Originally posted by HolaPaco

Originally posted by vaylha

Originally posted by Fariic

I'm waiting to play a true sandbox MMO. 
One that allows me to be and do whatever I want.

I'm hoping that MO will be just that game.

I do believe there are a lot of people who just want MO to be another DFO though.

 

...even the DnF failbots get fed up pretty quick since they can't bloodwall or afk macro in MO.

 

How are they going stop players from doing this?

What if your skill leveling doesn't impact your skills in the way you would expect.
 

What if your damage was primarilly determined by how well crafted your weapon is, and your use of that weapon?
What if skill increases effected things in other ways then increasing damage or damage mitigation?

I'm not saying that that's how it will work, but if you've read about what some of the skills effect then it's not a long shot.

Using a sword doesn't neccesarilly mean you get more damage out if it.  You get better understanding of the weapon.  How heavy it is, what it's made of, the amount of damage it can do, etc. etc.  Skills are supposed to work like this across the board, the better you get at something, the better your understanding and use of that skill is. 

I do expect that getting better at using a sword will effect your damage output, but I've got a feeling that it's not going to be the primary reason to level the skill.  I will say that not knowing anything about the weapon you hold becomes a huge incentive to increase the skill in that weapon.  Not knowing how much damage it's able to do, how much it weighs and such is actually a pain in the ass.  You take those sorts of things for granted in most games.  You already know what it's stats are as soon as you get it.  

What if you could only wear so much stuff.  Not just carry, but the weight of what you wear?  There would be incentive to know just how much that piece of armor weighs.  To know how much damage it will mitigate.  What if your right side was better then your left?  That kind of information could mean the dif. between winning a fight or losing one.  If your right side has better armor then the left you might know not to leave the left side exposed and try to take blow on the right instead.

That's not to say people won't macro in MO.  People will. 
The issue isn't always stopping it, but making sure that those that do aren't getting such an advantage over those that don't that it's a problem.  Bloodwalling in Darkfall gives a massive advantage to those that do it because character skill is the end all.  The higher that sword skill the more skills you get, the more damage you do, and the same goes for magic.  There's incentive to macro those skills, get them as high as possible; as fast as possible.

Also,
The skill system in MO is going to work much dif. then it does in DFO.  You have your primary skills which I believe are supposed to level rather fast, then secondary skills that will take more time.  I think that the primary skills will be the equivelant of DFO's known abilities (those skills you start with), and the secondary will be like the ones you purchase.  It could be that the primary skills are the ones that will have the most impact on  things like damage; so if you use a sword and can incrase the skill quickly without the need to macro, then increase the skills associated with the sword skill that will be more along the line of extended understanding of that primary skill, but may not have a big impact on damage.  Maybe the secondary stuff will allow you to swing faster, or use less stamina.

I'm just speculating.
Although Henrik himself has stated more then once, that I've seen, that macroing shouldn't be an issue with the way that they are doing the skill system.

Originally posted by Fariic

Originally posted by HolaPaco

Originally posted by vaylha

Originally posted by Fariic

I'm waiting to play a true sandbox MMO. 
One that allows me to be and do whatever I want.

I'm hoping that MO will be just that game.

I do believe there are a lot of people who just want MO to be another DFO though.

 

...even the DnF failbots get fed up pretty quick since they can't bloodwall or afk macro in MO.

 

How are they going stop players from doing this?

What if your skill leveling doesn't impact your skills in the way you would expect.
 

What if your damage was primarilly determined by how well crafted your weapon is, and your use of that weapon?
What if skill increases effected things in other ways then increasing damage or damage mitigation?

I'm not saying that that's how it will work, but if you've read about what some of the skills effect then it's not a long shot.

Using a sword doesn't neccesarilly mean you get more damage out if it.  You get better understanding of the weapon.  How heavy it is, what it's made of, the amount of damage it can do, etc. etc.  Skills are supposed to work like this across the board, the better you get at something, the better your understanding and use of that skill is. 

