Originally posted by BarCrow

WOW....great idea. This is the kind of experimentation that is truly needed in online gaming . I can't wait to see how World of Darkness pans out...and if similar implementation will be used.

Unfortunately, it could lead one to believe that WoD will suffer the console taint that CO and STO have.

Think about the hardware though, in regards to consoles.

X-Box: 2001, X-Box 360: 2005

PS: 1994, PS2: 2000, PS3: 2006

Think about how far graphic cards have come since 2005 and 2006.  The thing with PC games is that even if you do not have the latest video card, you can still play many of the games.  As the newer cards come out, the older cards get cheaper.  You can keep up with technology.  This allows developers to further explore new technologies.

We are about due for the next set of consoles, eh?  Then another 4-5 years, eh?

At the time of the X-Box 360/PS3, we had ATI X800-ATI X1900 and nVidia GF6xxx/GF7xxx.  ATI has gone through R600/R700 since then and R800s are coming out.  nVidia has gone through GF8xxx/GF9xxx/GTX1xx/GTX2xx and GTX3xx are on the way.

Why on earth would you want a MMORPG tied to console technology?

In some strange way the whole "PC is better than consoles" mentality is actually feeding into the RP value of this whole thing, as I can imagine that half-god, mightier then thou pod-pilots would feel the same way about the dust grunts :D

anyway I think it's brilliant and I really hope CCP does it the right way. There is way too little info for bitching out there, and I guess we will learn more about Dust, Sov changes, Ambulation and all the rest on the next fan fest, where as always CCP shells out the most solid info.

I think all of us should be happy that at least somebody in this cobweb marsh-stale genre, someone is trying to bring some decent steps forward.

If it doesn't come to pc and it takes off, I'd quit eve for good. And I'd try to get as many people off eve as possible too. This is too much. I hate consoles and now they are making one part of eve console based. I've been waiting a LOOONNNGG time for eve to feature planetside conflict and exploration, and I'm utterly infuriated that when my dreams finally did come true, its NOT going to be for me. My pod pilot can't cruise planetside and take part in this.

I can assure this is not just me rattling off without thinking, I've thought about this long and hard. Just my 0.02, I spoke to some people not all agree with me, but many t would like it on pc too. Can't they do what GTA did? PC and Xbox?

Originally posted by Xasapis

 I have no intention to buy a console for the forseable future. I guess I'll be left out from this innovation.

I personally despise console gamers. PC gaming FTW!!! But if you have BOTH a console and a PC, ur fine. No, ur not half a looser, its completely all right. However, console gamers are retards, wii are double retards.

WHY so harsh? Think about it. For the price of an xbox, you can soup up your old comp. Or replace it entirely. You're gona have to biy a comp anyway. But besides the price diff, if you play xbox only, you're probably an antisocial in terms of gaming considering mmo just doesnt happen on xbox... not yet.

---

Originally posted by Silver_Leaf
If it doesn't come to pc and it takes off, I'd quit eve for good. And I'd try to get as many people off eve as possible too. This is too much. I hate consoles and now they are making one part of eve console based. I've been waiting a LOOONNNGG time for eve to feature planetside conflict and exploration, and I'm utterly infuriated that when my dreams finally did come true, its NOT going to be for me. My pod pilot can't cruise planetside and take part in this.
I can assure this is not just me rattling off without thinking, I've thought about this long and hard. Just my 0.02, I spoke to some people not all agree with me, but many t would like it on pc too. Can't they do what GTA did? PC and Xbox?

---

May I have your stuff?

And your friend's too!!

Eve bores me to death, it is too slow to me and have too small player skill factor. Dust 514 would be interesting alternative for me, especially in times when many other MMOFPS games are going to flood the market. However lack of PC version is in my opinion huge mistake, not all of us see a point in buying a console.  

I am sorry... I feel that CCP has made a serious customer relations mistake here by not including their desktop players in this new expansion, especially if there is going to be interaction between the main game and the expansion. If there was no interaction between the two, then I would not have an issue here. This interaction would be a great selling point if one playing the main game also had access to the expansion without having to buy a whole new gaming platform. But with this interaction and not having a common platform that both parts of the game could be played on... that to me is a really big issue.

