Actually, this seems to be a huge issue with Gamestop in particular. I notice they ONLY carry PC games that sell. They have been phasing PC games out of the stores for alot in the past few years. It annoys the snot out of me personally. I have to go to Best Buy to see a good selection of retail PC choices and that is usually only the more recent stuff. May want to check them out though.

To be honest this is a great game i played it for 3 years. The item mall they put in to the game is NOT ruining the game since they are bound to 2 servers. And it lets others sell there toons once they quit. Most ppl dont play because  of the 15 a month or the fact that as i hear alot "its a WoW clone" Even though it was released way befor WoW lol. Sure its run by SOE the company that ruins all the games it touches but still a fun game.

Yes it is a fun game. I got TSO at best buy and agree that gamestop isnt the place go go for pc games. the one in my area has a few but i didnt see more than one copy of anything and the selection was small. but honestly even at best buy TSO wasnt on the shelves long, once what they had was gone i guess they never reordered.

My reasons for not liking EQ2 are as follows:

1. Hate the class system. It honestly feels like most classes are very similar. Troubador and Dirge felt very similar, Warlock and Conjuror felt too much alike. Wizard and Warlock felt the same, just with a different role. Paladin and Shadowknight felt too similar, and all the scout classes felt the same minus the assassin and ranger starting the fight(solo) with arrow attacks.

I played so many of the classes to 20+ and didn't feel like any of them were unique except the Monk and the Conjuror/Necromancer.

2. The graphics/art style. It's abysmal imo. I can't stand the graphics, there's nothing to look forward to on a cool factor, everyone looks the same and the armor/characters look atrocious. Note...this is MY opinion.

3. The beginning of the game was empty, there wasn't anyone to do quests with, all the times I tried the game(4-5 times) I couldn't ever find a group to do anything, very frustrating.

4. No matter how good my computer, I couldn't run the game worth a dang. I had a single core, could barely run the game. I had a dual core, game still ran like crap, I get a quad core, with top of the line video card and 4 gigs of RAM, the game STILL runs like crap. Every other game I play runs flawlessly. Honestly, I can't stand how badly the game plays, so I refuse to play it for this reason.(Yes, I did make sure "multi-core support" was checked.)

Those are my reasons. I'm sure its a great game, but thosew ere my issues with it, which to me, are very big issues.

Originally posted by DoomsDay01

Originally posted by Guillermo197

Sorry, but this is from the first 1-2 years. So much has changed since then. It's not even funny.

There were only 2 adventure packs released and are now made free since a long long time ago already.

Station Exchange caused luckily an uproar so they kept it to seperate new servers. Can't say it's a real success really.

Altho I hate Station Cash and the way it was stealth patched in. So far it indeed seems to be fluff crap. And they going to use it for Paid Character transfer services, expansion sale, char renaming (already in), character appearance change (already in) and such.

The game has more content and features then any other MMO out there to date.

The reason not more people are playing this good game (to answer the OP) is because SOE TOTALLY SUCKS at Marketing. Always have and always will.

Cheers

 

What?  EQ1 is getting what, Their 16th expansion this fall? Sorry, I disagree with that statement completely. EQ2 has a long road ahead of them before they can match eq1 in content.

And SOE does not suck at marketing, that is one of their best abilities, what they suck at is game management. They dont listen to their customers and think they know what is better for their customers than the customers do. That is where they totally suck. Look at all their games, EQ1 and EQ2 is now EQeasy. Matrix is gone, SWG is a fraction of what it once was and not because of its age, Vanguard I wont blame on them as it was already in trouble when they got it. The rest of their games are just indicative of how the company handles game management, boring and uninteresting. One day, when they actually get people who really know how to run a game in management, we will see them come back to a higher status. Until then, they will remain as SOE sucks.

We are talking about games released since 2004!!! Tjeez. And from that period, EQ2 provides easily the most content and features to date.

Ofcourse (and I sincerly hope) that games released in the end 90's like EQ1 has more content by now or it wouldn't be up and running anymore now would it?? But hardly any new player is going to jump on a heavily outdated game released 10 years ago.

SOE sucks at Marketing! Period!

Except of old EQ1 fans, hardly anyone here in Europe knows about SOE (including gamestores employees)! There isn't a single box of any SOE game available in the prominent stores.

