ITs funny to read post saying that darkfall is not a sandbox. So i want to hear from them, why do they think darkfall is not a sandbox.

A sandbox mmorpg for me is a game where anyone that play are in the same world. Once you login, you cannot be separate from the other login players. Meaning that a sandbox have 0 instances. Its a world where you have the freedom to do anything you want, go anywhere you want and nothing will stop you. You are free to do anything you want in DF so its a sandbox.

What they should say to look less stupid then saying that darkfall is not a sandbox is simply saying that darkfall is not like the old UO or the old AC or the old SB or the old SWG and other old sandbox.

Darkfall is his own game like no other, but it still an mmorpg sandbox.

Comparason: GTA 4 online on free mode is a sandbox game. Why? There is no instance. You can travel in the whole world while the others stay in liberty city killing each others., but you are still active on the map with them. You can do anything you want and nothing stop you from doing it. You use the tools added on the sandbox freely.

What is the different between gta 4 free mode online and darfkall online? Darkfall online have more feature then GTA 4 free mode. Thats all. Does it make GTA 4 free mode being less sandbox then darkfall? No. Its just more limited then darkfall. Thats it.

Then, you have those coming in other threads saying that lineage is a sandbox, FFX1 is a sandbox. OMG. Games like DF is a single world. A single sandbox. You login, there is no login screen that will make you go away from other online players. In theme park mmorpg, they have lvl. LVL sometime are use to like (You have to be lvl 50 to equip that. LVL 70 to do that raid. LVL 80 to pvp with the other lvl 80 players. and others.) So theme park are not sandbox games. Because they have a style of sandbox that is reserved for those who earned that rank already. In darkfall, from day one, you can go anywhere you want in the world. Only pkers that road on the sandbox will kill you and you will have to get spawned back to your latest spawn stone that you clicked on.

Not this sh!t again..........

well judgeing by your definition of what a sandobx is darkfall isn't one.

I'll bite. Bear in mind that I grew up on SWG and moved on the play EvE so that is where my opinion comes from.

One thing both of these games have are tools and freedom. In SWG, I could build my house anywhere that the terrain allowed. My player association could build their city wherever the terrain allowed and, based on the territory of the city, "own" the resources that spawned within its limits. You still need capably association members to harvest those resources, but you essentially had rights to them. EvE is a little more restricted in placement of structures as, to my knowledge, you can't just anchor out in some open space, but instead need an orbit to anchor in (someone can correct me here if I am mistaken). I guess you could see this as a terrain limitation like you would have in SWG to some extent. On the other hand, I think EvE excels in making tools available to players. Things as simple as the concord billboards, present at jump gates, bringing reports of various player conflicts, really add to the idea that you are all in one universe and strengthen the political aspects present in the game. Things like the contract system encourage different play types to interact as well. For example, someone who spent their time training for a Battleship, might not have the capacity to move a lot of cargo and thus contract the courier work out to someone who trained Industrials or Freighters. Ultimately, both games facilitate, and encourage an interdependance, on different play styles. I can survive, have fun, and be successful, in either game without ever firing a shot at another player if I chose to.

DF is getting there, I think, with the various patches they are putting out, but as of right now, I think it would only satisfy some of the most flexible definitions of "sandbox". That's my opinion though...your mileage may vary.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRpMHvcKCEw 

This will explain what a proper sandbox is, to me Darkfall is just a pvp play ground not a proper sandbox...

Since there is no universally accepted definition of what constitutes a sandbox game, people frequently look for functionality or tools  that DF lacks and use them as examples as to why its not a proper sandbox.

Some people feel that because its not really possible to pursue a crafting/merchant/exploring career and avoid skill training for the PVP aspects of the game such a limitation.

Others think the game needs to have player housing, viable and thriving economy/trade between players before it can be a sandbox.

I'm sure there are more, but you get the point.

