I mean where has all this shit come from? other then left field...i mean wtf.

Because the quest grind games have ruined the MMO community imo.... Quest grind MMOs are geared toward soloers.

Originally posted by aleos

I mean where has all this shit come from? other then left field...i mean wtf.

At a complete guess, TOR.

Bioware have recently stated that they're not aiming the game towards hardcore players, but catering to a far more casual/solo crowd. This resulted in an outcry from the hardcore minorities like the raiding "elite"  and an ensuing backlash from the soloers who are annoyed that the raiders are attempting to subvert the nature of the first real solo-oriented game into yet another raiding loot-ladder.

Couple be completely wrong, but I've seen quite a few solo-vs-group discussions spring from it.

Because the hardcore have once again realized:   "OMG people are playing games for a difffernt reason than me.... again!?!?!"

Originally posted by Ilvaldyr

Originally posted by aleos

I mean where has all this shit come from? other then left field...i mean wtf.

At a complete guess, TOR.

Bioware have recently stated that they're not aiming the game towards hardcore players, but catering to a far more casual/solo crowd. This resulted in an outcry from the hardcore minorities like the raiding "elite"  and an ensuing backlash from the soloers who are annoyed that the raiders are attempting to subvert the nature of the first real solo-oriented game into yet another raiding loot-ladder.

Couple be completely wrong, but I've seen quite a few solo-vs-group discussions spring from it.

One of the reasons I'm looking forward to SWTOR. Besides being a fan of Bioware and the Knights of the Old Republic games, that is.

Cause soloers are sucking the "MMO" out of mmorpg's.

Seriously i play these games for the sole purpose of playing with others,

but when you start gearing mmo's towards the solo crowd, your left with another bland, uninteresting, trashy mmo (more like single player rpg) that belongs in a shitter hole.

I wanna have the choice in games to do solo content also. Since I dont wanna play with others 24/7. I like pvp and grouping also but not all the time. So I am not crying about solo stuff, I like that you have the choice.

"Originally posted by Wolfenpride

Cause soloers are sucking the "MMO" out of mmorpg's.

Seriously i play these games for the sole purpose of playing with others,

but when you start gearing mmo's towards the solo crowd, your left with another bland, uninteresting, trashy mmo (more like single player rpg) that belongs in a shitter hole."

Can't really say this any better.

This is what daoc (and many other mmos) did well at its release you could solo , but it was by far better to group. I personally love the quest systems that have developed after daoc (wow, etc.), however, they are by no means better than GROUPING  up to grind out exp on mobs. the interaction between people is far better than easy solo quests.

So if i made a mmo you bet their be questing, and what not, but most of the mobs would be camps and you would get better exp and equal equipment from just grindign away at camps that require you to have at least 3-6 people to take, and you better believe group size would be 8-10.

An interestign thing was healers in daoc never just healed, they also cc'ed, or gave massive buffs that was REAL dps or tanking not a weak 1-5% but a nice 20-50% increase.

Originally posted by Wolfenpride

Cause soloers are sucking the "MMO" out of mmorpg's.

A game with millions of soloers is still an MMO - there are, you will notice, massive amounts of players online.  Nothing whatsoever in the title says anything about grouping.  Group if you want to, and best of luck to you, but would you people PLEASE stop whining - it's getting embarrassing now.

Originally posted by Wolfenpride

Cause soloers are sucking the "MMO" out of mmorpg's.

Seriously i play these games for the sole purpose of playing with others,

but when you start gearing mmo's towards the solo crowd, your left with another bland, uninteresting, trashy mmo (more like single player rpg) that belongs in a shitter hole.

You are playing with others. There are a few thousand people on each server and you're playing with all of them. That's what MMO stands for.

Moreover, if you think that "MMO" stands only for group play, you're the one who's sucking the "MMO" out of MMORPGs.

Personal opinion: It's not the soloers that suck the MMO out of the MMORPG; it's the raiders that suck out the RPG.

Could have something to do with how they finaly realized how much companies don't give a rat's ass about people that don't want to raid.

Originally posted by Wolfenpride

Cause soloers are sucking the "MMO" out of mmorpg's.

Seriously i play these games for the sole purpose of playing with others,

but when you start gearing mmo's towards the solo crowd, your left with another bland, uninteresting, trashy mmo (more like single player rpg) that belongs in a shitter hole.

