to essentially rebuild the game? (dsatahl the executive producer recently listed about 70% of the game as needing major work)

considering cryptics record the best case scenario for a star trek fan at this point imo is for the ip rights to be pulled and given to a competent developer.

cryptic has stated they did not have enought time to make the game, yet they accepted the project. they have stated most of the game needs major work at this point, and have ignored this for months. have stated since beta that the klingon faction would be flushed out, and have not done so.

there is no point imo in discussing what systems in the game need improvement and how to do it (this has allready been done), when the problem is very clearly the developer's lack of ability or willingness to address the problems that need attention in due time and order.

Uhg , where the f to start.

1. Character animation - I think the animation couldn't be any simpler then it is now.  Obviously they didn't put much work into it.
2. Klingon faction , actual have a fully fleshed out faction.
3. De-Instance - take the universe, star systems and planets out of the shoebox
4. Ground combat - lose the holds/stuns generally move it to an FPS model , because that's how ground combat should play.
5. Space combat - They aimed for a tall ships slug it out model and ended up with an FPS style combat . It has the opposite problem that ground combat had. It's niether strategic nor really involved.  Better 3-d movement
6. UI - I don't think anything more needs to be said other then,  it stinks
7. Where's the MMO part ? Fleets are irrelavant.
8. Quests ? What's the point ? It's not like doing the quests has any point. You can purchase anything you need with  ingame currency everything or in the C-Store. Gameplay is irrelavant.
9. Crafting ? Does it contribute anything to the game ?
10. Diplomacy ? What is the actual purpose of it ?  Does it grant any special items, buffs , abilities ?
11. Better game instructions and descriptions. Obviously not Cryptics strong suit.

Zap,

1. The crafting system - STO does not have a crafting system.  I can not create anything, I can only modify existing items.  In UO I could chop down a tree and make a chair but in STO I can only take an existing, plain, low value torpedo launcher and add a slight bonus to it.  The end result is the items that drop from mobs are way better than anything you can craft.  I also hate the way you gather crafting material in STO.  I made it to the second level of crafting but could not find any anti-matter samples.  I went through the entire LtCmd rank and only found 8 samples.  I spent all my money I had earned by Cmd on 14 more samples because they are going for a premium on the exchange.  I was only able to make three items and earn 120 points of the 500 points I need to get to the third tier.  Its ridiculous and if you hang around memory alpha you will see very few people participate in the crafting. 

2. Rushed Content - The new captains rooms on the ships are simply a joke.  This was a big feature of season 2 and listed near the top.  "You can now walk around your ship!"  but they didnt tell you you can not sit down in any chair and all you could interact with is two shelves in the captains room.  The whole thing is just to look at!  This should not have been added until it was ready but Cryptic is in a hurry to add features to the game to show all those who left that it is improving but it's NOT, it is only getting worse.

3. Poor Coding - If you go to your bridge and look at the LCARS display on the walls and look real close at the actual words, you will find they took textures and pasted them backwards or upside down.  One bridge pack has a hole in the floor that you can fall in and get stuck.  This is simply poor coding and terrible QA at its finest.

4. Multiple Currency - Why do I have to manage over 12 different forms of currency in the game.  You have badges, marks energy and latinum.  Some can be used here and some used only at special places.  If you want an item, you have to figure out where it is sold, then figure out the currency to use to buy it and then figure out where to go and what to do to earn that currency.  It is NOT fun and was a poor design decision.

5. Poorly Documented Skills - What is the difference between a deflector and a deflector dish?  How does it impact my ship and my skills?  I dont know and I doubt I ever will based on the information on Cryptics website.

6. Lack of social interaction - I went to the Sol Starbase last night and there were 4 instances, each with 7 to 9 players.  With only 9 players running around on a starbase, it sure looks empty.  Surely their server can handle 50 players in a starbase?  Speaking of socializing, why is it needed in this game?  Other than a few task force missions, there is no need to group.  I dont see the basis for STO to be labeled an MMO since there is no MM.

7. No strategy in the ground combat - All I do in ground combat is kneel and shoot.  There is no need to do anything else.  It is boring and other than look at the large chests I gave my crew, I dont enjoy the ground game.   The PVP ground game is even worse, everyone spams holds, people die quick and you can not even apply a heal in time.  I have sat near the cargo container on PVP missions and watched as the mission went on and NO ONE opened the container for the hypos.  There is simply no need for them since you die way faster than you could ever apply the hypo.  It is poor design.

