There is increased conversation about the legalization of drugs from many different types of Americans. A huge cross section of old and young are warming to the idea of not just medical legalization, but a complete legalization of recreational use.

From the Huffington Post, a recent conversation between a Representative from Tennesee and the FBI Director shows the main argument. The representative got some complete pwnage on the FBI guy:

---

At a House hearing last month, Rep. Steve Cohen, D-Tenn., challenged FBI Director Robert Mueller when Mueller spoke of parents losing their lives to drugs.

"Name me a couple of parents who have lost their lives to marijuana," Cohen said.

"Can't," Mueller replied.

"Exactly. You can't, because that hasn't happened," Cohen said. "Is there some time we're going to see that we ought to prioritize meth, crack, cocaine and heroin, and deal with the drugs that the American culture is really being affected by?"

---

The article also states other factors showing increased acceptance of marijuana for a variety of reasons:

Numerous prominent political leaders, including California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger and former Mexican presidents, have suggested it is time for open debate on legalization.

_Lawmakers in at least three states are considering joining the 13 states that have legalized pot for medical purposes. Massachusetts voters last fall decided to decriminalize possession of an ounce or less of pot; there are now a dozen states that have taken such steps.

_In Congress, Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, and Sen. Jim Webb, D-Va., are among several lawmakers contending that marijuana decriminalization should be studied in re-examining what they deem to be failed U.S. drug policy. "Nothing should be off the table," Webb said.

_National polls show close to half of American adults are now open to legalizing pot _ a constituency encompassing today's college students and the 60-something baby boomers who popularized the drug in their own youth. In California last month, a statewide Field Poll for the first time found 56 percent of voters supporting legalization.

That poll pleased California Assemblyman Tom Ammiano, a San Francisco Democrat who introduced a bill in February to legalize marijuana in a manner similar to alcohol _ taxing sales to adults while barring possession by anyone under 21. Ammiano hopes for a vote by early next year and contends the bill would generate up to $1.3 billion in revenue for his deficit-plagued state.

Ammiano, 67, said he has been heartened by cross-generational and bipartisan support.

"People who initially were very skeptical _ as the polls come in, as the budget situation gets worse _ are having a second look," he said. "Maybe these issues that have been treated as wedge issues aren't anymore. People know the drug war has failed."

Given the talk and worsening of the economy and impact it has on crime, do you think there will be a serious bill ever submitted to Congress about legalization during the next ten years?

Once they know their voters will not abandon them, they will do anything.  Probably quite a few of them have already toked.  I imagine at the same time, quite a few have seen the tokers not really go as far as the sober person beside them and don't wont to think about it at all. 

Depending on what circles you travel in, this has been a serious dicussion for a while man.

It's idiotic that alcohol and cigarettes are legal, while marijuana is criminalized.

To answer your question: Yes.  I think that within the next 10 years we will see serious steps to legalize casual use of marijuana.  Also we will hopefully see a more serious crackdown on heroin and cocaine importation into America due to freed up funds from the cessation of this faux war.

Originally posted by popinjay

Given the talk and worsening of the economy and impact it has on crime, do you think there will be a serious bill ever submitted to Congress about legalization during the next ten years?

Yes, and it's not just the talk that supports this action. There is also a tangible basis for upcoming legislation to decriminalize marijuana. The recent tabacco legislation is a good indicator, as well as the priority of health care reform, to include pharmaceuticals.

It is well known that the tabacco, alcohol, and pharmaceutical industries were always the real power players in keeping marijuana illegal. As long as we move toward reform in those areas, we move closer to reform of marijuana laws.

The best way to go about legalizing marijuana would be for organizations to compromise on an temporary/experimental legalization to see if our country does improve after legalization. But that's only what we should do if we can't outright legalize it.

I won't even read anything said before me. The only drug that should be legalized is marijuana and only for medicinal purposes.

I"m acutely aware that somebody will likely speak of "well how come alcohol is legal?" and it's simple: you can use alcohol and not abuse it. It can be used as a beverage at dinner that rational people can consume without getting negative effects. Drugs on the other hand cannot NOT be abused. If you use a drug, then you are abusing it. While this may not be the primary reason alcohol isn't banned, it's a reason differenciating the two.