CCP has always come across as one of, if not the most, user friendly gaming companies out there. I have respected them as such and have said so many times on various forums. However, I feel this restricting Dust to a gaming platform completely different from than that of the main game is a big step backwards in this regards, and an insult to the current player base that has supported this game over the years. From a purely business perspective, perhaps this is not a bad move, and I can understand reasons for doing this... especially in trying to expand CCP's customer base. However, I put this move on the same level as when SWG made their major design change years back and saw a good portion of their player base walk away... including myself. Even though EvE Online will not loose much in the way of its player base in this business decision as SWG did, and I am sure CCP is counting on that (perhaps a little too confident and arrogant, but we shall see), I cannot help but think that this is going to leave a sour feeling in many of the EvE Online players.

The problem now is that CCP has made the decision and thus cannot change their course now. So we, as dedicated players, are either forced to buy a gaming platform we may not want to buy or be left out of a portion of the game. All I can say is 'thank you CCP!'... as also a PC FPS player, I will remember this. Unfortunately it is human nature that one can do a hundred things right, but people will only remember the one big thing one did wrong... and this is CCP's one big thing wrong for me.

Originally posted by LexStriker

I am sorry... I feel that CCP has made a serious customer relations mistake here by not including their desktop players in this new expansion...

They said definitely no PC version?

It's an EVE expansion now?

Originally posted by LynxJSA

Originally posted by LexStriker

I am sorry... I feel that CCP has made a serious customer relations mistake here by not including their desktop players in this new expansion...

 

They said definitely no PC version?

It's an EVE expansion now?

We only know what CCP said, which is :

Currently only working on a Console version

It will influence and interact with EVE Online, there is no real definition for this, but I look it as an expansion of the gameworld yes.

CCP always lead us to believe that one day we would get such an expansion, but inside the current game, not on consoles ...

Originally posted by LynxJSA

They said definitely no PC version?

It's an EVE expansion now?

Yes, in one interview, CCP said that it would be for the console only.

Because the new design concept will allow players from the main EvE Online game to hire players (called Marines) from the console game to conquer planets in the main EvE Universe, and that the outcome of those planet battles would be reflected in the conquests of the main game's solar systems... then I believe one would be able to call Dust an EvE Online expansion.

Originally posted by LexStriker

Originally posted by LynxJSA

They said definitely no PC version?

It's an EVE expansion now?

 

Yes, in one interview, CCP said that it would be for the console only.

Because the new design concept will allow players from the main EvE Online game to hire players (called Marines) from the console game to conquer planets in the main EvE Universe, and that the outcome of those planet battles would be reflected in the conquests of the main game's solar systems... then I believe one would be able to call the Dust an EvE Online expansion.

 

Hilmar actually did not say that there won't be a PC version. When asked about whether there will be one, he said that he can't comment on it right now. This probably means that there's a time-exclusive deal for the consoles, and there *will* be a PC version later on.

Look, I can of course see the beauty of all this. They are trying to innovate and they are trying to get more subs/cash. I really don't have a problem with that.

But I really think they went at it the wrong way.

1st of all, WIS is still not released nor do we have a release date, alot of current EVE players are / were waiting for that.

CCP also told us before that they would like to expand the game beyond the current space sim. They also told their plans, things like atmospheric flight, planetary interaction, RTS, mabye even a groundgame.

So alot of EVE players were looking forward to this end all be all Sci-Fi experience, adn patient as we are, we could wait years for that.

Then all of a sudden they tell us they have a FPS ground game, but it is not inside the current game, it is on consoles only, still it ties in with our current game and influences it ...

WIS still not released.

If they would have told us thay have a new game that integrates with EVE Online and consists of WIS + DUST and that you can play WIS and DUST also on consoles, then it would have been a completely different story.

By doing this, CCP begged for controversy, and alot of players that like, but even more that dislike it. It is like the poster above me, CCP has a very good track record, but now they made their 1st major mistake, if only because of bad PR.

"Now, instead of simply leaving it at that, the CCP developers have chosen to allow the two games to interact and affect one another, creating the illusion of a more vast and complete universe. If EVE were "real life," how often do you think that Pod Pilots would generally interact with Dust Soldiers? Their lives would be almost entirely separate, the things that they do and the ways that they do them would be completely different. Save for the occasional alliance / business arrangement, facilitated in the EVE universe by the game's new social networking programs and perhaps membership in the same corporation, their worlds are different. Why shouldn't their games be?"

