Sony Online entertainment.

SOE

NSoft

Aventurine

EA

Originally posted by fcazares

I will never again play another MMO from SOE.

This.

There is no company out there that has done me so wrong I would black list them. The closest I would have come would have been Funcom but they have improved AOC so much they redeemed themsleves enough I will take a look at Secret World and still enjoy AOC.

I have been one of the lucky ones who have not expereienced many of the challenges or issues others have. I also think that many folks bring some of the issues on themself and blame the publisher/ Developer.  (IE: Pre-order game on last day of beta and are pissed bacuset hey did not get the beta email in time to try the game).

Also, I have, at times, probably been in blissful ignorance to some issues because I just don't care that much. I have more important things in life than having angst over one of my hobbies. I also tend to be a half full person. I would probably never consider who I WOULD NOT buy a game from and rather look to those I WOULD buy a game from.

Originally posted by Ilvaldyr

Originally posted by wolfmann

I'd rather miss out on one good game, than being treated as dirt, and served half working games, and have to deal with customer support thats more eager to get your creditcard number than helping you out.

I'm not that addicted to gaming, or shinies that I will "HAVE" it no matter what.

That's your choice of course, but I find that line of reasoning somewhat silly.

If, for example, SOE was to announce that they had acquired Star Wars: The Old Republic from Bioware/EA and would be taking charge of the general running of it once it had been released; it wouldn't kill my interest in the game.

I'd certainly not be enthusiastic at the prospect, but I'd continue to follow the game and, if it still looked appealing, wouldn't hesitate to buy it at release. If it sucked then I'd just not play it.

We roll the dice on every MMO we purchase at release and the worst that can happen is that we waste the cost of a retail box a couple of times a year. It's hardly the end of the world.

Sure we roll the dice on every purchase, but past history is a very good indicator of what you are likely to encounter with a company.  Especially a company that has a long track record of repeating the same mistakes over and over.

If a company has a habit of buying mmos from other companies and driving them into the ground, there isn't much reason to expect anything different the third time around. 

It would be like expecting funcom to have one of the most polished, content complete mmo releases in history.  While it could happen, the historical trend suggests that it will not.

SOE maybe... They ruined one of the best sandbox and PvE games ever: SWG  and Vanguard respectively.

I think every Company has done something stupid

EA ruined UO with thier AoS exp and thus ruined a perfect game,  Funcom for AO and Aoc both were really bad games from the start,  NCsoft for Tabula Rasa good game with alot of great things flushed down the toliet, Mythic for thinking pvp is the only thing in the world people like to do in MMO's  And Soe ohhh SOE the things they have done over the years in my opnion ar criminal. From EQ the 2 months were some peoples cards got charged 129.99 by mistake then took them almost 6 months to refund the money to SWG where they took in my opnion one of the best MMO's of our time and killed it.  Fact is every company seems to make a mistake hell Cryptic right now by letting some players that pre ordered early start the game and the other 80% that pre ordered months ago sit and wait..

I can go on for hours about back ally things these companys have done in the end no one company is great but a game can be (Here is to hope) Lets all hope Bioware Comes out and does an amazing job with Tor...

SOE for me too. It is unlikely I will ever buy a game made by them again unless they come out with something completely amazing.

Cryptic, Mythic and Turbine I am just very cautious with and will wait until a few months after launch to see what people say after staying in the game for a while.

For me, it would be Blizzard. The only game I liked from them was "the lost vikings". Except for that, I found all their games to be severely overrated and boring.

Other than Blizzard...well...SOE won't ever get my money again.

I judge games on their own merits and not because of the developer they may come from. If I like a game I will play it. Judging games based on their developers is pure stupidity. I really don't care if game X was developed by a company that screwed up game Y. As long as game X is fun to play that is all that matters. If they find a way to screw up game X in the future than I will stop playing it and move on to something else. What I won't do is go on to a forum and whine and cry every chance I get that the company is evil because they screwed up game X. It's just a game after all and there are plenty more to play. Getting all worked up over a company because they screwed up their game is a complete waste of time and is stupidity at it's finest.

Bren

I will never buy a game from SOE or Jagex again... EVER.  Boycott them both. LOL

 It has everything to do with customer service... It is like this, You go eat at a restaurant, they spit in your food and give you crappy service.. Are you going back to eat there again? HELL NO! The same goes for games.

I'll never, every give a dime to SOE again. The reasons are pretty obvious and well known.

I'd be very very cautious before giving any money to Funcom again.

And frankly, Cryptic's recent RMT in Champions Online has put me off from buying any of their products either.

Originally posted by Brenelael

Judging games based on their developers is pure stupidity.

 

Bren

If you buy a coffee maker from a company and it continually breaks, the customer service was not helpful and it doesn't perform as advertised would you think it smart to buy another coffee maker from the same company?

What if you bought a car from a company and had nothing but but problems with everything and hundreds of thousands of other people had similar experiences with that model.  Why would it be stupidity to judge the next vehicle they sell based on their previous products?