Drugs are horrible. They are mutating our society into burnouts and scum. Just listening to the people that are high on Vent or the like digusts me. They aren't making you feel spiritually closer to Earth or whatever you all say... they are placing you into a fantasy. True human beings with a genuine sense of creativity don't need to supplement what they were born with with that junk... it's a sign of weakness.

I'm pro drug war... I hope our society becomes better when it's over.

 It's legal to grow one Marijuana plant in your home for personal use in one of Australia's states.  

That's horrible.

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

I won't even read anything said before me. The only drug that should be legalized is marijuana and only for medicinal purposes.

 

I"m acutely aware that somebody will likely speak of "well how come alcohol is legal?" and it's simple: you can use alcohol and not abuse it. It can be used as a beverage at dinner that rational people can consume without getting negative effects. Drugs on the other hand cannot NOT be abused. If you use a drug, then you are abusing it. While this may not be the primary reason alcohol isn't banned, it's a reason differenciating the two.

 

Drugs are horrible. They are mutating our society into burnouts and scum. Just listening to the people that are high on Vent or the like digusts me. They aren't making you feel spiritually closer to Earth or whatever you all say... they are placing you into a fantasy. True human beings with a genuine sense of creativity don't need to supplement what they were born with with that junk... it's a sign of weakness.

 

I'm pro drug war... I hope our society becomes better when it's over.

That isn't even remotely an argument. What if I brewed marijuana into a tea and then consumed it? Is that using it without abusing it? Face it the only reason you think that alcohol is acceptable is you have been conditioned to think so. The fact of the matter is there isn't a difference between the two. Well that isn't entirely true there is a difference and when compared marijuana is far more favorable.

Furthermore who are you to dictate what I can and cannot consume? If it is my own time, in my own home why should I not be able to consume it, because you don't want me to? That isn't an argument.

Beyond that it is complete nonsense to claim they are mutating our society into "burnouts and scum", in fact I would argue it was your "war on drugs" that induces that nature because the degree to which people are punished does not allow them to integrate back into society and instead leaves them only to a state where it simply does not matter if they abuse again or not.

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

I won't even read anything said before me. The only drug that should be legalized is marijuana and only for medicinal purposes.

 

I"m acutely aware that somebody will likely speak of "well how come alcohol is legal?" and it's simple: you can use alcohol and not abuse it. It can be used as a beverage at dinner that rational people can consume without getting negative effects. Drugs on the other hand cannot NOT be abused. If you use a drug, then you are abusing it. While this may not be the primary reason alcohol isn't banned, it's a reason differenciating the two.

 

Drugs are horrible. They are mutating our society into burnouts and scum. Just listening to the people that are high on Vent or the like digusts me. They aren't making you feel spiritually closer to Earth or whatever you all say... they are placing you into a fantasy. True human beings with a genuine sense of creativity don't need to supplement what they were born with with that junk... it's a sign of weakness.

 

I'm pro drug war... I hope our society becomes better when it's over.

Another person who wants to control what other people can or cannot do.
 

This so called "negative effect" you are talking about isn't harming anybody else. the negative effects of Alcahol has cost far more lives.
 
Some people like the taste of alcahol, some people like marijuana.

If we're going to ban everything that has a negative side effect, wow, we can ban a lot of things. We can ban all unhealthy food, or we could ban cigaretes.

Other people using marijuana is simply none of your business.

Originally posted by Squirt5

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

I won't even read anything said before me. The only drug that should be legalized is marijuana and only for medicinal purposes.

 

I"m acutely aware that somebody will likely speak of "well how come alcohol is legal?" and it's simple: you can use alcohol and not abuse it. It can be used as a beverage at dinner that rational people can consume without getting negative effects. Drugs on the other hand cannot NOT be abused. If you use a drug, then you are abusing it. While this may not be the primary reason alcohol isn't banned, it's a reason differenciating the two.

 

Drugs are horrible. They are mutating our society into burnouts and scum. Just listening to the people that are high on Vent or the like digusts me. They aren't making you feel spiritually closer to Earth or whatever you all say... they are placing you into a fantasy. True human beings with a genuine sense of creativity don't need to supplement what they were born with with that junk... it's a sign of weakness.

 

I'm pro drug war... I hope our society becomes better when it's over.

