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News & Features Discussion  » Dark Age of Camelot: Jeff Hickman on WAR, DaoC and the Future

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70 posts found
  wizlmtz

Novice Member

Joined: 4/24/08
Posts: 21

mmmhmmmm

2/20/10 9:42:37 PM#61

 I dont think that purple shirt [ Mod Edit ] ever played war... lets all hope they make daoc 2 the way daoc was before it blew & leave it like that. Sometimes adding expansions ruins something amazing... Learn from your mistakes and your peers... (UO, Starwars)

  parrotpholk

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/20/05
Posts: 3313

2/20/10 9:52:44 PM#62

 DAoC 2 would be epic and maybe we will see it. Howeverr I am not sure this new Mythic would pull it off. DAoC was a shot in the dark. The hype alone would choke it to death.

  Warspine

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/05
Posts: 105

Dark age of Camelot
Everquest 2
Planetside 1&2
Vanguard saga of heroes
Might & Magic 6,7 and 8

4/15/10 11:32:41 AM#63

Dark Age Of Camlot 2 - Or major updates! But i think dark age of camelot 2 is a must.

That would be the greatest news in the world of computers for me.

And i swear, that if i ever win alot of money. I will donate, or invest in Dark Age of Camelot without hesitation. And not in the interest of gaining money. But as an investment to something that lies Very close to my heart.

  Vyava

Novice Member

Joined: 3/23/05
Posts: 895

4/15/10 11:44:45 AM#64
Originally posted by parrotpholk


 DAoC 2 would be epic and maybe we will see it. Howeverr I am not sure this new Mythic would pull it off. DAoC was a shot in the dark. The hype alone would choke it to death.

I would have hopes for a DAoC 2, but I also have serious concerns about the current Mythic's ability to succeed.

Just creating a sequel which lives up to an original success is difficult to begin with add in proper updates to current customer expectations and it becomes even more difficult.

Then there is EA...yeah the situation with EA is not conducive to creating a game like DAoC. The old Mythic was about creating a good game which will sell to make a profit. EA is about making an IP something which will profit quickly but without concern about maintaining it long term. While this makes for a successful company and does not exclude the possibility of creating a good MMO it rarely breeds creative thinking as "outside the box" is not rewarded.

  Kiersten

Novice Member

Joined: 10/29/09
Posts: 23

5/07/10 6:39:45 PM#65
Originally posted by parrotpholk


 DAoC 2 would be epic and maybe we will see it. Howeverr I am not sure this new Mythic would pull it off. DAoC was a shot in the dark. The hype alone would choke it to death.

Exactly why many games now days are not putting any info out there about games they are producing.  Hype alone has killed so many games in the past few years.  Game companies are quickly realizing that the less they tell fans, the less they have to regret after a game is released.

If you need examples of games that are not giving out much if any info.

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/331/Earthrise.html

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/404/The-Secret-World.html

Perfect example of a game putting out too much hype

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/367/Star-Wars-The-Old-Republic.html

 
  Atropos_Nyx

Novice Member

Joined: 3/26/10
Posts: 4

5/09/10 9:44:05 PM#66

Has there been any further news about Mythic considering a DAOC reboot?

Tamriel Foundry - News, Strategy, Theorycrafting, and Guides for Elder Scrolls Online

  rwyan

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/24/03
Posts: 388

5/09/10 10:02:40 PM#67
Originally posted by demarc01

I played DAoC from day 1 for about 5 years. It was a great game but it to had its faults.

In todays age of gaming the combat system is pretty bare-bones. There are attack chains and the like but it would need some more flesh added to the combat system. CC was a major issue in DAoC on release (Stungard anyone?) and although better now at the higer levels of the game (Determinations / purges etc) CC is still a major balancing issue with any PvP game.

The major issues I had with DAoC was the Cross-playstyles.

By that I mean, initially there were no realm ranks. We RvR'd because we enjoyed it. We RvR'd for realm pride. They added realm ranks which was great, my issue is with they way they rewarded realm ranks. The rewards were universal, meaning that they effected the PvE game as well. This was very apparent to the PvE player base and they raised concerns right there. It ment that PvE players HAD to RvR in order to stay in league with thier peer's who RvR'd and PvE'd. This was'ent a welcome change for the PvE crowd (yes DAoC did have a PvE aspect too) Of course this was shot down on the forums (Vn, Mythic had no official forums) with yells of "DAoC is a PvP game" "N00b" and so on.

Of course this all came about face with the release of ToA (Trials of Atlantis) which added Master levels and Artifacts. This was PvE. On the flip side tho these PvE aspects had an impact in RvR. Of course this was a blow to the RvR crowd who felt now that they HAD to PvE in order to RvR (Which they did) Shoe was on the other foot with the RvR crowd bitching and the PvE crowd telling them to sux it up.

