Just like every other hardcore game you have tried.

You cried when you got tank rushed in Red Alert.

You created Trammel.

You ruined Mordred.

You quit Shadowbane at release.

You quit AoC after seeing their patches and community.

You laughed at Darkfall for trying.

You made fun of EVE online because it is a space game.

Why try another hardcore game?

Originally posted by -Zeno-

Just like every other hardcore game you have tried.

You cried when you got tank rushed in Red Alert.

You created Trammel.

You ruined Mordred.

You quit Shadowbane at release.

You quit AoC after seeing their patches and community.

You laughed at Darkfall for trying.

You made fun of EVE online because it is a space game.

Why try another hardcore game?

Wow...another DF and it's players are the hardest post.  Nice.  Another carebears beware post.

I wish DF players wouldn't even mention Shadowbane.  So that us Shadowbane vets don't have to be lumped in with you guys.......

I guess I don't understand.  Since players like you are so obviously hardcore and dominant, wouldn't you want the legions of carebear wusses to play with you so you can slaughter them?  Why try to "scare" them away with your tough talk?

I remember when runescape was released, all that ganking, at first it was annoying but then I came to like it, because there was other things to do, and the free pvp put the danger in it (Those stable ambushes!).

I hope this game will do that, the sense of danger when you step out of town ("to get chicken eggs for the cook" AHAHAHAAH)

Also I'm a fanboy of UO, and this game makes think of UO with Oblivion come together (At least devs make me think that).

I don't care if it will be a disappointment, some day someone will do it right.

Maybe Bethesda will do it, dunno. :S

Let us enjoy the hype :D

Working alignment system.  You didn't get ganked left and right in Lineage 2. 
Some people will want to play a criminal; playing a criminal doesn't mean being able to run around killing people just for the hell of it.

Griefing has nothing to do with PvP.  It happens in PvE games, and it's usually not allowed in MMO's.

When you make a ffa PvP game with full loot, and your PvE is busted, the only thing you have to do is kill other players.  DFO's mechanics encourage pointless PvP.  That's the devs fault for creating an alignment system that allows you to go red with no risk or penalty, and no content outside of riding around killing people; not the ffa PvP.

This is funny. No matter how many times people are told this game is about PvPing (call it ganking/griefing), they will insist it should be a PvE.

Originally posted by Moretrinkets

This is funny. No matter how many times people are told this game is about PvPing (call it ganking/griefing), they will insist it should be a PvE.

Ganking/Griefing isn't PvP.  Its PKing.   This game is supposed to have harsh penalties on red name ( 10% stat loss ), attacked at towns, " blues " don't lose alignment against reds, etc.  Sure there will be the red names that run around, but its going to be very unsafe to play as one ( your house is the only safe spot ).

Originally posted by thinktank001

Originally posted by Moretrinkets

This is funny. No matter how many times people are told this game is about PvPing (call it ganking/griefing), they will insist it should be a PvE.

 

 

Ganking/Griefing isn't PvP.  Its PKing.   This game is supposed to have harsh penalties on red name ( 10% stat loss ), attacked at towns, " blues " don't lose alignment against reds, etc.  Sure there will be the red names that run around, but its going to be very unsafe to play as one ( your house is the only safe spot ).

and why they should? just because you dont like dying to red players? i die a lot, but I kill plenty myself...

seriously, you mazohists, why play a game which has game mechanics that you dont like??!! Then when you do buy the game you want the devs to chnage these core mechanics, which they never will so you get depressed some more, whats the point?

The problem with most PvP-centric MMOs is, that you can't level up your toon without getting griefed all the time.

This is where EvE Online does excel and stand out from the usual griefing-contests. You don't need to level up in the hostile areas, you can fly around in total safety in high-sec-systems, staying in a NPC-corp.

If you feel, that you're ready for the PvP, you can enter low-sec or join a 0.0alliance and get the party started and if you're fed up with PvP again, you can step back into a NPC-corp again and enjoy flying missions in high-sec again, or do some trading and stuff.

---

So the problem isn't really the open world PvP, it's the crappy implementation of it in most MMOs.

Introduce safer areas like in EvE, with guards reacting upon agression and killing the agressor and there wouldn't be so many complaints.
Have high/er rewards in the unguarded areas, to draw people into them, after they've leveled up their toons, and you've a game with a choice for both sides... risk vs. reward.

I like the way Shadowbane does it. You get a tracking skill that lets you see who is near you. This gives you a chance to get away.

Originally posted by Cristina1

 

and why they should? just because you dont like dying to red players? i die a lot, but I kill plenty myself...

seriously, you mazohists, why play a game which has game mechanics that you dont like??!! Then when you do buy the game you want the devs to chnage these core mechanics, which they never will so you get depressed some more, whats the point?

Plain and simple answer;  To promote other play styles.    I don't really care if I die from a red player, but for some reason you think I do.