 

That isn't even remotely an argument. What if I brewed marijuana into a tea and then consumed it? Is that using it without abusing it?

If it will give you a negative effect, then you are abusing it.

Face it the only reason you think that alcohol is acceptable is you have been conditioned to think so. The fact of the matter is there isn't a difference between the two. Well that isn't entirely true there is a difference and when compared marijuana is far more favorable.

Alcohol can be used without being abused. A rational person can consume and alcoholic beverage and not negatively affect them like drugs do, for example. The same type of erratic behavior that a person who would want to get high has, is the behavior a person who drinks to get drunk has. When using a drug, there is no way to use it without having the negative effect, and therefore it cannot be used without being abused. I would say that the same person who would do drugs should be restricted from using alcohol as they have not exhibited responsible behavior.

Furthermore who are you to dictate what I can and cannot consume? If it is my own time, in my own home why should I not be able to consume it, because you don't want me to? That isn't an argument.

The society you live in. We should come to the conclusion that people who are using these substances shouldn't be accepted and we should make further attempts to strictly regulate these substances to make them impossible to obtain and encourage the populace to lead healthy, successful lifestyles.

Beyond that it is complete nonsense to claim they are mutating our society into "burnouts and scum", in fact I would argue it was your "war on drugs" that induces that nature because the degree to which people are punished does not allow them to integrate back into society and instead leaves them only to a state where it simply does not matter if they abuse again or not.

Such a punishment is supposed to serve as an example to you to show you the consequences of your wrongful actions. Those people made their bad decisions and now are paying for them.

Originally posted by Gameloading

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

I won't even read anything said before me. The only drug that should be legalized is marijuana and only for medicinal purposes.

 

I"m acutely aware that somebody will likely speak of "well how come alcohol is legal?" and it's simple: you can use alcohol and not abuse it. It can be used as a beverage at dinner that rational people can consume without getting negative effects. Drugs on the other hand cannot NOT be abused. If you use a drug, then you are abusing it. While this may not be the primary reason alcohol isn't banned, it's a reason differenciating the two.

 

Drugs are horrible. They are mutating our society into burnouts and scum. Just listening to the people that are high on Vent or the like digusts me. They aren't making you feel spiritually closer to Earth or whatever you all say... they are placing you into a fantasy. True human beings with a genuine sense of creativity don't need to supplement what they were born with with that junk... it's a sign of weakness.

 

I'm pro drug war... I hope our society becomes better when it's over.

Another person who wants to control what other people can or cannot do.

Yes.
 

This so called "negative effect" you are talking about isn't harming anybody else. the negative effects of Alcahol has cost far more lives.

Because people turn a neutral substance into something hostile with their erratic behavior.
 
Some people like the taste of alcahol, some people like marijuana.

And the ones who like the taste of alcohol are in the clear, so long as they do not abuse the substance. However you cannot use a drug without abusing it.

If we're going to ban everything that has a negative side effect, wow, we can ban a lot of things. We can ban all unhealthy food, or we could ban cigaretes.

Those things that cannot be used without being abused should be banned. Cigarettes cause damage to the lungs but that problem is too deeply ingrained into our society... the tobacco industries are way too huge to be taken down at this point and to do so would cause further problems. It's unfortunately a necessary, however unfortunate, evil. The best we can do is encourage people to utilize good judgement which is an impossible thing to ask.

Other people using marijuana is simply none of your business.

It is.

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

I won't even read anything said before me. The only drug that should be legalized is marijuana and only for medicinal purposes.

 

I"m acutely aware that somebody will likely speak of "well how come alcohol is legal?" and it's simple: you can use alcohol and not abuse it. It can be used as a beverage at dinner that rational people can consume without getting negative effects. Drugs on the other hand cannot NOT be abused. If you use a drug, then you are abusing it. While this may not be the primary reason alcohol isn't banned, it's a reason differenciating the two.

 

Drugs are horrible. They are mutating our society into burnouts and scum. Just listening to the people that are high on Vent or the like digusts me. They aren't making you feel spiritually closer to Earth or whatever you all say... they are placing you into a fantasy. True human beings with a genuine sense of creativity don't need to supplement what they were born with with that junk... it's a sign of weakness.

 

I'm pro drug war... I hope our society becomes better when it's over.

