Diablo 2?

First of all my hats off to the OP.  Great subject for discussion. 

My personal opinion is a mixed bag of what's already been posted here.  On the one hand in terms of misleading, yes I agree that it is in fact misleading to call any game "Free to Play" if it is only somewhat free to play in that you can access the game and play within it's landscape, BUT you are restricted from things that have a real impact on your gaming experience within the environment. (i.e. people that pay for this and that have an advantage over someone else who does not because they don't want to pay for it)

That above being said, it is true that nothing is truly free and so on some level we have to be realistic about the fact that these are still companies that need to be compensated some way or another.  Perhaps it's simply a matter of changing the naming convention of F2P to something that better describes what you're getting vs. actually getting something for free.

Originally posted by thinktank001

Is there any F2P game that offers all their content free of charge?

I don't have a problem with the micro transaction model, but out of the F2P games I have tried there isn't a single one that truly offers players a way to obtain all of a games content free of charge.  

 

Ex.

Maplestory:: Restricts some items from their MTS system, and restricts access to the MTS system on new servers.

Rappelz:: Does not allow players to trade HV passes or tents.  ( Although they do give 7 day passes to players that have joined before the event has started. )

 

edit:  changed ethical to unethical and added a few examples

Free to play - or F2P - does not mislead anyone excluding the terminally idiotic.

F2P games are just that - free to play. You can download and play any F2P game out there and play it without having to pay a single penny. However, you can - at your discretion - pay to have an advantage buy purchasing particular items, rewards and bonuses through a cash store. That does not mitigate the F2P nature of the title. It simply adds another level to the game experience.

Of course, with the current climate of entitlement in the MMO genre - where certain companies have encouraged players to believe that they are entitled to all content without any form of boundaries - has led many to stand atop a straw hill and scream about how micro-transactions fly in the face of the term, "F2P."

In short, facilitating micro-transactions does not alter the fact that you can - freely - play the game for free without having to spend a penny on anything. The choice to spend your money is yours alone. You are not mislead. If you truly believe F2P titles aren't F2P titles, you are an idiot.

All free to play means is that you have the option to play the game for free. It never means you get to play every part of the game or get every item for free.

But if a person has trouble understanding that term, they probably buy every product on TV that offers a free extra item if you're one of the first 100 callers. HURRY CALL NOW!!!!

Let's stop trying to protect stupid and weed it out like nature intended.

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Originally posted by Dragim
Diablo 2?

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With Diablo 2, you paid your money up front, just like you do with Guild Wars.

Originally posted by Infalible

Originally posted by thinktank001

Is there any F2P game that offers all their content free of charge?

I don't have a problem with the micro transaction model, but out of the F2P games I have tried there isn't a single one that truly offers players a way to obtain all of a games content free of charge.  

 

Ex.

Maplestory:: Restricts some items from their MTS system, and restricts access to the MTS system on new servers.

Rappelz:: Does not allow players to trade HV passes or tents.  ( Although they do give 7 day passes to players that have joined before the event has started. )

 

edit:  changed ethical to unethical and added a few examples

Free to play - or F2P - does not mislead anyone excluding the terminally idiotic.

F2P games are just that - free to play. You can download and play any F2P game out there and play it without having to pay a single penny. However, you can - at your discretion - pay to have an advantage buy purchasing particular items, rewards and bonuses through a cash store. That does not mitigate the F2P nature of the title. It simply adds another level to the game experience.

Of course, with the current climate of entitlement in the MMO genre - where certain companies have encouraged players to believe that they are entitled to all content without any form of boundaries - has led many to stand atop a straw hill and scream about how micro-transactions fly in the face of the term, "F2P."

In short, facilitating micro-transactions does not alter the fact that you can - freely - play the game for free without having to spend a penny on anything. The choice to spend your money is yours alone. You are not mislead. If you truly believe F2P titles aren't F2P titles, you are an idiot.

 

Technically he is right, however, the OP isn't speaking technically he is speaking ethically.  Ethically the OP is right because anyone giving the customer the surface view that they are able to play in the environment for "free" is the same as giving out prescription drugs that can cure a migraine.