I do expect that getting better at using a sword will effect your damage output, but I've got a feeling that it's not going to be the primary reason to level the skill.  I will say that not knowing anything about the weapon you hold becomes a huge incentive to increase the skill in that weapon.  Not knowing how much damage it's able to do, how much it weighs and such is actually a pain in the ass.  You take those sorts of things for granted in most games.  You already know what it's stats are as soon as you get it.  

What if you could only wear so much stuff.  Not just carry, but the weight of what you wear?  There would be incentive to know just how much that piece of armor weighs.  To know how much damage it will mitigate.  What if your right side was better then your left?  That kind of information could mean the dif. between winning a fight or losing one.  If your right side has better armor then the left you might know not to leave the left side exposed and try to take blow on the right instead.

That's not to say people won't macro in MO.  People will. 
The issue isn't always stopping it, but making sure that those that do aren't getting such an advantage over those that don't that it's a problem.  Bloodwalling in Darkfall gives a massive advantage to those that do it because character skill is the end all.  The higher that sword skill the more skills you get, the more damage you do, and the same goes for magic.  There's incentive to macro those skills, get them as high as possible; as fast as possible.

Also,
The skill system in MO is going to work much dif. then it does in DFO.  You have your primary skills which I believe are supposed to level rather fast, then secondary skills that will take more time.  I think that the primary skills will be the equivelant of DFO's known abilities (those skills you start with), and the secondary will be like the ones you purchase.  It could be that the primary skills are the ones that will have the most impact on  things like damage; so if you use a sword and can incrase the skill quickly without the need to macro, then increase the skills associated with the sword skill that will be more along the line of extended understanding of that primary skill, but may not have a big impact on damage.  Maybe the secondary stuff will allow you to swing faster, or use less stamina.

I'm just speculating.
Although Henrik himself has stated more then once, that I've seen, that macroing shouldn't be an issue with the way that they are doing the skill system.

 

Thanks for the info.
 

Originally posted by HolaPaco

Originally posted by Fariic

Originally posted by HolaPaco

Originally posted by vaylha

Originally posted by Fariic

I'm waiting to play a true sandbox MMO. 
One that allows me to be and do whatever I want.

I'm hoping that MO will be just that game.

I do believe there are a lot of people who just want MO to be another DFO though.

 

...even the DnF failbots get fed up pretty quick since they can't bloodwall or afk macro in MO.

 

How are they going stop players from doing this?

What if your skill leveling doesn't impact your skills in the way you would expect.
 

What if your damage was primarilly determined by how well crafted your weapon is, and your use of that weapon?
What if skill increases effected things in other ways then increasing damage or damage mitigation?

I'm not saying that that's how it will work, but if you've read about what some of the skills effect then it's not a long shot.

Using a sword doesn't neccesarilly mean you get more damage out if it.  You get better understanding of the weapon.  How heavy it is, what it's made of, the amount of damage it can do, etc. etc.  Skills are supposed to work like this across the board, the better you get at something, the better your understanding and use of that skill is. 

I do expect that getting better at using a sword will effect your damage output, but I've got a feeling that it's not going to be the primary reason to level the skill.  I will say that not knowing anything about the weapon you hold becomes a huge incentive to increase the skill in that weapon.  Not knowing how much damage it's able to do, how much it weighs and such is actually a pain in the ass.  You take those sorts of things for granted in most games.  You already know what it's stats are as soon as you get it.  

What if you could only wear so much stuff.  Not just carry, but the weight of what you wear?  There would be incentive to know just how much that piece of armor weighs.  To know how much damage it will mitigate.  What if your right side was better then your left?  That kind of information could mean the dif. between winning a fight or losing one.  If your right side has better armor then the left you might know not to leave the left side exposed and try to take blow on the right instead.

That's not to say people won't macro in MO.  People will. 
The issue isn't always stopping it, but making sure that those that do aren't getting such an advantage over those that don't that it's a problem.  Bloodwalling in Darkfall gives a massive advantage to those that do it because character skill is the end all.  The higher that sword skill the more skills you get, the more damage you do, and the same goes for magic.  There's incentive to macro those skills, get them as high as possible; as fast as possible.