I think that's a very sharp insight.  It didn't occur to me but it makes a crazy amount of sense.  However a seperate application available for the PC might well have the same effect but I definitely like the idea of a seperate product marketed to a different playerbase.

Way to fuck your existing player base CCP. I am a PC gamer not a console gamer and now if I want to play this game to it's full potential I have to go spend cash on a crap console? Screw that. I did not spend $6000 on machine just to turn around and spend more on a crap console.    

It's like any game putting out an expansion and only allowing half of the player base to play. I have always loved CCP for what they have done with EVE but now I have lost full respect. Who payed for the devopment of that new game CCP? It's easy, we have because you guys were a bunch of no name gamers before we made you what you are. GG CCP, GG. 

/rant 

Originally posted by LexStriker

I am sorry... I feel that CCP has made a serious customer relations mistake here by not including their desktop players in this new expansion, especially if there is going to be interaction between the main game and the expansion. If there was no interaction between the two, then I would not have an issue here. This interaction would be a great selling point if one playing the main game also had access to the expansion without having to buy a whole new gaming platform. But with this interaction and not having a common platform that both parts of the game could be played on... that to me is a really big issue.

CCP has always come across as one of, if not the most, user friendly gaming companies out there. I have respected them as such and have said so many times on various forums. However, I feel this restricting Dust to a gaming platform completely different from than that of the main game is a big step backwards in this regards, and an insult to the current player base that has supported this game over the years. From a purely business perspective, perhaps this is not a bad move, and I can understand reasons for doing this... especially in trying to expand CCP's customer base. However, I put this move on the same level as when SWG made their major design change years back and saw a good portion of their player base walk away... including myself. Even though EvE Online will not loose much in the way of its player base in this business decision as SWG did, and I am sure CCP is counting on that (perhaps a little too confident and arrogant, but we shall see), I cannot help but think that this is going to leave a sour feeling in many of the EvE Online players.

The problem now is that CCP has made the decision and thus cannot change their course now. So we, as dedicated players, are either forced to buy a gaming platform we may not want to buy or be left out of a portion of the game. All I can say is 'thank you CCP!'... as also a PC FPS player, I will remember this. Unfortunately it is human nature that one can do a hundred things right, but people will only remember the one big thing one did wrong... and this is CCP's one big thing wrong for me.

 

Thats interesting, but I don't see the insult involved. This ISN'T an expansion of Eve. Its a completely different game, that will have some second hand influence on it. We will have to see how it works out. I'm happy for them being able to expand their player base beyond the typical Eve demographic. I doubt most Eve players would have any real interest in a MMOFPS.

Picking a console for this new game wouldn't have been my choice(console FPS's in my experience are stiff, and not nearly as responsive as mouse and keyboard PC FPS's). But perhaps they are looking at different factors? I do know that the Asian suits have a phobia about PC games without some nonsense like GameGuard(one of the most intrusive and poorly coded apps I've seen for quite some time) embedded in their code base. Perhaps since consoles are relatively more "secure" that influenced their decision?

It has yet to be announced if consoles will remain the only platform that Dust 514 will run on. Perhaps they will go to PC later? In any event, consoles aren't that expensive these days. If you really want to play, perhaps you should pick one up? You would then have access to all of the nice console games for that platform as well.
 

Originally posted by Silver_Leaf

Originally posted by Xasapis

 I have no intention to buy a console for the forseable future. I guess I'll be left out from this innovation.

 

I personally despise console gamers. PC gaming FTW!!! But if you have BOTH a console and a PC, ur fine. No, ur not half a looser, its completely all right. However, console gamers are retards, wii are double retards.

 

WHY so harsh? Think about it. For the price of an xbox, you can soup up your old comp. Or replace it entirely. You're gona have to biy a comp anyway. But besides the price diff, if you play xbox only, you're probably an antisocial in terms of gaming considering mmo just doesnt happen on xbox... not yet.

FFXI was on Xbox and it was an MMO that ran for 5-6 years and it's still going. There actually making a new FF MMO due to the success of the first. Of course it was on PC, PS2 and Xbox360. Don't worry a lot of PC players have little knowledge of what consoles are capable of now days. Did you know that you can even use a keyboard and mouse with consoles now?

yeah that divide is pretty slim now days lol. Consoles generally experience less lag, less cheats, and less D/C's than PC's in many games now days.

