Most of us know WOW is the big giant out there in the MMO world, and many of us feel WOW is a bit too slow on the expansions, forcing players to repeat old content again and again and again.

But WOW is coming out with a new expansion, "Cataclysm", that I predict will rock the charts just like all of their expansions.  So, between now and when Cataclysm releases, is a window of opportunity for a new first rate MMO to step in and scoop up some bored WOW players.

Is this not so?  Therefore, I think FF XIV would be wise to release before Cataclysm comes out.  Just my opinion.

Thoughts?

It would be wise for SE to have FFXIV out before Cataclysm comes out just so that they have a fair shot at the market. 

Although I can say that I rather like having expnasions slowly come out with patches that include new dungeons and such.  You must remember that Everquest is a prime example of "Too much, too fast, too soon" when it comes to expansions.  And unfortunately I was there to experience it first hand.

Well i do believe that all new MMO's need to be aware of upcoming WoW expansions and their release dates because, whether we like it or not, it does make a huge impact on the market.

That being said, if FFXIV holds onto the same ideals and directions that FFXI has, then it will pull in a completely different crowd to the WoW crowd. Many people just prefer a more challenging game. And other people (that played WoW and quit) might like the opportunity to play something with more depth. I myself loved WoW (vanilla) and moved onto FFXI afterwards and really appreciated it for how great it is. So i do think there will be a wealth of people who will play FFXIV anyways even if Cataclysm is released around the same time as it. Don't underestimate the power of WoWBurnout...

Best bet would be to put it out between the new expansion and the new patch cause after only a few weeks of the patch being released most content will be done and before the expansion so you have those mass of bored WoW players come in play the game for a few months and find they like it stick with it and maybe half the players will stick or maybe more.

They shouldn't release it unfinished yet they should try to get it out as soon as they can but with nothing broken of course because as you can see most games that release broken don't bounce back from it. So it's all about timing it if they can between the WoW final big patch and the new expansion.

I do not believe Square is worried about Wow and their expansion.The reason is because no matter what, WOW players are highly unlikely to just walk away from their level 60+ players and all their trinkets they have collected inthe game.This is just the nature of players in general,i am actually one who does not care period,i play a game that is good,i can walk away from a maxxed out player EASILY.

I think all Square is worried about is everyday the game is not launched it is potentially hundreds of thousands of dollars.I have touched on this one aspect several times,because we all know players ask for player housing in all games.So why would Square not take that extra time to involve player housing and avoid WOW's xpac?Answer is obvious,i just pointed it out,they do not care,they just want the game out as fast as they can in a workable fashion.

If anyone knows anything about Square they do not release bugs,i believe this is because they spend a lot of time to make sure the game is bug free.I believe that FFXIV is already pretty much finished,they are spending all this time,touching up the game.I believe in this so strongly,i doubt there will be many bugs if any even when it hits open beta testing.

I have no problems at all with players who really want to play the game and have legitimate gripes,i expect it,but i would choose to avoid al lthose WOW players ,rather than get a % of them to boost subscription numbers.I am not one of those clueless people who need to have large subscription numbers to decide weather the game is any good or not.I will most likely turn my chat right off or ignore it totally,so that i miss any of those WOW players telling us how the game SHOULD be done,because that is the way WOW does it.

Final Fantasy has a very strong following. I don't think even Blizzard's monolithic WoW will deter someone from making a choice to play a FF game, even it is only for the first 30 days.

I personally don't like FFXI, nor do I really enjoy any of the FF series, but they have a very large fanbase. Square's only goal should be to please the people that they have, and only hope to appeal to more players after that.

Ideally, they would want the game to be a no-brainer switch for anyone currently playing FFXI, because it has a very steady, probably the most steady, playerbase of any MMO.

I don't see them being able to go wrong unless the game is not better than FFXI.

I would even consider giving the game a shot if they don't use PlayOnline or at the very least create a new version of it. My major qualm with FFXI wasn't actually the game itself, it was the terrible interface for logging into the game. I hope the game does well, any competition is good competition.

edit: Second thoughts:

Initially, yes, the release of a WOW expansion will probably hinder and even sometimes crush the release of an MMO. I don't think a game like Final Fantasy which in name alone carries a ton of girth would be ruined because of an untimely release.

That said, it is much better to wait for Blizzard to release Cataclysm. That way it gives the developers more time to polish and get the game ready for release and also lets the giant buzz around a new WoW expansion dwindle a bit.