8. The C-Store - I dont need to comment on how greedy I think it is to charge $3 to play as Worf.

9. No fast transport system - Sure I can warp once every 30 minutes to the Sol system but if i am 3 sectors away doing missions and I need to clear out my inventory I have to fly all the way back and I get sucked into the enemy contact missions which makes the trip even longer.

10. Klingon content - Even 6 months after launch, it isnt even close to half of what the Fed faction has and to make matters worse, Cryptic is working on a third faction.  Can you imagine the hate that will be on the boards when they launch a third faction with little content?

11. The way Cryptic treats the loyal customers - SOE made this same mistake and they will pay for it for years.  Less than a month after launch the game goes on sale and gives 60 days of game time?  How is that for a slap in the face to all the people who supported Cryptic at launch?  How about all the people who purchased multiple versions of the game to get the exclusive items only to see those items pop up on the C-Store a few months later? 

12. The lack of development in the last 6 months - Cryptic has been getting a ton of free ideas from the users and very little of it is being used.  You look at some of the biggest defenders of the game and see their signatures pointing to some great ideas and yet Cryptic fails to implement them.  All we have been getting is half-developed content in order for Cryptic to defend its position of continually improving the game.  The difficulty slider is weak at best and there is no real increase in rewards that I have noticed for making the mobs tougher.  The ship interiors are useless and are only there to look at with nothing to interact with.  Episodes are released that are buggy and some were even unplayable for weeks after they were released. 

I could go on a lot more and discuss fleet actions, the lack of fleet support and how you cant mission with your fleet but I think i made enough points to show this game is lacking and should NOT be charging a premium sub.

Originally posted by Loke666

You just can't make a MMO in 2 years.

Either they should completely revamp the game for the people who should have been the original focus group: Trekkies.

Or they should add a lot more content (at least 3 times the current one), revamp space combat and steal ideas from the old C-64 game Elite.

Get the devs in a room with 25 Trekkies, ask how they want the game to be. Is that too much to ask for a Star trek game?

STO didnt take 2 years to make... only 18 months.

I dont understand how Cryptic thinks that they can chrage $15/month for a game that tok 18 months to make.

And even worse they added the biggest cash shop we have seen in a P2P MMO.

Is it strange that so many people hate Cryptic and their games now?

Originally posted by Talonsin

Zap,

 

1. The crafting system - STO does not have a crafting system.  I can not create anything, I can only modify existing items.  In UO I could chop down a tree and make a chair but in STO I can only take an existing, plain, low value torpedo launcher and add a slight bonus to it.  The end result is the items that drop from mobs are way better than anything you can craft.  I also hate the way you gather crafting material in STO.  I made it to the second level of crafting but could not find any anti-matter samples.  I went through the entire LtCmd rank and only found 8 samples.  I spent all my money I had earned by Cmd on 14 more samples because they are going for a premium on the exchange.  I was only able to make three items and earn 120 points of the 500 points I need to get to the third tier.  Its ridiculous and if you hang around memory alpha you will see very few people participate in the crafting. 

 I can agree with you there 100%.  We do not research any recepies, and we do not construct anything from the materials we gather.  We simply hand over the materials and a piece of equipment to be made slightly better.  I am curious... are we placing our materials into some sort of replicator or how is the upgrading happening? 

2. Rushed Content - The new captains rooms on the ships are simply a joke.  This was a big feature of season 2 and listed near the top.  "You can now walk around your ship!"  but they didnt tell you you can not sit down in any chair and all you could interact with is two shelves in the captains room.  The whole thing is just to look at!  This should not have been added until it was ready but Cryptic is in a hurry to add features to the game to show all those who left that it is improving but it's NOT, it is only getting worse.

 At first I enjoyed seeing the new areas, but I just feel bothered by the sheer size and height of the corridors, rooms.  It does not feel to me like I am on a Star Ship, but rather I am walking in some massive cathedrial or something.

3. Poor Coding - If you go to your bridge and look at the LCARS display on the walls and look real close at the actual words, you will find they took textures and pasted them backwards or upside down.  One bridge pack has a hole in the floor that you can fall in and get stuck.  This is simply poor coding and terrible QA at its finest.

 Hmm... I have not purchased any bridge packs or looked closely enough at the lcars screens to notice this.  However, I feel that now I have yet even more reason to stay away from the C store.  If we are going to be paying for extra things, I would hope they would not be buggy. 

4. Multiple Currency - Why do I have to manage over 12 different forms of currency in the game.  You have badges, marks energy and latinum.  Some can be used here and some used only at special places.  If you want an item, you have to figure out where it is sold, then figure out the currency to use to buy it and then figure out where to go and what to do to earn that currency.  It is NOT fun and was a poor design decision.

