Originally posted by Wharg0ul

Originally posted by khartman2005

Originally posted by Nihilist

I agree with your criticisms, but people just wanted an open pvp game to succeed since the market is flooded with boring WoW clones.

 

I defended the game pre-release, but after playing it I now see the crapfest for what it is.

 

 

 

Would you all stop with the stupid "WoW clone crap". WoW was not the first MMO by a longshot and it in itself copied many, many other games before them. The only thing that makes WoW popular is that you can play it on a 10 to 15 year old system with nearly no trouble.

 

you seem to be mis-understanding the terminology. A "wow-clone" is a cheap piece of quest-based themepark trash churned out by a money-grubbing corporation who is simply attempting to cash in on the MMO genre as a result of the dollar signs they see in the popularity of WoW. They aren't makeing a game for the sake of making a game, or for ANY reason other than to try to milk Blizzard's cash-cow.

the term is NOT an implication that any game with some of the features found in wow is a clone, at least in it's proper definition.

Just wanted to clear that up for ya....

The term is thrown around for every game lately and quite frankly a lot of us are sick of hearing it.

Originally posted by khartman2005

you seem to be mis-understanding the terminology. A "wow-clone" is a cheap piece of quest-based themepark trash churned out by a money-grubbing corporation who is simply attempting to cash in on the MMO genre as a result of the dollar signs they see in the popularity of WoW. They aren't makeing a game for the sake of making a game, or for ANY reason other than to try to milk Blizzard's cash-cow.

the term is NOT an implication that any game with some of the features found in wow is a clone, at least in it's proper definition.

Just wanted to clear that up for ya....

The term is thrown around for every game lately and quite frankly a lot of us are sick of hearing it.

That is because (almost) every game is what he just said a WoW clone is (beside the last money-grubbing corp part, all gaming companies are that, including AV even though they pretend not to be).

If you are sick of it then mail the companies that are spewing the crap out like *cough* Turbine... If a bird walks like a duck, swims like a duck and and quacks like a duck then I call that bird a duck. 

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by khartman2005

you seem to be mis-understanding the terminology. A "wow-clone" is a cheap piece of quest-based themepark trash churned out by a money-grubbing corporation who is simply attempting to cash in on the MMO genre as a result of the dollar signs they see in the popularity of WoW. They aren't makeing a game for the sake of making a game, or for ANY reason other than to try to milk Blizzard's cash-cow.

the term is NOT an implication that any game with some of the features found in wow is a clone, at least in it's proper definition.

Just wanted to clear that up for ya....

The term is thrown around for every game lately and quite frankly a lot of us are sick of hearing it.

 

That is because (almost) every game is what he just said a WoW clone is (beside the last money-grubbing corp part, all gaming companies are that, including AV even though they pretend not to be).

If you are sick of it then mail the companies that are spewing the crap out like *cough* Turbine... If a bird walks like a duck, swims like a duck and and quacks like a duck then I call that bird a duck. 

Why would I mail Turbine other then to thank them for a great game? I do not see how anyone can call Lord of the Rings Online a WoW clone. I played WoW for about 2 months before I could not stand it any longer. I, on the other hand have a lifetime founders subscription to Lord of the Rings Online.

Many games share certain qualities, that does not make them clones of each other.

Originally posted by khartman2005

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by khartman2005

you seem to be mis-understanding the terminology. A "wow-clone" is a cheap piece of quest-based themepark trash churned out by a money-grubbing corporation who is simply attempting to cash in on the MMO genre as a result of the dollar signs they see in the popularity of WoW. They aren't makeing a game for the sake of making a game, or for ANY reason other than to try to milk Blizzard's cash-cow.

the term is NOT an implication that any game with some of the features found in wow is a clone, at least in it's proper definition.

Just wanted to clear that up for ya....

The term is thrown around for every game lately and quite frankly a lot of us are sick of hearing it.

 

That is because (almost) every game is what he just said a WoW clone is (beside the last money-grubbing corp part, all gaming companies are that, including AV even though they pretend not to be).

If you are sick of it then mail the companies that are spewing the crap out like *cough* Turbine... If a bird walks like a duck, swims like a duck and and quacks like a duck then I call that bird a duck. 

 

Why would I mail Turbine other then to thank them for a great game? I do not see how anyone can call Lord of the Rings Online a WoW clone. I played WoW for about 2 months before I could not stand it any longer. I, on the other hand have a lifetime founders subscription to Lord of the Rings Online.