Every MMO, from WOW to UO and everything in between have sandbox like elements/tools.  Some just have them more than others, and at some tipping point (which is different for every player) a game is considered to be a sandbox rather than a theme park.

Originally posted by ozy1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRpMHvcKCEw

 

This will explain what a proper sandbox is, to me Darkfall is just a pvp play ground not a proper sandbox...

Before i start the video, i have one question. So if darkfall is a 1 huge battle ground, why cant it still be a sandbox at the same time when its only 1 huge BG. 1 world that you always log on. The only place to respawn, the place where you can do anything, go anywhere.

Edit, i saw the video. Darkfall and eve have many same common stuff. They are both in 1 sandbox with no other realms to get aways from other players in the world. How many time Eve was release to get the time to get all that? DF, only 7 months. Many player keep supported eve and to made it how it is today. Darkfall will drain our money and do big stuff in their sandbox too.

Dont also forget that darkfall is a paid beta. So the stuff you showed on the eve video, you dont know if it will be added one day in darkfall.

Both eve and DF are sandbox, but Eve just got more tools/feature in his sandbox. Thats it. If you put your kid in the sandbox with no tools, he is still in a sandbox.

Final question, how big Eve is? How many players can play at the same time in one server? How many players can fight at the same place without lagging or server crash?

Breaking news: Solo combat PVP is dead in EVE

Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UkH0ylw7Io

Darkfall still have that solo pvp. Does it make Eve less sandbox or darkfall less sandbox because it lack something that eve have and the opposite? NO.

they are both sandbox equaly. 1 sandbox world. No other realms and you can do anything you want, go anywhere you want no matter what. This is my definition of a sandbox game. Not the comparason of a sandbox to an other sandbox game.

Sandbox is when there is just one world for everyone and when there is no classes and levels restricting the content and having to undergo a linear progression to participate it.

there are pure crafters in Darkfall and it is possible to be successful and profitable (although not for a good long time) from being a pure crafter but it is very competitive since only a few people can make the top end gear.  Lord Tenebrion probably the most prevalent example.

Originally posted by Realbigdeal

Breaking news: Solo combat PVP is dead in EVE

Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UkH0ylw7Io

 

Darkfall still have that solo pvp. Does it make Eve less sandbox or darkfall less sandbox because it lack something that eve have and the opposite? NO.

they are both sandbox equaly. 1 sandbox world. No other realms and you can do anything you want, go anywhere you want no matter what. This is my definition of a sandbox game. Not the comparason of a sandbox to an other sandbox game.

That directly contradicts the message most often repeated for DF. That being "you need to join a clan to really experience politics/pvp/other-fun-thing". Solo PvP in EvE seems about as viable as solo PvP in DF. Sure, you can do it, have some success, but it's best when done with others. In my experience, solo PvP doesn't seem so dead in EvE when it comes to Wormholes and I've seen it some in lowsec. Haven't gotten out to nullsec much recently so I cannot speak for that, but imagine it is mostly gangs out there.

As far as one realm, doesn't DF have NA1 and EU1 and wouldn't those be different realms? For EvE I just get either the live server or the test server. Again, I could be off on this, so others can feel free to correct me. As far as your other question about how many people online at a time, I believe EvE's record is a little over 51k users logged in at once. Not sure of max battle size so far. I've heard significant numbers thrown around, but don't really have a source I can point to, so I'll let someone else answer that one.

edit: corrected the "logged on users" amount and link: ve3d.ign.com/articles/news/44661/EVE-Online-Breaks-Peak-Concurrent-User-Record

Originally posted by Realbigdeal

ITs funny to read post saying that darkfall is not a sandbox. So i want to hear from them, why do they think darkfall is not a sandbox.

A sandbox mmorpg for me is a game where anyone that play are in the same world. Once you login, you cannot be separate from the other login players. Meaning that a sandbox have 0 instances. Its a world where you have the freedom to do anything you want, go anywhere you want and nothing will stop you. You are free to do anything you want in DF so its a sandbox.