I'll say that the worst thing you can do in the MMO world is release an unfinished or buggy product. Many players have a one-shot sort of deal with these games and they'll turn their back on them for good. You don't want to cut out potential fans before they have a chance to play the game you intended to create.

Originally posted by Wizardry

I do not believe Square is worried about Wow and their expansion.The reason is because no matter what, WOW players are highly unlikely to just walk away from their level 60+ players and all their trinkets they have collected inthe game.This is just the nature of players in general,i am actually one who does not care period,i play a game that is good,i can walk away from a maxxed out player EASILY.

I think all Square is worried about is everyday the game is not launched it is potentially hundreds of thousands of dollars.I have touched on this one aspect several times,because we all know players ask for player housing in all games.So why would Square not take that extra time to involve player housing and avoid WOW's xpac?Answer is obvious,i just pointed it out,they do not care,they just want the game out as fast as they can in a workable fashion.

If anyone knows anything about Square they do not release bugs,i believe this is because they spend a lot of time to make sure the game is bug free.I believe that FFXIV is already pretty much finished,they are spending all this time,touching up the game.I believe in this so strongly,i doubt there will be many bugs if any even when it hits open beta testing.

I have no problems at all with players who really want to play the game and have legitimate gripes,i expect it,but i would choose to avoid al lthose WOW players ,rather than get a % of them to boost subscription numbers.I am not one of those clueless people who need to have large subscription numbers to decide weather the game is any good or not.I will most likely turn my chat right off or ignore it totally,so that i miss any of those WOW players telling us how the game SHOULD be done,because that is the way WOW does it.

Unfortunately, after all these big talks, we still do not know what FF is doing.  Or where it is heading.

Square is a business.  They want sub money, they need sub money to recover development cost and maintain the game enhancement cycles.  Big talks about not wanting WoW player is just vanity talks.  Square will make use of every means possible to draw in sub money, WoWers or not.  After all, there is no valid pre-screening process to identify ex WoWers, or identify WoW burners.  There is no way to exclude players with both FF and WoW sub concurrent.

As for Square do not release bugs, that means what?  Time and money spent in debugging is money income postponed and risk that the game is old when released.  Rushing out a buggy game is death, releasing a game too old and too late is death, any company need to strike a balance.

The OP clears sees the dialema of any company competing with WoW & Blizzard.  They need to time their publication to enjoy a good moment for catching wary players.  Caught by a major WoW release, almost any game will face an uphill battle grabbing enough initial box sales and sub to maintain a healthy lifecycle.

Each new WoW expansion has, so far, been met with less and less enthusiasm by the community. The vast majority of people you could talk to that currently play WoW play it mainly because they're nothing better out there.

It's easy to get in to. Easy to get on for just an hour and actually be able to do something. The gameplay is smooth and there really aren't many bugs. The features are actually quite impressive and cross-server instancing is even more impressive.

I don't play WoW anymore and to be honest I do wish it would kind of go away. At the same time though I do recognize just how good it is. All the problems that people have with it are purely a matter of flavor. Be it art style, how 'carebear' it is, how easy it is or whatever most of these things are just flavor choices.

I personally am looking for something a bit more....heavy? Yes....heavy I think is the right word. Maybe Mortal Online will do that for me. Maybe it will fail me, key distinction there though - I couldn't care less if everybody else dislikes it. I don't think it's too much to ask for a game that can capture the essence of old school UO. We'll see.

If its gana be a solo quest grind then yeah it needs to come out first.

If its FFXI with the few annoying bits removed, then I hope it comes out after, so all the wow kiddies are off playing it, and the rest of us can enjoy the game.

Originally posted by Lord_Ixigan

Each new WoW expansion has, so far, been met with less and less enthusiasm by the community. The vast majority of people you could talk to that currently play WoW play it mainly because they're nothing better out there.

It's easy to get in to. Easy to get on for just an hour and actually be able to do something. The gameplay is smooth and there really aren't many bugs. The features are actually quite impressive and cross-server instancing is even more impressive.

I don't play WoW anymore and to be honest I do wish it would kind of go away. At the same time though I do recognize just how good it is. All the problems that people have with it are purely a matter of flavor. Be it art style, how 'carebear' it is, how easy it is or whatever most of these things are just flavor choices.

I personally am looking for something a bit more....heavy? Yes....heavy I think is the right word. Maybe Mortal Online will do that for me. Maybe it will fail me, key distinction there though - I couldn't care less if everybody else dislikes it. I don't think it's too much to ask for a game that can capture the essence of old school UO. We'll see.