Many games share certain qualities, that does not make them clones of each other.

DFO would have been great IF, it had insured the security of its client...and had all the content it advertised. Frankly the lack of content, buggyness, afkmacroing, and the hacking were its greatest failing.

I have to admit though, I did laugh my arse off when I saw that ship bieng stolen that had what 20-30 peeps on it, and the guy still got away with thier ship. DFO is so hardcore it has flying SHIPS! BUWHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaa(cough).

Originally posted by vader999

Originally posted by khartman2005

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by khartman2005

you seem to be mis-understanding the terminology. A "wow-clone" is a cheap piece of quest-based themepark trash churned out by a money-grubbing corporation who is simply attempting to cash in on the MMO genre as a result of the dollar signs they see in the popularity of WoW. They aren't makeing a game for the sake of making a game, or for ANY reason other than to try to milk Blizzard's cash-cow.

the term is NOT an implication that any game with some of the features found in wow is a clone, at least in it's proper definition.

Just wanted to clear that up for ya....

The term is thrown around for every game lately and quite frankly a lot of us are sick of hearing it.

 

That is because (almost) every game is what he just said a WoW clone is (beside the last money-grubbing corp part, all gaming companies are that, including AV even though they pretend not to be).

If you are sick of it then mail the companies that are spewing the crap out like *cough* Turbine... If a bird walks like a duck, swims like a duck and and quacks like a duck then I call that bird a duck. 

 

Why would I mail Turbine other then to thank them for a great game? I do not see how anyone can call Lord of the Rings Online a WoW clone. I played WoW for about 2 months before I could not stand it any longer. I, on the other hand have a lifetime founders subscription to Lord of the Rings Online.

Many games share certain qualities, that does not make them clones of each other.

LoTRO despite you liking the game is a perfect example of a total ripoff. From the interface to the skill trees, to the tooltips on items, to vendors, to mob placements, quest givers and map layouts, when I first tried LoTRO I couldn't believe they didnt get sued for it. The second closest that comes to WoW is Warhammer, just considering basic mechanics without delving into PvE/PvP/raiding/FFA/Full Loot/RP/Lore etc.

Now take a look at something like AoC or Darkfall, it has its own style whether you agree they're good or bad games, the basic systems employed are totally different. Hell look at GW, AO, EvE, AC, or Shadowbane, the only other ones I'm familiar with, if you can't see how different the basic games are from equipment stats, skills, mob placement, maps, NPC (vendors, questgiveres, etc) etc to WoW/LoTRO I despair. Although this could be more to do with you being an ex EQ/DAOC player where if those mechanics are similar, you would take them as granted.

I see you mentioned EQ? Wonder if that is who WOW ripped off? I swear the WOW worshipers figure out more ways to work a comment into a thread than Bizz can to keep people grinding.

Originally posted by khartman2005

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by khartman2005

you seem to be mis-understanding the terminology. A "wow-clone" is a cheap piece of quest-based themepark trash churned out by a money-grubbing corporation who is simply attempting to cash in on the MMO genre as a result of the dollar signs they see in the popularity of WoW. They aren't makeing a game for the sake of making a game, or for ANY reason other than to try to milk Blizzard's cash-cow.

the term is NOT an implication that any game with some of the features found in wow is a clone, at least in it's proper definition.

Just wanted to clear that up for ya....

The term is thrown around for every game lately and quite frankly a lot of us are sick of hearing it.

 

That is because (almost) every game is what he just said a WoW clone is (beside the last money-grubbing corp part, all gaming companies are that, including AV even though they pretend not to be).

If you are sick of it then mail the companies that are spewing the crap out like *cough* Turbine... If a bird walks like a duck, swims like a duck and and quacks like a duck then I call that bird a duck. 

 

Why would I mail Turbine other then to thank them for a great game? I do not see how anyone can call Lord of the Rings Online a WoW clone. I played WoW for about 2 months before I could not stand it any longer. I, on the other hand have a lifetime founders subscription to Lord of the Rings Online.

Many games share certain qualities, that does not make them clones of each other.