I've always found it odd that people think you should be punished for killing other players in a Player vs Player game. It's like having a $50 fine for walking on the sidewalk. If you're in an open PvP area you're consenting to PvP. Should games have safe areas is another issue. Non-consensual PvP should be avoided simply because it's bad for revenue. History has shown again and again many people will not play a game where they feel they're being forced to play the victim. gaming companies will always care less about your e-peen than their bottom line.

What was the point of this post, lol? To show the MMORPG.com community how hardcore you are, with threats of uber ownage in mortal online? Please kid, go check out the darkfall forums, its where you belong.

Originally posted by zymurgeist

I've always found it odd that people think you should be punished for killing other players in a Player vs Player game. It's like having a $50 fine for walking on the sidewalk. If you're in an open PvP area you're consenting to PvP. Should games have safe areas is another issue. Non-consensual PvP should be avoided simply because it's bad for revenue. History has shown again and again many people will not play a game where they feel they're being forced to play the victim. gaming companies will always care less about your e-peen than their bottom line.

 

 

I repeat myself...

It's just the way how you impement it, and how much safety you provide to those, who don't want to engage in PvP at all.
The system in EvE Online is proof enough, that open world FFA PvP with full loot is interesting enough players, to make for a healthy MMO-population.

If you don't want to go in unsecure areas, it's fine, but you'll miss out 50% of the content of the game and don't get to the high rewards. It's risk vs. reward.

Originally posted by Cristina1

Originally posted by thinktank001

Originally posted by Moretrinkets

This is funny. No matter how many times people are told this game is about PvPing (call it ganking/griefing), they will insist it should be a PvE.

 

 

Ganking/Griefing isn't PvP.  Its PKing.   This game is supposed to have harsh penalties on red name ( 10% stat loss ), attacked at towns, " blues " don't lose alignment against reds, etc.  Sure there will be the red names that run around, but its going to be very unsafe to play as one ( your house is the only safe spot ).

 

and why they should? just because you dont like dying to red players? i die a lot, but I kill plenty myself...

seriously, you mazohists, why play a game which has game mechanics that you dont like??!! Then when you do buy the game you want the devs to chnage these core mechanics, which they never will so you get depressed some more, whats the point?

It's all in the implementation of the core mechanics, and how they support the style of game that was advertised.

Darkfall has a terrible set of core mechanics that do not work in concert with each other.  The end result: a supposed sandbox MMO that isn't a sandbox MMO - it's a ganking/griefing/clan warfare simulator set in a persistent world.  Quake with a grind.

Hopefully, Mortal Online actually succeeds in putting in the core elements of a sandbox game from the start, with systems that support real sandbox play.

Originally posted by -Zeno-
........ wah wah wah, baby wants his bottle.......

Fixed

Originally posted by jrs77

Originally posted by zymurgeist

I've always found it odd that people think you should be punished for killing other players in a Player vs Player game. It's like having a $50 fine for walking on the sidewalk. If you're in an open PvP area you're consenting to PvP. Should games have safe areas is another issue. Non-consensual PvP should be avoided simply because it's bad for revenue. History has shown again and again many people will not play a game where they feel they're being forced to play the victim. gaming companies will always care less about your e-peen than their bottom line.

 

 

 

I repeat myself...

It's just the way how you impement it, and how much safety you provide to those, who don't want to engage in PvP at all.
The system in EvE Online is proof enough, that open world FFA PvP with full loot is interesting enough players, to make for a healthy MMO-population.

If you don't want to go in unsecure areas, it's fine, but you'll miss out 50% of the content of the game and don't get to the high rewards. It's risk vs. reward.

EVE isn't and has never been full loot. It's not even full loss. There are game mechanisms to mitigate your losses. It's also an extremely complex niche game not subject to a simple analysis. It's done extremely well compared to any other superficially similar game  but it's not something easily repeated.

My response to such an idiotic post:

I will post vague crap in order to flex my epeen.

I will try to abuse anything I can in game to get ahead.

I will hack if I can and then try to justify it.

I will pk newbs then think I'm 1337.

I will bitch when a more skilled player kills me when I'm red.

I will cry when a more skilled player destroys me and takes all my gear.

Seriously, people need to just stop. This crap is getting annoying to the extreme. If you think you're hot shit then let the number of people you kill say that. If you need to post usless bs on forums to try to intimidate people then you probably suck.

The funny thing is how PKers have latched onto MO as 'their' game, much like DF before it, and EVE, AC/Darktide, and Ultima before that..  Sure the game has open pvp and looting, but it also has crafting that matters, exploration, housing, pve, and a host of other things that will attract all types of players.  All this blustering nonsense about how people will cry and quit when they're  PK'd is exactly that: nonsense. 

PKers overestimate their own importance, and the impact their activities have on more well-adjusted gamers.  They may inconvenience someone for a couple of minutes, or however long it takes them to respawn, but the reality is that they're just as ineffectual and meaningless in this virtual world as they are in the real one, and won't affect my enjoyment of MO one whit.  It was the same in all the games I mentioned previously.  I'm a crafter and a roleplayer, and I played each of those 'hardcore' titles for years, with much enjoyment.

