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News & Features Discussion  » General: Cult of (Multiple) Personality

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  Adamai

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/06/10
Posts: 469

5/08/10 9:40:49 AM#41
Originally posted by alkarionlog


lol its article make me remember my days when I played RFonline, no Role Players there, but all the hate griefing and drama you describe as there XD, so its still make wonder? what is the diference of the RP over the non-RP?

 

none all are people who have nothing else to do.... just exist to annoy you, I guess it was a reason for me to love pvp games, I kil the moron and move on, if he come back kill him again XD, nothing like make a kid thrown a tantrum for you killing him, and don't forget the block XD

 

because you dont know what the difference between rp and none-rp is actualy the difrence between them lol. the diffrence is you dont know what the diffrence is. am i makeing sence to you ? i suspect not :)

  Disdena

Novice Member

Joined: 3/05/10
Posts: 1098

5/08/10 10:18:31 AM#42

This article really does go too far in trying to malign RPers in general. It is a poor article and, as others have said, reads like something that was written in anger due to recent events. You've written about everything negative about RPing that you could think of, and almost nothing positive.

  DKWFirstborn

Novice Member

Joined: 5/05/10
Posts: 31

It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice.

5/08/10 1:26:13 PM#43
Originally posted by Adamai

well to kil their guild you would have to god emote it in the first place, and to force them to use emotes to get out of dieing by putting them on ignore was also god emoteing too..  this is the exact elitest attidude people dont want to see in rp.. im sorry sir but your a good example of how not to rp.. your guild clearly has its own very strickt rp polocies and rules that only apply to your guild and not the greater community. you basically dictate the out come of other peoples rp by breaking your own so called rules and tabo's.  not very smart :)

sure what they was role playing wa ssprobably disgusting and off plot slightly for a game enviroment, but thats not really for another plaayer to decide or punish for.. thats why you have the option to report players for conduct.

you just openely admitted to being the type of role player no body wants to see. well done buddy!!

 

It's not something i am exactly proud off, it's not something that should be done in any circumstances. But then again whatever one does it offends somebody. If you too critical somebody disagrees if to agreeing/positive somebody disagrees. Often in insulting way. Our actions could be concidered as stealing one's freedom of choice.

But what comes to the type of roleplayer I am?

Let me illuminate my position as guild leader in such situation, I had in my command the largest roleplay/raid guild upon the server. I believe that guild leader needs to have level head and calm nature in any stresfull cirumstances. Not even the wiesest person is a good leader if he can't controll his emotions. We could say that a leader is required to take drastic mesures to ensure his guild members that their in good hands.

In my view: The person, broke rules of the server and the eula with her beahviour. I could just have ignored her, but in such situation where there are 50 people, you can't decide that the situation doesn't occur when it does. So can I ignore situation if my guild & others don't? Answer is simply a NO as majority reacted to situation I was forced to do so aswell. Most people were absolutely furious, I did break role for sake of rules and said that he/she is breaking rules.

However as even then my actions/words offended somebody. I was in position to make the call, to take the action. What do you choose, your own morale screams deciding to report and ignore. Others didin't think so. I could have used my leader's power to ask people to ignore however, I decided to be loyal to roleplay and others. 

So I did what was required, took the action. In terms of roleplay, everybody refered her/him as monster. In such fantasy setting, monsters die. Even city guard would killed the monster, so in the setting's spirit. It was radical action however that's something I deemed nessasserry.  So is the right choice to ignore every situation of not my liking?

If this all makes me disgusting/dislikable roleplayer or likable strong figure is for each to decide. Idealist can claim I am wrong, laywer can claim the same, judge might agree with me. In a way there is no right or wrong. Wrong is when one takes law upon his hands, right is when one let's the law deal with situation, but if there is no laws or rules that dicate what is illeagall? Perhaps roleplay lore nazis are right, as they set the tight rules? Perhaps it's the casualists whom are right? In the end of the day everybody lost in that situation.

A reason why I brought up the rules and tools, is simply the fact that roleplay situations often dictate you to grey area that is between good taste and straightout against the rules. I personally believe that I did the right thing, made the right call. As people become bloodhungry pack of mindless beasts when their safe heaven is stepped one.

In other words, all is about point of view. But in the end of the day, what is really right? to allow one roleplayer to ruin it for 50 others, or do as the 50 believe to be right? I have no preset layer of answers for that question.

But please don't judge me upon one opinnion or one action.

Kindest regards,

DKW

  MMO.Maverick

Inquisitor

Joined: 3/05/10
Posts: 7792

The middle road is the place to be!