I play WOW for years, LOTRO a few months. WOW did alot right, which is why its a sucess. Fact I played WOW longer then I did my all time favorite game which was DAOC. And the simple reason is WOW didnt try to reinvent its game like Mythic did with DAOC, aka Trials of Atlantis expac. Had LOTRO been true to the basic premise of Tolkiens books, it would have been a epic rvr canvas nothing else except perhaps...a true to IP Warhammer could have been. In my opinion both IP's were flushed to do precisely what you claim they didnt in LOTRO.
 

Further regarding the game that is the namesake of this forum, DFO, even IT, had more novel ideas then LOTRO did. Sorry, but I just dont see LOTRO the same way you do, but then again, I never bought a founders sub.

I like cookies.

Originally posted by vader999

Originally posted by khartman2005

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by khartman2005

you seem to be mis-understanding the terminology. A "wow-clone" is a cheap piece of quest-based themepark trash churned out by a money-grubbing corporation who is simply attempting to cash in on the MMO genre as a result of the dollar signs they see in the popularity of WoW. They aren't makeing a game for the sake of making a game, or for ANY reason other than to try to milk Blizzard's cash-cow.

the term is NOT an implication that any game with some of the features found in wow is a clone, at least in it's proper definition.

Just wanted to clear that up for ya....

The term is thrown around for every game lately and quite frankly a lot of us are sick of hearing it.

 

That is because (almost) every game is what he just said a WoW clone is (beside the last money-grubbing corp part, all gaming companies are that, including AV even though they pretend not to be).

If you are sick of it then mail the companies that are spewing the crap out like *cough* Turbine... If a bird walks like a duck, swims like a duck and and quacks like a duck then I call that bird a duck. 

 

Why would I mail Turbine other then to thank them for a great game? I do not see how anyone can call Lord of the Rings Online a WoW clone. I played WoW for about 2 months before I could not stand it any longer. I, on the other hand have a lifetime founders subscription to Lord of the Rings Online.

Many games share certain qualities, that does not make them clones of each other.

LoTRO despite you liking the game is a perfect example of a total ripoff. From the interface to the skill trees, to the tooltips on items, to vendors, to mob placements, quest givers and map layouts, when I first tried LoTRO I couldn't believe they didnt get sued for it. The second closest that comes to WoW is Warhammer, just considering basic mechanics without delving into PvE/PvP/raiding/FFA/Full Loot/RP/Lore etc.

Now take a look at something like AoC or Darkfall, it has its own style whether you agree they're good or bad games, the basic systems employed are totally different. Hell look at GW, AO, EvE, AC, or Shadowbane, the only other ones I'm familiar with, if you can't see how different the basic games are from equipment stats, skills, mob placement, maps, NPC (vendors, questgiveres, etc) etc to WoW/LoTRO I despair. Although this could be more to do with you being an ex EQ/DAOC player where if those mechanics are similar, you would take them as granted.

The funny thing is that a lot of this is based on opinion and perception.

Case in point: The characters in LOTRO dont' have skill trees as you claim above.  They do have slots in which they affix traits that serve some of the same function as a skill tree, but not exactly the same way.  Additionally, the traits are earned differently from just leveling, as in WoW.

Conversely, do you know which game DOES have skill trees?  That's right, AoC - the one you said has it's own style.  It has three skill trees (just like WoW) for each character, and the feat points spent in these trees are gained by leveling, like in WoW.

Many of the games you listed have similarities to WoW.  Fans of a particular game will make claims that their chosen game has aspects that makes them "totally different", while others are just clones.  I believe most of them are pretty similar.  While each has its own variation on how it does things, they usually aren't nearly as radical as a fanatic would claim.

Originally posted by vader999

Originally posted by khartman2005

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by khartman2005

you seem to be mis-understanding the terminology. A "wow-clone" is a cheap piece of quest-based themepark trash churned out by a money-grubbing corporation who is simply attempting to cash in on the MMO genre as a result of the dollar signs they see in the popularity of WoW. They aren't makeing a game for the sake of making a game, or for ANY reason other than to try to milk Blizzard's cash-cow.

the term is NOT an implication that any game with some of the features found in wow is a clone, at least in it's proper definition.

Just wanted to clear that up for ya....

The term is thrown around for every game lately and quite frankly a lot of us are sick of hearing it.

 

That is because (almost) every game is what he just said a WoW clone is (beside the last money-grubbing corp part, all gaming companies are that, including AV even though they pretend not to be).

If you are sick of it then mail the companies that are spewing the crap out like *cough* Turbine... If a bird walks like a duck, swims like a duck and and quacks like a duck then I call that bird a duck. 

