Can't wait for New Eden to come out in "Q!". Didn't even know that existed.

Originally posted by Kyleran

 

Ah, but the real difference between the two games is that in EVE, death has real meaning and consequences, and in WWII online, its all rather pointless, doesn't matter if you win or lose.

EVE's got the better PVP I think.

Nah, being ganked 6 on 1 has no meaning. Sure the lost time sucks, but all that can do is force you from the game, which is a bad design. There is no "meaning" to sovreignty as it is except ego stroking. There is no "we won" in Eve, unless you're on the Chinese server where that has happened (and caused massive problems).

In Eve, it doesn't matter if you win or lose. Just buy up some more isk and presto, brand new ship and implants and away you go like nothing happened.

Originally posted by eric_w66

Originally posted by tvalentine

Originally posted by eric_w66

Just so you people who think you're clever with the snide comments know: I have 2 active Eve accounts, and do compare region prices with alts...

But I'm "gaming the game" to do so, it isn't part of the game itself.

 

yeah, and from what i can tell from your previous posts about EVE .... you hate pvp and perfer to be 100% solo.... which is VERY odd considering you said you play WW2 which is centered around pvp and having other people have your back.

 

Not odd. WW2 Online is based around PvP. Eve is not. Most people in Eve do not PvP. Eve PvP is also "gank" or "blob" mentality 99% of the time.  

lol the scary part is that you actually believe the bullshit your typing. Everyone in EVE pvps... if its either the market or living in more dangerous parts of eve. You're either a troll or you are just a complete idiot who thinks he knows everything .... which you dont. And if you dont like the game then leave it and quit bitching. Who has the gun to your head forcing you to play eve?

When all is said and done, potentially losing hours of gaming time over one PvP death is simply too much for 99% of gamers out there.

Until the devs change that fact, no talk about sandbox, features or whatever is going to make this game anything more than a niche game.

I predict that once Star Trek Online is released, people will be leaving this game in droves.

Originally posted by Yamota

When all is said and done, potentially losing hours of gaming time over one PvP death is simply too much for 99% of gamers out there.

Until the devs change that fact, no talk about sandbox, features or whatever is going to make this game anything more than a niche game.

I predict that once Star Trek Online is released, people will be leaving this game in droves.

i doubt it ... the people who stayed with eve enjoy and understand risk vs reward. They enjoy the fact you lose isk when you lose a ship ... i've read forum threads on the eve forums about people getting upset because CCP is going to increase insurance payouts on T2 ships.... the people who want an arcade spaceship game have already left.... earlier in the thread someone mentioned 3 million people have tried and only 300k accounts are active.

Originally posted by Yamota

When all is said and done, potentially losing hours of gaming time over one PvP death is simply too much for 99% of gamers out there.

Until the devs change that fact, no talk about sandbox, features or whatever is going to make this game anything more than a niche game.

I predict that once Star Trek Online is released, people will be leaving this game in droves.

Funny thing is most of us dont give a shit about Eve becoming anything other than a niche game.

As for STO lets leave the crystal ball talk out of this and wait for STO's release.

Originally posted by tvalentine

Originally posted by eric_w66

Originally posted by tvalentine

Originally posted by eric_w66

Just so you people who think you're clever with the snide comments know: I have 2 active Eve accounts, and do compare region prices with alts...

But I'm "gaming the game" to do so, it isn't part of the game itself.

 

yeah, and from what i can tell from your previous posts about EVE .... you hate pvp and perfer to be 100% solo.... which is VERY odd considering you said you play WW2 which is centered around pvp and having other people have your back.

 

Not odd. WW2 Online is based around PvP. Eve is not. Most people in Eve do not PvP. Eve PvP is also "gank" or "blob" mentality 99% of the time.  

 

lol the scary part is that you actually believe the bullshit your typing. Everyone in EVE pvps... if its either the market or living in more dangerous parts of eve. You're either a troll or you are just a complete idiot who thinks he knows everything .... which you dont. And if you dont like the game then leave it and quit bitching. Who has the gun to your head forcing you to play eve?