5/08/10 1:35:37 PM#44
Originally posted by Disdena

This article really does go too far in trying to malign RPers in general. It is a poor article and, as others have said, reads like something that was written in anger due to recent events. You've written about everything negative about RPing that you could think of, and almost nothing positive.

Well, Disdena (and others), the Subject title was "Cult of (Multiple) personality" not "RP in MMO's the goods and the bads".

Or as the opening sentence on the news-page says:

"MMORPG.com's Jaime Skelton uses her Player Perspectives column this week to talk about the darker side of the role-playing sub-culture in MMOs."

 

Really, after that sentence how could you not have expected the focus to be on the darker or more frowned-upon/annoying aspects of RP?

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  erithe

Novice Member

Joined: 8/03/06
Posts: 8

5/08/10 3:21:24 PM#45

:)  I'm an RP'er and a guild leader, and what you just described is something I have to work very, very hard to avoid.  My guild is on an RP server in EQ2, and, when I first started there, I had this imaginary place in my head where everyone would just RP with me wherever I went, that it would grow organically ... much as it had in MUDD's I'd played in the past.  Alas, this was a vicious lie.

Now, as a guild leader of an RP guild, I have to work hard to provide a friendly, drama-lite environment for the people in my guild, and this usually means vetting candidates very thoroughly on top of their application.  I have everything from silly RP'ers to very serious types, and some hard core types along with raiders, but because my main criteria is a.  did your mama teach you manners?  and b.  Do you attract drama or repel it? and c. Are you nice?   Everyone pretty much gets along.   Sort of.  Most of the time.  Hah hah

I don't know if that's snobby or not, but I've had members come from other guilds and RP experiences who had pretty much been beaten and bullied to a pulp.  I've had to tell people to leave my guild who have gotten so caught up in their own sense of importance that they were bullying other guild members, and I've turned away RP'ers who were so snobby they thought they would 'fix' my guild.  

It says a lot about a community when you and a few of the other guild leaders see their jobs as providing 'safe havens' for people.  The entire community isn't necessarily this way, but there are enough danger zones that it can be scary for a new player who really only wants to join in and have fun.  I've developed a new appreciation for my boss at work when she's had to fire someone, because my main job in game is to act as a kind of peace keeper and facilitator of fun.  When I see drama stirring, I make no apologies for quashing it with a giant hammer.

  Disdena

Novice Member

Joined: 3/05/10
Posts: 1098

5/08/10 3:53:18 PM#46
Originally posted by cyphers
Originally posted by Disdena

This article really does go too far in trying to malign RPers in general. It is a poor article and, as others have said, reads like something that was written in anger due to recent events. You've written about everything negative about RPing that you could think of, and almost nothing positive.

Well, Disdena (and others), the Subject title was "Cult of (Multiple) personality" not "RP in MMO's the goods and the bads".

Or as the opening sentence on the news-page says:

"MMORPG.com's Jaime Skelton uses her Player Perspectives column this week to talk about the darker side of the role-playing sub-culture in MMOs."

 

Really, after that sentence how could you not have expected the focus to be on the darker or more frowned-upon/annoying aspects of RP?

I hope you don't think I'm nitpicking at semantics here, but in order to have a "darker side", there would have to be a light side. What Jamie has written goes a long way in trying to prove that there is no light side. She went past the point of claiming "there's a light side and darker side to RP, here's the darker side" and well into "all RP is bad" territory.

Don't be fooled: it's also a quiet lie.

Here, she's talking about what she just described in the previous paragraph: roleplayers who explain the ins-and-outs of RP, publicly RP, and invite others to join in for fun. Even if you accept the rest of her article — that hardcore RPers are bad because they are elitist, cliquish, and "full of vitriol" — it doesn't make any sense to malign the people who are encouraging RP in a way that anyone would approve of. She takes the people who gently instruct, encourage, and host welcome-all events, and accuses them of being a lie. Not misleading, not a rare exception, and not naive about the actions of their roleplaying peers. A lie. She claims that people who RP in an acceptable way, the people on what you could otherwise call the lighter side of the role-playing sub-culture, have ill motives at heart and are acting kind and welcoming only as a deception. She flatly denies that a lighter side of RP can exist at all.

There are three basic groups: the casuals, the rule-breakers, and the hardcore. Casual role-players (aka "softcore") are the majority group. This is a catch-all term that includes players who may only role-play once in a while, to those that role-play on a more regular basis but are a little more relaxed to the 'rules.' They may be the ones who do things simply because it's something else to do between waiting on a dungeon or engaging in PvP, or while they're doing other things. It's simple enjoyment to them, and they generally don't care how other people might view them.