 Multiple currencies indeed.  I only paid attention to two.. the energy credits and the latinum. The others I just ignored.  Unfortunatley poor design is something that is very common among all aspects  this game.

5. Poorly Documented Skills - What is the difference between a deflector and a deflector dish?  How does it impact my ship and my skills?  I dont know and I doubt I ever will based on the information on Cryptics website.

 Some skills are pretty self explanitory, but the majority of the skills out there have very vauge descriptions about what you are actually getting if you were to increse this skill.  So, yes I agree with you here on that one.

6. Lack of social interaction - I went to the Sol Starbase last night and there were 4 instances, each with 7 to 9 players.  With only 9 players running around on a starbase, it sure looks empty.  Surely their server can handle 50 players in a starbase?  Speaking of socializing, why is it needed in this game?  Other than a few task force missions, there is no need to group.  I dont see the basis for STO to be labeled an MMO since there is no MM.

 There really is no need for fleets.  You can only do content with what the instance cap will allow into the instance.  I have heard that even if you are grouped and you enter an instance.. that the game will put you in different instances.  You will then have to coordinate and expierement to get to the same instance in order to do the contene. 

7. No strategy in the ground combat - All I do in ground combat is kneel and shoot.  There is no need to do anything else.  It is boring and other than look at the large chests I gave my crew, I dont enjoy the ground game.   The PVP ground game is even worse, everyone spams holds, people die quick and you can not even apply a heal in time.  I have sat near the cargo container on PVP missions and watched as the mission went on and NO ONE opened the container for the hypos.  There is simply no need for them since you die way faster than you could ever apply the hypo.  It is poor design.

 Pretty much this.  I think the new breen encounters in the new weekly episodes might offer some stragegy, but again... most of the ground combat is press this and that, then rinse and repeat.  But this seems to be something shared in most mmo's I have played.  I hardly expected to see something new or different from Cryptic though.

8. The C-Store - I dont need to comment on how greedy I think it is to charge $3 to play as Worf.

I think this is the only reason that Cryptic "made worf get mad at the federation and leave".  So they could then charge us for playing Klingons in the Federation.

 

9. No fast transport system - Sure I can warp once every 30 minutes to the Sol system but if i am 3 sectors away doing missions and I need to clear out my inventory I have to fly all the way back and I get sucked into the enemy contact missions which makes the trip even longer.

Just flying through space seems silly.  You do not feel you are at warp, as there are no stars wizzing by,  you can be stopped in your tracks by a planets popsicle stick, and you can run into an invisible traffic controller wall asking you if you want to warp to the next section.  Now that is terrible design.

 

10. Klingon content - Even 6 months after launch, it isnt even close to half of what the Fed faction has and to make matters worse, Cryptic is working on a third faction.  Can you imagine the hate that will be on the boards when they launch a third faction with little content?

 Its been said that they are putting off the thrid faction untill the Klingons get equivelent content that the feds have... untill the Klingons become "Fully fleshed out".  So it makes me wonder if another faction will ever be released... and if so.. it might be put into the C store (my own viewpoint on that last point).

11. The way Cryptic treats the loyal customers - SOE made this same mistake and they will pay for it for years.  Less than a month after launch the game goes on sale and gives 60 days of game time?  How is that for a slap in the face to all the people who supported Cryptic at launch?  How about all the people who purchased multiple versions of the game to get the exclusive items only to see those items pop up on the C-Store a few months later? 

 I do not really have anything to add to this.  You pretty much said my feelings on the matter.

12. The lack of development in the last 6 months - Cryptic has been getting a ton of free ideas from the users and very little of it is being used.  You look at some of the biggest defenders of the game and see their signatures pointing to some great ideas and yet Cryptic fails to implement them.  All we have been getting is half-developed content in order for Cryptic to defend its position of continually improving the game.  The difficulty slider is weak at best and there is no real increase in rewards that I have noticed for making the mobs tougher.  The ship interiors are useless and are only there to look at with nothing to interact with.  Episodes are released that are buggy and some were even unplayable for weeks after they were released. 

 I know that Cryptic has purchased ideas and concepts from a player called "thomas the cat".  The ideas were all pretty much minigames, though I am not sure if any actual gameplay ideas were part of the purchase.  Other than that... there is a plethra of awesome ideas that get talked about, developed, updated and developed some more, then the devs come in and say something like "Thats an awesome Idea" yet nothing ever comes of it.

I could go on a lot more and discuss fleet actions, the lack of fleet support and how you cant mission with your fleet but I think i made enough points to show this game is lacking and should NOT be charging a premium sub.

 In red.