I believe that would be me Mr. Valentine. I am the troll with the GUN!!! HAHAHA

Originally posted by tvalentine

 

lol the scary part is that you actually believe the bullshit your typing. Everyone in EVE pvps... if its either the market or living in more dangerous parts of eve. You're either a troll or you are just a complete idiot who thinks he knows everything .... which you dont. And if you dont like the game then leave it and quit bitching. Who has the gun to your head forcing you to play eve?

Ok, I'll break it down to a much simpler form so you can understand.

Eve is not built around PvP COMBAT, WW2 Online is. Most people in Eve do NOT partake in Eve's rather pathetic PvP COMBAT. Eve's own numbers show this.

Originally posted by eric_w66

Originally posted by tvalentine

 

lol the scary part is that you actually believe the bullshit your typing. Everyone in EVE pvps... if its either the market or living in more dangerous parts of eve. You're either a troll or you are just a complete idiot who thinks he knows everything .... which you dont. And if you dont like the game then leave it and quit bitching. Who has the gun to your head forcing you to play eve?

 

Ok, I'll break it down to a much simpler form so you can understand.

Eve is not built around PvP COMBAT, WW2 Online is. Most people in Eve do NOT partake in Eve's rather pathetic PvP COMBAT. Eve's own numbers show this.

I second this. From what I saw of Eve PvP it is either about ganking or warping away. People are so afraid to die, and understandibly so, so the moment they see something resembling a fair fight they try to get away.

Eves PvP combat is constipated, at best, and completely non existant as worst.

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by eric_w66

Originally posted by tvalentine

 

lol the scary part is that you actually believe the bullshit your typing. Everyone in EVE pvps... if its either the market or living in more dangerous parts of eve. You're either a troll or you are just a complete idiot who thinks he knows everything .... which you dont. And if you dont like the game then leave it and quit bitching. Who has the gun to your head forcing you to play eve?

 

Ok, I'll break it down to a much simpler form so you can understand.

Eve is not built around PvP COMBAT, WW2 Online is. Most people in Eve do NOT partake in Eve's rather pathetic PvP COMBAT. Eve's own numbers show this.

I second this. From what I saw of Eve PvP it is either about ganking or warping away. People are so afraid to die, and understandibly so, so the moment they see something resembling a fair fight they try to get away.

Eves PvP combat is constipated, at best, and completely non existant as worst.

Sigh, so much BS, so little time.  Been a part of faction wars? Red vs Blue? Fought to the death to save your stations in 0.0? Been part of the empire Merc wars?

I have, and despite definitely being a carebear by nature, I have most certainly spent some time PVPing as it were.

But it is true, in EVE PVP, winning is the most important thing, its what gives the game meaning for those who play it.  You fail to understand the mechanic but no reason to keep spewing your crap here. 

At any given moment you can set your map overview to show pods killed in the last 24 hours and you will find dozens of systems with sometimes hundreds of pod kills. 

Yeah right, no one is pvping.......

Eve is most certainly a social game, and what we do has real meaning in almost every aspect.  '

The butterfly effect is more real in EVE than any other MMO out there.

Originally posted by Yamota

When all is said and done, potentially losing hours of gaming time over one PvP death is simply too much for 99% of gamers out there.

Until the devs change that fact, no talk about sandbox, features or whatever is going to make this game anything more than a niche game.

I predict that once Star Trek Online is released, people will be leaving this game in droves.

Considering up until Aion it was #2 on the NA block... I kind of have to disagree with its "Niche" label. It has surpassed both WAR and AoC.

As for the harsh pvp penalties... thats what makes eve, eve. You either like it or you dont. With out it there is no rush and pvp is meaningless.

Removing those penalties would kill the economy, kill crafting, kill minning, trading, pvp...etc etc.

STO is for all intents and purposes not even the same genre. There are space ships...its in space... other than that every aspect of STO has nothing in it that would draw eve players.

