Sorry guys I didnt relize you might be hesitant to click on my previous link...its just a url shortner I use for twitter

New Link: Direct link to my facebook post http://www.facebook.com/pages/Gary-Gannon/120401346989

{ Mod Edit }

 Here is some of the conversation going on over there...

1. Its Star Wars...the IP is known and loved by millions
about an hour ago · Delete

2. More and more WoW fans are looking for a new fix...yes there is Cataclysm but alot of WoW players will at least give SWTOR a shot. If Bioware gets it right they will get their sub
about an hour ago · Delete

3. Innovation and new mechanics like a cover system, more immersive epic story lines that include conversations with NPC's that not only include you but also your party members.
about an hour ago · Delete

4. Ohh yea did I mention it's STAR WARS!
about an hour ago · Delete

Jeremy GerstenbergAs long as they dont sell to SOE they have a real shot at this, I agree... :)
about an hour ago · Delete · Report

Brian ArmstrongNearly everyone I've talked to that is into gaming (including guildees in WoW) is pining for SWTOR. If they get things right and the beta buzz is positive, it could definitely be a contender. I don't think WoW will lose a lot though; I think people will just start playing both since they'll be so different.
about an hour ago · Delete · Report

Mathew EdwardsTrust me. I'm rooting like hell for SWTOR to kick WoW's ass, but it is a tlal order... 10 million people? It's possible, but I wont hold my breath. I'll be happy if its even close to half as successful as WoW!

I see the initial subs and game launch day being a huge mess just for all of the points listed in this thread.

I do not see the subs rate lasting long.  Replayability will annoy most of the WoW crowd having to sit through what they deem as "same ol cut scenes" even though they cna make different options. 

I also think that the add-ons and releases for the game will be a long time coming with all of the voice over acting required in new content that most games do not have in developement.  This will cause a severe loss of subs due to static content. 

I also do not think this game will do BAD for any of the reasons I listed.  Just do not feel it will CORNER the market for any LONG period of time.  It may make it for a month or 2 but, long term staying power is a bit cloudy.

 Simply put: No.  There will be a big dropoff after the first month or so.  There is no longevity except for people who are very slow at finishing the story / don't have a lot of time to play.

Originally posted by GaryGannon

 Here is some of the conversation going on over there...

1. Its Star Wars...the IP is known and loved by millions
about an hour ago · Delete

Except that it isn't Star Wars. It's KOTOR. It has almost nothing in common with the movies.

I like the fact it is being looked at as another fail waiting to happen, means I won't deal with as many of the wow generation of sorry mmo players.

Originally posted by demalus

 Simply put: No.  There will be a big dropoff after the first month or so.  There is no longevity except for people who are very slow at finishing the story / don't have a lot of time to play.

Maybe in a game where all the classes had the same content, but if what they say is true about how much there is, I imagine even if you tried all the classes, you could not finish it all within one month. So I doubt that is correct, unless you hate Star Wars and KOTOR.

Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

Originally posted by GaryGannon

 Here is some of the conversation going on over there...

1. Its Star Wars...the IP is known and loved by millions
about an hour ago · Delete

Except that it isn't Star Wars. It's KOTOR. It has almost nothing in common with the movies.

KotoR has been more popular that SWG with almost all the SWG monthly subscribers put together.  So if the game is like KotoR instead of SWG this is an incredibly good thing.

I hope the game has Absolutely nothing to do with episodes 4-6.  They were great 30 years ago.  It's 2009.  It's time for the next game.  SWTOR has the chance to be that game.  By being NEW.  Not by doing the same tired old crap.

Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

Originally posted by GaryGannon

 Here is some of the conversation going on over there...

1. Its Star Wars...the IP is known and loved by millions
about an hour ago · Delete

Except that it isn't Star Wars. It's KOTOR. It has almost nothing in common with the movies.