I'm won't even go into the legalising of drugs arguement.

But to say blatantly that someone can consume ANY alcohol and not be affected in a negative way is so wrong. I can't even believe that you are saying this. And at the same time that  ANY consumption of weed has a negative effect.

[Mod Edit]

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

Originally posted by Squirt5

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

I won't even read anything said before me. The only drug that should be legalized is marijuana and only for medicinal purposes.

 

I"m acutely aware that somebody will likely speak of "well how come alcohol is legal?" and it's simple: you can use alcohol and not abuse it. It can be used as a beverage at dinner that rational people can consume without getting negative effects. Drugs on the other hand cannot NOT be abused. If you use a drug, then you are abusing it. While this may not be the primary reason alcohol isn't banned, it's a reason differenciating the two.

 

Drugs are horrible. They are mutating our society into burnouts and scum. Just listening to the people that are high on Vent or the like digusts me. They aren't making you feel spiritually closer to Earth or whatever you all say... they are placing you into a fantasy. True human beings with a genuine sense of creativity don't need to supplement what they were born with with that junk... it's a sign of weakness.

 

I'm pro drug war... I hope our society becomes better when it's over.

 

That isn't even remotely an argument. What if I brewed marijuana into a tea and then consumed it? Is that using it without abusing it?

If it will give you a negative effect, then you are abusing it.

Face it the only reason you think that alcohol is acceptable is you have been conditioned to think so. The fact of the matter is there isn't a difference between the two. Well that isn't entirely true there is a difference and when compared marijuana is far more favorable.

Alcohol can be used without being abused. A rational person can consume and alcoholic beverage and not negatively affect them like drugs do, for example. The same type of erratic behavior that a person who would want to get high has, is the behavior a person who drinks to get drunk has. When using a drug, there is no way to use it without having the negative effect, and therefore it cannot be used without being abused. I would say that the same person who would do drugs should be restricted from using alcohol as they have not exhibited responsible behavior.

Furthermore who are you to dictate what I can and cannot consume? If it is my own time, in my own home why should I not be able to consume it, because you don't want me to? That isn't an argument.

The society you live in. We should come to the conclusion that people who are using these substances shouldn't be accepted and we should make further attempts to strictly regulate these substances to make them impossible to obtain and encourage the populace to lead healthy, successful lifestyles.

Beyond that it is complete nonsense to claim they are mutating our society into "burnouts and scum", in fact I would argue it was your "war on drugs" that induces that nature because the degree to which people are punished does not allow them to integrate back into society and instead leaves them only to a state where it simply does not matter if they abuse again or not.

Such a punishment is supposed to serve as an example to you to show you the consequences of your wrongful actions. Those people made their bad decisions and now are paying for them.

What are you defining as a "negative effect"? There are people who will become completely intoxicated after one beer, one glass of wine, or one shot of any liquor. Are they abusing according to you? It would seem so under that pretense alcohol should be illegal correct?

People simply don't drink alcohol because it is a liquid, they do it because of the effects of the intoxication. The degree to which you get intoxicated is controlled by you, some people do it to get "drunk" others do it to get a "buzz", why? Because it feels good to them and they enjoy that feeling and those who do it "rationally" do not inflict harm on others. That's why the "abuse" of alcohol is illegal because it does inflict harm on other people who may have chosen not to consume. Similarly a person can control the same factors in consuming marijuana and other drugs. Similarly there are those who abuse and cannot control themselves, that is what the law is there for and what drug rehab is for. Simple consumption is not abuse.

You say we should come to that conclusion but you have offered nothing to support that conclusion. Are the people who have chosen to consume these substances on their own time still productive members of society when not on their time? Yes, they are doctors, politicians, scientists, firemen, policemen, and teachers. They simply enjoy the intoxication that results from consuming these substances; what is "unhealthy" about that?

Furthermore what good is that punishment if it prevents them from re-entering society as normal? If they can't re-integrate why should they not abuse again? They'll get punished again and be right back where they were left off when they were first punished? Punishment is fine but if that punishment is completely debilitating it serves no purpose.

For alcohol I am speaking of becoming drunk. That is the target negative effect. It is possible to drink without becoming drunk. The way you word that, I am sure that if you really thought about it and provided circular logic, you could conclude that everything has a negative effect, but that isn't what I am saying.

