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10/21/09 1:37:12 PM#41
Originally posted by Sortis Blizz does do it...you cna change your race/faction for a modest 30 bucks... So i've heard, I was just using them and SOE as an example as everyone knows those names. = )
Some times you gotta go where everybody knows your name.... |
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10/21/09 1:42:25 PM#42
Originally posted by Sortis
You can still spend a shat ton of in game currency to respec if you want...the option to do the very same thing in game is still there, just another option for those who want to go that route. Your argument just lost most of its substance. I am going to rewrite what you said, but only change 2 words.
You can still spend a shat ton of in game currency in game loot if you want...the option to do the very same thing in game is still there, just another option for those who want to go that route. Your argument just lost most of its substance. Beware of the precedent being set here, because your logic can be applied to ANYTHING in the game. Somehow I don't think you would be so dismissive if that was the case.
Beyond that, you can't earn extra character slots in game and there is no reason to sell additional ones after release. It really is just greedy. I assume the same applies to the extra costume slots?
It really is an example of a company reducing or eliminating things from release with the intention of selling them as "addons" in a cash store. The problem is that there is no benefit to the players in this type of business model. In a straight subscription based game, all of these items would be free and have their access levels determined by gameplay and not restricted to encourage people to spend extra money.
Long story short, I don't see a benefit to players when a company removes content and features only to hold them hostage for a ransom.
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10/21/09 1:45:26 PM#43
Originally posted by Daffid011 I am going to rewrite what you said, but only change 2 words.
You can still spend a shat ton of in game currency in game loot if you want...the option to do the very same thing in game is still there, just another option for those who want to go that route. Your argument just lost most of its substance. Beware of the precedent being set here, because your logic can be applied to ANYTHING in the game. Somehow I don't think you would be so dismissive if that was the case.
Beyond that, you can't earn extra character slots in game and there is no reason to sell additional ones after release. It really is just greedy. I assume the same applies to the extra costume slots?
It really is an example of a company reducing or eliminating things from release with the intention of selling them as "addons" in a cash store. The problem is that there is no benefit to the players in this type of business model. In a straight subscription based game, all of these items would be free and have their access levels determined by gameplay and not restricted to encourage people to spend extra money.
Long story short, I don't see a benefit to players when a company removes content and features only to hold them hostage for a ransom.
you get 8 character slots 16 with special subcription offters Or buy them in 4 packs you get 4 costumes in game or buys more in the c store
Holoween Costumes? Earned in the event or bought
New contume sets and emblems Earn perks or buy a set Action figures? Mission or C store
NEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEXXXXXXXXXXXXXTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
Edit: i think i know your problem You don't want to work in game for anything, or pay for it out of game. You want everything free. Your part of the fricking "gimmie" genenration which expect people to spood feed you everything for free. |
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10/21/09 2:13:22 PM#44
The precedent was set long ago with loot cards, and repurchasing software for exclusive items. When CoX started adding a few things to the online store, they blatantly told the community that they were running on a shoestring budget, and they wanted to add a few specialized developers to the team. Now with Cryptic I'm guess they had a big budget coming out of the gate, and the game hasn't made as much money to this point as they would have liked. Makes me wonder if the $15 a month standard fee is dated and should be raised? |
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10/21/09 2:19:54 PM#45
Originally posted by ebonfire
Probably, but honestly can you really see people paying more? I can't |
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10/21/09 2:25:12 PM#46
Actually this was requested via a thread on the official forums by many players. So, don't go just blaming cryptic. However, I find it amazing that they had the time to do this, but yet not find the time to add more content. (And no, three small instances doesn't equal enough content to fill the gaps). Ugh, Cryptic needs to get there act together. After my 6 month sub, I'm out. |
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10/21/09 2:26:22 PM#47
Originally posted by junzo316
A valid concern. i BARLY made it to 40, and i had to go several days with content half my level as the only grind around 38 and from 21 on i kept fighting +1,+2, +3...by the time i ran out at 38 i was running 42/43s |
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10/21/09 4:01:48 PM#48
Originally posted by Sortis
Well I mean I love CO and I'm not gonna quit just because of the C-store. I dont like it, I understand why they do it. I'm rather logical about it, I dont think it is a black and white issue like so many are slamming it for. It isnt a downright greedy practice as you dont HAVE to do it. Are they looking for an extra buck...deffinitly, does it matter, deffinitly not because its a video game. We arent playing "burn the heretic here" so everyone can just relax. At the end of the day they wanna make a quick buck and i wanna play the game. Now I think people would look at this completely different if say, most if not all of the contents were offered in an expansion pack and you had to run out to the store to buy it, along with a level cap increase and such. Now the question we ask ourselves is "If we dont condone this, then why the hell has it been ok for a game to charge money for expansions?" And dont feed yourself a lump of shit so you can sleep better tonight. New zones...new level cap you say? Well DDO has done that for free in the form of many many content updates, so now that we know a company can afford it...it should be no problem for hard hitters like SOE and Blizz to do it right? NO Blizz and SOE want their buck at the end of the day just like Cryptic does, is it a mild different because you can get on any time and buy a respec...yeah it is but like i said you can do that with in game currency too. There is a thin line here ladies and gentlemen and you can walk it if you like, but all i'm saying is dont claim its black and white and turn into a big flamming hypocrite when you just gave SOE or Blizz or whoever their $30 for the same damn thing DDO is giving away for free. Which is really the same argument you bring to the table "This company doesnt do it so why does yours charge for it?" I'm not saying its right...but i'm not saying its wrong either, just food for thought.