I'd think PC gamers would see this as an endorsement of their elite status.  We're not Dirt Soldiers, we're Pod Pilots.  Let them suck gravity and hardship while we cruise around, eternally, in our cozy womblike podships far removed from the grit and grime and blood and sweat.  We're the aces.  They're just grunts, dogfaces, cannonfodder.*

*I say this as someone who may well pick up Dirt 514 and check it out on his beloved PS3.  I also say this as a PC gamer, and Eve Online vet, who's a bit wary of the online console community.  The difference between the kinds of chatter you run across in many PC MMOs and in online console games can be huge.  Keeping us at arms length from each other, and given our preexisting biases/temperments, might well play even more strongly into creating a believeable universe.  Look at any rivalry between service branches and you see something like this.

Originally posted by Wraithone

Originally posted by LexStriker

I am sorry... I feel that CCP has made a serious customer relations mistake here by not including their desktop players in this new expansion, especially if there is going to be interaction between the main game and the expansion. If there was no interaction between the two, then I would not have an issue here. This interaction would be a great selling point if one playing the main game also had access to the expansion without having to buy a whole new gaming platform. But with this interaction and not having a common platform that both parts of the game could be played on... that to me is a really big issue.

CCP has always come across as one of, if not the most, user friendly gaming companies out there. I have respected them as such and have said so many times on various forums. However, I feel this restricting Dust to a gaming platform completely different from than that of the main game is a big step backwards in this regards, and an insult to the current player base that has supported this game over the years. From a purely business perspective, perhaps this is not a bad move, and I can understand reasons for doing this... especially in trying to expand CCP's customer base. However, I put this move on the same level as when SWG made their major design change years back and saw a good portion of their player base walk away... including myself. Even though EvE Online will not loose much in the way of its player base in this business decision as SWG did, and I am sure CCP is counting on that (perhaps a little too confident and arrogant, but we shall see), I cannot help but think that this is going to leave a sour feeling in many of the EvE Online players.

The problem now is that CCP has made the decision and thus cannot change their course now. So we, as dedicated players, are either forced to buy a gaming platform we may not want to buy or be left out of a portion of the game. All I can say is 'thank you CCP!'... as also a PC FPS player, I will remember this. Unfortunately it is human nature that one can do a hundred things right, but people will only remember the one big thing one did wrong... and this is CCP's one big thing wrong for me.

 

 

Thats interesting, but I don't see the insult involved. This ISN'T an expansion of Eve. Its a completely different game, that will have some second hand influence on it. We will have to see how it works out. I'm happy for them being able to expand their player base beyond the typical Eve demographic. I doubt most Eve players would have any real interest in a MMOFPS.

Picking a console for this new game wouldn't have been my choice(console FPS's in my experience are stiff, and not nearly as responsive as mouse and keyboard PC FPS's). But perhaps they are looking at different factors? I do know that the Asian suits have a phobia about PC games without some nonsense like GameGuard(one of the most intrusive and poorly coded apps I've seen for quite some time) embedded in their code base. Perhaps since consoles are relatively more "secure" that influenced their decision?

It has yet to be announced if consoles will remain the only platform that Dust 514 will run on. Perhaps they will go to PC later? In any event, consoles aren't that expensive these days. If you really want to play, perhaps you should pick one up? You would then have access to all of the nice console games for that platform as well.
 

That seems to be where the communication break down is. EvE players are treating this like an EvE expansion when it's nothing like that. It's a completely seperate game with seperate mechanics that will interact with EvE in a limited way. It's funny really lol. These very people are accussing CCP of getting greedy and stabbing there player base in the back then shouting "Give it to me Free on PC or I quit!" .

This really does represent a step into the next frontier for MMOs.

Right now everyone in the virtual world is playing it more or less the same way. We all have the same mechanics and all have the same set of roles. What this does is open the world to take another portion of the game that's been automated and add in a new type of gameplay.

This could be big, or it could flop.

"4players.de has talked to Petursson after the show, asking why there will be no PC-Version. Petursson smiled and stated, that he cannot comment on it right now. The only thing he can say at the moment is that there will be a console version."