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by eric_w66

Originally posted by tvalentine

 

lol the scary part is that you actually believe the bullshit your typing. Everyone in EVE pvps... if its either the market or living in more dangerous parts of eve. You're either a troll or you are just a complete idiot who thinks he knows everything .... which you dont. And if you dont like the game then leave it and quit bitching. Who has the gun to your head forcing you to play eve?

 

Ok, I'll break it down to a much simpler form so you can understand.

Eve is not built around PvP COMBAT, WW2 Online is. Most people in Eve do NOT partake in Eve's rather pathetic PvP COMBAT. Eve's own numbers show this.

I second this. From what I saw of Eve PvP it is either about ganking or warping away. People are so afraid to die, and understandibly so, so the moment they see something resembling a fair fight they try to get away.

Eves PvP combat is constipated, at best, and completely non existant as worst.

Then you obviously havent spent much time in the game. Yes there are people who gank, there are people who run... but you get that in ANY MMO. Look at Aion, currently the abyss is either ganking solos with a group, or chasing victims as they run away. 9 hours a week its about fortresses... where you might get a fight.

In eve... there are solo fights, group fights, zerg fights, ganks, and pretty much any other type of combat you can possibly think of.

I think you are confusing smart combat with no pvp. If you have 10 ships and Im out with a buddy, Im going to be showing you my tail before you can lock, however, if its a remotely fair fight then me and my boys are game. Do we win all the time? Nope. Do we win enough to make things fun? Hells yeah.

However, saying a game isnt about pvp when the entire point of the game is player conflict simply blows my mind.

For those that don't think that EVE Online's 300,000 players and 50,000 simeltanious users isn't a big deal maybe you should take a look at some of the hardware minded devblogs. I know at fanfest a representative from IBM CCP's hardware partner called CCP's system one of the most advanced in the world.

To manage the character database alone it requires a brick server consisting of 2x 16-blade servers stacked on top of one another with each processor being a 6 core 2.66 GHz Intel Dunnington,  128GB DDR2 RAM, along with multiple RAM SAN arrays aka "the world's fastest storage" for the hard disk.

FunFact: RAM-SANs are capable of +600,000 IOPS (Input Outputs Per Seconds). To get the same number of IOPS you would need over 3000 traditional platter based hard drives.

No, if just any MMO can do what EVE does like you are implying then I doubt Texas Memory Systems would be plugging CCP and EVE along side monsters like San Diego Supercomputer, New Corp, and Qualcomm. Likewise Microsoft trophies CCP as an example of their super enterprise HPC solutions and VIVOX as one of their first adopters.

Really if any other MMOs use such advanced technology and bend over backward to make sure that they can support 50,000 simeltanious without lag then I haven't heard of it and I don't see them being trophied as success stories by technology leaders such as IBM, Texas Memory Systems, Microsoft, etc.

No... 50,000 users in one universe is NOT something any MMO can do. Sure EVE runs on 60x seperate blade servers which are each monsters in their own right (Jita has a dedicated blade and it can support over 1300 players in a single system, for major fleet battles CCP dedicates a blade so 1000+ players can fight seamlessly) but while a zone's load may be spread across multiple servers and new ones bought and added in a database server's load can't. CCP has stated continuously in their dev blogs nothing short of a RAM SAN could ever have done what EVE does 'cause you can't just add more servers when all 300,000+ players are on the same single database.

Originally posted by Kyleran

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by eric_w66

Originally posted by tvalentine

 

lol the scary part is that you actually believe the bullshit your typing. Everyone in EVE pvps... if its either the market or living in more dangerous parts of eve. You're either a troll or you are just a complete idiot who thinks he knows everything .... which you dont. And if you dont like the game then leave it and quit bitching. Who has the gun to your head forcing you to play eve?

 

Ok, I'll break it down to a much simpler form so you can understand.

Eve is not built around PvP COMBAT, WW2 Online is. Most people in Eve do NOT partake in Eve's rather pathetic PvP COMBAT. Eve's own numbers show this.

I second this. From what I saw of Eve PvP it is either about ganking or warping away. People are so afraid to die, and understandibly so, so the moment they see something resembling a fair fight they try to get away.

Eves PvP combat is constipated, at best, and completely non existant as worst.