Take Topomax.  On the surface it will prevent Migraines...but would you still buy it knowing that it contained the following side effects:

# Unusual sensations, such as burning or tingling (paresthesias) -- in up to 51 percent of people
# Dizziness -- up to 32 percent
# Fatigue -- up to 30 percent
# Drowsiness -- up to 29 percent
# Mental and physical slowing or delays -- up to 21 percent
# Nervousness -- up to 19 percent
# Upper respiratory infection (such as the common cold) -- up to 18 percent
# Coordination problems -- up to 16 percent
# Weight loss -- up to 16 percent (see Topamax Weight Loss)
# Loss of appetite -- up to 15 percent
# Taste changes -- up to 15 percent
# Confusion -- up to 14 percent
# Difficulty with concentration or attention -- up to 14 percent
# Nausea -- up to 14 percent.

Oh wait..here's a few more:

# Diarrhea
# Memory loss
# Anxiety
# Language or speech problems
# Changes in gait (walking pattern)
# Sinus infection or irritation
# Injury
# Insomnia
# Mood problems
# Decreased sense of touch
# Viral infections
# Abdominal pain (stomach pain)
# Joint pain
# Weakness
# Sore throat
# Dry mouth
# Indigestion
# Mood problems
# Back pain.

Same difference with calling something F2P without explaining what is actually free and what the effects could be if you aren't paying for the stuff that other people in the game are.  It's misleading.

I don't think so.  At least regarding the ones I've played.

Though there was one browser game I played that was suspect, though, called something like "adventure quest"?  You could pay to get "priority" over free players to get access to the server.  I remember having no trouble whatsoever getting in that night.  After that, it would tell me the server was full with x number of players.  If I kept trying, that number would seem completely random.  I suspect that their f2p claims were more of a 1 day "demo" than a f2p.

It's a tough line to walk, to create an MMO model in which people can play much of the content, yet have it be worth it to actually pay the money for the extra content("value added" is the marketing term).  I think DDO is doing it as well as any, with "weekend special" emails that remind you that the game still exists, and good quality free content available that makes you wonder, "if the free stuff is this well made, what about the paid content?".  I'm interested to see how it does.

As others have mentioned, give Runes of Magic a go, it can be played without ever spending any cash, and you can access all content and items.  But you will need to devote quite a bit more time than others who chose to pay cash for things.

F2P is only misleading in that there are folks out there who for some reason think the game is really suspposed to be totally free.  Think about it, why would any company create a totally free game? That's no way to run a railroad, you have to make money somewhere by enticing the players to spend some cash.

Lots of ways to go about it of course, some less onerous than others, but overall, there are no free games, though you can certainly play many of them for free as long as you are willing to accept limiitations that other players who pay won't run into.

Originally posted by mmaize

First of all my hats off to the OP.  Great subject for discussion. 

My personal opinion is a mixed bag of what's already been posted here.  On the one hand in terms of misleading, yes I agree that it is in fact misleading to call any game "Free to Play" if it is only somewhat free to play in that you can access the game and play within it's landscape, BUT you are restricted from things that have a real impact on your gaming experience within the environment. (i.e. people that pay for this and that have an advantage over someone else who does not because they don't want to pay for it)

That above being said, it is true that nothing is truly free and so on some level we have to be realistic about the fact that these are still companies that need to be compensated some way or another.  Perhaps it's simply a matter of changing the naming convention of F2P to something that better describes what you're getting vs. actually getting something for free.

You drive some very valid points. A game that gives you access to play the entire game without limitation for free is technically a "f2p" game regardless if the way they choose to keep their game going (item mall or in game advertisement) is considered a good business model.

If at anytime you are required to pay ANYTHING to advance in certain areas, it becomes false or misleading advertising if  they advertise the game "f2p" as that game is a p2p game in obvious disguise.

So far we know of only 2 methods a company can stay in business and offer a game to the public 100% free of charge and that is by selling in game resources like gold, or in game items like weapons and armor, or cosmetic upgrades. Some allow in game advertising and their sponsors help keep the game going but most true f2p games have an optional item mall. You are NEVER obligated to buy anything to progress in a true "f2p" game.

Good topic.
 

Originally posted by mmaize

Originally posted by Infalible

Originally posted by thinktank001

Is there any F2P game that offers all their content free of charge?

I don't have a problem with the micro transaction model, but out of the F2P games I have tried there isn't a single one that truly offers players a way to obtain all of a games content free of charge.  

 

Ex.