I would never call it stupidity to make an informed decision based on a companies history, especially when they might have a long history of doing the same things over and over again.  Personally I think it is smart consumer sense to avoid problematic companies until they make efforts to show they have made changes to correct their problems. 

Originally posted by Daffid011

I Personally I think it is smart consumer sense to avoid problematic companies until they make efforts to show they have made changes to correct their problems. 

But if you never buy another product from them you will never know if they made that effort now will you. Your other arguments are mute since a real world product has little to do with software. Game companies change dev teams like most people change their underwear. The chances of the same exact same dev team making two different games are slim to none. This would be like that coffee maker company or the car maker replacing half of their production staff in between each coffee pot or car. The comparison really doesn't hold up.

As for the customer service part of it I have yet to see a MMO company that didn't have shitty customer service. Even Blizzard and Turbine have loads of problems in this department and they are considered by most to be the best. If you want good customer service you have the wrong hobby as it's hard to come by with any of these companies. Every single major MMO company has already been mentioned in this thread alone. You rule all of those out and who are you going to buy your games from? Like I said... stupidity at it's finest.

Edit: Now that doesn't mean that I buy games without trying them first or at the very least seeing some good reviews. This is just common sense and everyone should do this. Also I would never pre-order a game or pay for more than a 1 month sub especially if the game is a MMO. This is even stupider than judging the game on the company as you never know how a game is going to change by the time it releases or how it will be a month from now. If your smart you never get burned as you never set yourself up for the fire.

Bren

SOE

Not only for the poor choices the company head has made but in my experience the staff have been deceitful and corrupt.

I'm surprised by the amount of people saying who the developer is doesn't matter. Of course it matters.

If you bought a car and it turned out to be very reliable and last a long time, wouldn't you first consider that company for your next car? I would and do. And if you buy a car and it constantly has problems and costs a lot of money to keep running, wouldn't you avoid that car company in the future?

Same for TVs, PCs, Appliances, mattresses, airlines, etc etc etc. So why in the gaming world would it suddenly be normaly to not judge a product by it's company. Just like every other market that exists, a video game company is likely to produce the same level of product time and time again. So when you start noticing that SOE puts out crap, or EA puts out crap, you quickly learn to not waste your money on crap.

Unless of course you don't use your brain and just keep saying "Well maybe next time it will be good, oh guess not, maybe next time, or next time........" That makes far less sense then not buying from a company who puts out crap.

But hey who is to argue when the country that many of us post from had an economy collapse from people and companies doing stupid things repeatedly, and then the government bailed them all out so they could do stupid things again. Can't expect people to use their head and learn that when a company screws up to be done with it and move on to a different one.

Originally posted by Brenelael

I judge games on their own merits and not because of the developer they may come from. If I like a game I will play it. Judging games based on their developers is pure stupidity. I really don't care if game X was developed by a company that screwed up game Y. As long as game X is fun to play that is all that matters. If they find a way to screw up game X in the future than I will stop playing it and move on to something else. What I won't do is go on to a forum and whine and cry every chance I get that the company is evil because they screwed up game X. It's just a game after all and there are plenty more to play. Getting all worked up over a company because they screwed up their game is a complete waste of time and is stupidity at it's finest.

 

Bren

I think that is pretty much it.

I guess what I would say more from my personal view is...  I won't buy ANY MMO unless I get to beta it or trial it.

I have purchased most MMO's that were relased... going back to Ultima Online.  I just couldn't wait to try something else and to be honest I was pretty happy with most MMO's I tried (at least for a while).

In the last few years it has seemed more like flushing 100 dollars (becuase I have to buy at least two copies for the household) for 30 days...  So my view changed to I want to see it... and make up my mind.  Reviews and forums cannot tell you if you will personally enjoy a game.

So yes there are developers (mostly development companies) that have pissed me off.  Yet if they made a game I really enjoyed.. I would play it.

Anyone who blindly blacklists a publisher or devoloper doesnt really understand how this industry works.

Go ahead and assume every game X devoloper releases will be bad because of their past and you will only end up missing out on good games.

I suggestion you just devolop a more indepth screening process, that way you dont end up buying crappy games and regretting it.

Originally posted by Brenelael

Originally posted by Daffid011

I Personally I think it is smart consumer sense to avoid problematic companies until they make efforts to show they have made changes to correct their problems. 

But if you never buy another product from them you will never know if they made that effort now will you. Your other arguments are mute since a real world product has little to do with software. Game companies change dev teams like most people change their underwear. The chances of the same exact same dev team making two different games are slim to none. This would be like that coffee maker company or the car maker replacing half of their production staff in between each coffee pot or car. The comparison really doesn't hold up.