Oh! Reason! How rare. And boring. =P Nah, I agree. But it is way more fun to start a flamewar, ja ne? *giggles* But seriously, I would not quit CO if I liked it, but for my perspective it is sorta like the final nail on the coffin. I hated the nerfs, I hated how CO lacked in some parts right away and adding stuff to buy extra is so just the final "enough" for me to skip this game. Even tho I loved the general idea of the game, but we don't feed from ideas. |
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10/21/09 4:05:44 PM#49
Originally posted by Yunbei
Well I mean I love CO and I'm not gonna quit just because of the C-store. I dont like it, I understand why they do it. I'm rather logical about it, I dont think it is a black and white issue like so many are slamming it for. It isnt a downright greedy practice as you dont HAVE to do it. Are they looking for an extra buck...deffinitly, does it matter, deffinitly not because its a video game. We arent playing "burn the heretic here" so everyone can just relax. At the end of the day they wanna make a quick buck and i wanna play the game. Now I think people would look at this completely different if say, most if not all of the contents were offered in an expansion pack and you had to run out to the store to buy it, along with a level cap increase and such. Now the question we ask ourselves is "If we dont condone this, then why the hell has it been ok for a game to charge money for expansions?" And dont feed yourself a lump of shit so you can sleep better tonight. New zones...new level cap you say? Well DDO has done that for free in the form of many many content updates, so now that we know a company can afford it...it should be no problem for hard hitters like SOE and Blizz to do it right? NO Blizz and SOE want their buck at the end of the day just like Cryptic does, is it a mild different because you can get on any time and buy a respec...yeah it is but like i said you can do that with in game currency too. There is a thin line here ladies and gentlemen and you can walk it if you like, but all i'm saying is dont claim its black and white and turn into a big flamming hypocrite when you just gave SOE or Blizz or whoever their $30 for the same damn thing DDO is giving away for free. Which is really the same argument you bring to the table "This company doesnt do it so why does yours charge for it?" I'm not saying its right...but i'm not saying its wrong either, just food for thought.
Oh! Reason! How rare. And boring. =P Nah, I agree. But it is way more fun to start a flamewar, ja ne? *giggles* But seriously, I would not quit CO if I liked it, but for my perspective it is sorta like the final nail on the coffin. I hated the nerfs, I hated how CO lacked in some parts right away and adding stuff to buy extra is so just the final "enough" for me to skip this game. Even tho I loved the general idea of the game, but we don't feed from ideas. What is this "Adding stuff to buy" fuss about. You get all that stuff in some form just by PLAYING THE GAME. Sheesh. |
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10/21/09 4:15:53 PM#50
As long as the shop is doing things that can be gotten through game play I don't have as much of a problem with it, still won't play the game because of it though. I prefer everyone to do things through the game, and earn the rewards. I also have a feeling this sort of payment plan will be in star trek online and if they do that I will have to check that game off my list of mmos I am interested in. |
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10/21/09 4:20:37 PM#51
Originally posted by BloodDuality
so how would you have prefered they handle it? 8 character slots and 4 costumes is enough for most people for example. That's free and in game.
Special subscriptions get you 16 characters.