 

This was IMO DAoC's main flaw. Cross-over gaming. PvE rewards should only have "value" in PvE. RvR (Or PvP) rewards should only have "Value" in RvR. If they had played to this model with realm rank rewards only effecting the RvR game and PvE rewards only effecting the PvE game they would'ent have lost subs after the Realm Rank additions (admittedly these losses were minimal since DAoC was billed as a PvP game) but they lost ALOT of subs after the TOA expac.

Players still cited the "TOA" expansion as being a reason for leaving months after the Xpac and to this day you have vets that take issue with the TOA xpac.

If there is a DAoC2, I would hope that they can be more foward thinking and seperate apects of game play minimizing "cross-over" Its how you keep both "factions" of players happy and playing .. dont force them to play aspects of the game that hold no interest for them in order to play the aspects that they do actually like.

 

My input.

This is exactly why DAoC will never have the longevity of EQ, UO, or even AC for that matter.  Mythic itself didn't know what kind of game DAoC was and they continued to make a lot of miscalculated steps.

Was it a pve game with rvr?  Was it a rvr game with pve? WTH was it?  Mythic couldn't find a way to make RvR and PvE better tied together as both were considered separate but "equal".  Darkness Falls was close as it added a fun dungeon with a rvr twist (probably one of the best content updates ever for the game and that happened in its first year?).  The RVR game has stagnated for years while they continued to fluff up the pve content.  If Mythic was smart - it would have produced paid pve expansions while offering free rvr expansions to keep both pieces of content fresh and new.

  Bugrahan78

Novice Member

Joined: 7/05/10
Posts: 1

7/05/10 7:05:34 AM#68

 A sequel to DAOC would be a serious reason for me to avoid dieing... Even thinking about it makes me feel good. DAOC was simply better than life itself for me...

  Avatar01234

Novice Member

Joined: 7/14/03
Posts: 4

7/19/10 1:51:35 PM#69

What a crying shame that this IP has been swept under the rug of forgetfullness.  I really hope somewhere, someday, someone with a lot of currency can repurchase the imagination necessary for Mr. Hickman to care about a DAoC graphics revamp or even more splendid -  DAoC 2.  Now, hmm what would I name it?  Let's see, my undergrad in Medieval and Ancient History has influenced me a bit:

 

Golden Age of Camelot 

Dark Age of Camelot - The Medieval Era

or - how about the time of Charlemagne? Unite Hibernia and Albion, allow for the Norse to continue to be a threat (they make such great raiders) and bring in the Moors or such - and yes still keep the saracen race for Alb lol.

 

Every friend I have that has rotted through EQ2, Vanguard, LOTRO, DDO, WoW, etc., etc., has wished that DAoC would really again be invested in - with lessons learned from the mistakes of Failhammer and Trials of Atlantis.

 

Rome Total War series has taught us that we love epical battles as a player base.  DAoC taught the mmorpg world that 3 realms work (to such an extent that apparently no one has the imagination to follow suit and is still trapped in the 2 faction or FFA model).  Mix Rome Total War and DAoC...upgrade the snot out of the graphics - etc...give us that three realm gem back that we all want so badly.

  Avatar01234

Novice Member

Joined: 7/14/03
Posts: 4

7/19/10 2:02:49 PM#70
Originally posted by rwyan
Originally posted by demarc01

I played DAoC from day 1 for about 5 years. It was a great game but it to had its faults.

In todays age of gaming the combat system is pretty bare-bones. There are attack chains and the like but it would need some more flesh added to the combat system. CC was a major issue in DAoC on release (Stungard anyone?) and although better now at the higer levels of the game (Determinations / purges etc) CC is still a major balancing issue with any PvP game.

The major issues I had with DAoC was the Cross-playstyles.

By that I mean, initially there were no realm ranks. We RvR'd because we enjoyed it. We RvR'd for realm pride. They added realm ranks which was great, my issue is with they way they rewarded realm ranks. The rewards were universal, meaning that they effected the PvE game as well. This was very apparent to the PvE player base and they raised concerns right there. It ment that PvE players HAD to RvR in order to stay in league with thier peer's who RvR'd and PvE'd. This was'ent a welcome change for the PvE crowd (yes DAoC did have a PvE aspect too) Of course this was shot down on the forums (Vn, Mythic had no official forums) with yells of "DAoC is a PvP game" "N00b" and so on.

Of course this all came about face with the release of ToA (Trials of Atlantis) which added Master levels and Artifacts. This was PvE. On the flip side tho these PvE aspects had an impact in RvR. Of course this was a blow to the RvR crowd who felt now that they HAD to PvE in order to RvR (Which they did) Shoe was on the other foot with the RvR crowd bitching and the PvE crowd telling them to sux it up.