Here in Oslo we got dozens of Gamestop stores and they have not a single SOE product in the shelves, while boxes from like WoW, FFXI, LOTRO (and its expansion), CoX, Guild Wars, etc, etc are prominent on display.

That's easy 100-200k potential subs for EQ2 out of the window. Extra subs they could have had along the years if they bothered to look outside their US borders!!

I definitely agree that EQ2 has by far the most content and overall features than recent mmos over the last 5 years or so.  Easily.  I don't play it anymore but I'll give it its due.

I will say, however, that they really failed to implement the game lore in a gripping or interesting fashion that makes you feel a part of the world.  The game ends up being, for the most part, just your generic quest lines that revolve around whatever current town or quest hub area you're dealing with and their problems with creatures and so forth.  No real overarching story or interesting tales, at least to me.  The books were about as much lore as you're going to get.  Some of the heritage quests were good though.

Originally posted by Guillermo197

Originally posted by DoomsDay01

Originally posted by Guillermo197

Sorry, but this is from the first 1-2 years. So much has changed since then. It's not even funny.

There were only 2 adventure packs released and are now made free since a long long time ago already.

Station Exchange caused luckily an uproar so they kept it to seperate new servers. Can't say it's a real success really.

Altho I hate Station Cash and the way it was stealth patched in. So far it indeed seems to be fluff crap. And they going to use it for Paid Character transfer services, expansion sale, char renaming (already in), character appearance change (already in) and such.

The game has more content and features then any other MMO out there to date.

The reason not more people are playing this good game (to answer the OP) is because SOE TOTALLY SUCKS at Marketing. Always have and always will.

Cheers

 

What?  EQ1 is getting what, Their 16th expansion this fall? Sorry, I disagree with that statement completely. EQ2 has a long road ahead of them before they can match eq1 in content.

And SOE does not suck at marketing, that is one of their best abilities, what they suck at is game management. They dont listen to their customers and think they know what is better for their customers than the customers do. That is where they totally suck. Look at all their games, EQ1 and EQ2 is now EQeasy. Matrix is gone, SWG is a fraction of what it once was and not because of its age, Vanguard I wont blame on them as it was already in trouble when they got it. The rest of their games are just indicative of how the company handles game management, boring and uninteresting. One day, when they actually get people who really know how to run a game in management, we will see them come back to a higher status. Until then, they will remain as SOE sucks.

 

We are talking about games released since 2004!!! Tjeez. And from that period, EQ2 provides easily the most content and features to date.

Ofcourse (and I sincerly hope) that games released in the end 90's like EQ1 has more content by now or it wouldn't be up and running anymore now would it?? But hardly any new player is going to jump on a heavily outdated game released 10 years ago.

SOE sucks at Marketing! Period!

Except of old EQ1 fans, hardly anyone here in Europe knows about SOE (including gamestores employees)! There isn't a single box of any SOE game available in the prominent stores.

Here in Oslo we got dozens of Gamestop stores and they have not a single SOE product in the shelves, while boxes from like WoW, FFXI, LOTRO (and its expansion), CoX, Guild Wars, etc, etc are prominent on display.

That's easy 100-200k potential subs for EQ2 out of the window. Extra subs they could have had along the years if they bothered to look outside their US borders!!

 

I love you Guillermo197 <3333 and i couldn't agree more :D

The game is called "Everquest" for a reason, it's not all about one giant story-line, it's about many many many stories and events that come together, both big and small. And I think this game handles that well.

If I want to jump into this game...what do I have to buy? I see the Shadow Odyssey expansion and it says it contains all the previous expansions but I assume I need to buy the game itself seperately. Is that the box with the elf pointing a sword at you on the cover? So those two are all I need?

I see there's a digital download but I'm one of those people that likes to have the disc and the manual.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions.
 

No, newest expansion pack = everything you need to play (and to unlock everything)

Originally posted by Guillermo197 

We are talking about games released since 2004!!! Tjeez. And from that period, EQ2 provides easily the most content and features to date.

Ofcourse (and I sincerly hope) that games released in the end 90's like EQ1 has more content by now or it wouldn't be up and running anymore now would it?? But hardly any new player is going to jump on a heavily outdated game released 10 years ago.