But for some that still isnt enough. So what give everyon 40 costumes and characters? Or give people a good, fair base amount and let them buy extra if they want more then "average" |
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10/21/09 4:22:42 PM#52
The fact is the game is designed for the casual player. Casual players dont like to work for things in game, they want them handed to them. The items in the C store are the logical conclusion for a game based around casual play in which the average player has more RL money than time. I personally dont care so long as I am able to get he same thing in game and there is no gamebreaking stuff for sale in the shop. On a sidenote: I have never seen or heard of a gold spammer in the game yet. Some guildmates did look at some sites and found some gold for sale for a rediculous price. So at least players dont have to fact that crap. For me the only downside to the game is the fact it can be completed in about 1 to 2 months. And it is possible to get to lvl 40(max level) now with no break in quests. You might have to do a few repeatables here and there. For this game to go anywhere they need to double the size and amount of content in the game at a minimum. On the other hand if you are the type that will drop $50 on a single player/console game this game would be comparable in overall worth to any of those...just dont subscribe past the free period. |
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10/21/09 5:11:26 PM#53
Originally posted by nekollx
You got all that information about me from one post. Wow, what are next weeks lottery numbers? In all seriousness, this isn't about putting some tarnish on players for not wanting to pony up some money for extra stuff. There is no justification for these things having a price tag in the first place. This isn't extra stuff. This is the type of stuff games should include as part of the ongoing sub fee. You know that fee developers convinced us was needed to keep updating the game with content and maintenance.
This is about companies hacking bits and pieces away from games and then reselling it to us as if it is some sort of perk. Why should there be an additional fee for extra costume slots? Where is the benefit to players for that? For 10 years there has been no need to do this, what has changed and how does this make any players lazy or gimmie for not wanting it? My "problem" is that I see no rational value for players in the way game developers are doing with these types of things. You can bad mouth me all you want with baseless accusations, but you honestly have no idea what I game like. In the end you are defending the design choices of the idiot that did this same type of things in hellgate london. Now go ask any premium members of that game about the value of their purchases.
Answer this for me. How many character slots would be too few and would make this a problem? 6? 3? 1? If your answer is any number then you agree with me. The only thing you disagree with is what number of characters slots is "acceptable" and honestly that number is going to differ from player to player. If something is a problem at 6 then it fundamentally is a problem at 10 and 3 and it just becomes a measurement of how much it can be tolerated.
I'm sorry if I expect more for my money and any way you slice it, you are paying a subscription fee for less than 100% of the game. You are defending a company that is giving you less than 100% of the game and holding the remainder on layaway until you pay for it. You will have to come up with a better viewpoint than calling me lazy to get me to see your side of things.
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10/21/09 5:25:59 PM#54
Originally posted by Daffid011
You got all that information about me from one post. Wow, what are next weeks lottery numbers? In all seriousness, this isn't about putting some tarnish on players for not wanting to pony up some money for extra stuff. There is no justification for these things having a price tag in the first place. This isn't extra stuff. This is the type of stuff games should include as part of the ongoing sub fee. You know that fee developers convinced us was needed to keep updating the game with content and maintenance.
This is about companies hacking bits and pieces away from games and then reselling it to us as if it is some sort of perk. Why should there be an additional fee for extra costume slots? Where is the benefit to players for that? For 10 years there has been no need to do this, what has changed and how does this make any players lazy or gimmie for not wanting it? My "problem" is that I see no rational value for players in the way game developers are doing with these types of things. You can bad mouth me all you want with baseless accusations, but you honestly have no idea what I game like. In the end you are defending the design choices of the idiot that did this same type of things in hellgate london. Now go ask any premium members of that game about the value of their purchases.
Answer this for me. How many character slots would be too few and would make this a problem? 6? 3? 1? If your answer is any number then you agree with me. The only thing you disagree with is what number of characters slots is "acceptable" and honestly that number is going to differ from player to player. If something is a problem at 6 then it fundamentally is a problem at 10 and 3 and it just becomes a measurement of how much it can be tolerated.
I'm sorry if I expect more for my money and any way you slice it, you are paying a subscription fee for less than 100% of the game. You are defending a company that is giving you less than 100% of the game and holding the remainder on layaway until you pay for it. You will have to come up with a better viewpoint than calling me lazy to get me to see your side of things.
but you see that just what your missing. All the things in the c store ARE part of the sub and you can get them in the game if you want...OR buy them. It's a Choice. Totally up to you. Grind or Pay. Need extra over the average, you can do "buy extra"
Most people aren't going to need more then 8/16 characters or 4 costumes per. That's free. Doesn't cost a dime.
But the few who want more can get it for a small one time fee.
Want a Retcon? Grind gold in game or pay money
very few c store items don't have a in game equivilent. |
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10/21/09 5:32:01 PM#55
Originally posted by Daffid011 I am going to rewrite what you said, but only change 2 words.
You can still spend a shat ton of in game currency in game loot if you want...the option to do the very same thing in game is still there, just another option for those who want to go that route. Your argument just lost most of its substance. Beware of the precedent being set here, because your logic can be applied to ANYTHING in the game. Somehow I don't think you would be so dismissive if that was the case.