What they should say to look less stupid then saying that darkfall is not a sandbox is simply saying that darkfall is not like the old UO or the old AC or the old SB or the old SWG and other old sandbox.

Darkfall is his own game like no other, but it still an mmorpg sandbox.

Comparason: GTA 4 online on free mode is a sandbox game. Why? There is no instance. You can travel in the whole world while the others stay in liberty city killing each others., but you are still active on the map with them. You can do anything you want and nothing stop you from doing it. You use the tools added on the sandbox freely.

What is the different between gta 4 free mode online and darfkall online? Darkfall online have more feature then GTA 4 free mode. Thats all. Does it make GTA 4 free mode being less sandbox then darkfall? No. Its just more limited then darkfall. Thats it.

Then, you have those coming in other threads saying that lineage is a sandbox, FFX1 is a sandbox. OMG. Games like DF is a single world. A single sandbox. You login, there is no login screen that will make you go away from other online players. In theme park mmorpg, they have lvl. LVL sometime are use to like (You have to be lvl 50 to equip that. LVL 70 to do that raid. LVL 80 to pvp with the other lvl 80 players. and others.) So theme park are not sandbox games. Because they have a style of sandbox that is reserved for those who earned that rank already. In darkfall, from day one, you can go anywhere you want in the world. Only pkers that road on the sandbox will kill you and you will have to get spawned back to your latest spawn stone that you clicked on.

 

i agree with you but this forum is full of troll .....

gaming.wikia.com/wiki/Sandbox

Originally posted by Realbigdeal

Breaking news: Solo combat PVP is dead in EVE

Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UkH0ylw7Io

 

Darkfall still have that solo pvp. Does it make Eve less sandbox or darkfall less sandbox because it lack something that eve have and the opposite? NO.

they are both sandbox equaly. 1 sandbox world. No other realms and you can do anything you want, go anywhere you want no matter what. This is my definition of a sandbox game. Not the comparason of a sandbox to an other sandbox game.

Well what if i want to go farm some wood and build a cabin in a remote area to make my own spells and potions in peace.

Oh thats right the only thing sandbox about this game isa  open empty world to run aroudn it and you can only place a house on a object in a single location...... And this "sandbox" dosnt have the tools of making your own spells..... Ohhhhhhhh..... yeah so what is sandbox? FFAPVP in a open world? thats it? i find "Anything"  at least in my mind to consist of a little more then a crappy crafting system, harvesting, and FFAPVP.. Thats a very limited anything unless you enjoy long naked stroles in the woods YAY.

oh yeah and Universal banks thats so sandbox no merchant caravans so no bandits WoW great content.

Darkfall <  Mortal online

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Originally posted by Realbigdeal
ITs funny to read post saying that darkfall is not a sandbox. So i want to hear from them, why do they think darkfall is not a sandbox.
A sandbox mmorpg for me is a game where anyone that play are in the same world. Once you login, you cannot be separate from the other login players. Meaning that a sandbox have 0 instances. Its a world where you have the freedom to do anything you want, go anywhere you want and nothing will stop you. You are free to do anything you want in DF so its a sandbox.
What they should say to look less stupid then saying that darkfall is not a sandbox is simply saying that darkfall is not like the old UO or the old AC or the old SB or the old SWG and other old sandbox.
Darkfall is his own game like no other, but it still an mmorpg sandbox.
Comparason: GTA 4 online on free mode is a sandbox game. Why? There is no instance. You can travel in the whole world while the others stay in liberty city killing each others., but you are still active on the map with them. You can do anything you want and nothing stop you from doing it. You use the tools added on the sandbox freely.
What is the different between gta 4 free mode online and darfkall online? Darkfall online have more feature then GTA 4 free mode. Thats all. Does it make GTA 4 free mode being less sandbox then darkfall? No. Its just more limited then darkfall. Thats it.
Then, you have those coming in other threads saying that lineage is a sandbox, FFX1 is a sandbox. OMG. Games like DF is a single world. A single sandbox. You login, there is no login screen that will make you go away from other online players. In theme park mmorpg, they have lvl. LVL sometime are use to like (You have to be lvl 50 to equip that. LVL 70 to do that raid. LVL 80 to pvp with the other lvl 80 players. and others.) So theme park are not sandbox games. Because they have a style of sandbox that is reserved for those who earned that rank already. In darkfall, from day one, you can go anywhere you want in the world. Only pkers that road on the sandbox will kill you and you will have to get spawned back to your latest spawn stone that you clicked on.
 

