Originally posted by MMMOGIRL

Originally posted by Demz2

You know what I hate??.  Its the whining bitches on these forums.  That act like they speak for  a whole playerbase, the only people that they speak for are the 200 active people on this site.

AMEN! Quit whining about the damn game and GO PLAY SOMETHING ELSE! WoW doesn't care what you think and neither does their 11mil+ subscribers, so get over it. You don't need to force it down everyone else's throat by constantly making new threads on it. You hate WoW, we've established that, MOVE ON!

so.. how is posting what you don't like about WoW any different than posting what you don't like about WAR?  It seems like you don't have a problem with that...

 I hate WoW because it slept with my girlfriend and wrecked my car.

Originally posted by Astralglide

 I hate WoW because it slept with my girlfriend and wrecked my car.

WoW killed my parakeet and gave me irritable bowel syndrome. 

I play WoW, but there is a lot about it that is bad. Even a successful game has room for improvement.

I agree about the player base. If it weren't for being in a guild with friends I enjoy spending time with and who are adults and actually act like it, I couldn't play the game.

My ignore list is full. I have to delete one a-hole to put a new one on the list and I hope each time that the a-hole removed from my ignore has moved on or changed sides so I don't have to listen to them any more. It takes a lot to have me use ignore, so the people on that list deserve to be ignored by everyone on the server.

The game is simple as well. There isn't any complexity to the systems, the new raids have a few new twists but are easily understood and dealt with by even mediocre players. The draw of the game for most people is the simplicity and ease of play.

I simply don't have time for anything more complex. I can thrive in WoW with my limited play time, something I could not do in more difficult systems. I left SWG partially because I simply could no longer dedicate the time to my Shipwright to gather the materials I needed for my Imp Pilot (I pretty much left the ground game after the NGE and lived in the cockpit of my TIE Oppressor). And SWG isn't the most complex game I've dealt with.

The hate comes from the fact that WoWs simplicity allows a larger player base that at times is the most obnoxious group of individuals in one place on the face of the earth. Trade chat is filled with bile and filth, ignorant children thinking profanity and vulgarity make people think they are adult and adults acting like spoiled brat children with their whines about Gear Score or Paladins being  OP.

Its funny, but there is actually an elitism forming among players on the fuller WoW servers, looking down on people still running heroics and the older Naxx or EoE raids. Its like they expect people to treat them as some sort of gaming god for running the newer content that simply requires you to have gear that allows you to do and take more damage.

And there is the real rub. Newer raids aren't harder because they do something different, they simply require players gear to give them more health and dps (or healing ability). Its just dressing up the same old style of play: Have gear, know your rotation, kill things in the right order....

Does it deserve hate? No. Hate is too strong an emotion to be wasted on a game. You can show disdain all you want, you can feel superior because you play EVE, but save hate not for the game but for the faceless mass of ignorance that is a vocal minority in the game.

Originally posted by Grayseven

I play WoW, but there is a lot about it that is bad. Even a successful game has room for improvement.

I agree about the player base. If it weren't for being in a guild with friends I enjoy spending time with and who are adults and actually act like it, I couldn't play the game.

My ignore list is full. I have to delete one a-hole to put a new one on the list and I hope each time that the a-hole removed from my ignore has moved on or changed sides so I don't have to listen to them any more. It takes a lot to have me use ignore, so the people on that list deserve to be ignored by everyone on the server.

The game is simple as well. There isn't any complexity to the systems, the new raids have a few new twists but are easily understood and dealt with by even mediocre players. The draw of the game for most people is the simplicity and ease of play.

I simply don't have time for anything more complex. I can thrive in WoW with my limited play time, something I could not do in more difficult systems. I left SWG partially because I simply could no longer dedicate the time to my Shipwright to gather the materials I needed for my Imp Pilot (I pretty much left the ground game after the NGE and lived in the cockpit of my TIE Oppressor). And SWG isn't the most complex game I've dealt with.

The hate comes from the fact that WoWs simplicity allows a larger player base that at times is the most obnoxious group of individuals in one place on the face of the earth. Trade chat is filled with bile and filth, ignorant children thinking profanity and vulgarity make people think they are adult and adults acting like spoiled brat children with their whines about Gear Score or Paladins being  OP.