Beyond that, you can't earn extra character slots in game and there is no reason to sell additional ones after release. It really is just greedy. I assume the same applies to the extra costume slots?
It really is an example of a company reducing or eliminating things from release with the intention of selling them as "addons" in a cash store. The problem is that there is no benefit to the players in this type of business model. In a straight subscription based game, all of these items would be free and have their access levels determined by gameplay and not restricted to encourage people to spend extra money.
Long story short, I don't see a benefit to players when a company removes content and features only to hold them hostage for a ransom.
Wow, somehow you think its ok to change 2 words in a paragraph of information to make your argument valid. Dude I could change 2 words in a lot of posts on here and make them sound radicly different. I just cant even wrap my head around why you think its ok to put words in peoples mouth? Besides even if it was ok, character slots and more costume slots arent something you NEED to play the game and its not game breaking if my character doesnt have an extra purple costume slot, at your logic a game should have an infinite ammount of slots for both, why doesnt any other MMO have an infinite?! OMG they make us buy another account, which is the same thing as cryptic charging for extra, except i'm paying less money. So...other MMOs are being greedy because they dont offer tons and tons of character slots for free? Get real dude, your argument as well just lost most of its substance.... Deadpool(to "Daredevil): See how you like it when I smack you with an interspatial distorter that will temporarily phase your brain into Dimension X! "Daredevil": This is an ipod with a piece of masking tape attached to it. Deadpool: It is...Ah, but for a second there, you were really worried! "Daredevil": Idiot. |
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10/21/09 5:37:06 PM#56
Originally posted by Daffid011
You got all that information about me from one post. Wow, what are next weeks lottery numbers? In all seriousness, this isn't about putting some tarnish on players for not wanting to pony up some money for extra stuff. There is no justification for these things having a price tag in the first place. This isn't extra stuff. This is the type of stuff games should include as part of the ongoing sub fee. You know that fee developers convinced us was needed to keep updating the game with content and maintenance.
This is about companies hacking bits and pieces away from games and then reselling it to us as if it is some sort of perk. Why should there be an additional fee for extra costume slots? Where is the benefit to players for that? For 10 years there has been no need to do this, what has changed and how does this make any players lazy or gimmie for not wanting it? My "problem" is that I see no rational value for players in the way game developers are doing with these types of things. You can bad mouth me all you want with baseless accusations, but you honestly have no idea what I game like. In the end you are defending the design choices of the idiot that did this same type of things in hellgate london. Now go ask any premium members of that game about the value of their purchases.
Answer this for me. How many character slots would be too few and would make this a problem? 6? 3? 1? If your answer is any number then you agree with me. The only thing you disagree with is what number of characters slots is "acceptable" and honestly that number is going to differ from player to player. If something is a problem at 6 then it fundamentally is a problem at 10 and 3 and it just becomes a measurement of how much it can be tolerated.
I'm sorry if I expect more for my money and any way you slice it, you are paying a subscription fee for less than 100% of the game. You are defending a company that is giving you less than 100% of the game and holding the remainder on layaway until you pay for it. You will have to come up with a better viewpoint than calling me lazy to get me to see your side of things.
I dont think they will ever come up with a better viewpoint, Trying to get Numbskulls to understand common logic is very hard on these forums ... |
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10/21/09 5:46:12 PM#57
ok let's clear the air and try a experiement
1: How many characters do you have now? 2: Do you have a special subcription? 3: How many characters do you see yourself making in the future? 4a: if you said no to 2 is 1+3 less then 8? 4b: If you said yes to 2 is 1+3 less then 16? If you answers yes to 4a or 4b cstore character slots are imaterial to you. If no you can get more in blocks of 4 for a low one time fee.
1: Do you need a retcon? if yes: Are you willing to grind in game gold for it? if no Are you willing to wait for the next infrequent freetcon? if no are you willing to wait ofrthe freetcon mission in development? if no Go to C store. |
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10/21/09 6:00:43 PM#58
Originally posted by nekollx
....... " sigh" ....... |
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10/21/09 6:06:54 PM#59
So can anyone explain why CO have a monthly sub at all? The funny things is that Atari/Cryptic are just stupid, not greedy. They would make tons of more money if it was like GW without monthly fee and people would spend money on costumes/respecs/character slots. They just shoot themelves in the foot :) Instead theyve got a dwindling playerbase who they are trying to get as much money out of as possible. Thats what disgusts me.. If WoW = The Beatles |
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10/21/09 6:30:20 PM#60
Originally posted by Papadam
see my questionare above |
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