When you use marijuana, it gets you high. When you drink an alcoholic beverage, it will not certainly get you drunk, unless if you consume a large amount of it (or a little amount of it depending on the beverage).

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

For alcohol I am speaking of becoming drunk. That is the target negative effect. It is possible to drink without becoming drunk. The way you word that, I am sure that if you really thought about it and provided circular logic, you could conclude that everything has a negative effect, but that isn't what I am saying.

When you use marijuana, it gets you high. When you drink an alcoholic beverage, it will not certainly get you drunk, unless if you consume a large amount of it (or a little amount of it depending on the beverage).

As I already mentioned, which you have ignored, study has shown that even having a tiny bit of alcohol, like just 1 beer, has a negative effect on persons judgement and driving capabilities. Studies has also proven that little bits of alcohol has a negative affect on the brain even at a blood percentage level of 0.01%. To compare, the driving limit is 0.08%

Originally posted by Squirt5

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

Originally posted by Squirt5

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

I won't even read anything said before me. The only drug that should be legalized is marijuana and only for medicinal purposes.

 

I"m acutely aware that somebody will likely speak of "well how come alcohol is legal?" and it's simple: you can use alcohol and not abuse it. It can be used as a beverage at dinner that rational people can consume without getting negative effects. Drugs on the other hand cannot NOT be abused. If you use a drug, then you are abusing it. While this may not be the primary reason alcohol isn't banned, it's a reason differenciating the two.

 

Drugs are horrible. They are mutating our society into burnouts and scum. Just listening to the people that are high on Vent or the like digusts me. They aren't making you feel spiritually closer to Earth or whatever you all say... they are placing you into a fantasy. True human beings with a genuine sense of creativity don't need to supplement what they were born with with that junk... it's a sign of weakness.

 

I'm pro drug war... I hope our society becomes better when it's over.

 

That isn't even remotely an argument. What if I brewed marijuana into a tea and then consumed it? Is that using it without abusing it?

If it will give you a negative effect, then you are abusing it.

Face it the only reason you think that alcohol is acceptable is you have been conditioned to think so. The fact of the matter is there isn't a difference between the two. Well that isn't entirely true there is a difference and when compared marijuana is far more favorable.

Alcohol can be used without being abused. A rational person can consume and alcoholic beverage and not negatively affect them like drugs do, for example. The same type of erratic behavior that a person who would want to get high has, is the behavior a person who drinks to get drunk has. When using a drug, there is no way to use it without having the negative effect, and therefore it cannot be used without being abused. I would say that the same person who would do drugs should be restricted from using alcohol as they have not exhibited responsible behavior.

Furthermore who are you to dictate what I can and cannot consume? If it is my own time, in my own home why should I not be able to consume it, because you don't want me to? That isn't an argument.

The society you live in. We should come to the conclusion that people who are using these substances shouldn't be accepted and we should make further attempts to strictly regulate these substances to make them impossible to obtain and encourage the populace to lead healthy, successful lifestyles.

Beyond that it is complete nonsense to claim they are mutating our society into "burnouts and scum", in fact I would argue it was your "war on drugs" that induces that nature because the degree to which people are punished does not allow them to integrate back into society and instead leaves them only to a state where it simply does not matter if they abuse again or not.

Such a punishment is supposed to serve as an example to you to show you the consequences of your wrongful actions. Those people made their bad decisions and now are paying for them.

 

What are you defining as a "negative effect"? There are people who will become completely intoxicated after one beer, one glass of wine, or one shot of any liquor. Are they abusing according to you? It would seem so under that pretense alcohol should be illegal correct?

People simply don't drink alcohol because it is a liquid, they do it because of the effects of the intoxication. The degree to which you get intoxicated is controlled by you, some people do it to get "drunk" others do it to get a "buzz", why? Because it feels good to them and they enjoy that feeling and those who do it "rationally" do not inflict harm on others. That's why the "abuse" of alcohol is illegal because it does inflict harm on other people who may have chosen not to consume. Similarly a person can control the same factors in consuming marijuana and other drugs. Similarly there are those who abuse and cannot control themselves, that is what the law is there for and what drug rehab is for. Simple consumption is not abuse.