 

Why would I mail Turbine other then to thank them for a great game? I do not see how anyone can call Lord of the Rings Online a WoW clone. I played WoW for about 2 months before I could not stand it any longer. I, on the other hand have a lifetime founders subscription to Lord of the Rings Online.

Many games share certain qualities, that does not make them clones of each other.

LoTRO despite you liking the game is a perfect example of a total ripoff. From the interface to the skill trees, to the tooltips on items, to vendors, to mob placements, quest givers and map layouts, when I first tried LoTRO I couldn't believe they didnt get sued for it. The second closest that comes to WoW is Warhammer, just considering basic mechanics without delving into PvE/PvP/raiding/FFA/Full Loot/RP/Lore etc.

Now take a look at something like AoC or Darkfall, it has its own style whether you agree they're good or bad games, the basic systems employed are totally different. Hell look at GW, AO, EvE, AC, or Shadowbane, the only other ones I'm familiar with, if you can't see how different the basic games are from equipment stats, skills, mob placement, maps, NPC (vendors, questgiveres, etc) etc to WoW/LoTRO I despair. Although this could be more to do with you being an ex EQ/DAOC player where if those mechanics are similar, you would take them as granted.

Now that is a confusing message in almost all dimensions

(1) first what is knowledge?  ideas and opinions passed on from generation to generation.  Everyone is ripping off everyone else.  You should not be talking or typing your are ripping off your mom

(2) user interface.  Every car looks alike, every door looks alike, every shirt looks alike, everything people interact with looks alike.  Fact is, there are industrial standards to enforce the look alike, such as dimensions and size of batteries.  So who is ripping off who?

(3) DF invented a new UI, that means its good?  The old saying is always wise, why reinvent a wheel for the sake of reinventing unless it is an improvement?  WoW does not invent much, they make the best mix of those that works.  That is all we want.  We use German made screw drivers in the past, not because its a new invention, but its a screw driver that works whenever you pull it out of your bag.  And it won't break.  Fact is, DF is being criticised for its stupid UI, its stupid mob AI, its stupid game mechanism, skill system.  New invention or attempts at being new, is not always good.  Unless it works.

(4) You do not need to label anyone as ex-EQ, ex-DAoC.  That is little short of personal discrimination.  Everyone is unique and have his own judgment.  The key issue is, how each and every gamer see the "new" features being implemented.  Or better still, how each and every gamer feel about the total package being delivered, no matter now much "new-ness" contained.  If the game is good, it is good, with or without newness.  A totally "original" game can be a pile of turd, look at DF.  A game with most features common to the majority can provide very refreshing gameplay, look at LOTRo.  That is how one gamer, ME, look at the total packages.  You can go on and argue with me about the details of each game, say how the eyes look lively in FF but far less lively in DAoC.  Yes, we can argue that, but it does not change my feeling about the overall "game-worthiness" of a game.  DF might provide ffa pvp with full loot, something not many games offer, but that along with the rest of the fiasco, still makes DF a pile of turd.  My view.

What am I looking for in a game?  Nobel prize invention?  Or just a game?

---

Originally posted by Wharg0ul

---

Originally posted by gamerman98

 

---

Originally posted by Wharg0ul

---

Originally posted by grimal
 
Please, your bait and switch is lame at best. 
You defeneded DF from the beginning:
"Darkfall is the BEST MMO of it's KIND. Simple as that. There is not other MMORPG that even attempts to do what Darkfall does..."
and then go on to sa:
"This is EXACTLY how I feel. I feel like I just got fucking betrayed.
I'll never give AV another cent. They can join the list with SOE and Valve of companies that will never EVER get my money again..:
If you apparently agree with me now, why the hostility?  Is it that you won't//can't admit that you were wrong from the get-go?
 
 
 

---

Well, Darkfall IS the best game of it's kind.
 
That really has nothing to do with the fact that as of today's announcement, it has become apparent that those of us who live in NA were scammed into thinking that we would be able to either transfer over to NA servers once they opened, or re-roll from scratch, without paying for the privelage to do so.
NOWHERE do I contradict myself...the merits and flaws of the game (such as they are) have NOTHING to do with my anger at AV's foolish decision on this matter.
And I'm sorry, but...."hostility"?? Please...I've have gone out of my WAY to not exibit my typical hostility in this thread...because that's what you want...you're just here to stir up trouble on a forum designated for a game you don't play, because you need your ego stroked, or need a little attention.
You're like a child that acts up and does things he KNOWS his parents will be angry about, just to get attention. It's sad, and it's more than a little obvious.