SOE sucks at Marketing! Period!

Except of old EQ1 fans, hardly anyone here in Europe knows about SOE (including gamestores employees)! There isn't a single box of any SOE game available in the prominent stores.

Here in Oslo we got dozens of Gamestop stores and they have not a single SOE product in the shelves, while boxes from like WoW, FFXI, LOTRO (and its expansion), CoX, Guild Wars, etc, etc are prominent on display.

That's easy 100-200k potential subs for EQ2 out of the window. Extra subs they could have had along the years if they bothered to look outside their US borders!!

 

EQ2 does not provide the most features of mmos.  It completely lacks pvp worth mentioning which puts it into one of the smaller featured mmos.  It doesn't matter what you, I or the next person thinks, because pvp is an important feature for many people as can be seen by just about every other game on the market.  I can't think of any pve only games that are feature rich or subscriber heavy.  PvP is a far larger part of gaming than instanced housing or some other fluff.  

The quantity of expansions for the game isn't a strong point either.  When the president of the company has to promise to slow down expansions so that quality gets better that says something.

As for soe sucks at marketing, I think you are wrong.  Soe is actually pretty good at marketing and they put out some of the more impressive trailers that I have ever seen.  However that does not give them power to force stores to carry their product.  Stores stock items that sell and if they are not stocking EQ2 it is because the game does not sell.  It is as simple as that.  Soe marketing cannot force stores to carry their products. 

If it was as simple as advertising the game a little bit to increase income by more than was spent on marketing, don't you think they would be doing that?  What would possibly make you think they don't understand that?  Everyone keeps saying "if soe would market their games more people would play them" as if it is some concept that has escaped the attention of soe marketing.  Has it ever occured to anyone that they have stopped marketing, because it has not proven financially viable?  That marketing the games has not had the intended effect of increasing subs, let alone by the numbers people speculate here?

Originally posted by socrates656

Been playing mmo's for 10 years. Played wow for 4 1/2 years. Quit wow because the game is retarded now

Everquest  2 is 10x better then it was before. Why are not more people playing this game? This game is so much better then World of Warcraft in almost every single way.

- More things too do in Eq2 then wow, when you play eq2 you will always have somthing too do. You dont just to have to quest and lvl up all the time.

- Better crafting system

- Better character creation

- Better class system

- Better gameplay

- Better questing system

- Better achievments system

- Player Housing

- More game lore

- Books that you can actually learn stuff about and get special attacks when completing the quests they you get from the books

- Better achievments system then wow, more indepth

- Better talent tree's

 

I could list many more things. So my question is... what the hell is wrong with gamers now a days? Why do more people play wow? what the hell is wrong with gamers? do they like to play shitty games or what?

Well  TBO  the reason more play wow is simple  it can be played on low end systems that can not what so ever run eq2 and this has always been true. I personally got eq2 at release and couldnt play on my P3  1.6  Cpu   But i ran wow just fine  two years after i got a new system that could handle eq2 with out any problems and i quit wow and never looked back.  I was in japan and was in a internet cafe and all the people were playing wow and i ask why all the wow fan bois the person at the counter simply stated that there machines couldnt hand eq2 either so thats why wow is so popular there also.
 

It's too bad alot of people don't like EQ2 simply, because of SOE, or because it has a item mall. I really think EQ2 has alot more to offer then most of the MMO's on the market right now. I have beta tested alot of upcomming MMO's this year and must say most of them don't even compare to this game at all. There are so many things you can do in this game, and there is so much content in it, it's just plain rediculas. And what I like about it is that you don't have to just sit and quest and lvl all the time, there is simply so many things differn't things too do. I havin't had as much fun playing a MMO like this since the original Starwars Galaxies.

It's too bad SOE is so bad at marketing, because if they would of treated their customers better in the past, their previous customers who they treated unfairly could see how much of a great game EQ2 has become since it's original release in 2004. There has been so many things added into EQ2 it's just plain retarded, and I don't think I'll be getting bored of it anytime soon.

Originally posted by Daffid011

Originally posted by Guillermo197 

We are talking about games released since 2004!!! Tjeez. And from that period, EQ2 provides easily the most content and features to date.