You say we should come to that conclusion but you have offered nothing to support that conclusion. Are the people who have chosen to consume these substances on their own time still productive members of society when not on their time? Yes, they are doctors, politicians, scientists, firemen, policemen, and teachers. They simply enjoy the intoxication that results from consuming these substances; what is "unhealthy" about that?

Furthermore what good is that punishment if it prevents them from re-entering society as normal? If they can't re-integrate why should they not abuse again? They'll get punished again and be right back where they were left of when they were done? Punishment is fine but if that punishment is completely debilitating it serves no purpose.

Yes. If it takes so little for them to become intoxicated after so little, then they should refrain from drinking it entirely. Alcohol shouldn't be illegal as it isn't certain to provide intoxication unless if moderation isn't applied.

Many people drink red wine, for example, as they believe that it can lead to positive effects for your blood. Not all people use alcohol to get a buzz or intoxicated.

I'm saying that abusing the substance is when it gives you an effect. In that sense, it is possible to use alcohol without getting the intoxication effect (as allegedly everything in existence gives you a negative effect in some way). It's not possible to use marijuana without getting the high effect, which is abusing the substance.

Then that is their choice to accept that punishment... they belong there for their actions.

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

Originally posted by Squirt5

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

Originally posted by Squirt5

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

I won't even read anything said before me. The only drug that should be legalized is marijuana and only for medicinal purposes.

 

I"m acutely aware that somebody will likely speak of "well how come alcohol is legal?" and it's simple: you can use alcohol and not abuse it. It can be used as a beverage at dinner that rational people can consume without getting negative effects. Drugs on the other hand cannot NOT be abused. If you use a drug, then you are abusing it. While this may not be the primary reason alcohol isn't banned, it's a reason differenciating the two.

 

Drugs are horrible. They are mutating our society into burnouts and scum. Just listening to the people that are high on Vent or the like digusts me. They aren't making you feel spiritually closer to Earth or whatever you all say... they are placing you into a fantasy. True human beings with a genuine sense of creativity don't need to supplement what they were born with with that junk... it's a sign of weakness.

 

I'm pro drug war... I hope our society becomes better when it's over.

 

That isn't even remotely an argument. What if I brewed marijuana into a tea and then consumed it? Is that using it without abusing it?

If it will give you a negative effect, then you are abusing it.

Face it the only reason you think that alcohol is acceptable is you have been conditioned to think so. The fact of the matter is there isn't a difference between the two. Well that isn't entirely true there is a difference and when compared marijuana is far more favorable.

Alcohol can be used without being abused. A rational person can consume and alcoholic beverage and not negatively affect them like drugs do, for example. The same type of erratic behavior that a person who would want to get high has, is the behavior a person who drinks to get drunk has. When using a drug, there is no way to use it without having the negative effect, and therefore it cannot be used without being abused. I would say that the same person who would do drugs should be restricted from using alcohol as they have not exhibited responsible behavior.

Furthermore who are you to dictate what I can and cannot consume? If it is my own time, in my own home why should I not be able to consume it, because you don't want me to? That isn't an argument.

The society you live in. We should come to the conclusion that people who are using these substances shouldn't be accepted and we should make further attempts to strictly regulate these substances to make them impossible to obtain and encourage the populace to lead healthy, successful lifestyles.

Beyond that it is complete nonsense to claim they are mutating our society into "burnouts and scum", in fact I would argue it was your "war on drugs" that induces that nature because the degree to which people are punished does not allow them to integrate back into society and instead leaves them only to a state where it simply does not matter if they abuse again or not.

Such a punishment is supposed to serve as an example to you to show you the consequences of your wrongful actions. Those people made their bad decisions and now are paying for them.

 

What are you defining as a "negative effect"? There are people who will become completely intoxicated after one beer, one glass of wine, or one shot of any liquor. Are they abusing according to you? It would seem so under that pretense alcohol should be illegal correct?

People simply don't drink alcohol because it is a liquid, they do it because of the effects of the intoxication. The degree to which you get intoxicated is controlled by you, some people do it to get "drunk" others do it to get a "buzz", why? Because it feels good to them and they enjoy that feeling and those who do it "rationally" do not inflict harm on others. That's why the "abuse" of alcohol is illegal because it does inflict harm on other people who may have chosen not to consume. Similarly a person can control the same factors in consuming marijuana and other drugs. Similarly there are those who abuse and cannot control themselves, that is what the law is there for and what drug rehab is for. Simple consumption is not abuse.

