Originally posted by elderotter

no, but sometimes I make note of which shoe company makes the shoes I like more often than not.

and well.. I dont.

Maybe the example as now cleared it up.

I usually notice the brand of shoe a week or so after I buy it :)

I do think Av needs to think about there image more though! i mean look at the reaction the new star wars game gets, "it's bioware so it will be good" so people do take notice of companys behind games and AV should work hard to rebuild thier rep, if it's not too late :)

I hope other smaller company's dont think twice about trying due to the frenzied hate that AV recieve. Otherwise we all lose!

Originally posted by shukes33

I do think Av needs to think about there image more though! i mean look at the reaction the new star wars game gets, "it's bioware so it will be good" so people do take notice of companys behind games and AV should work hard to rebuild thier rep, if it's not too late :)

I hope other smaller company's dont think twice about trying due to the frenzied hate that AV recieve. Otherwise we all lose!

I am not saying people dont watch companies and it doesnt affect the bottom line. In fact, its so common place I think most gaming companies should create two seperate forums subjects (the game, the company) and I am sure if they did on almost all sites "the company" would have more posts than "the game".

I am just saying I dont care about that and I judge a game based on the game itself.

that was the point of the orginal thread.

Have fun "company trolling"

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by Fariic

 

There is just entirely to much logicial thought in this post.  I'm confused.
Av made Darkfall, but who made the actual game as the game is actually?

Or is this more of a, "what came first, the chicken or the egg" kind of thing?
What came first.  Av or a darkfall, a game that is actually bad?

 

its really fairly easy.

If i walk into the shoe store, try on a shoe and it fits well I buy it. I dont ask the store clerk which shoe company responds best to consumers and keeps them informed on any new models. I also dont ask which shoe company doesnt use child labor.

Now, if anyone responds with anything other than "well MMO is not a shoe" it would be intresting read.
 

Well, if you were talking about a single player game, or an ordinary multiplayer game: then its a decent  comparison.

However, since this is a MMO its more like this: you walk into the shoe store, then you RENT a shoe from a specific shoe company. This shoe company will then demand money from you as long as you use the shoe, when you dont want to pay anymore they will take it back (or "disable" it since with a MMO you can still "have" the game, but you cant play it).

Even worse, they have the right to actually ALTER your shoe anytime and in any way they want. So you liked that black and slick looking shoe..? Too bad, because now they changed the color to pink, and added really high heels on it... Of course if its a somewhat serious company, you can just stop renting the shoe.

With MMOs the company matters a bit more than for other genres, and by looking at the company and try to determine how serious they are, some people try to predict if this company is the kind that will triple charge you for the shoe, change the color to pink and lime green, and then run off with your socks...

Originally posted by Remains

Well, if you were talking about a single player game, or an ordinary multiplayer game: then its a decent  comparison.

However, since this is a MMO its more like this: you walk into the shoe store, then you RENT a shoe from a specific shoe company. This shoe company will then demand money from you as long as you use the shoe, when you dont want to pay anymore they will take it back (or "disable" it since with a MMO you can still "have" the game, but you cant play it).

Even worse, they have the right to actually ALTER your shoe anytime and in any way they want. So you liked that black and slick looking shoe..? Too bad, because now they changed the color to pink, and added really high heels on it... Of course if its a somewhat serious company, you can just stop renting the shoe.

With MMOs the company matters a bit more than for other genres, and by looking at the company and try to determine how serious they are, some people try to predict if this company is the kind that will triple charge you for the shoe, change the color to pink and lime green, and then run off with your socks...

The exact same rules apply though.

Cable is a good example, I subscribe to Star's if I see a pattern of not liking it I unsubscribe, I dont unsubscribe becuase they havent called me to tell me what is up and comming.

if we were talking about $1000 a month I could understand but we are only talking about $15 a month and at that price point its just more effective to try it and stop when you dont like it anymore.

That is how I roll anyway

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by Remains

Well, if you were talking about a single player game, or an ordinary multiplayer game: then its a decent  comparison.

However, since this is a MMO its more like this: you walk into the shoe store, then you RENT a shoe from a specific shoe company. This shoe company will then demand money from you as long as you use the shoe, when you dont want to pay anymore they will take it back (or "disable" it since with a MMO you can still "have" the game, but you cant play it).

Even worse, they have the right to actually ALTER your shoe anytime and in any way they want. So you liked that black and slick looking shoe..? Too bad, because now they changed the color to pink, and added really high heels on it... Of course if its a somewhat serious company, you can just stop renting the shoe.