 

Sigh, so much BS, so little time.  Been a part of faction wars? Red vs Blue? Fought to the death to save your stations in 0.0? Been part of the empire Merc wars?

I have, and despite definitely being a carebear by nature, I have most certainly spent some time PVPing as it were.

But it is true, in EVE PVP, winning is the most important thing, its what gives the game meaning for those who play it.  You fail to understand the mechanic but no reason to keep spewing your crap here. 

At any given moment you can set your map overview to show pods killed in the last 24 hours and you will find dozens of systems with sometimes hundreds of pod kills. 

Yeah right, no one is pvping.......

Eve is most certainly a social game, and what we do has real meaning in almost every aspect.  '

The butterfly effect is more real in EVE than any other MMO out there.

 

 

^ this and what the above poster said.... Thanks for typin the posts up to help others understand.

Originally posted by Yamota

When all is said and done, potentially losing hours of gaming time over one PvP death is simply too much for 99% of gamers out there.

Until the devs change that fact, no talk about sandbox, features or whatever is going to make this game anything more than a niche game.

I predict that once Star Trek Online is released, people will be leaving this game in droves.

I'd bet my pension against that.  That's how strongly I know you are absolutely 100% wrong

Originally posted by eric_w66

Originally posted by Kyleran

 

Ah, but the real difference between the two games is that in EVE, death has real meaning and consequences, and in WWII online, its all rather pointless, doesn't matter if you win or lose.

EVE's got the better PVP I think.

 

Nah, being ganked 6 on 1 has no meaning. Sure the lost time sucks, but all that can do is force you from the game, which is a bad design. There is no "meaning" to sovreignty as it is except ego stroking. There is no "we won" in Eve, unless you're on the Chinese server where that has happened (and caused massive problems).

In Eve, it doesn't matter if you win or lose. Just buy up some more isk and presto, brand new ship and implants and away you go like nothing happened.

Way to focus on random ganking like its the only form of PvP combat.  Obviously ganking only happens in Eve, and not every other single PvP enabled MMO on the market.

Don't mention the scenarios where two corps go to war over a handful of  systems, a war which may last weeks or months... and after multiple large scale and small scale battles(anything from 1v1s to ganking, to small gang warfare to fleet battles), one corp "breaks" the other corps economic  "back" and pushes them out of the systems. 

How?  Because of keeping pressure on their mining OPs and locking down supply routes while whittling away at their ship reserves via smart, strategic attacks.  Damn, that almost sounds like real warfare.  Maybe because it is.

Dunno, that sounds a little more deep than 6v1 ganking to me. I'd also consider that both a "win" and a "loss" for the respective side.  I'm also pretty sure it matters to the players of both of those corps that they won or lost, considering one is homeless and the other just expanded its space and have access to the resources that reside there.  This is even pre-Dominion.   It's even more important post-Dominion where you drops tons of capital into upgrading your space.

Bottom line is you don't understand this game.  Your vision of what is happening in-game is too narrow because you don't seem to see past the tip of your nose  You see a handful of random bored people flying around ganking people and you think thats all PvP entails, or you see a local market and don't seem to realize that their are multiple people trading between regional market hubs.  You don't know whats going on around you because you can't see past whats happening right in front of you.  And because you never saw past whats right in front of you, you never involved yourself in the real game.

When all is said and done, potentially losing hours of gaming time over one PvP death is simply too much for 99% of gamers out there.

Until the devs change that fact, no talk about sandbox, features or whatever is going to make this game anything more than a niche game.

Fly cheaper ships.  I can make enough money in a couple hours of mission running to supply myself with enough frigates/cruisers to last a week of PvP.  With insurance the only thing you actually are spending money on is mods.

That is most of the new players problem.  They try to PvP with  that shiny new battleship that they spent the last week saving up money for, and naturally when they lose it they get discouraged.  Instead they should be sticking to frigates, cruisers, destroyers, and interceptors, which are all incredibly cheap and easy to replace.  Hell, most corps will supply you with T1 frigs and Cruisers for free, as long as your supporting Corp OPS.