And yet it is Star Wars.  I know kids that play WoW and Wizard 101 that can't wait for SW:TOR to come out.  They didn't grow up with the origional Star Wars like we did and yet they love it just the same.  One kid on my football team said it best, "As long as there are lightsabers and bantha fodder I'm in!".  Kids don't get hung up on all the bs like we do and can appreciate the whole Star Wars Universe.  They don't have to have Han Solo in it for it to appeal to them.  It's been done...we watched 3 movies about it...do we need a game to relive virtually what we've already seen? 

I'm gonna pour some beer on the curb for my homie Yoda on release day, then get to crackin' with all new Star Wars adventures on what will hopefully the most fun game I've played in years.

Originally posted by demalus

 Simply put: No.  There will be a big dropoff after the first month or so.  There is no longevity except for people who are very slow at finishing the story / don't have a lot of time to play.

And that may be the majority of the market. Knight of the old republic is like 60 hours of gameplay. Bioware is quote saying that this is bigger than 6-7 times the KOTOR games. So let's say you have 400 hours of gameplay. For people who can play 2 hrs a day (and my kids definitely have LESS THAN that a day because of homework and stuff), we are talking about 200 days ... 6-7 months.

That is quite enough. And I am sure there will be additional repetitive elements like PvP and free form fighting.

Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

Originally posted by GaryGannon

 Here is some of the conversation going on over there...

1. Its Star Wars...the IP is known and loved by millions
about an hour ago · Delete

Except that it isn't Star Wars. It's KOTOR. It has almost nothing in common with the movies.

Star Wars have moved beyond the movies for a long long time. Just witness all the SW games, Clone wars on cartoon network and so on.

 We need to know more about the game to make a real strong prediction.   A lot is still unknown. Some cool features but we still don't know how pvp is going to be put in. We also had no idea about "end game content".    I also wonder if the game will be too short with the story driven aspect.    This game might not be subscription based? Or did I get my games confused?

 No game will overtake WoW at launch it's just too impossible because there's just so many factors that go into keeping someone who's an MMO person where they are. The question is will it be good enough to take at least 600k away in 3 to 6 months that would be a strong foot hold that would open up the flood gates to mass exodus. 

Originally posted by Ragnaven

I like the fact it is being looked at as another fail waiting to happen, means I won't deal with as many of the wow generation of sorry mmo players.

It's not looked at as a fail...it's looked at as the next big thing.

Why do you consider WoW and TOR to be opposites?  They aren't even close to opposites.  If anything, TOR is relatively close to WoW in terms of what kind of MMO it is (if you were to create a sort of spectrum of MMOs).  I view the target audience for this as a subset of WoW's target audience - the notable difference being that the subset are the kinds of players in WoW that don't raid / arena PvP.  The other part of the target audience are the people who like single player games like KotOR.

There just isn't that many great mmo's out there and I am excited that there is a game coming out that is going to be great. And I agree with Gary that WOW people are looking for a new fix because I am one of those players. I like a game with good graphics and great game play and there aren't many MMO's that give you that.

And also even though the old republic isn't the same story as the old movies it is just as easy to get into the storyline of KOTOR. I think any Star Wars fan love's the story of KOTOR so I don't see why you would say that millions would not love this game just as much as the movies.

Originally posted by demalus

Originally posted by Ragnaven

I like the fact it is being looked at as another fail waiting to happen, means I won't deal with as many of the wow generation of sorry mmo players.

It's not looked at as a fail...it's looked at as the next big thing.

Why do you consider WoW and TOR to be opposites?  They aren't even close to opposites.  If anything, TOR is relatively close to WoW in terms of what kind of MMO it is (if you were to create a sort of spectrum of MMOs).  I view the target audience for this as a subset of WoW's target audience - the notable difference being that the subset are the kinds of players in WoW that don't raid / arena PvP.  The other part of the target audience are the people who like single player games like KotOR.

Then that's more then enough. Do you have any clue how many small guilds there is that don't focus on raiding, I'm sure it out numbers the raiders. Or how many people enjoy BGs/World PvP over Arena, lots, trust me.

