Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

1 -  from the little I have heard

2 - Star Wars is first and foremost about the movies. Other than the force and some location names, this game has no connection to the movies.

 

1 - You have heard nothing

http://www.massively.com/2008/10/24/swtor-classes-part-2/

2 - And that's a shock? Perhaps you missed "The Old Republic" following the Star Wars logo. It was approved by lucas, so apparently it fit into his idea of Star Wars. And it has more connection then you think. Do you think it was just a poof and Star Wars Started the way it was in the movies. There was always past stories, ones shown in Kotor and so on. By the way people are wanting a Star Wars movie in the time of the Old Republic. If that was made what would you fall back on next?

Most people who try the game will be expecting will be expecting characters, places, and plots from the movies.

TOR is a sideline.

I defnitely agree with Isturi. Maybe TOR will just be good as number #1, but the fact that Blizzard is always hyping about their rediculous IP's. Where for that matter they're just waiting for some great idea and copy pasting it into their brand label. That's what I observed for their products as far as I can remember. Blizzard is used to milking peoples pockets even though the word "Polished" is just a marketing strategy they always used just for their fan based to think that they're not being fooled into another round of business success for their company.

Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

Originally posted by greed0104

 

1 - You have heard nothing

http://www.massively.com/2008/10/24/swtor-classes-part-2/

2 - And that's a shock? Perhaps you missed "The Old Republic" following the Star Wars logo. It was approved by lucas, so apparently it fit into his idea of Star Wars. And it has more connection then you think. Do you think it was just a poof and Star Wars Started the way it was in the movies. There was always past stories, ones shown in Kotor and so on. By the way people are wanting a Star Wars movie in the time of the Old Republic. If that was made what would you fall back on next?

Most people who try the game will be expecting will be expecting characters, places, and plots from the movies.

TOR is a sideline.

Thanks for providing a linky unlike some people making claims.

Furthermore if people expect to see vader in a game set 3000 years before the movie they should have read the box.

TOR isn't WoW because TOR is set in a sci-fi setting while WoW is set in medieval fantasy.

/thread 

Originally posted by konz3n

I defnitely agree with Isturi. Maybe TOR will just be good as number #1, but the fact that Blizzard is always hyping about their rediculous IP's. Where for that matter they're just waiting for some great idea and copy pasting it into their brand label. That's what I observed for their products as far as I can remember. Blizzard is used to milking peoples pockets even though the word "Polished" is just a marketing strategy they always used just for their fan based to think that they're not being fooled into another round of business success for their company.

Thank you Konz3n.

@ MMO_Doubter

Your wisdom and insight is lost here. I totally agree with you in all of your points. People have forgotten what a true MMORPG is. They see it is played over the Internet, even if it is single-player mostly, and they pay a monthly fee, so it must be a MMORPG.

They see light-sabers and see Jedi and think it is Star Wars already. They say it is George Lucas approved and even that doesn't wake them up. Because George Lucas approved means nowadays simplistic, kid-ready junk, that will generate lots and lots of money through merchandise.

It might have the shiny exterior of Star Wars but the soul is long lost.

Originally posted by greed0104 

Thanks for providing a linky unlike some people making claims.

Furthermore if people expect to see vader in a game set 3000 years before the movie they should have read the box.

I bet "Star Wars" will be in much larger print than "Old Republic" and "3000 years in the past" will be in tiny print on the back.

Originally posted by Fuerchtegott

@ MMO_Doubter

  People have forgotten what a true MMORPG is.

And how would you describe a MMORPG?

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by Fuerchtegott

@ MMO_Doubter

  People have forgotten what a true MMORPG is.

And how would you describe a MMORPG?

I think if you spelled out those 6 letters, they would fully describe what one may look like.

Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

Originally posted by greed0104 

Thanks for providing a linky unlike some people making claims.

Furthermore if people expect to see vader in a game set 3000 years before the movie they should have read the box.

I bet "Star Wars" will be in much larger print than "Old Republic" and "3000 years in the past" will be in tiny print on the back.

Yeah because 3000 years in the past is something BioWare wants to hide. That has nothing to do with the story line.

Originally posted by twiggy550

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by Fuerchtegott

@ MMO_Doubter

  People have forgotten what a true MMORPG is.

And how would you describe a MMORPG?

I think if you spelled out those 6 letters, they would fully describe what one may look like.

I asked for his description. You wanna share one to?

Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

Originally posted by Dameonk

Ok, I'll bite.