Oh and on the few occasions that I do manage to kill someone, heaven help their poor little ego if they find out they just got ganked by a carebearing roleplayer.  Oh the humanity.

Originally posted by zymurgeist

I've always found it odd that people think you should be punished for killing other players in a Player vs Player game. It's like having a $50 fine for walking on the sidewalk. If you're in an open PvP area you're consenting to PvP. Should games have safe areas is another issue. Non-consensual PvP should be avoided simply because it's bad for revenue. History has shown again and again many people will not play a game where they feel they're being forced to play the victim. gaming companies will always care less about your e-peen than their bottom line.

 

 

Because there is no such thing as "Moral values" in a game, so they have to be enforced through game mechanics, its pretty simple, most of us wouldnt just kill someone they found on the road while travelling, because this is a game and there are no moral values people will do that, which will in consequence ruin the whole medieval world simulation, MO isnt just about killing other people its a part of the game but there are many other aspects that will be hindered without mechanics that will create some sort of "virtual morality".

Originally posted by -Zeno-

Just like every other hardcore game you have tried.

You cried when you got tank rushed in Red Alert.

You created Trammel.

You ruined Mordred.

You quit Shadowbane at release.

You quit AoC after seeing their patches and community.

You laughed at Darkfall for trying.

You made fun of EVE online because it is a space game.

Why try another hardcore game?

Just like every other self absorbed "hardcore pvp 4life!!" player (and the term is used loosely)

You talked big talk waiting for DF release

You insulted everyone who might of played the game

You made sure to create a horrible community so the game could never grow

You essentially killed DF before it ever launched

Why make sure you do that to another game?

Originally posted by SnarlingWolf

Originally posted by -Zeno-

Just like every other hardcore game you have tried.

You cried when you got tank rushed in Red Alert.

You created Trammel.

You ruined Mordred.

You quit Shadowbane at release.

You quit AoC after seeing their patches and community.

You laughed at Darkfall for trying.

You made fun of EVE online because it is a space game.

Why try another hardcore game?

Just like every other self absorbed "hardcore pvp 4life!!" player (and the term is used loosely)

 

You talked big talk waiting for DF release

 

You insulted everyone who might of played the game

 

You made sure to create a horrible community so the game could never grow

 

You essentially killed DF before it ever launched

 

Why make sure you do that to another game?

umm DF and like it are created exactly for that crowd, they are the target audience, not you.

Only problems with PvP (or rather more like PK in this case) is that people does it half hearted. 

Example:  Maybe I'll PK some random guy over and over again today for fun.

PK is really more of a system that is in place so you can settle your grudge and for a more cut-throat simulation for a game world, when someone just out to kill whoever to prove "self-worth" it almost make the PK system a meaningless thing. 

(Not gonna go into how games don't set the gameworld up for a proper PK system, I can almost write a research paper on it)

PK = Player Killing/Killer/Kill (whichever applies for situation) which is where the so called "griefing" comes from

PvP = Player versus Player which includes PK but applies more to any situation where players compete against each other (Usually direct confrontation through fighting).

There are loopholes in law in real life however you rarely get away clean for violation of law, in game however, there are so many loopholes it's basically anarchy.  (No, I am not talking about the game, I am talking about the word itself)

the only good ffa pvp has Lineage 2 were you take a risk when you pk random ppl. You can loose your items every city guards atks you and so on. Aoc is justa big fail i could kill everthing around me and nothing happend.

Originally posted by zymurgeist

I've always found it odd that people think you should be punished for killing other players in a Player vs Player game. It's like having a $50 fine for walking on the sidewalk. If you're in an open PvP area you're consenting to PvP. Should games have safe areas is another issue. Non-consensual PvP should be avoided simply because it's bad for revenue. History has shown again and again many people will not play a game where they feel they're being forced to play the victim. gaming companies will always care less about your e-peen than their bottom line.

 

 

Life has an open PvP ruleset but there are still penalties for killing. It would be kind of odd if the game world condoned murderers.

Originally posted by skeaser

Originally posted by zymurgeist

I've always found it odd that people think you should be punished for killing other players in a Player vs Player game. It's like having a $50 fine for walking on the sidewalk. If you're in an open PvP area you're consenting to PvP. Should games have safe areas is another issue. Non-consensual PvP should be avoided simply because it's bad for revenue. History has shown again and again many people will not play a game where they feel they're being forced to play the victim. gaming companies will always care less about your e-peen than their bottom line.

 

 

 

Life has an open PvP ruleset but there are still penalties for killing. It would be kind of odd if the game world condoned murderers.

I think this is exactly the case.  Mortal Online is not a "PvP game"; it's an RPG which is trying to create a world in which player characters interact.  It will have PvP in it, but it is supposed to have a number of other things in the game to do as well.  As seen in Darkfall, anarchy fueled by no real consequences makes PvP/ganking/griefing the overwhelmingly dominant playstyle, which aids greatly in killing it as a sandbox game (though the lack of other systems kills it here as well).

It's not Counterstrike.  Like it or not, there has to be some sort of rules that simulate the social contract of society.