 

This was IMO DAoC's main flaw. Cross-over gaming. PvE rewards should only have "value" in PvE. RvR (Or PvP) rewards should only have "Value" in RvR. If they had played to this model with realm rank rewards only effecting the RvR game and PvE rewards only effecting the PvE game they would'ent have lost subs after the Realm Rank additions (admittedly these losses were minimal since DAoC was billed as a PvP game) but they lost ALOT of subs after the TOA expac.

Players still cited the "TOA" expansion as being a reason for leaving months after the Xpac and to this day you have vets that take issue with the TOA xpac.

If there is a DAoC2, I would hope that they can be more foward thinking and seperate apects of game play minimizing "cross-over" Its how you keep both "factions" of players happy and playing .. dont force them to play aspects of the game that hold no interest for them in order to play the aspects that they do actually like.

 

My input.

This is exactly why DAoC will never have the longevity of EQ, UO, or even AC for that matter.  Mythic itself didn't know what kind of game DAoC was and they continued to make a lot of miscalculated steps.

Was it a pve game with rvr?  Was it a rvr game with pve? WTH was it?  Mythic couldn't find a way to make RvR and PvE better tied together as both were considered separate but "equal".  Darkness Falls was close as it added a fun dungeon with a rvr twist (probably one of the best content updates ever for the game and that happened in its first year?).  The RVR game has stagnated for years while they continued to fluff up the pve content.  If Mythic was smart - it would have produced paid pve expansions while offering free rvr expansions to keep both pieces of content fresh and new.

 Mythic taught an intelligent but lethargic audience (the gaming world) that battles happen.  Secondly, the company taught us that unlike EQ pvp zones and mmorpgs with open pvp where npcs die non stop and players are unable to build defenses - that walls and castles exist as well.  WoW devs ignore the fact that after the endless attacks on Goldshire (Moonguard server for example) that walls would be in place - undead locks would no longer be able to climb on top of the Inn...and so forth without massive retaliation. 

In short, battles were brought to as close to epic portions as possible with an IP of the time.  Granted, we need to see mounted cavalry, organized rows of pikemen, swordsmen, and archers facing each other in the field of battle - SADLY WE ARE VERY FAR FROM THIS simulation of actual medieval and ancient world warfare. 

 

DAoC however, did give us three completely independent realms that could not talk to one another and did not cross over onto one another's PVE territory.  Battles were quick and unforgiving for the untrained but lengthy and complex for those who had enough time invested in realm defense to gather the skills to be called, "heroes of the realm."

DAoC allows players to have a sense of purpose in that we have good reason to defend relics (castles that contain them), and the sense of US vs THEM always existed in Dark Age of Camelot - something not ONE FLIPPEN mmorpg can emulate or even cares about.

Most mmorpgs that have organized siege, say Age of Conan, for example, have the same races and classes killing one another.  The only difference between one "army" or realistically speaking, one guild, is the red name over their heads.  Northmen kill Northmen, priests of the god Mitra kill their own, and necromancers can have all pets out and run through Cimmeria without npcs even caring - something that never existed in the books.

Dark Age, unlike Conan and other more less developed mmorpg titles, had visibly different cultures on the field of battle.  You knew you were different, in title of class, style and resist type of your culture's armor, the type of spells, etc.  You really felt unique to your realm - and each realm was truly unique to her own.

In short, Dark Age of Camelot was very special to many of us who really wanted a mythological feel to what the era of magic, vikings, and knights just might have been had the laws of physics been a little different in the 8th century.

 Even moreso was the brilliance of the third realm.. This point here is especially lost on most players who have never experienced an mmorpg that didnt reward battle time with gear and the thought of a third realm tearing it up from behind them meant the field of battle would be unpredictable (opposite of WoW eh?) and complicated.  Hate that stalemate in Warhammer Online that never ends?  TIred of seeing one faction on a server of a title of your choice being so much larger than the other that pvp is pointless or depressing? Dark Age of Camelot fixed this issue in 2001 with one of the best mmorpg launches to date.  Three realms is the magic tie breaker - wth don't mmorpgs even consider this?

In short, in DAoC we got to be heroes - a million expansions wouldn't matter - the prettiest sword and armor would only be useful in the hands of the skilled battle hardened players that were rewarded with actual time spent on a battlefield - just the same had they been in real life conflicts.

 

We got to be heroes and the battles we fought for our realms made a measurable difference from the lowest level player in a tiny pve valley to the hardened veteran assisting in a seige warfare event - what mmorpg does this?

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