That is almost tautology.  Someone plays WoW b/c there is nothing better.  Someone else is not playing WoW b/c he found something better.  That something differs for each someone.

Does that make WoW look smaller or bigger?  No.  Its just a fact that the largest number of people settle on WoW today as the best game they can find for their personal gaming preference.  As for tomorrow, it is a 99.9999% chance guess that WoW will still be the one for the largest number of people.  What about day after, month after, year after.  We do not know, nor do we need to care.  Its just a game, you forget it the moment you log out.

Whether FFXIV launches before or after Cataclysm makes no difference, there will still be tons of WoW players that will try it out, because its the new bling-bling of graphics, but as soon as they realize that one must think and actually have to read and be ever slightly competent they will leave and return to whatever doesn't require a brain! 

This happens with FFXI to this day and it will happen again with FFXIV!

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Originally posted by Khrymson
Whether FFXIV launches before or after Cataclysm makes no difference, there will still be tons of WoW players that will try it out, because its the new bling-bling of graphics, but as soon as they realize that one must think and actually have to read and be ever slightly competent they will leave and return to whatever doesn't require a brain! 
 
This happens with FFXI to this day and it will happen again with FFXIV!

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You's trollin' son.

Originally posted by uohaloran

 

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Originally posted by Khrymson
Whether FFXIV launches before or after Cataclysm makes no difference, there will still be tons of WoW players that will try it out, because its the new bling-bling of graphics, but as soon as they realize that one must think and actually have to read and be ever slightly competent they will leave and return to whatever doesn't require a brain! 
 
This happens with FFXI to this day and it will happen again with FFXIV!

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Condescending attitude...check
Holier-than-thou syndrome...check
Post that doesn't really pertain to the topic at hand...check

 

You's trollin' son.

so are you....

It will only take 3 weeks for WoW players to experience everything the new expansion will give out of box. Then all those players that have quit over the year and came back just for this expansion will get pissed at Blizzard curse them out and vow never to play WoW again ...  until patch 4.11. Then they will be back.

Best time to "attack" would be about a month to 6 weeks after Cataclysm it will hit the MMO player at their biggest moment of weakness.

Originally posted by uohaloran

Final Fantasy has a very strong following. I don't think even Blizzard's monolithic WoW will deter someone from making a choice to play a FF game, even it is only for the first 30 days.

I personally don't like FFXI, nor do I really enjoy any of the FF series, but they have a very large fanbase. Square's only goal should be to please the people that they have, and only hope to appeal to more players after that.

Bingo. I wish more developers would do that - cater to your core audience first and build a strong foundation (a la FFXI). Then look for ways to attract others who might not otherwise check it out. In some ways, I think that's the approach they're taking with XIV. They know what they did right with XI, and they know the areas that many people weren't happy with. I'm sure there are aspects of XI that even they're not happy with in the company as well. So that gives them a platform to build from.

Ideally, they would want the game to be a no-brainer switch for anyone currently playing FFXI, because it has a very steady, probably the most steady, playerbase of any MMO.

I don't see them being able to go wrong unless the game is not better than FFXI.

I would even consider giving the game a shot if they don't use PlayOnline or at the very least create a new version of it. My major qualm with FFXI wasn't actually the game itself, it was the terrible interface for logging into the game. I hope the game does well, any competition is good competition.

They're doing away with PlayOnline for FFXIV. They've already setup a "Square Enix Account", which is what your security token ties into (if you have one) and it's what FFXIV will tie into. So it will most likely work like other MMOs.. you log in directly from a login screen. I like that they're going in that direction as well.

I think PlayOnline was a good idea that just never panned out and became, basically, superfluous; an unnecessary step to get into the game (or series of them, as the case be)

edit: Second thoughts:

Initially, yes, the release of a WOW expansion will probably hinder and even sometimes crush the release of an MMO. I don't think a game like Final Fantasy which in name alone carries a ton of girth would be ruined because of an untimely release.

That said, it is much better to wait for Blizzard to release Cataclysm. That way it gives the developers more time to polish and get the game ready for release and also lets the giant buzz around a new WoW expansion dwindle a bit.

I'll say that the worst thing you can do in the MMO world is release an unfinished or buggy product. Many players have a one-shot sort of deal with these games and they'll turn their back on them for good. You don't want to cut out potential fans before they have a chance to play the game you intended to create.