---

 
no DF is not the best of ITS kind...
a game from the past Mourning scammed players more harsh than DF has so far, but I will admit it is catching up. And just to point out...your little explanation, ego stroke or whatever that is, seems to be more about you than the person you are talking too. So next time you want to act all big and mighty, get some facts straight about what you are talking about before you start typing. Next time it might not make you look like a idiot.
 

---

WHAT fucking "facts" are you talking about here?? You contradict my statement, (with no example of what could be considered "better), and make empty irrelevant comments that make absolutely NO sense!
And the part that has me laughing my ASS off, is that you DARE to say that I look like an idiot, after making a post that has us all wondering if you have suffered some kind of unfortunate head trauma.
Wow....hehehe...thanks for the comedy relief.

---

Although I barely read any of what you wrote (which is probably not important anyway) I didnt DARE to say you were an idiot...i just outright said it. And what I mean is that i didnt need any example of anything I wrote. Such "FACTS" I was talking about is pretty much splattered all over these DF forums so I dont need to say more than that. Now as for your lame 12 year old "attempt" to actually insult me (which was about as effective as a bug bite) next time try it on someone who cares. And also dont tell me what i do and dont know about DF, cuz ive been watching it since day 1 and I am loving every bit of its slow but sure downfall. Nuff said...thnks for playing :D

Originally posted by indiramourn

Originally posted by lethys

Originally posted by grimal

Originally posted by lethys

 Thanks for the really important thread.

 

And for the equally important reply.

This issue is old news, you even said yourself you wonder why you posted it, and it's a thread giving reasons why you made a seperate thread three months ago.  This is pointless garbage and it seems that with the Internet, people can just post up whatever pointless nonsensical thoughts that come to their heads.  This thread seems to have oil and gasoline all over it with the intention of starting a fire, but it's not going to happen.  Everyone already got their steam for the game out.  The only person getting flamed here is you, and I don't even like Darkfall either.

 

Lethys, please learn not to bump threads that you feel shouldn't exist.  It's kind of like yelling at the echo to stop, don't you think?

STOP!!......STOP!!......STOP!!..........STOP!!.....................STOP!!

Originally posted by vader999

Originally posted by khartman2005

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by khartman2005

you seem to be mis-understanding the terminology. A "wow-clone" is a cheap piece of quest-based themepark trash churned out by a money-grubbing corporation who is simply attempting to cash in on the MMO genre as a result of the dollar signs they see in the popularity of WoW. They aren't makeing a game for the sake of making a game, or for ANY reason other than to try to milk Blizzard's cash-cow.

the term is NOT an implication that any game with some of the features found in wow is a clone, at least in it's proper definition.

Just wanted to clear that up for ya....

The term is thrown around for every game lately and quite frankly a lot of us are sick of hearing it.

 

That is because (almost) every game is what he just said a WoW clone is (beside the last money-grubbing corp part, all gaming companies are that, including AV even though they pretend not to be).

If you are sick of it then mail the companies that are spewing the crap out like *cough* Turbine... If a bird walks like a duck, swims like a duck and and quacks like a duck then I call that bird a duck. 

 

Why would I mail Turbine other then to thank them for a great game? I do not see how anyone can call Lord of the Rings Online a WoW clone. I played WoW for about 2 months before I could not stand it any longer. I, on the other hand have a lifetime founders subscription to Lord of the Rings Online.

Many games share certain qualities, that does not make them clones of each other.

LoTRO despite you liking the game is a perfect example of a total ripoff. From the interface to the skill trees, to the tooltips on items, to vendors, to mob placements, quest givers and map layouts, when I first tried LoTRO I couldn't believe they didnt get sued for it. The second closest that comes to WoW is Warhammer, just considering basic mechanics without delving into PvE/PvP/raiding/FFA/Full Loot/RP/Lore etc.

Now take a look at something like AoC or Darkfall, it has its own style whether you agree they're good or bad games, the basic systems employed are totally different. Hell look at GW, AO, EvE, AC, or Shadowbane, the only other ones I'm familiar with, if you can't see how different the basic games are from equipment stats, skills, mob placement, maps, NPC (vendors, questgiveres, etc) etc to WoW/LoTRO I despair. Although this could be more to do with you being an ex EQ/DAOC player where if those mechanics are similar, you would take them as granted.