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The answer why Darkfall is not a sandbox is simple - it is linear.

Q: What is the goal of the game?
A: To advance your character via repetitive tasks.

End of the story. Nothing more, nothing less.

Maybe one day they will make it something more but until then, it is a MMO like any other just with FFA PVP...

God almighty, this horse has been beaten beyond a bloody pulp.

It's pointless to argue this anymore. Each and everyone here will present a definition of sandbox, and won't budge a nanometer from it. I've commented extensively about this in the past so, if you are interested, check my posting history. I'll gladly comment, then.

All I say is: sandbox games are NOT simply non-instanced, open worlds. Sandboxes give real options, real individualization, real player-driven content, and do not funnel everyone into the same mould.

Just because you allow everyone to have every ability in game doesn't make it a sandbox.
Instancing has nothing to do with a sandbox.

DF doesn't use a skill system, it uses an ability system.  You level one ability in order to get a new ability.

It has one class.  The warrriorarchermage.

Everyone starts in exactly the same way.  With a leafblade.  That's linear.

You are restricted to were you have a house.  You can't build a house, and not everyone can have a house.

City building is restricted.  Were you can place assets is predetermined.  That's linear.

The only thing sandboxy about the game is that you can learn every ability.
Other then that the game imposes restrictions and a very linear leveling system.

Originally posted by Kyleran

Every MMO, from WOW to UO and everything in between have sandbox like elements/tools.  Some just have them more than others, and at some tipping point (which is different for every player) a game is considered to be a sandbox rather than a theme park.

 

I think whether a game is a so called sandbox game or not is determined more by how you play it and less by it's features/mechanics.

In the right guild's hands, even a game that most people would consider to be the ultimate "themepark"--how I lothe that word--game could be made very sandboxy, with guild created events, hunts, craftsmen, contests, etc.

What I am getting as it that I think Sandbox is more of a verb than a noun.

Originally posted by indiramourn

Originally posted by Kyleran

Every MMO, from WOW to UO and everything in between have sandbox like elements/tools.  Some just have them more than others, and at some tipping point (which is different for every player) a game is considered to be a sandbox rather than a theme park.

 

 

I think whether a game is a so called sandbox game or not is determined more by how you play it and less by it's features/mechanics.

In the right guild's hands, even a game that most people would consider to be the ultimate "themepark"--how I lothe that word--game could be made very sandboxy, with guild created events, hunts, craftsmen, contests, etc.

What I am getting as it that I think Sandbox is more of a verb than a noun.

Excellent observation, you are correct, it is a better verb than a noun, and resolves some of the debate.

Originally posted by indiramourn

What I am getting as it that I think Sandbox is more of a verb than a noun.

I thought we were using it as an adjective....curses!

I think joking aside though, even that guild you mention is forced to live within specific constraints. Now, if you were to look at something like SecondLife...I imagine that would be one of the few "true" sandboxes since you can make whatever and go where ever (as far as i can tell). It requires player skill (programming to some extent if you want to make things) too. SecondLife is truly hardcore! :P

This isn't meant to debate whether systems like SecondLife or MetaPlace are actually MMOs, but more so a good illustration of the current extremes in player freedom versus the well known extremes as far as linear games.