There's no need for me to break down the last two groups that she mentions, as she describes them as evil-incarnate. But in glossing over casuals, she reveals the depth of her convictions that the dark side of RP is the only side. She says that casual RPers are the softcore ones, people who either do not roleplay all the time, or who do not follow the supposedly sacred cardinal rules. As there are only three groups that she thinks roleplayers fall into, the only way to avoid being classified as a bad one is to not roleplay all the time, or to roleplay the wrong way. Phrased another way, if you are in character more than occasionally and you follow commonsense RP conventions, you are automatically a blight on the server community. This is another flat denial that there can be a good side to RP; the only way to do it right is to do it wrong or to hardly do it at all.

I could go on but there's no need. Enough people have already seen (and commented) that this is a vindictive article containing a lot of generalizations that have no basis in fact. Jamie has no shame in playing armchair psychiatrist, laying on plenty of loaded phrases like "the fake lives they're leading", "their sudden, secret emotional needs", "dwell in a fantasy world", "turning away others to feel better about themselves". For shame. The claims that she makes about cliquish hardcore RPers turning on their friends are so outlandish and so bizarrely specific (especially towards the end) that I really can't help playing psychiatrist myself and claiming that she's talking about actual events that recently happened to her personally and have nothing to do with the rest of the RP community on that server, in that game, or anywhere in MMOs.

  FarOutFish

Novice Member

Joined: 2/24/09
Posts: 52

5/08/10 4:23:26 PM#47
Originally posted by kevorkianj
Originally posted by FarOutFish

This is a no-brainer. If you play the game, you are obliged to follow the fules, both the letter and spirit of the rules.. This is not just a role players view, it should be the mantra of every gamerr.- no everyone with honorr - that  makes everybody, play fair.

Agreed, but only if the server is defined as RP. A common misunderstanding about RP is that it is a sort of mini-game, something you do on and off. However, the basis of RP is nothing else but playing in-character all the time. 

I don't believe a dedicated server is neccesary. The group you are with determines how much you role-play, some wan't to role-p[ay as if they were King Kear, others just wan't to go out and wack something.. If you match your play style to  that of the rest  of your team, It has been my experience, being flexable, keeps the fun going with out the Drama.some seem to thrive on.

Most games require cooperation of players to achieve goals. "We must hang together or surly we will hang seperatly." Ben Franklin.

In my worlld, games are played untill they stop being fun..If I am not enjoying the game, why keep playiing..

  Dinendae

Novice Member

Joined: 3/26/06
Posts: 1269

5/08/10 6:34:45 PM#48
Originally posted by cyphers
 

 

Really, after that sentence how could you not have expected the focus to be on the darker or more frowned-upon/annoying aspects of RP?

 It doesn't have to focus on the positive side of things, but the article is using a broad brush to try and paint most roleplayers that way. You can talk about the problem people in roleplaying communities without implying that most (if not all) are like that.

"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan

  Hluill

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/30/09
Posts: 104

5/08/10 8:10:10 PM#49
Originally posted by kevorkianj
Originally posted by FarOutFish

This is a no-brainer. If you play the game, you are obliged to follow the fules, both the letter and spirit of the rules.. This is not just a role players view, it should be the mantra of every gamerr.- no everyone with honorr - that  makes everybody, play fair.

Agreed, but only if the server is defined as RP. A common misunderstanding about RP is that it is a sort of mini-game, something you do on and off. However, the basis of RP is nothing else but playing in-character all the time. 

 

 I got about halfway through the comments and had to quote this one.  How many RP guilds have I jooined only to see (()) around everything they /s, /g, /t, and /gu.  Then there was the incessant RP in /gu even though we were all on opposite ends of the game world.  Yeah, my toon is fighting for her life right now, not sitting in the guild's imaginary lounge.

So what kind of RPer am I?  I like playing my character as it exists in game.  That's not just guild chat or RP events, that's with the choices it makes. 

It's  funny that I've experienced players that griefed RPers, but not the other way around...

Hluill, a barbarian rogue, and his Warrior-daughter, Leyek
Playing: GW2, TSW, LotRO, EQ2, and V:SoH
Played: EQ, UO, DAoC, WAR, DDO, AoC, MO

  Cedia

Novice Member

Joined: 11/09/08
Posts: 20

5/08/10 11:52:24 PM#50

Not all roleplaying communities are like that.  WoW's is, though.  Definitely.

GCT Xfire Miniprofile
  Noxulus

Novice Member

Joined: 7/05/09
Posts: 31

5/09/10 4:32:50 AM#51

Lol. Stick to reviewing games and leave the hard-hitting journalism to the pulitzer prize winners, please.