1. It's going to allow massive people per server, it's multi-player and it's online.  Why isn't it an MMO?

2. It's set in the Star Wars universe, it's being co-developed by Lucas Arts.  How isn't it Star Wars?

1 - it will be a solo or small group oriented game. I have seen no idications of large group play, and from the little I have heard crafting and other player interaction will be quite limited. A strong storyline does not make for an MMO.

2 - Star Wars is first and foremost about the movies. Other than the force and some location names, this game has no connection to the movies.

1 -  Lord of the Rings Online is an MMO with mass solo content.  The "storyline" is based upon "epic books", which tend to start solo and end with group activities for each book.  It is more than 95% solo and small group content yet you won't find many who'll claim it's not an MMO.  It also uses mass amounts of instancing for solo, group and raid content.

*THINK* about the situation a bit.  Bioware is rather well known for having decisions that effect the future course your characters *CAN* progress along.  Now do you really want to try and do PUG's (pick-up groups) where some meat-head can go kill an NPC and change what your character can *EVER* do?  

So you "isolate" decision points and put them into solo situations so that character, and only that character, *CAN* decide their own path.  In many games such decision points are "events" and a good deal of detail is put into them so, while introducing a game, those points will be what you'll tend to show.  There's also the fact that the game is not in release yet and they are still hammering a lot out.  As such, the "refined", important solo events, will be cleanest and easiest to show so that is what they show.

"wait and see" on the subject but I don't see anything in what they are showing that'll limit any forms of group or raid content.  You hit a "decision point" and get a mission to go wipe out a rebel or imperial camp -- depending on your decision.  That can be a group run but the decision that'd put you there...  That quite easily is done solo.

2 -- Lucas arts grants this as a *LIVE* franchise.  They lend the logo out, making official, *TONS* of crap all the time.  As a live changing world, if they decide to give bounty hunters personal transports to beam around plants and worlds or have jedi slaughter school children or sith donate most of their money to charities... that'll be valid as "Star Wars".  They *OWN* the rights to do whatever the hell they want with their "product".

Honestly I don't like some of the changes they've done even in the movies but it is their choice and their right to do anything they want.  That's the downside of having "living authors" with "rights to change"...  Odds are good that they'll decide to change things in ways many fans won't like just to make more money from "new" things they can come up with.  Their goal is profits and has squat to do with anything else.

So... Will it be star wars?  Yup.  New, up to date and changing to match "the vision" that the merchandiser wants to show.  You already have the Jedi in armor and non-jedi packing/using light sabers as part of the story.  You've seen in the movies how jedi get shot down with blasters and the like.  So don't think of it as being based upon a static world.  It'll change and any changes will be "right and proper" as Star Wars.

As for the game in general...  I'm not overly impressed at "mass voice over".  It won't operate any different than text quest info.  It'll be even LESS personalized than a text system (in text, you can replace a "token" in the text with the player's name.  WIth recorded voice overs...  Nope.).  You'll still have limited answers to questions and options to pick from.  So it'll "make noise" when you pick an option?  Woopie.  Some may find that as "advanced technology" but I find it little different than "press 1 for English.  Press 2 for Spanish ..."

It's a pretty game and it has potential but I'll have to wait and see if it'll be woth playing or not and only time will tell on that portion.

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by twiggy550

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by Fuerchtegott

@ MMO_Doubter

  People have forgotten what a true MMORPG is.

And how would you describe a MMORPG?

I think if you spelled out those 6 letters, they would fully describe what one may look like.

 

I asked for his description. You wanna share one to?

Naw. I just felt like being a smartass.

But I'll /wave to you on the sidelines! How's that sound? :D

Originally posted by twiggy550

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by Fuerchtegott

@ MMO_Doubter

  People have forgotten what a true MMORPG is.

And how would you describe a MMORPG?

I think if you spelled out those 6 letters, they would fully describe what one may look like.

Ah guys Bioware themself are claiming it to be a MMO not to date a MMORPG unless they offer RPG realms that is yet to remain to be seen.

Originally posted by twiggy550

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by twiggy550

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by Fuerchtegott

@ MMO_Doubter

  People have forgotten what a true MMORPG is.

And how would you describe a MMORPG?

I think if you spelled out those 6 letters, they would fully describe what one may look like.

 

I asked for his description. You wanna share one to?

Naw. I just felt like being a smartass.

But I'll /wave to you on the sidelines! How's that sound? :D

One, you being a smartass makes you cool with me. Thats what makes www.mmorpg.com so special.
 

two, /accepted.

Yeah ....

I have yet to see more than 2 players sharing any content on any game footage yet..and milling around a starting area or a trading hub =/= shared content (environmental or Player based)

Massive, multi-player = lots of people sharing content not just your small group doing the "STORY"

..welcome to Guild wars 1

Originally posted by mattybee007

Yeah ....