With MMOs the company matters a bit more than for other genres, and by looking at the company and try to determine how serious they are, some people try to predict if this company is the kind that will triple charge you for the shoe, change the color to pink and lime green, and then run off with your socks...

 

The exact same rules apply though.

Cable is a good example, I subscribe to Star's if I see a pattern of not liking it I unsubscribe, I dont unsubscribe becuase they havent called me to tell me what is up and comming.

if we were talking about $1000 a month I could understand but we are only talking about $15 a month and at that price point its just more effective to try it and stop when you dont like it anymore.

 

That is how I roll anyway

Well, for the 3 MMOs that you've actually tried anyway. 

You'll have to excuse some of us not really giving your opinion much consideration when you are basing it on so little actual experience.

Once you've been playing MMOs for 10+ years and you go through what SoE did with SWG or when your favorite MMO is shut-down.  Then you will see that the companies behind the games are what makes or breaks them.  Sure a good, stable game that is fun to play helps a lot. 

However, if there are not enough other players that have that same opinion... the game will get shut-down.  It's really that simple.

MMOs are a unique breed among computer games.  The game and the company are one in the same.  As the company goes, so goes the game... and vice versa.

Even when the game and company are separated (i.e. Vanguard, Horizons, etc.) the game almost never recovers.

Give yourself another 5 years or so with MMOs... you'll see that we are right. 

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by Remains

Well, if you were talking about a single player game, or an ordinary multiplayer game: then its a decent  comparison.

However, since this is a MMO its more like this: you walk into the shoe store, then you RENT a shoe from a specific shoe company. This shoe company will then demand money from you as long as you use the shoe, when you dont want to pay anymore they will take it back (or "disable" it since with a MMO you can still "have" the game, but you cant play it).

Even worse, they have the right to actually ALTER your shoe anytime and in any way they want. So you liked that black and slick looking shoe..? Too bad, because now they changed the color to pink, and added really high heels on it... Of course if its a somewhat serious company, you can just stop renting the shoe.

With MMOs the company matters a bit more than for other genres, and by looking at the company and try to determine how serious they are, some people try to predict if this company is the kind that will triple charge you for the shoe, change the color to pink and lime green, and then run off with your socks...

 

The exact same rules apply though.

Cable is a good example, I subscribe to Star's if I see a pattern of not liking it I unsubscribe, I dont unsubscribe becuase they havent called me to tell me what is up and comming.

if we were talking about $1000 a month I could understand but we are only talking about $15 a month and at that price point its just more effective to try it and stop when you dont like it anymore.

 

That is how I roll anyway

my cable company sends a little pamphlet every month telling me the new movies coming on cable next month so /shrug

Originally posted by xzyax

Well, for the 3 MMOs that you've actually tried anyway. 

 

You'll have to excuse some of us not really giving your opinion much consideration when you are basing it on so little actual experience.

 

Once you've been playing MMOs for 10+ years and you go through what SoE did with SWG or when your favorite MMO is shut-down.  Then you will see that the companies behind the games are what makes or breaks them.  Sure a good, stable game that is fun to play helps a lot. 

 

However, if there are not enough other players that have that same opinion... the game will get shut-down.  It's really that simple.

 

MMOs are a unique breed among computer games.  The game and the company are one in the same.  As the company goes, so goes the game... and vice versa.

 

Even when the game and company are separated (i.e. Vanguard, Horizons, etc.) the game almost never recovers.

Give yourself another 5 years or so with MMOs... you'll see that we are right. 

lets take Darkfall as an example to test out your theory shall we?

When someone is thinking about playing Darkfall and they decide to not to join up which reason do you think is most likely the reason.

1. All the people complaining about the company

2. the direct affects to their personal gaming experience based on what the company does or dosent do?

I would venture to say the complaining itself hurts the company more than what is being complain about in this specific case.

Pause for a few moments before responding and think it thru slowly.

(p.s. overall I have been playing PC games for almost 30 years. just an FYI)

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by Remains

Well, if you were talking about a single player game, or an ordinary multiplayer game: then its a decent  comparison.

However, since this is a MMO its more like this: you walk into the shoe store, then you RENT a shoe from a specific shoe company. This shoe company will then demand money from you as long as you use the shoe, when you dont want to pay anymore they will take it back (or "disable" it since with a MMO you can still "have" the game, but you cant play it).

Even worse, they have the right to actually ALTER your shoe anytime and in any way they want. So you liked that black and slick looking shoe..? Too bad, because now they changed the color to pink, and added really high heels on it... Of course if its a somewhat serious company, you can just stop renting the shoe.