  Scot

Elite Member

Joined: 10/10/03
Posts: 5404

5/09/10 4:42:09 AM#52
It is the easiest thing in the world to ignore a line of text and send a private message to someone explaining where they went wrong. It will only become an OOC drama if you want it to. Although I hear a lot about uber strict RP guilds I have never been in one. Perhaps that indicates the high standard I expect us all to follow, but then what do you want to set yourself a low standard for? I have never met anyone I would describe as a ‘rule breaker’, but casual and hard core certainly exist.
 
If you think being good at something ss elitist that’s down to you. Are Olympic athletes, the world’s top businessmen and artists all elitist? If you are good at something, anything, don’t let those who are average drag you down to their level. We live in a society which favours the lowest common denominator more than individual genius, which is madness.
 
I have never known a role-player to describe another role-player as lazy or an idiot. Jamie’s description of roleplay as some sort of down and dirty fight reveals she has some real issues with those she has roleplayed with. I don’t recognise what she is describing at all and it is sad she had to go through that sort of nonsense.
 
But this is not the norm, I and I am sure most others can say that roleplaying wherever you find it is fun and well worth the effort.
  MyDcmbr81

Novice Member

Joined: 6/07/09
Posts: 60

5/09/10 8:47:35 AM#53
Originally posted by Noxulus

Lol. Stick to reviewing games and leave the hard-hitting journalism to the pulitzer prize winners, please.

^ This.

 

It's obvious that you have an axe to grind with RPers, and your statement of  "Heck, I roleplay" reminds me of a racist saying "Hey, I have black friends."

  Amathe

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 3/02/05
Posts: 1666

5/09/10 2:37:58 PM#54

I understand where the article is coming from, because I have met some extremely rude and insular role players.

 

But let me say this in their defense. These are role playing games. They have their origin in games where everyone was an actual roleplayer. Then about 11 million people crashed their party, showed up in their type of game,  kicked role playing to the curb as an activity for oddwads, while they obsessed only about gear and loot and and leveling. This caused developers to stop caring about roleplayers, and focus their products on the party crashers.

 

So yeah, they have a reason to be ticked off.  Considering how shabbily they have been treated, it's amazing they are as gracious as they are.

EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  GT3000

Novice Member

Joined: 10/05/08
Posts: 13

5/09/10 2:52:36 PM#55

Looks like the RPers have some touchy nerves. White people.

[-Shakes head.-]

When you've done something right, no one will know you've done anything at all. -Unknown

  FarOutFish

Novice Member

Joined: 2/24/09
Posts: 52

5/09/10 3:18:19 PM#56
Originally posted by MyDcmbr81
Originally posted by Noxulus

Lol. Stick to reviewing games and leave the hard-hitting journalism to the pulitzer prize winners, please.

^ This.

 

It's obvious that you have an axe to grind with RPers, and your statement of  "Heck, I roleplay" reminds me of a racist saying "Hey, I have black friends."

You know someone realizes they are loosing the argument when the play the "Race Card.". It's a cheap trick which a suprising number of pople fall for.

  Boneflower

Novice Member

Joined: 6/02/04
Posts: 92

5/09/10 3:57:21 PM#57

So exactly how are roleplayers (based on the original article) any different from any other group of players then? Oh...wait...they aren't. You could ascribe these traits and behaviours to any group or sub-group of players in games (or for that matter anywhere in life) and they would be just as valid.

 

It isn't roleplayer characteristics you are describing, but human nature. Every group in life has its extremists and it's utter asses. Most groups are cliquish to some degree by the very nature of groups and sub-cultures. Singling any specific group out for this sort of article seems silly and gratuitous to me.

  eyeswideopen

Tipster

Joined: 5/24/09
Posts: 2503

5/09/10 4:29:52 PM#58

I would suggest that Jamie uninstall any mmoRPGs on her computer(s), and stick to singleplayer games and CounterStrike clones. She may also want to avoid ventrillo and other forms of chat. In fact, probably better if she just avoids the internet altogether ( better for her AND the rest of us ). This way, her potential to be butthurt and have to whine about it disguised as "writing" will be minimized.

-Letting Derek Smart work on your game is like letting Osama bin Laden work in the White House. Something will burn.-
-And on the 8th day, man created God.-

  harnquist

Novice Member

Joined: 12/26/08
Posts: 13

5/09/10 7:15:27 PM#59

Jaime is right on. I think she must have spent too much time in PlaneShift. The number of RPers who popped up in this thread to defend RP is about right. RPers have this thing where they all believe that they are not the RPers that cause the problems. Then you get in game with them.

  User Deleted
5/09/10 8:49:01 PM#60

Funny enough, this article reminded me of the SCA.

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