I have yet to see more than 2 players sharing any content on any game footage yet..and milling around a starting area or a trading hub =/= shared content (environmental or Player based)

Massive, multi-player = lots of people sharing content not just your small group doing the "STORY"

..welcome to Alpha

Fix'd

Anyways bed time. Enjoy debating, assuming, pulling things out of your ass.

Originally posted by Eleazaros

1 -  Lord of the Rings Online is an MMO with mass solo content.  The "storyline" is based upon "epic books", which tend to start solo and end with group activities for each book.  It is more than 95% solo and small group content yet you won't find many who'll claim it's not an MMO.  It also uses mass amounts of instancing for solo, group and raid content.

*THINK* about the situation a bit.  Bioware is rather well known for having decisions that effect the future course your characters *CAN* progress along.  Now do you really want to try and do PUG's (pick-up groups) where some meat-head can go kill an NPC and change what your character can *EVER* do?  

So you "isolate" decision points and put them into solo situations so that character, and only that character, *CAN* decide their own path.  In many games such decision points are "events" and a good deal of detail is put into them so, while introducing a game, those points will be what you'll tend to show.  There's also the fact that the game is not in release yet and they are still hammering a lot out.  As such, the "refined", important solo events, will be cleanest and easiest to show so that is what they show.

"wait and see" on the subject but I don't see anything in what they are showing that'll limit any forms of group or raid content.  You hit a "decision point" and get a mission to go wipe out a rebel or imperial camp -- depending on your decision.  That can be a group run but the decision that'd put you there...  That quite easily is done solo.

2 -- Lucas arts grants this as a *LIVE* franchise.  They lend the logo out, making official, *TONS* of crap all the time.  As a live changing world, if they decide to give bounty hunters personal transports to beam around plants and worlds or have jedi slaughter school children or sith donate most of their money to charities... that'll be valid as "Star Wars".  They *OWN* the rights to do whatever the hell they want with their "product".

Honestly I don't like some of the changes they've done even in the movies but it is their choice and their right to do anything they want.  That's the downside of having "living authors" with "rights to change"...  Odds are good that they'll decide to change things in ways many fans won't like just to make more money from "new" things they can come up with.  Their goal is profits and has squat to do with anything else.

So... Will it be star wars?  Yup.  New, up to date and changing to match "the vision" that the merchandiser wants to show.  You already have the Jedi in armor and non-jedi packing/using light sabers as part of the story.  You've seen in the movies how jedi get shot down with blasters and the like.  So don't think of it as being based upon a static world.  It'll change and any changes will be "right and proper" as Star Wars.

As for the game in general...  I'm not overly impressed at "mass voice over".  It won't operate any different than text quest info.  It'll be even LESS personalized than a text system (in text, you can replace a "token" in the text with the player's name.  WIth recorded voice overs...  Nope.).  You'll still have limited answers to questions and options to pick from.  So it'll "make noise" when you pick an option?  Woopie.  Some may find that as "advanced technology" but I find it little different than "press 1 for English.  Press 2 for Spanish ..."

It's a pretty game and it has potential but I'll have to wait and see if it'll be woth playing or not and only time will tell on that portion.

Good post. You make some good points.

1 - as I said: " A strong storyline does not make for an MMO."

2 - As far as popularity is concerned (and that is what this thread is about), it really doesn't matter what George Lucas calls it. It matters what the fans think, and most fans will be looking for strong ties to the movies. This game doesn't have them.

I am in no way saying that SW:tOR will be a BAD game. I would probably play it for a few months to follow the storyline to its end. From what I have seen so far, it won't be a good MMORPG, however, because there won't be the interaction between many players that pretty much defines "MMO".

Originally posted by greed0104

Originally posted by mattybee007

Yeah ....

I have yet to see more than 2 players sharing any content on any game footage yet..and milling around a starting area or a trading hub =/= shared content (environmental or Player based)

Massive, multi-player = lots of people sharing content not just your small group doing the "STORY"

..welcome to Alpha

 

Fix'd

Anyways bed time. Enjoy debating, assuming, pulling things out of your ass.

Gee, and here I thought that, that was standard for any forum message board.

All of your arguements will be a lot stronger when you base them off something other than Alpha footage.  The game isn't even a game yet, it's still being put together.  Until they release BETA, it's all just wind. 

Except, Movie guy.  You make some good points, that I think will be over shadowed by the fact that this game is based of a single player game that is pretty damn popular and this MMO will go along with that story line, which is canon.  So while I did enjoy reading your write up, I am not 100% with you on this one, YET.   Again, very early to start passing judgement yet.