With MMOs the company matters a bit more than for other genres, and by looking at the company and try to determine how serious they are, some people try to predict if this company is the kind that will triple charge you for the shoe, change the color to pink and lime green, and then run off with your socks...

 

The exact same rules apply though.

Cable is a good example, I subscribe to Star's if I see a pattern of not liking it I unsubscribe, I dont unsubscribe becuase they havent called me to tell me what is up and comming.

if we were talking about $1000 a month I could understand but we are only talking about $15 a month and at that price point its just more effective to try it and stop when you dont like it anymore.

 

That is how I roll anyway

What if you just subscribed to Star's with a yearly contract and 2 months after you start your contract they changed all of the channels to only broadcast kid's channel's you call them in and they tell you "we already had this planned to start this month, we just didnt tell you when you actually purchased the service" wouldnt you be pissed?

I guess some people just like to know exactly where they are spending their money some people dont, It doesnt matter if its 1USD or 1000USD if im spending money on a service I want to know exactly what I am paying for and if the server is gonna suit my needs today but also tomorrow and for the duration of the service I have purchased or signed to.

Originally posted by rav3n2

 

What if you just subscribed to Star's with a yearly contract and 2 months after you start your contract they changed all of the channels to only broadcast kid's channel's you call them in and they tell you "we already had this planned to start this month, we just didnt tell you when you actually purchased the service" wouldnt you be pissed?

I guess some people just like to know exactly where they are spending their money some people dont, It doesnt matter if its 1USD or 1000USD if im spending money on a service I want to know exactly what I am paying for and if the server is gonna suit my needs today but also tomorrow and for the duration of the service I have purchased or signed to.

1. if I pre-pay for a full year on something then I do it at my own risk with full knowedge that everything might change within that year. So I would be sad but no I would not be pissed, I would simply have regreted not doing it. That said, do you pay for a full year in advance on an MMO?

2. The amount of money does matter, the amount of degrees do matter. Its a fact of life. $30 to test something out (2 months) isnt jack. I think I spent that much going to go see Star Trek for christ sake!

(P.S. Most of the people who complain about the company do not even like the game to begin with so this whole "we want to see the game succede becuase we like it" just doesnt sell with me)

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by rav3n2

 

What if you just subscribed to Star's with a yearly contract and 2 months after you start your contract they changed all of the channels to only broadcast kid's channel's you call them in and they tell you "we already had this planned to start this month, we just didnt tell you when you actually purchased the service" wouldnt you be pissed?

I guess some people just like to know exactly where they are spending their money some people dont, It doesnt matter if its 1USD or 1000USD if im spending money on a service I want to know exactly what I am paying for and if the server is gonna suit my needs today but also tomorrow and for the duration of the service I have purchased or signed to.

 

1. if I pre-pay for a full year on something then I do it at my own risk with full knowedge that everything might change within that year. So I would be sad but no I would not be pissed, I would simply have regreted not doing it. That said, do you pay for a full year in advance on an MMO?

2. The amount of money does matter, the amount of degrees do matter. Its a fact of life. $30 to test something out (2 months) isnt jack. I think I spent that much going to go see Star Trek for christ sake!

Its a bit odd to assume that your service will change if you do a yearly contract, which country do you live in? Also I dunno why you brought pre-pay up since contract does not necessarily mean that you are pre-paying.

When it comes to companies providing bad services or not being transparent in their business practices it DOES NOT matter what money you are spending if its either 30USD or 3000USD, its that sort of attitude that allows shady business practices to continue, because they know they have people like you that will always pay those 30USD that will go directly into their pockets. It lowers the overall quality of services provided, I wish I did not have to go through tons of crap service providers and spend hours on the phone sometimes because well, there are wayyy more bad services out there than good ones, because some people are just dumb enough to not care and pay for it, so why should they stop.

This is a bit out of the scope of just entretainment but the same logic applies to MMO's nowadays, if we allow companies to not be transparent and fill their pockets with money for whatever short amount of time they manage to stay live, more will follow because well "its just 30USD" and we will have more and more crap MMO's, If you cant understand this then there is no point me spending more time trying to explain it to you.

Originally posted by rav3n2

 

Its a bit odd to assume that your service will change if you do a yearly contract, which country do you live in? Also I dunno why you brought pre-pay up since contract does not necessarily mean that you are pre-paying.

When it comes to companies providing bad services or not being transparent in their business practices it DOES NOT matter what money you are spending if its either 30USD or 3000USD, its that sort of attitude that allows shady business practices to continue, because they know they have people like you that will always pay those 30USD that will go directly into their pockets. It lowers the overall quality of services provided, I wish I did not have to go through tons of crap service providers and spend hours on the phone sometimes because well, there are wayyy more bad services out there than good ones, because some people are just dumb enough to not care and pay for it, so why should they stop.