Someone doesn't have a clue of what he's talking about. Turbine is a good, reputable gaming company, and LotRO is a rock-solid title. Pointing fingers and telling that "X did it first" is stupid, because that's the basic principle of evolution and refining that happens anytime, anywhere. As someone pointed out, WoW copied a good whole lot of other titles (namely EQ), and that's fine. After all, that's one of the reasons to the success of that game.

Is originality a good thing? Of course it is. But it's not everything. Nothing wrong in grabbing a concept and taking it to the next level. Reinventing stuff can be art, too.

DFO tried something new. That's laudable and certainly one of the reasons why people were intrigued with the game in the past. However, it turned out to be a half-assed attempt at a great initial concept, and a money-hungry project, lately. Being original is not a "get-out-of-jail" card, sorry.

Originally posted by StrixMaxima

Originally posted by vader999

Originally posted by khartman2005

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by khartman2005

you seem to be mis-understanding the terminology. A "wow-clone" is a cheap piece of quest-based themepark trash churned out by a money-grubbing corporation who is simply attempting to cash in on the MMO genre as a result of the dollar signs they see in the popularity of WoW. They aren't makeing a game for the sake of making a game, or for ANY reason other than to try to milk Blizzard's cash-cow.

the term is NOT an implication that any game with some of the features found in wow is a clone, at least in it's proper definition.

Just wanted to clear that up for ya....

The term is thrown around for every game lately and quite frankly a lot of us are sick of hearing it.

 

That is because (almost) every game is what he just said a WoW clone is (beside the last money-grubbing corp part, all gaming companies are that, including AV even though they pretend not to be).

If you are sick of it then mail the companies that are spewing the crap out like *cough* Turbine... If a bird walks like a duck, swims like a duck and and quacks like a duck then I call that bird a duck. 

 

Why would I mail Turbine other then to thank them for a great game? I do not see how anyone can call Lord of the Rings Online a WoW clone. I played WoW for about 2 months before I could not stand it any longer. I, on the other hand have a lifetime founders subscription to Lord of the Rings Online.

Many games share certain qualities, that does not make them clones of each other.

LoTRO despite you liking the game is a perfect example of a total ripoff. From the interface to the skill trees, to the tooltips on items, to vendors, to mob placements, quest givers and map layouts, when I first tried LoTRO I couldn't believe they didnt get sued for it. The second closest that comes to WoW is Warhammer, just considering basic mechanics without delving into PvE/PvP/raiding/FFA/Full Loot/RP/Lore etc.

Now take a look at something like AoC or Darkfall, it has its own style whether you agree they're good or bad games, the basic systems employed are totally different. Hell look at GW, AO, EvE, AC, or Shadowbane, the only other ones I'm familiar with, if you can't see how different the basic games are from equipment stats, skills, mob placement, maps, NPC (vendors, questgiveres, etc) etc to WoW/LoTRO I despair. Although this could be more to do with you being an ex EQ/DAOC player where if those mechanics are similar, you would take them as granted.

 

Someone doesn't have a clue of what he's talking about. Turbine is a good, reputable gaming company, and LotRO is a rock-solid title. Pointing fingers and telling that "X did it first" is stupid, because that's the basic principle of evolution and refining that happens anytime, anywhere. As someone pointed out, WoW copied a good whole lot of other titles (namely EQ), and that's fine. After all, that's one of the reasons to the success of that game.

Is originality a good thing? Of course it is. But it's not everything. Nothing wrong in grabbing a concept and taking it to the next level. Reinventing stuff can be art, too.

DFO tried something new. That's laudable and certainly one of the reasons why people were intrigued with the game in the past. However, it turned out to be a half-assed attempt at a great initial concept, and a money-hungry project, lately. Being original is not a "get-out-of-jail" card, sorry.

Agreed, good points, and yes, for all of DFOs failings, you still have to give credit here, we are after all in the end gamers, and want to find the ideal game we all crave. DFO conceptually was one hell of a offering, its reality was less then as attested by the people whom played, have commented, and decided to move on. Lets hope however that indi or otherwise game designers continue to push the envelope so that we all may one day enjoy our ideal.