Originally posted by ic0n67

It will only take 3 weeks for WoW players to experience everything the new expansion will give out of box. Then all those players that have quit over the year and came back just for this expansion will get pissed at Blizzard curse them out and vow never to play WoW again ...  until patch 4.11. Then they will be back.

Best time to "attack" would be about a month to 6 weeks after Cataclysm it will hit the MMO player at their biggest moment of weakness.

LOL. Well played... sadly, you don't even need a crystal ball to see that. It's like the "battered girlfriend syndrome" with that game. People leave because Blizzard isn't treating them right... Then Blizzard says "But we're changing! We're going to be better! Please give us another chance!", and the players all think "Oh, okay... I'll give you another chance.. But this is the last time! I swear!". A few weeks later,players are leaving again, saying "You lied to me again!".

Though I also don't think WoW is going to have the impact on FFXIV, in particular, that it might on other MMOs. WoW is established. Updates and changes aside (though Cataclysm *is* a pretty damn major update.. seems to be the most substantial change to the game that I can think of... whether for better or worse, who knows), WoW will be what it will be at its core. Nothing new there. I think it'll mostly attract those who would have stuck to WoW and not checked out XIV anyway.

Though there is certainly overlap, SE and Blizzard seem to have very different playerbases, at least in their MMO market.

I think SE can ignore what WoW is doing because their real target market is Japan and no one in Japan has even heard of WoW

Originally posted by pencilrick

Most of us know WOW is the big giant out there in the MMO world, and many of us feel WOW is a bit too slow on the expansions, forcing players to repeat old content again and again and again.

But WOW is coming out with a new expansion, "Cataclysm", that I predict will rock the charts just like all of their expansions.  So, between now and when Cataclysm releases, is a window of opportunity for a new first rate MMO to step in and scoop up some bored WOW players.

Is this not so?  Therefore, I think FF XIV would be wise to release before Cataclysm comes out.  Just my opinion.

Thoughts?

 

1. Players aren't forced to repeat old content. They can choose to quit the game once they've had their fill of it.

2. A die hard WoW player is going to buy Cataclysm no matter what.

I think those who like WoW, but aren't diehard fans that'll buy every expansion just because, will buy FFXIV no matter when Cataclysm releases, but only if FFXIV interests them. If a person is curious about Cataclsym or FFXIV, it won't matter when it's released, because they'll buy it just to check it out.

For example, I bought Fallen Earth, Champions Online, and AION within 1 week of each other, because I was curious about all of them. This was after recently rusubbing to WoW, only to quit 2 weeks later to try out these new games. So if a curious person like me manages to try out new things, doesn't it stand to reason that other people will too? I'm sure games and expansions releasing around each other has some influence, but don't forget there's plenty of people who aren't influence by such things and will buy them all out of plain curiousity.

Honestly, I think the fact that FFXIV is not a WoW clone will do it great service in the market.  The problem with almost all MMOs these days is they try to copy WoW too much.  Similar level system, similar combat mechanics, similar crafting, etc.  FFXIV is going to have very different combat mechanics (position is important, a move away from the Tank-Healer-DPS system, more engaged group dynamic), crafting is clearly going to be quite different, and leveling is totally different.  Custom quests is a pretty cool idea too, so I think that will also help them out.  The Class System of course, will be a great boon, as a lot of people will appreciate being able to do multiple classes and switch between skills, I think.

Overall FFXIV has a lot going for it, so I think it will compare well even to Cataclysm.  Let's face it WoW does make small improvements with expansions, but the combat system is going to remain very stale, imho (personally, the boring and unthinking nature of combat made me quit Wow).  Questing isn't THAT engaging either in WoW, since it is basically "do whatever the guy tells you to do" at least with FFXIV you can do what you CHOOSE to do, and choices are nice.

In short, FFXIV will have more differences compared to WoW than FFXI did, and that's a good thing.  Makes it so that it won't blend in with the WoW-clones.

Originally posted by ic0n67

It will only take 3 weeks for WoW players to experience everything the new expansion will give out of box. Then all those players that have quit over the year and came back just for this expansion will get pissed at Blizzard curse them out and vow never to play WoW again ...  until patch 4.11. Then they will be back.

Best time to "attack" would be about a month to 6 weeks after Cataclysm it will hit the MMO player at their biggest moment of weakness.

This doomsday prediction has been floating around for years.  If I earn a dime reading each repetition of this same idea, I will be richer than Bill Gates.

Luckily WoW is still doing very well, so you guys can go on repeating the same words, without the need to find a new game to plug into this sentence.