Originally posted by nariusseldon

Originally posted by demalus

 Simply put: No.  There will be a big dropoff after the first month or so.  There is no longevity except for people who are very slow at finishing the story / don't have a lot of time to play.

 

And that may be the majority of the market. Knight of the old republic is like 60 hours of gameplay. Bioware is quote saying that this is bigger than 6-7 times the KOTOR games. So let's say you have 400 hours of gameplay. For people who can play 2 hrs a day (and my kids definitely have LESS THAN that a day because of homework and stuff), we are talking about 200 days ... 6-7 months.

That is quite enough. And I am sure there will be additional repetitive elements like PvP and free form fighting.

It took you 60 hours to finish KotOR?

Anyways, I think this game will sell a lot of boxes, but I see the population dropping off once the stories start running out. Having different stories for different classes adds the difficulty of making each story unique, compelling, and interesting enough to continue play. While the game may off many different stories, I would bet most players would only play through a couple before they call it quits.

That is unless Bioware can introduce some fun and repeatable endgame. That would change it a bit, but from what we have seen so far it seems their focus is almost entirely on story.

This game is going to fail and Bioware will go back to something they are actually good at.

Originally posted by Ruyn

This game is going to fail and Bioware will go back to something they are actually good at.

Simply... in response to this,  No.... No it will not fail.

Its actually ingenious how bioware is going about this.  Think about it. What is bioware known for?  Making incredible single player games.  To that, anyone who contradicts obviously isn't much of a gamer.

Thats why this game is breaking new ground, because they are keeping the single player element with ToR.  Everything that makes ToR series worth playing in the first place is already present, which will draw a large number of box sales.  The model resembles many console games...  but expands on it 10 fold.  In a console game you play through the story mode to get your bearings, then go into online arena modes. but the gameplay usually doesn't expand much farther then small, quick skirmishes and additional downloadable content.

In this game they are giving you more of a purpose, larger persistent worlds with combat that looks fairly exciting and fast paced.  Throw in some crafting, some housing, races/planets/factions  and continual content updates and I don't see how this game can't be successful.  Did I mention its based on not just the star wars IP but some of the most popular RPGs in RPG history?

Originally posted by Abrahmm

Originally posted by nariusseldon

Originally posted by demalus

 Simply put: No.  There will be a big dropoff after the first month or so.  There is no longevity except for people who are very slow at finishing the story / don't have a lot of time to play.

 

And that may be the majority of the market. Knight of the old republic is like 60 hours of gameplay. Bioware is quote saying that this is bigger than 6-7 times the KOTOR games. So let's say you have 400 hours of gameplay. For people who can play 2 hrs a day (and my kids definitely have LESS THAN that a day because of homework and stuff), we are talking about 200 days ... 6-7 months.

That is quite enough. And I am sure there will be additional repetitive elements like PvP and free form fighting.

 

It took you 60 hours to finish KotOR?

 

Anyways, I think this game will sell a lot of boxes, but I see the population dropping off once the stories start running out. Having different stories for different classes adds the difficulty of making each story unique, compelling, and interesting enough to continue play. While the game may off many different stories, I would bet most players would only play through a couple before they call it quits.

That is unless Bioware can introduce some fun and repeatable endgame. That would change it a bit, but from what we have seen so far it seems their focus is almost entirely on story.

I think when he says 60 hours, he is referring to every side quest included.

As far as people dropping off it really depends on if BioWare backs up content in advance. And I believe that is something they would do. This gives them more room to work. Releasing the boxed game then 3 months later they have a completely new content patch to release and during that 3 months they could be working on another. Really, a new story for an alternative character > the same guided path leveling zones in other MMOs. Just my opinion anyways.

And I agree, I really hope the endgame turns out pretty good. End game is usually not a thing that bothers me. I'm just hoping for something other then, well, story. But I really doubt BioWare will forget that part, if they atleast paid attention to other MMOs that released without end game.