Its funny, but there is actually an elitism forming among players on the fuller WoW servers, looking down on people still running heroics and the older Naxx or EoE raids. Its like they expect people to treat them as some sort of gaming god for running the newer content that simply requires you to have gear that allows you to do and take more damage.

And there is the real rub. Newer raids aren't harder because they do something different, they simply require players gear to give them more health and dps (or healing ability). Its just dressing up the same old style of play: Have gear, know your rotation, kill things in the right order....

Does it deserve hate? No. Hate is too strong an emotion to be wasted on a game. You can show disdain all you want, you can feel superior because you play EVE, but save hate not for the game but for the faceless mass of ignorance that is a vocal minority in the game.

 

There sint any complexity to the systems?????  My friend this is the only game with mechanics that work on mathamatical theories.  Go look up eleitist jekrs forums and others etc.    On that site there are hundrerds of thousands of players using it, and peopel that actually do the math behind DPS, tnaking , pvp everything to pump out dps, healign gear etc.  My friend what seems simple on the outside has huge mechanics on the inside.  Any noob can fuucking play, its understanding the mehcnaics about ur class tthat give you the edge over other players my friend.  You think spamming ur  few skill buttons on your in a random order hotbar even come close to understanding the mechanics of dps ?  NOPE!.  New raids arnt harder?  ASK the top guilds in the world the hardmore encounters on algalon or Firefighter or yog+0 etc etc.   newsfflash there was elitims back in old wow, when noobs were running UBRS to gera up while other guilds were doing MC and BWL.  Plz dont confuse player ease of use with complexity my freind.  because getitng deep down into it, wows character and gear mechanics are far more complex than looting it and putting it on.

Originally posted by tro44_1

-The game being stingy with experience and the whole leveling process

All RPGs are about Lvling. RPG RL games and Table Top, may not, but video games as a genre is all about lvling. Even Skill Based Sandbox games deal with lvling, they just dont show the EXP bars and such.

-

 

 

This is soo wrong. RPGs at least used to be about the story. Thats what Role Playing stands for.

The level? Thats just a indicator for the progress of your hero. Those storys generally let you start as a small

guy who gradually grows up to a hero and the level indicates that. You cant start as the legandary superhuman who

kills dragons with his kitchen knife for breakfast, cause that would be just boring. And thats what the lvl should be for. Making lvling the whole goal of the game has little to do with RP . 

Its true though that mmos are alot about grind. WoW changed it a bit with its heavier focus on questing  but its still there.

Ideally you should be able to experience the story regardless of your lvl . Nothing bothered me more than doing 3-4 quests in a group and then getting a "your level is to low for this quest" , nice... thanks that you let me decide when i can do this quest...

Originally posted by Malifiss

Originally posted by Astralglide

 I hate WoW because it slept with my girlfriend and wrecked my car.

 

WoW killed my parakeet and gave me irritable bowel syndrome. 

YOU TWO ARE THE BIGEST IDIOTS ON THIS FORUM!!!!

LEARN2SUE-RICH-COMPANIES

LEARN2BUY-INSURANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by tro44_1

Originally posted by Malifiss

Originally posted by Astralglide

 I hate WoW because it slept with my girlfriend and wrecked my car.

 

WoW killed my parakeet and gave me irritable bowel syndrome. 

 

YOU TWO ARE THE BIGEST IDIOTS ON THIS FORUM!!!!

LEARN2SUE-RICH-COMPANIES

LEARN2BUY-INSURANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am NOT the biggest idiot on this forum. That would be too difficult of an achievement for me and there are so many who are ahead of me for that title. That being said, I hate tro44_1 because he had sex with my car and gave my parakeet irritable bowel syndrome.

Originally posted by Astralglide

Originally posted by tro44_1

Originally posted by Malifiss

Originally posted by Astralglide

 I hate WoW because it slept with my girlfriend and wrecked my car.

 

WoW killed my parakeet and gave me irritable bowel syndrome. 

 

YOU TWO ARE THE BIGEST IDIOTS ON THIS FORUM!!!!