EQ2 does not provide the most features of mmos.  It completely lacks pvp worth mentioning which puts it into one of the smaller featured mmos.  It doesn't matter what you, I or the next person thinks, because pvp is an important feature for many people as can be seen by just about every other game on the market. 

The quantity of expansions for the game isn't a strong point either.  When the president of the company has to promise to slow down expansions so that quality gets better that says something.

 *edit* Reponse to Guillermo197:

It doesn't even come close to the most features or content.

*edit* Response to Daffid011
 

The standard accepted number for the MMO industry is that 10% of the market is PvP.  I'd also challenge you to list the western based MMO's that have meaningful pvp and had a higher subscription base than EQ2...  Other than WoW which I'm not sure I see as meaningful pvp.  Lack of PvP entirely would not give a game the smallest feature set...  Tho I suppose size of feature set has nothing to do with total subscribers (I think the thread was about .. the amount of people playing the game).

I like pvp but that is a pretty odd point of view as to why EQ2 is in the state its in.  UO certainly had some of the best PvP in my opinion and its peak of all time was 250,000 subscribers and that was after AoS (what I consider the worst expansion UO ever had when I was still playing..) aka it came after trammel etc

I'm not sure about a general mass perception on the EQ2 expansions.  DoF was probably fine but there was a combat revamp put in there that was not a good choice.. and a lot of people quit then.  However, it wasn't due to the expansion it was due to the moronic combat revamp.  KoS and EoF for the most part were "ok" and well done.  RoK came along with another drop off in developer quality.. as we got all the healer stats put on Leather quest rewards.  Which screwed over Chain/Plate healers and Brawlers.  As there to this day in the "RoK" quest lines a severe lack of Brawler rewards (almost all the leather is healer spec'd).  They did add new quests in recently to these zones so that may have improved but those quests weren't part of the expansion.  TSO is probably the worst expansion so far...

The next expansion is going out the door in Feb with a level cap raise to 90.  So they seem to be on about the same speed of expansion releases they have always had for EQ2...

I tried to do a search for for the "slow down expansions comment" and I can't find it.. so I can't really say one way or the other.  As a still semi active EQ2 player I've never heard reference to that comment about EQ2 expansions release slow down.

EQ2 like many MMO's is a victim of its own development team and design decisions made.

Look back at the archived discussions about various major changes to the game and then look at the various time lines for server mergers for EQ2... You will find a pretty direct and obvious connection.

After all these years developers have still not figured out when you completely change the game people buy... there is a pretty high percentage they will no longer play it.  The only real chance to keep them.. is if the game they bought wasn't the one you advertised...

I don't think the expansions were the problem.  They had some bad re-design choices here and there.  Then around when RoK was released we saw a drop off in developer quality )

The current class developer.. is also one of the most clueless people I have ever seen on a design team.  Luckily the game director came in and dumped his "Tank Overhaul" so they didn't have the same outcome as his Ranger revamp.  (I don't play a tank or a scout .. but when you see a really bad/stupid idea.. you don't have to play the class.  I play a healer ... if it matters).

*edited* to make it clear what was in reponse to who.

Originally posted by DoomsDay01

I have played EQ2 a couple of times and the same thing always gets me about that game. I do not like the fact that you have to purchase your spells from other players. Sure you can get apprentice versions from npc's but lets face it, without adapts most of the powers sucked and you could barely function for your class. The other part that really ticked me off about that was how overpriced the adapts where. Sure there were a few classes that could adapts cheaply but for most of the people playing it was very hard to afford your spells. It was a catch 22, people didnt want you in their groups if you didnt have certain spells at adapt levels yet these are the same people that put the adapts up for a level 10 person at several gold a piece.

Me and a buddy of mine went back and played  last year. he played a swashbuckler and I played a warden. It was night and day for the costs of our spells. He was able to buy adapts of every single power he had up to level 20 and none of them ever cost him more than 50-60 silver and that was when he was near 20 and heck, even when he was up in the 40's his costs still only got to a couple of gold per spell. My wardens powers were costing me several gold a spell before I even got to 10. there were lots of spells I couldn't buy simply because I couldn't afford them.