You say we should come to that conclusion but you have offered nothing to support that conclusion. Are the people who have chosen to consume these substances on their own time still productive members of society when not on their time? Yes, they are doctors, politicians, scientists, firemen, policemen, and teachers. They simply enjoy the intoxication that results from consuming these substances; what is "unhealthy" about that?

Furthermore what good is that punishment if it prevents them from re-entering society as normal? If they can't re-integrate why should they not abuse again? They'll get punished again and be right back where they were left of when they were done? Punishment is fine but if that punishment is completely debilitating it serves no purpose.

Yes. If it takes so little for them to become intoxicated after so little, then they should refrain from drinking it entirely. Alcohol shouldn't be illegal as it isn't certain to provide intoxication unless if moderation isn't applied.

Many people drink red wine, for example, as they believe that it can lead to positive effects for your blood. Not all people use alcohol to get a buzz or intoxicated.

I'm saying that abusing the substance is when it gives you an effect. In that sense, it is possible to use alcohol without getting the intoxication effect (as allegedly everything in existence gives you a negative effect in some way). It's not possible to use marijuana without getting the high effect, which is abusing the substance.

Then that is their choice to accept that punishment... they belong there for their actions.

 

It is not possible to drink alcohol without having negative side effect.
 

Go do some actual research, something which you have clearly haven't done.
Marijuana does have positive effect, far more than red wine does.

this includes pain relief, helping with meditation (yoga), stress relief, and problems with gaining weigth.

Originally posted by Gameloading

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

For alcohol I am speaking of becoming drunk. That is the target negative effect. It is possible to drink without becoming drunk. The way you word that, I am sure that if you really thought about it and provided circular logic, you could conclude that everything has a negative effect, but that isn't what I am saying.

When you use marijuana, it gets you high. When you drink an alcoholic beverage, it will not certainly get you drunk, unless if you consume a large amount of it (or a little amount of it depending on the beverage).

 

As I already mentioned, which you have ignored, study has shown that even having a tiny bit of alcohol, like just 1 beer, has a negative effect on persons judgement and driving capabilities. Studies has also proven that little bits of alcohol has a negative affect on the brain even at a blood percentage level of 0.01%. To compare, the driving limit is 0.08%

 

I didn't ignore anything. That negative effect is not the full intoxication effect. Studies can prove that a significant amount of everyday things could have negative effects on you, but they are irrelevant. Since they have set the limit to .08%, then they have concluded that the negative effects of it on you aren't evident enough to impair judgement enough to affect their driving ability. Otherwise, you wouldn't be able to drive with any alcohol in your system at all were it to have that much of an affect on your ability to drive.

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

Originally posted by Gameloading

Originally posted by zchmrkenhoff

For alcohol I am speaking of becoming drunk. That is the target negative effect. It is possible to drink without becoming drunk. The way you word that, I am sure that if you really thought about it and provided circular logic, you could conclude that everything has a negative effect, but that isn't what I am saying.

When you use marijuana, it gets you high. When you drink an alcoholic beverage, it will not certainly get you drunk, unless if you consume a large amount of it (or a little amount of it depending on the beverage).

 

As I already mentioned, which you have ignored, study has shown that even having a tiny bit of alcohol, like just 1 beer, has a negative effect on persons judgement and driving capabilities. Studies has also proven that little bits of alcohol has a negative affect on the brain even at a blood percentage level of 0.01%. To compare, the driving limit is 0.08%

 

I didn't ignore anything. That negative effect is not the full intoxication effect. Studies can prove that a significant amount of everyday things could have negative effects on you, but they are irrelevant. Since they have set the limit to .08%, then they have concluded that the negative effects of it on you aren't evident enough to impair judgement enough to affect their driving ability. Otherwise, you wouldn't be able to drive with any alcohol in your system at all were it to have that much of an affect on your ability to drive.

[Mod Edit]
The negative effects of marijuana are also completely irrelevant and neglectabe, Thats why we have been trying to tell you that you saying it should be banned just because it has a negative effect is not an argument.