This is a bit out of the scope of just entretainment but the same logic applies to MMO's nowadays, if we allow companies to not be transparent and fill their pockets with money for whatever short amount of time they manage to stay live, more will follow because well "its just 30USD" and we will have more and more crap MMO's, If you cant understand this then there is no point me spending more time trying to explain it to you.

 

 

so basically you are the one guy who yells at Universal studios when you watch a movie that was not "the biggest hit of the summer".

Ok well whatever.

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by rav3n2

 

Its a bit odd to assume that your service will change if you do a yearly contract, which country do you live in? Also I dunno why you brought pre-pay up since contract does not necessarily mean that you are pre-paying.

When it comes to companies providing bad services or not being transparent in their business practices it DOES NOT matter what money you are spending if its either 30USD or 3000USD, its that sort of attitude that allows shady business practices to continue, because they know they have people like you that will always pay those 30USD that will go directly into their pockets. It lowers the overall quality of services provided, I wish I did not have to go through tons of crap service providers and spend hours on the phone sometimes because well, there are wayyy more bad services out there than good ones, because some people are just dumb enough to not care and pay for it, so why should they stop.

This is a bit out of the scope of just entretainment but the same logic applies to MMO's nowadays, if we allow companies to not be transparent and fill their pockets with money for whatever short amount of time they manage to stay live, more will follow because well "its just 30USD" and we will have more and more crap MMO's, If you cant understand this then there is no point me spending more time trying to explain it to you.

 

 

 

so basically you are the one guy who yells at Universal studios when you watch a movie that was not "the biggest hit of the summer".

 

Ok well whatever.

No again you are confusing things, I am the guy that screams at whatever movie company if I pay to watch star trek and at the middle of the movie Gandalf and an Orc army appear in space.

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by xzyax

Well, for the 3 MMOs that you've actually tried anyway. 

 

You'll have to excuse some of us not really giving your opinion much consideration when you are basing it on so little actual experience.

 

Once you've been playing MMOs for 10+ years and you go through what SoE did with SWG or when your favorite MMO is shut-down.  Then you will see that the companies behind the games are what makes or breaks them.  Sure a good, stable game that is fun to play helps a lot. 

 

However, if there are not enough other players that have that same opinion... the game will get shut-down.  It's really that simple.

 

MMOs are a unique breed among computer games.  The game and the company are one in the same.  As the company goes, so goes the game... and vice versa.

 

Even when the game and company are separated (i.e. Vanguard, Horizons, etc.) the game almost never recovers.

Give yourself another 5 years or so with MMOs... you'll see that we are right. 

 

lets take Darkfall as an example to test out your theory shall we?

When someone is thinking about playing Darkfall and they decide to not to join up which reason do you think is most likely the reason.

1. All the people complaining about the company

2. the direct affects to their personal gaming experience based on what the company does or dosent do?

I would venture to say the complaining itself hurts the company more than what is being complain about in this specific case.

Pause for a few moments before responding and think it thru slowly.

(p.s. overall I have been playing PC games for almost 30 years. just an FYI)

I can't speak for anyone else.  I can speak for my own reasons for not playing DarkFall yet.

They have not (up until this most recent update) implemented the features that I thought would be fun for me. 

The player housing (if implemented correctly) is a step in the right direction for me.

Now all they have to do is have a free trial and I'll be on-board. 

I have plenty to keep me busy and have fun with, so I have no problem waiting. 

Just an F.Y.I.  --- only other MMO experience; especially in the same play-style, is useful for MMO gaming.  Single-player games are just not the same thing. 

Games like UO, SWG, EvE, L2, DAoC, SB, EQ (PvP servers) AC DarkTide... those MMOs had you played them would have given you a frame of reference to compare DarkFall to. 

However since of that list you only played EvE for about a week... then DarkFall is really your first MMO with this play-style.  It's natural that your first exposure to a given MMO play-style; you will think is the greatest and best.  We were there too at one time.  After a few more years of playing MMOs though, you will realize that is not the case.

We will just have remember that you are a baby with MMOs like DarkFall and you are like a  young boy looking at his first porno.  

Originally posted by rav3n2

 

No again you are confusing things, I am the guy that screams at whatever movie company if I pay to watch star trek and at the middle of the movie Gandalf and an Orc army appear in space.

only because you paid for all three follow up movies in advance and on the 2nd one it was different than the advertisement.

yeah...pretty much the same although a little different.