I hated this model when they put it in EQ1 after the first expansion. I dont mind having to travel around to vendors to get my spells and I dont mind if I have to do some quests to get them, but having them as random drops off of mobs so that people can sell them is just wrong. I had 2 chars that made it to around 60 and a couple that was in the mid 30's. I can honestly say that I never had more than 2 or 3 spells ever drop for my own class and as for master drops, I got 3 total master drops combined with all my characters and yes I know they were supposed to be rare but thats still crazy. Im sorry, there is just no way anyone can justify this type of spell drop system. I still remember my first character (a cleric) that saw his first adapt spell (a level 2 spell) that was selling for 10 gold. This was right at the start of the game. Nobody had 10 gold. Heck I was in the mid teens before I actually had more than 5 gold to my name. Sorry, I just can not play a game like that any more. I am surprised that I lasted as long as I did considering how bad I hated it in eq1. I will say though, I will never play another mmo that has that type of a spell drop system again. Its just not worth the frustration.

 

Making money was stupid easy if you knew how.

All you had to do was sell collectible items, even some of the low level ones in Antonica or Commonlands and WC and so forth could go for up to a plat (sometimes a bit more) each, and usually they went for at least a few gold.

Originally posted by Daffid011

EQ2 does not provide the most features of mmos.  It completely lacks pvp worth mentioning which puts it into one of the smaller featured mmos.  It doesn't matter what you, I or the next person thinks, because pvp is an important feature for many people as can be seen by just about every other game on the market.  I can't think of any pve only games that are feature rich or subscriber heavy.  PvP is a far larger part of gaming than instanced housing or some other fluff.  

The quantity of expansions for the game isn't a strong point either.  When the president of the company has to promise to slow down expansions so that quality gets better that says something.

As for soe sucks at marketing, I think you are wrong.  Soe is actually pretty good at marketing and they put out some of the more impressive trailers that I have ever seen.  However that does not give them power to force stores to carry their product.  Stores stock items that sell and if they are not stocking EQ2 it is because the game does not sell.  It is as simple as that.  Soe marketing cannot force stores to carry their products. 

If it was as simple as advertising the game a little bit to increase income by more than was spent on marketing, don't you think they would be doing that?  What would possibly make you think they don't understand that?  Everyone keeps saying "if soe would market their games more people would play them" as if it is some concept that has escaped the attention of soe marketing.  Has it ever occured to anyone that they have stopped marketing, because it has not proven financially viable?  That marketing the games has not had the intended effect of increasing subs, let alone by the numbers people speculate here?

 

 

What is it with PVP?? When do you people understand that EverQuest 2 was never meant to be a PVP game! Just like it's predecesor EverQuest 1.

That they later put up 2 PVP servers, because some vocal minority requested it. Fine. No problem with that. But the classes aren't balanced for PVP and never will. Simply, because it's PVE game. And the focus will always be there. Period. Get over it.

And YES, YES and more YES! SOE does SUCK at Marketing.

They only promote their games within the US. That's all.

There is no need to force stores to display your product. If you don't bother to distribute any of your games outside US, then you don't need to be a rocket scientist to figure out that basically every prominent store isn't gonna bother to pay heavily to import your game boxes themselves. So far only online stores like Amazon.co.uk and Amazon.de does this.

Gamestop USA has SOE games on the shelves, but Gamestop Europe doesn't have a single box on display. Simply because SOE has no European distribution of their games.

I have seen plenty of games on the shelves that do far worse then EverQuest2, EverQuest1. Hell... I still ran into boxes of Tabula Rasa and Hellgate: London in some stores ROFL. While these games have already been shut down.

Hence, they basically don't give a damn about non-US customers. If we have to use phone support, we are forced to make very expensive phonecalls, as there is only a US number.

Also, you don't want to know how long we European players had to complain and spam the EQ2 forums to get our 2 EU servers moved to Europe to get acceptable PING's.

Then we had to complain and spam the forums for almost 2 years, before they changed the maintainance windows for the EU servers outside our Prime Time hours!

You can put it all you want. SOE just sucks at Marketing and basically any customer care outside US! And they always have.

With all due respect, you live in the US. So you don't know what you are talking about.

Cheers

I personally enjoy Vanguard more than EQII.  IMO it is more of what the EQ replacement should have been than EQII.

Originally posted by Guillermo197 

What is it with PVP?? When do you people understand that EverQuest 2 was never meant to be a PVP game! Just like it's predecesor EverQuest 1.