Also,
The skill system in MO is going to work much dif. then it does in DFO.  You have your primary skills which I believe are supposed to level rather fast, then secondary skills that will take more time.  I think that the primary skills will be the equivelant of DFO's known abilities (those skills you start with), and the secondary will be like the ones you purchase.  It could be that the primary skills are the ones that will have the most impact on  things like damage; so if you use a sword and can incrase the skill quickly without the need to macro, then increase the skills associated with the sword skill that will be more along the line of extended understanding of that primary skill, but may not have a big impact on damage.  Maybe the secondary stuff will allow you to swing faster, or use less stamina.

I'm just speculating.
Although Henrik himself has stated more then once, that I've seen, that macroing shouldn't be an issue with the way that they are doing the skill system.

 

Thanks for the info.
 

Welcome.

Just keep in mind that much of that is speculation based on how skills are supposed to work.
The means to avoid macroing could just be as simple as anti-cheat that will kick you if you're using 3rd party software, and a skill system that allows you to level realatively quickly to make macroing pointless.

Can I say that a keyboard doesn't work?
At least as far as I'm aware.
 

Originally posted by DAS1337

Originally posted by Galadourn

...that many people are waiting MO just to play another CS arena as an online battleground?

 

This is a troll post if I've ever seen one.  The only things that are similar is that they are first person.  Might as well say CS is trying to be EQ without the massive world and round based combat.  See how idiotic that sounds?  Or even better.  EQ is trying to be a DOOM clone with a massive persistant world.  I could continue, but I'm sure you understand now how dumb that was.

I think you misunderstood. The OP thinks that alot of players are reading FFA PVP with FPV and they think it is some sort of MMO counter strike. He is not saying the games are similar, he is saying alot of people will think they are similar.

He is just voicing a concern over the potential player base.

Originally posted by Galadourn

...that many people are waiting MO just to play another CS arena as an online battleground?

Think you are wrong. Many waited DF and sees its what you say. I'm happy that MO is pointing to absolutely different direction: PvP around  PvE and crafting, so its more likely to turn into PvE game than CS PvP fest.

Oh really?

Do you mind telling me how MO will pursue PVP based around PVE and crafting?

Originally posted by Einstein-DF

Oh really?

 

Do you mind telling me how MO will pursue PVP based around PVE and crafting?

i'll answer that one for him. did you ever read that old quest example the mortal devs posted? it's a nice blend of pve, pvp, and crafting.

· There’s an ancient, sealed gate hidden in the mountainside.

· Around the world there are bits and pieces of history to be found, like books, poems, lyrics etc. One might tell about a "powerful soul" sealed inside a cave, and that the seal will eventually break if a certain ritual isn’t performed again soon. One might give a wayfarer directions to a mysterious door of unknown origin in the mountains. One might prophesize about the "Essence-Shaper", a powerful soul that will return to the surface of the world.

· There are secret skills (spell rituals) to be found that can open, or seal, such ancient doors.

· There are secret skills (crafting) to be found that can produce weapons to aid in slaying the Essence-Shaper.

· There are secret items to be found that might give the wielders the power to control the Essence-Shaper.

· Religions in the game may be affected by the state of certain power-nodes. For instance one religions power might be +-0 as long as the Essence-Shaper is alive, -1 if the Essence-Shaper is dead, or +1 if the Essence-Shaper is released into the world.

· Any player or group controlling the Essence-Shaper would benefit greatly from it.

· Any player or group slaying the Essence-Shaper would be greatly affected by it.

Monsters or other beings involved in epic quests can be played by GMs.

I am glad to hear that they are adressing macroing, that pretty much destroyed any real skill to the pvp in DF.

I just hope MO has an open pvp system that has a certain level of consequence for attacking random people in order to prevent a total cluster **** with no sense or reason, making pvp pointless and unsatisfying. Lazer towers are not enough, towns need guards who are tough, ranged, will give chase and have mechanics that prevent abuse (i.e. 1 guy pulling the entire city guard and training them away to let attackers get in incredibly easily).

And please for the love of god don't let people massively exploit mobs on day 1 and do NOTHING about it.