Maplestory:: Restricts some items from their MTS system, and restricts access to the MTS system on new servers.

Rappelz:: Does not allow players to trade HV passes or tents.  ( Although they do give 7 day passes to players that have joined before the event has started. )

 

edit:  changed ethical to unethical and added a few examples

Free to play - or F2P - does not mislead anyone excluding the terminally idiotic.

F2P games are just that - free to play. You can download and play any F2P game out there and play it without having to pay a single penny. However, you can - at your discretion - pay to have an advantage buy purchasing particular items, rewards and bonuses through a cash store. That does not mitigate the F2P nature of the title. It simply adds another level to the game experience.

Of course, with the current climate of entitlement in the MMO genre - where certain companies have encouraged players to believe that they are entitled to all content without any form of boundaries - has led many to stand atop a straw hill and scream about how micro-transactions fly in the face of the term, "F2P."

In short, facilitating micro-transactions does not alter the fact that you can - freely - play the game for free without having to spend a penny on anything. The choice to spend your money is yours alone. You are not mislead. If you truly believe F2P titles aren't F2P titles, you are an idiot.

 

Technically he is right, however, the OP isn't speaking technically he is speaking ethically.  Ethically the OP is right because anyone giving the customer the surface view that they are able to play in the environment for "free" is the same as giving out prescription drugs that can cure a migraine.

Take Topomax.  On the surface it will prevent Migraines...but would you still buy it knowing that it contained the following side effects:

# Unusual sensations, such as burning or tingling (paresthesias) -- in up to 51 percent of people
# Dizziness -- up to 32 percent
# Fatigue -- up to 30 percent
# Drowsiness -- up to 29 percent
# Mental and physical slowing or delays -- up to 21 percent
# Nervousness -- up to 19 percent
# Upper respiratory infection (such as the common cold) -- up to 18 percent
# Coordination problems -- up to 16 percent
# Weight loss -- up to 16 percent (see Topamax Weight Loss)
# Loss of appetite -- up to 15 percent
# Taste changes -- up to 15 percent
# Confusion -- up to 14 percent
# Difficulty with concentration or attention -- up to 14 percent
# Nausea -- up to 14 percent.

Oh wait..here's a few more:

# Diarrhea
# Memory loss
# Anxiety
# Language or speech problems
# Changes in gait (walking pattern)
# Sinus infection or irritation
# Injury
# Insomnia
# Mood problems
# Decreased sense of touch
# Viral infections
# Abdominal pain (stomach pain)
# Joint pain
# Weakness
# Sore throat
# Dry mouth
# Indigestion
# Mood problems
# Back pain.

 

Same difference with calling something F2P without explaining what is actually free and what the effects could be if you aren't paying for the stuff that other people in the game are.  It's misleading.

Indeed, that's why I consider it is unethical while not wrong.

It wouldn't be unethical IMO if they provided a list of their design philosophy on this, what kinds of item functions it currently offers for RMT, and how they plan to expand it in the future (talking about functionalities here, like, taking an item mall based on cosmetic items only and adding the crap - buffs and multipliers, equipment upgrading material, etc in one sudden update). But no, that's not part of the new-player experience in their games and may require quite some research on their website.

If you think that hiding from you how they get your money and how they plan to do that in the future, then I don't know what to say, you probably feel fine with the F2P low budget MMO flood in which "quality" and "support" are mostly non-existent terms and average costs for being competitive are way over $15, in fact, some of them will charge you over $15 for ONE thing, while featuring nowhere near a P2P gameplay quality.

Originally posted by Vagabond80

Originally posted by kaiser3282

think of it this way.... if you won a free car, but then whined that it was just the base stock version without all the upgrades and extras that cost lots more.... does that make the person giving you the car unethical? No, youre still getting it for free, theyre just not giving you everything YOU want added to it unless you spend the money on it yourself.

 

For a game with PvP and raid centered endgame you gotta add to this metaphor... you'd have to add that you are a professional driver competing against other people that have paid a lot of money for their cars.... Why would you bother racing a stock ford focus against a NOx charged import? (I know nothing about cars but hopefully that works)

That point speaks to the wrong "f2p".  It's FREE to play, not FAIR to play.  Even paying customers don't necessarily get "fair 2 play".

Just my opinion, but if you like the game enough to make it to endgame, I don't see why you wouldn't want to unlock all the content by paying for it.