Yes I understand the EQ2 was not designed for pvp, which also has zero bearing on what I said.  Not having pvp is lacking a feature and one that many people seem to consider a very large feature by the looks of other games.   Perhaps there are numberous other features in EQ2 that I am not aware of, but people who tend to make claims of how awesome this game is and how many more features it offers never really seem to qualify those comments.  Pointing at the lack of pvp easily shows a large void in the game in comparison to other mmos on the market. 

It doesn't matter why it doesn't have something, because that was not the reason it was brought up. 
 

As for your marketing claims, I'll just say this.  Gamestop US hardly carries any PC titles worth mentioning in their strores.  You can find plenty online or even listed as "available" in the store, but what is actually on the shleves is drastically different.  I don't think that has anything to do with soe, but more about gamestop stocking a small selection of pc titles in their brick and mortar stores.  

Some people think there are hordes of potential customers waiting to play eq2 if only soe would market the game.  History has shown they tried and I think this thread reflects the results. I don't think soe is to stupid to miss truckloads of easy money if only they would market a little bit.  Saying things like that really glosses over a lot of real issues. 

Originally posted by Daffid011

Originally posted by Guillermo197 

What is it with PVP?? When do you people understand that EverQuest 2 was never meant to be a PVP game! Just like it's predecesor EverQuest 1.

 

Yes I understand the EQ2 was not designed for pvp, which also has zero bearing on what I said.  Not having pvp is lacking a feature and one that many people seem to consider a very large feature by the looks of other games.   Perhaps there are numberous other features in EQ2 that I am not aware of, but people who tend to make claims of how awesome this game is and how many more features it offers never really seem to qualify those comments.  Pointing at the lack of pvp easily shows a large void in the game in comparison to other mmos on the market. 

 

It doesn't matter why it doesn't have something, because that was not the reason it was brought up. 
 

 

As for your marketing claims, I'll just say this.  Gamestop US hardly carries any PC titles worth mentioning in their strores.  You can find plenty online or even listed as "available" in the store, but what is actually on the shleves is drastically different.  I don't think that has anything to do with soe, but more about gamestop stocking a small selection of pc titles in their brick and mortar stores.  

Some people think there are hordes of potential customers waiting to play eq2 if only soe would market the game.  History has shown they tried and I think this thread reflects the results. I don't think soe is to stupid to miss truckloads of easy money if only they would market a little bit.  Saying things like that really glosses over a lot of real issues. 

 

It's funny that you talk about PVP in EQ2 being terrible. I'm actually on the pvp server for Everquest 2 and it's one of the most popular severs in the game. I agree the PVP in Everquest 2 could be alot better, but I think alot of the things you have said in this thread are pretty ignorant, because most of what you saying is just your opinion. You don't even state any facts to prove your point. And who's to say that SOE have not had bad marketing in the past. Have you ever heard of a guy named John Smedley? John Smedley is President and CEO of Sony Online Entertainment and is a very good example of someone with very bad marketing skills in the past. Do some of your own research and look what he did with Sony's previous games.

To say too Guillermo197 that the marketing is doing well in europe when clearly you don't even live there how do you think you know? how could you know? I don't even know that, because I don't live there! You live in the United States. I live in canada, and I must say I hardly see any EQ2 games on sell in any of the stores here. As a matter of fact the only way I could purchase the game was to get it online. Not to say SOE is bad at marketing, but it does raise some questions. This isn't one or two stores were talking about here, this is alot of stores that should be carrying this product, but it's few and far between compared to Blizzards World of Warcraft. I can get WoW anywere I want too, at any store, and why can't I find any Everquest games, at any stores? I'm not in a small city eather. I'm in Edmonton, Alberta.

You also, talk about history.. well maybe you should do a little research of your own on the history of Sony Online Entertainment, because frankly you are very misinformed Daffid011
 

-> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Online_Entertainment

-> http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/02/21/tech/gamecore/main1335511.shtml

-> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Smedley_(developer)

Originally posted by NovaKayne

I personally enjoy Vanguard more than EQII.  IMO it is more of what the EQ replacement should have been than EQII.

 

 

I couldnt agree more. Vanguard is a great game. I was thinking about comming back too it soon.