 

As for the customer service part of it I have yet to see a MMO company that didn't have shitty customer service. Even Blizzard and Turbine have loads of problems in this department and they are considered by most to be the best. If you want good customer service you have the wrong hobby as it's hard to come by with any of these companies. Every single major MMO company has already been mentioned in this thread alone. You rule all of those out and who are you going to buy your games from? Like I said... stupidity at it's finest.

 

Bren

Okay, you have been spending too much time in your " virtual reality".  There is only ONE World, it is the REAL world.
 

You pay real money for goods and services. You pay real money for their software, and real money for their service.  Software is a real product that you buy from them.

It is like this, you buy a car then they come and take the engine out of the car you have already paid for, while your still paying them $15 a month for the upkeep, and put in a crappy engine that doesn;t work as good as the first., It is THE same as when you buy a game then they change it after you purchased it and then you are still paying them for the service to do so.

We " the consumers" spend thousands of dollars on their games only to have them break them time and time again.

As for Customer service,  you have lowered your expectations rather than realized there are  companies that offer excellent customer service. For example, When I contacted Guild wars customer service because their program was corrupted by problem on my old computer, not only did they put me through to a tech that talked me through step by step to get the program functioning again, they helped fix my computer. The program had become stuck, couldn;t access it or  uninstall it, and they talked me through it and got it working. This took some time, and they didn;t even charge me a monthy fee for it..

  Rather than accept poo on a platter, people should make their voices heard and demand companies provide the services we are paying for otherwise they will just continue to serve you poo.  Why bother giving the players anything better when they appear all to be content with poo? LOL

I found an iron on for you to put on  your T- shirt:

Originally posted by SnarlingWolf

I'm surprised by the amount of people saying who the developer is doesn't matter. Of course it matters.

 

If you bought a car and it turned out to be very reliable and last a long time, wouldn't you first consider that company for your next car? I would and do. And if you buy a car and it constantly has problems and costs a lot of money to keep running, wouldn't you avoid that car company in the future?

 

Same for TVs, PCs, Appliances, mattresses, airlines, etc etc etc. So why in the gaming world would it suddenly be normaly to not judge a product by it's company. Just like every other market that exists, a video game company is likely to produce the same level of product time and time again. So when you start noticing that SOE puts out crap, or EA puts out crap, you quickly learn to not waste your money on crap.

 

Unless of course you don't use your brain and just keep saying "Well maybe next time it will be good, oh guess not, maybe next time, or next time........" That makes far less sense then not buying from a company who puts out crap.

 

But hey who is to argue when the country that many of us post from had an economy collapse from people and companies doing stupid things repeatedly, and then the government bailed them all out so they could do stupid things again. Can't expect people to use their head and learn that when a company screws up to be done with it and move on to a different one.

What you are saying is true in some sense but not true in others.  Let's take a trip down mmo memory lane.  Wolfpack studios build a game calling it Shadowbane.  They host alpha and beta sessions to iron out the game and it is extremely well received by it's niche.  However, unknown to everyone but UBI and Wolfpack, the production/hosting company is lurking in the background getting ready to pounce.  2 weeks before release, UBI steps all over the game and basically breaks it, opening it up to hacks glitches, unplayable situations, etc etc.  Is Wolfpack at fault here?  Well, I guess you could not say they have no fault, but in order to finish the product, they needed the money and UBI was offering.  The contract behind that backing could have been handled better but I think UBI used the lure to get their hands on another good game so they could ruin it.  Unfortunately, due to what UBI pulled off, Wolfpack games does not exist anymore.  No other company, to date, has built a game with the world altering ability for the players that shadowbane had.  Some of the core members of Wolfpack are now in a company called Stray Bullet games but they keep making promises about this and that and the other but have yet to produce anything new.  I am guessing this core members group was part of the reason that UBI was able to rape Wolfpack with the contract for Shadowbane.

To the other side of the fence.  Sony, sony sony sony, Online, online online online, Entertainment, entertainment entertainment entertainment!!!!!   I don't think there is are very many people that can say good things about this companies P.C. gaming.  Playstation seems to do well but I hate consoles due to the fact that interaction is limited via controller.  Let's face it, 105 keys and a 5 button mouse beat ABCXYZ, left 1 and 2. right 1 and 2, and a trigger with gimp joystick controls.  Their P.C. gaming market however is infamous for taking a good game with some flaws and tweaking it till it completely sucks.  Points a finger at Brad McQuaid, aka lead designer of Everquest and Vanguard: Saga of Heroes.  That anyone thought Sigil games was a stand alone entity was really doubtful.  That McQuaid managed to completely destroy two games and be removed from the projects by Sony due to his one-sided tweaking to make certain character classes the god of the game should be proof of that.  That even after he was gone, Sony continued to make bad decisions about character tweaking in the games and while on the sides lines was destroying the Star Wars legacy along with a couple of other small companies games says that what McQuaid was doing was coming from Sony but due to massive catcalling from the audience, they felt the need to publicly make a statement counter hiding the fact that they desired to screw it up in the first place.  Yes this is a company I would never buy a game from again.