I have been playing MMO's form EQ days. As i get older i have more things to do and less time to "Group" up in a MMO for hours to kill a boss. After having a child i find myself more and more into the solo game SO WHEN I HAVE TIME i'm still high lvl and can "Group" with others. GET OVER IT !!!. Not everyone lives with their parents and have no job ! (not aming at you but.....)

Originally posted by patrikd23

I wanna have the choice in games to do solo content also. Since I dont wanna play with others 24/7. I like pvp and grouping also but not all the time. So I am not crying about solo stuff, I like that you have the choice.

That's fine. But what if I want to group with someone and the only other players on my server that are my level are content to just solo away? Doesn't seem like much of a choice to me.

Originally posted by Palebane

Originally posted by patrikd23

I wanna have the choice in games to do solo content also. Since I dont wanna play with others 24/7. I like pvp and grouping also but not all the time. So I am not crying about solo stuff, I like that you have the choice.

That's fine. But what if I want to group with someone and the only other players on my server that are my level are content to just solo away? Doesn't seem like much of a choice to me.

At that point, you have to ask yourself: If I'm the only person who wants to group, why is my preference more important than that of every other player who doesn't?

In this situation, you can still solo yourself. It might not be entirely to your preference, but you can still play and have fun. That option would be removed if the situation were reversed.

remember lineage 2 back 5 years ago? 1 hour+ getting ready gathering enough people. boring and sleepy. standing still do nothing but chit chat till enough people.

im not into that stuff. i dont have patient.

 I can't help but agree with the notion, even if it is somewhat inaccurate, that the pro-solo play MMO's are destroying the genre.

In general, I look at the lack of community in most of the modern day MMO's, and it just causes me to shake my head in disbelief. The last several MMO's I have played have had a very dismal, weak community (Age of Conan, Vanguard, Warhammer Online). Most people are so focused on just advancing their own character's gear that they forget that there are other people in the world to mingle with. When I played these games, the only reason people spoke was if 1) They were in the same area as me, and needed to team up to complete a quest, 2) If someone was lost/had a question on directions to a place/questgiver, or 3) If there was someone talking trash in the regional chat.

I personally attribute a lot of it to the fact that everything is solo-capable these days. Want raid-class gear? Solo/small group some tough mobs. Want exp? Turn in some delivery quests on your own for a large exp + item reward. Since grouping seems to be a strategy of the past, it seems people rarely opt for the partying experience these days.

Now maybe I'm just too old and crabby for the genre, but I enjoyed the days of sitting around in SWG at the camp sites while we all mended our injuries to the dancer, just interacting and socializing with other players in the world. I liked grouping in FFXI, where the same 6 of us would hack-and-slash at crabs for hours at a time, making fun of how the Clippers were far greater than the Snippers, or which Goblin was easy prey, and which one would whip your tail.

While I am not a person who loathes the idea of being able to get things done on your own... I have yet to see a game company succeed at doing it properly. Most MMO's are so simplistic these days... it's just a matter of slow-and-steady wins the race. I suppose you could classify me as a bit of a hardcore in my outlook on the way a game should be played, but that's not because I have a self-loathing complex or anything. It's more that, when I take a look at the MMO's that are coming out nowadays in comparison to the ones that came out back in the day... well, I will choose the older games any day of the year.

Honestly though, community is the most underrated aspect of every MMO on the market these days, and it's painful to see developer after developer overlook this critical factor time and time again.

Originally posted by Wolfenpride

Cause soloers are sucking the "MMO" out of mmorpg's.

Seriously i play these games for the sole purpose of playing with others,

but when you start gearing mmo's towards the solo crowd, your left with another bland, uninteresting, trashy mmo (more like single player rpg) that belongs in a shitter hole.

Nope, I see it the other way - hardcore, elitists SUCKED the life out of MMo's, almost to the point of extinction.

MMO's turned around when someone decided that you do not have to play 12 hours a day to keep up.

Originally posted by aleos

I mean where has all this shit come from? other then left field...i mean wtf.

NOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!

Why did you do post this?! Don't you realize that they were about to shut up about it?!! And then you come along and... and...

GAWD I hate you so fuckin' much right now!!!!

as i said the last time this thread is becoming an exercise in futility.  so in the long run does anyone really care.