Most games that say free to play says most of the time that the game has micro payments or item mall, So free to play is not misleading since you can play the game it self free however to end game or to become more powerful or enjoy the best content you might have to pay for it,

Games like this do this for the simple fact it makes more money then p2p games like WoW, Most of these games have gear and other items for sale for real money and in the end some people pay 30,40,50 a month to enjoy the game.

Most games like this I dislike for that reason it takes the fairness out of games a Doctor who makes 100k a year vs a construction worker who makes 25k a year who is able to spend more money normaly is the best in the game with all the best stuff.  This is my main reason I would suggest stay with games that are p2p and everyone has the same options makes for a better MMO In my opnion.

Originally posted by mmaize

Technically he is right, however, the OP isn't speaking technically he is speaking ethically.  Ethically the OP is right because anyone giving the customer the surface view that they are able to play in the environment for "free" is the same as giving out prescription drugs that can cure a migraine.

Take Topomax.  On the surface it will prevent Migraines...but would you still buy it knowing that it contained the following side effects:

# Unusual sensations, such as burning or tingling (paresthesias) -- in up to 51 percent of people
# Dizziness -- up to 32 percent
# Fatigue -- up to 30 percent
# Drowsiness -- up to 29 percent
# Mental and physical slowing or delays -- up to 21 percent
# Nervousness -- up to 19 percent
# Upper respiratory infection (such as the common cold) -- up to 18 percent
# Coordination problems -- up to 16 percent
# Weight loss -- up to 16 percent (see Topamax Weight Loss)
# Loss of appetite -- up to 15 percent
# Taste changes -- up to 15 percent
# Confusion -- up to 14 percent
# Difficulty with concentration or attention -- up to 14 percent
# Nausea -- up to 14 percent.

Oh wait..here's a few more:

# Diarrhea
# Memory loss
# Anxiety
# Language or speech problems
# Changes in gait (walking pattern)
# Sinus infection or irritation
# Injury
# Insomnia
# Mood problems
# Decreased sense of touch
# Viral infections
# Abdominal pain (stomach pain)
# Joint pain
# Weakness
# Sore throat
# Dry mouth
# Indigestion
# Mood problems
# Back pain.

 

Same difference with calling something F2P without explaining what is actually free and what the effects could be if you aren't paying for the stuff that other people in the game are.  It's misleading.

Hey, complainiac!  You neglected to mention that those side effects come FREE OF CHARGE!!! :P

Perfect World has a gold auction system. Most Cash shop items are either fashion or convenience although there are a few exceptions. If you have enough time to spare everything in the game can be obtained, you just need to grind or otherwise make enough coin to buy whatever gold you need.

I don think "free to play" is misleading advertising in games like these. Youd have to be blind, deaf and dumb not to realize using RMT makes the game much more convenient, but i certainly knew of many cases in which people managed to competitively reach endgame, and even turn themselves into ingame millionaires.

Its only unethical if they truly fooled you into buying it under false pretenses.  You knew what you were getting, dont deny it.

edit: Actually duh, how could it be false advertising if you never paid for it?  You are complaining because they didnt give you more free stuff? 

It is nothing more than a gimmick.They might claim to be offering you a choice,but by not giving you the entire game free,it is an outright lie.What makes it worse is how the rest of the game that they make you purchase,it always far more costly than a P2P game,so it is a VERY bad model for gamers.

There is other cheating developers that some how pull off making money from the BS claim to "Donations".When you design an entire game around paying money,then it is NOT a donation,it is a pay to play game, i can't understand how the law lets these guys away with it.

It's perfectly ethical.  I remember a time when you had to put money down on a game before you could ever step foot in the virtual world.  Or does that still happen these days?

Another one of these. Yikes. The game is f2p. No one forces you to spend money. End of story.

Free to play does not exist. Actually they are very expensive to play. End of story.

when an ad for a game says free to play i guess it is not misleading or unethical..

because from the moment you have created account, character and then

successfully log in into the game without paying anything.. that's already a f2p..

the items, systems and other features inside the game that is restricted unless you pay

that's just like their main product.. what i mean is just like in free taste or free samples

of items they will give you a piece only for you to experience how delicious

it is or how good it is.. then if you liked it and wanted a whole that's the time

that you have to pay so you can enjoy it more or continuously..