There is a reason that the first piece of advice every new player gets in PvP is to fly what you can afford to lose.  The cool thing about this game is that you are still incredibly useful to your fleet flying a frigate.  The same can't be said of other games where not having the best "gear" basically makes you a liability.

I do Love Eves looks, makes you feel like your really out there, but the skill system is just to long for peeps like me who have played the game for years, 3.5 months for a skill is no fun grrr

Originally posted by Kyleran

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by eric_w66

Originally posted by tvalentine

 

lol the scary part is that you actually believe the bullshit your typing. Everyone in EVE pvps... if its either the market or living in more dangerous parts of eve. You're either a troll or you are just a complete idiot who thinks he knows everything .... which you dont. And if you dont like the game then leave it and quit bitching. Who has the gun to your head forcing you to play eve?

 

Ok, I'll break it down to a much simpler form so you can understand.

Eve is not built around PvP COMBAT, WW2 Online is. Most people in Eve do NOT partake in Eve's rather pathetic PvP COMBAT. Eve's own numbers show this.

I second this. From what I saw of Eve PvP it is either about ganking or warping away. People are so afraid to die, and understandibly so, so the moment they see something resembling a fair fight they try to get away.

Eves PvP combat is constipated, at best, and completely non existant as worst.

 

Sigh, so much BS, so little time.  Been a part of faction wars? Red vs Blue? Fought to the death to save your stations in 0.0? Been part of the empire Merc wars?

I have, and despite definitely being a carebear by nature, I have most certainly spent some time PVPing as it were.

But it is true, in EVE PVP, winning is the most important thing, its what gives the game meaning for those who play it.  You fail to understand the mechanic but no reason to keep spewing your crap here. 

At any given moment you can set your map overview to show pods killed in the last 24 hours and you will find dozens of systems with sometimes hundreds of pod kills. 

Yeah right, no one is pvping.......

Eve is most certainly a social game, and what we do has real meaning in almost every aspect.  '

The butterfly effect is more real in EVE than any other MMO out there. 

 

Ofcourse winning is the most important thing but that does not mean that the loser should lose HOURS of gaming time for one PvP death. That has nothing to do with mechanics or whatever, it is possibly to have more lenient death penalties and still maintain the crafting mechanics of the game. Things does not need to be black and white (either no penalty or extreme penalty) you know...

As for PvPing, as was mentioned, there is alot of ganking going on. Meaning gatecampers who kill people gating in/out and hence all the pod kills. If that for you is the definition of PvPing then all the power to you. For me it is not.

But sure, there are 0.0 wars as well but I would say that is not as common as people would want you to believe.

Originally posted by comerb

Originally posted by Yamota

When all is said and done, potentially losing hours of gaming time over one PvP death is simply too much for 99% of gamers out there.

Until the devs change that fact, no talk about sandbox, features or whatever is going to make this game anything more than a niche game.

I predict that once Star Trek Online is released, people will be leaving this game in droves.

 

I'd bet my pension against that.  That's how strongly I know you are absolutely 100% wrong

Eve is the only spaceship-sci-fi MMORPG out there so obviously people who likes that kind of game will play it.

However once STO is released, which is also a spaceship-sci-fi MMORPG, then it would be foolish to think that not some (I say alot) of Eve players will move there.

Sure Eve is "hardcore" and alot of people who likes to think themselves to be "leet" and what not plays the game for that reason but I dont think most of the 300k subscribers Eve has belongs to that cathegory. Most likely alot of them plays Eve because it is the only spaceship-sci-fi MMORPG out there. This is evident by the massive number of people in high-sec space compared to the relative low numbers of people in 0.0 space and even fewer in low sec space (mostly gankers).

When STO is released Eve will not monopolise the genre any more and the flood gates will open up...

I for one love space ship sci-fi games and have been waiting for a fun game like that for years. But somehow losing hours of gaming time for one PvP death is not fun. And I bet alot of other MMORPG players feels the same.

Before you start accusing me for being a WoW fan, carebear, bla bla bla. There is something between huge death penalty and zero death penalty. I don't like either.