LEARN2SUE-RICH-COMPANIES

LEARN2BUY-INSURANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am NOT the biggest idiot on this forum. That would be too difficult of an achievement for me and there are so many who are ahead of me for that title. That being said, I hate tro44_1 because he had sex with my car and gave my parakeet irritable bowel syndrome.

 

I hate tro44_1 because he's my ex-girlfriend and he won't have sex with my parakeet in my car. 

Originally posted by Malifiss

Originally posted by Astralglide

Originally posted by tro44_1

Originally posted by Malifiss

Originally posted by Astralglide

 I hate WoW because it slept with my girlfriend and wrecked my car.

 

WoW killed my parakeet and gave me irritable bowel syndrome. 

 

YOU TWO ARE THE BIGEST IDIOTS ON THIS FORUM!!!!

LEARN2SUE-RICH-COMPANIES

LEARN2BUY-INSURANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am NOT the biggest idiot on this forum. That would be too difficult of an achievement for me and there are so many who are ahead of me for that title. That being said, I hate tro44_1 because he had sex with my car and gave my parakeet irritable bowel syndrome.

 

 

I hate tro44_1 because he's my ex-girlfriend and he won't have sex with my parakeet in my car. 

I hate WoW because it made my plush hamster kill himself, made twin clones of Hitler, punched Superboy Prime in reality, stared my dog down, spoiled my grandmother, assimilated me into the Borg, then made me into a real boy, just to make me a woman again.

And tro44_1 just smells.

Originally posted by Goronian

Originally posted by Malifiss

Originally posted by Astralglide

Originally posted by tro44_1

Originally posted by Malifiss

Originally posted by Astralglide

 I hate WoW because it slept with my girlfriend and wrecked my car.

 

WoW killed my parakeet and gave me irritable bowel syndrome. 

 

YOU TWO ARE THE BIGEST IDIOTS ON THIS FORUM!!!!

LEARN2SUE-RICH-COMPANIES

LEARN2BUY-INSURANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am NOT the biggest idiot on this forum. That would be too difficult of an achievement for me and there are so many who are ahead of me for that title. That being said, I hate tro44_1 because he had sex with my car and gave my parakeet irritable bowel syndrome.

 

 

I hate tro44_1 because he's my ex-girlfriend and he won't have sex with my parakeet in my car. 

I hate WoW because it made my plush hamster kill himself, made twin clones of Hitler, punched Superboy Prime in reality, stared my dog down, spoiled my grandmother, assimilated me into the Borg, then made me into a real boy, just to make me a woman again.

And tro44_1 just smells.

He does, really.  Sorta like sweaty feet and stale cheese. 

Originally posted by Daffid011

Originally posted by girlgeek

Originally posted by Predator160

I think players are given way to much and are spoiled in WoW. A lot of them didn't play oldstyle MMO's partly because they were too young, and MMORPG's didn't become mainstream until WoW.

 

THAT is a great analogy.

 

Aweful analogy.

 

I feel confident in saying that most people didn't play old mmos, because they just were not fun to many people.  Not because they where hard or people were to young. 

Sitting around a dungeon for 8 hours hoping something exciting would spawn is not the pinnacle of enjoyment for many people.  Nor is roaming around the landscape randomly killing anything that moves just to push an experience bar from empty to full.  Grinding 40 hours just to get access to one zone is not something many people would enjoy and I recall a lot of old school hardcore players hating that concept too.  I know I did.

Old mmos were filled with hiddious timesinks that somehow people translate into earning or difficult gameplay.  I don't think sitting around waiting is an achievment or somehow hard effort. 

And WoW ISN'T filled with "hideous timesinks?"  Were you playing the same game? The problem is the WoW "timesinks" aren't challenging, they're just....TIME with no challenge.  If you have enough TIME you can get anything you want, for the most part. There are no mythical weapons to get by long chains of activity. Hell, warlocks don't even have the warlock mount quest chain anymore to earn their mount. It's just GIVEN TO THEM, which makes it very NOT special.

Even though new mmos are far more complex than anything from the good old days, they still are not hard.  Old games kept people loot starved, so every item upgrade was memorable [which does have merit].  New games hand out more items, because the is no reason to only have useful 12 items for a player in the entire expansion.  It doesn't change the actual gameplay of "earning" those items which is very similar in nature from the old days to current days. 

 

Reading the analogy above just reminds me of the old guy shouting at kids to stay off his grass, because everything was harder when he was young and these kids today are just whippersnappers.  

 

 

 

 

Who said anything about CAMPING mobs being how you "earn" anything?  Honestly, I myself was thinking about before the last few patches that made getting the best gear so freaking EASY.  I was a raider.  I had to go to Ulduar (and eventually ToC), learn the fights, and then probably go 30 times before what I wanted actually DROPPED and I actually WON the roll for it.  NOW.....all you have to do is pick an easy heroic and farm it for emblems, or....if you want the BEST gear....do the daily heroic every day for a while.  Heroics are so easy now, you could almost run them with your character naked.  There's no challenge in that, and no sense of accomplishment when you get a "reward" for it.

I stand by my "that was a great analogy," and you're proving it with your whining "old guy" and "whippersnapper" comments. I've played new AND old MMOs, and the OLD ones definitely have something the new ones DON'T....a sense of actually "EARNING" what you got. And no....I don't mean EQ (that's an old one I didn't play) camping mobs for 8 hours.  I'm talking about challenging gameplay, and time invested to acquire something "special," so that it actually was somehow meaningful (in a virtual reality sense).

I hate wow because it looks like it was developed to entertain preschoolers. Melted crayons. ugly.

I don't hate WoW, however the game has been around since late 2004 and around 2007 I just got bored with the same old same ole thing, day in and day out. Chase this, chase that and which carrot method are they using now.

WoW in 2004 is alot different than it is today though, of course all mmorpgs grow with time (for good or bad), but I wish they would have taken the game in a different direction instead the current one they got.

Just like SWG PreCu,  I wish there was a traditional WoW server before the Burning Crusade was introduced.

WoW before TBC was a excellent game in my opinion.

Will I ever go back, hmm, I dont think so, but never say never when it comes to mmorpgs. Who knows, they might introduce a Classic server down the road and I will be playing it again.

I think WoW's a great game , Although i dont play anymore i sometimes have the urge to go back and play

Originally posted by Thormier

I think WoW's a great game , Although i dont play anymore i sometimes have the urge to go back and play

I think most of us do. I haven't played since pre-TBC but once you get the itch, you must scratch.

Been how many years now and I still find myself going to WoW's homepage to read about the latest features.

Originally posted by Krieg

Originally posted by Thormier

I think WoW's a great game , Although i dont play anymore i sometimes have the urge to go back and play

 

I think most of us do. I haven't played since pre-TBC but once you get the itch, you must scratch.

Been how many years now and I still find myself going to WoW's homepage to read about the latest features.

Yeah vanillia wow was a good game but unfortunately the direction the game took ruined it for me and im sure many others.

Originally posted by girlgeek 

Who said anything about CAMPING mobs being how you "earn" anything?  Honestly, I myself was thinking about before the last few patches that made getting the best gear so freaking EASY.  I was a raider.  I had to go to Ulduar (and eventually ToC), learn the fights, and then probably go 30 times before what I wanted actually DROPPED and I actually WON the roll for it.  NOW.....all you have to do is pick an easy heroic and farm it for emblems, or....if you want the BEST gear....do the daily heroic every day for a while.  Heroics are so easy now, you could almost run them with your character naked.  There's no challenge in that, and no sense of accomplishment when you get a "reward" for it.

 

I stand by my "that was a great analogy," and you're proving it with your whining "old guy" and "whippersnapper" comments. I've played new AND old MMOs, and the OLD ones definitely have something the new ones DON'T....a sense of actually "EARNING" what you got. And no....I don't mean EQ (that's an old one I didn't play) camping mobs for 8 hours.  I'm talking about challenging gameplay, and time invested to acquire something "special," so that it actually was somehow meaningful (in a virtual reality sense).

The analogy sucked, because it is not representative of players today against players of old.  There have always been beggars and lazy people.  You see the game through the eyes of a raider and there are many people who want avenues of advancement other than raiding.  I am saying this as a raidcentric player, but raiders are not the only people entitled to rewards, thus my "get off the grass" comment.  

Believe it or not I agree with you that to many items are available through heroics and other tasks that are mostly time commitments instead of difficult encounters.  There is always better available in the most recent raids, but I personally think blizzard is downgrading old rewards to fast.  That doesn't mean people are not "earning" anything and whining about it.   Farming a boss once you have beat it isn't exactly hard.

Just because there are different avenues doesn't mean people are lazy selfish ingrates for not agreeing with your views.  This whole notion of whiny spoiled kids is getting to the point of ridiculous.  Raid or die is, well dying.  The current aspects of non-raiding advancement are not perfect, but it is a work in progress I guess.  The real problem is that new raids (as you pointed out) require learning, expenses, etc and heroics do not evolve in the same manner.  At the same time I will see 20x more items in a 2 hour raid than a non-raider will see in who knows how long farming. 

Most of the old games sense of "earning" came through extremely limited supply, such as 4-5 times a month for the entire server and other variations of time sinks or time barriers.  Almost every one of them revolved around time, not difficulty.  It certainly gave the impression that something was earned, but in reality there was no more real effort put forth in the actual acts of conquest.  Fighting a boss mob is still fighting a boss mob, sust the odds of winning the reward were much much less back then. 

Originally posted by Salvatoris

Originally posted by MMMOGIRL

Originally posted by Demz2

You know what I hate??.  Its the whining bitches on these forums.  That act like they speak for  a whole playerbase, the only people that they speak for are the 200 active people on this site.

AMEN! Quit whining about the damn game and GO PLAY SOMETHING ELSE! WoW doesn't care what you think and neither does their 11mil+ subscribers, so get over it. You don't need to force it down everyone else's throat by constantly making new threads on it. You hate WoW, we've established that, MOVE ON!

 

so.. how is posting what you don't like about WoW any different than posting what you don't like about WAR?  It seems like you don't have a problem with that...

Posting your OPINION of a game in a discussion thread about the game is one thing, but making NEW threads CONSTANTLY bitching about WoW and all its so-called faults is just getting annoying. I gave my opinion in that WarHammer thread and left it at that, I didn't start NEW threads BITCHING about it.

Originally posted by Ginkeq

 

Because it isn't as good as Everquest was, and Everquest is now dead and so are MMORPGs that were similar to it.

There are several reasons why WoW is not a good MMORPG:

-Lack of challenging PvE content

I used to play WoW when they had 40 man content still.  My guild was doing AQ40 while people on our server were stuck in newb zones like Molten Core.  Clearing instances for the first time was still fun at that time..  Then the geniuses at blizzard decided to dumb down the PvE content.  They made almost every instance a 25/10 man, and also made the content much easier.  Almost every newbie on the server could now do any zone they wanted, but they made the game too easy for the skilled players.

Plus the expansion added solo quests that anyone could do.. The gear from solo quests, and even green items had better stats than the difficult 40 man content.  It's ridiculous, they let all those horrible players catch up by making trivial expansion content with better loot than what was in instances that most guilds couldn't handle.

It was great when Naxx40 gear became useless because of soloable quests in the expansion.  Good job Blizzard sell-outs handing gear out to skill-less players who couldn't even handle Molten Core content. 

Maybe if their leveling system wasn't so trivial in the first place there wouldn't be the problem of 99% of endgame guilds not being able to clear newb zones like Molten Core.  Their leveling system would have weeded out the bad players or at least taught them how to play by level 60, but no, leveling in WoW is an activity that takes no skill or effort.  Boring

There should be some sort of progression between expansions / content release.  With the expansion, it allowed complete newbies to skip over MC -> BWL -> AQ40 -> Naxx40 progression.

Just was put in for a dumb playerbase who couldn't handle real PvE content like it was before the newb 25/10 mans came out.

PvE content in WoW just isn't difficult enough.  They should have made it more difficult than it was when 40 mans were out.  Then make everything a WORLD SPAWN so there is competition between guilds/teams on the same server, and so there is a healthy and real PvP system within the server.  But no, competition is too hard of a concept for the morons at Blizzard.  People on the same server can't fight each other for PvE content, that's just too natural, so put it in fake carebear instances and make World PvP meaningless in WoW.

Amen to that.
I remember the AQ40 days when PvE contents were serious business. 
Gotta love the Twin Emperors, Disbander of Guilds.