What is it about EVE.  I have been playing it off and on for 2 years and the player base just keeps growing while other MMOs are contracting?  Is it the sandbox gameplay? Great updates?  Great CS?  I logged into some old MMOs I used to play and they are mostly ghost towns.  I log into EVE now and theres 30k+ ppl online. 

Discuss.

its pretty much all of those things in eve there is pretty much something that everyone likes and dislikes so u bound to find something in it to enjoy to try it out. also ccp sells box versions of the game now seen them at walmart. that also is why u see more people

IMO, I honestly couldn't tell you, the game is incredibly boring. I'm guessing at least 30% of their subs are people with multiple accounts though.

Versatility mostly. You can change the way you play the game to suit your own tastes, even changing tastes, over time.

This is the example I'll make...

According to Vivendi financials WoW keeps growing.

EvE keeps growing....

WoW is basicly like almost every MMO on the market (so they shrink).

EvE is fairly unique now as many of the games which were somewhat like it were changed more the other way (towards eq/wow whatever example you want to use).

It makes sense to me... people that don't like what most of the market is shoveling will try EvE.   That's why I often talk about going for the market segment most people aren't going after...

Originally posted by jusomdude

IMO, I honestly couldn't tell you, the game is incredibly boring. I'm guessing at least 30% of their subs are people with multiple accounts though.

Eve is boring for people that find thinking boring. Eve is boring for people that need to be told what to do.  Eve is boring for people that lack imagination.

For people that love problem solving, love a challenge, and love complexity, Eve has no equal in the gaming world.

This is the reason the game always grows- once you've played Eve, every other game is fluff.  Some of it is FUN fluff, but it's fluff just the same.  I can honestly say if Eve didn't exist I'd walk away from MMOs completely.

When a game can manage to keep you engaged for 5+ years (pretty common for people that get it)  even a small infux of new players will keep the game growing.

 Because they just re-entered the retail market with a boxed version of Apocrypha.

That, and quite simply the game is constantly getting bigger and better. While most MMOs make old content obsolete (look at EQ2, 90% of the content is old and obsolete), the old content in Eve is still playable, profitable, and needed for the economy.

Once walking in stations hits it's really going to explode.

First: lack of competition

I'm personally sick of EVE, left after playing for better than 2 years, but even I am tempted to go back because there is NO ONE else doing anything notable in the Space genre, sandbox or not. Easy to dominate a niche market when no one else is in it. JGE looks to be trainwrecking nicely, so I doubt they will see any competition soon.

Second: visibility and access

They just re-launched with a big media ad blitz and new retail boxes. You can download the game and try it free. 

Third: stability

It's a stable and mostly bug-free game; you may not like some of the gameplay but the vast majority of it works

Fourth: casual friendly

The whole offline skill training thing attracts many players who cannot or will not spend the 29hrs+ a week logged in that most MMOs assume to progress

and Lastly: multiple accounts

Really can't ignore this one, it is a competitive game where there are definate advantages to having and using multiple accounts, enough so that a significant minority (15,20 maybe even 30%) of the playerbase have 2,3,4 accounts in use.

Originally posted by mechtech256

 Because they just re-entered the retail market with a boxed version of Apocrypha.

 

That, and quite simply the game is constantly getting bigger and better. While most MMOs make old content obsolete (look at EQ2, 90% of the content is old and obsolete), the old content in Eve is still playable, profitable, and needed for the economy.

 

Once walking in stations hits it's really going to explode.

Honestly I think stations are going to kill a lot of the magic that makes the game work. Good point about the content though. EVE just keeps getting deeper.

 EVE keeps growing because the entire game IS end-game.  Most of the latest MMOs have been following the WoW-style quest oriented (and level-based) system.  That can be a lot of fun if done right, but you will run out of content at some point.  Since those games focus entirely on the created content, there's essentially very little else to do.  Arena and PvP in WoW are probably the most sustainable activities long term, but even those are fairly limited.  Additionally, while you can make a name for yourself on one server, most modern MMOs have multiple servers and you are likely completely unknown on the others.

On the other end of the spectrum is EVE.  Aside from the mission stories (which aren't generally that in-depth), everything is up to the player.  In fact, this tends to be one of the major problems for some new people... too much to do with little overt indication that it can actually be done.  You can decide whether you want to run missions (boring IMHO, but good money), mine (also boring IMHO), scan for exploration sites, scan for ships running missions to steal their crap, haul valuable stuff through potentially dangerous territories, find people to shoot at, go on a low or null sec adventure, manufacture stuff, trade on the market (sometimes more interesting than it sounds), scam people (boo!), find wormholes to unknown space or the other side of the galaxy, fight corp wars, faction warfare, etc.

There's tons to add to that if you join a good corp or get established in null sec space.  Additionally, many of those things have a lot of depth and complexity when you start focusing in on them.  For instance, you could be part of a small mercenary corp.  If you happen to know more about locator agents, good ship builds, sneaky tactics, basic scanning, and just plain playing it smart, you can trounce a well established corp in a war.  And have a blast doing it.

The game is doing well because it frees you up to do whatever you want.  Expanding the content is easy too... since it's in space, they can add physical locations easily.  New items and ship-types mean new opportunities at all levels - component gathering or mining, manufacturing, new tactics for pilots.  I could probably go on for awhile, but I'll stop here.  :)

EDIT: Eesh, all that and I somehow didn't even mention the whole "real danger" aspect.  You get blown up, you lose a ship and its equipment.  It effects several areas of the game, and makes the economy work quite well since there is constant demand for various components and ships.  Even if that sounds scary, it's really not bad once you get used to it.  You have to weigh the risks in any given activity and decide if you can afford it.  Makes things seem a little more substantial and purposeful.

I think there is a very simple answer to the original question

1.- In Eve alt characters are actually useful and you don't train them just to do the same stuff with a different character class. You train them to do different things with them alltogether.

2.- Multiple characters can be controlled simultaneously with relative ease on a multi-client/multi-screen setup. I dare any WoW/Lotro/EQ player to have a shot at that. And i predict unless you have 6 arms and at least 2 brains you gonna be in trouble.

3.- ISK farmers, ISK scammers, Macros and what not. I'm not even gonna start ranting on about this particular part.

I have been in small size gangs of lets say 10-12 ships where the actual number of people flying them was like 4 or 5. And i'm sure all of you have seen the same. Then there's players with 5,6 or even more accounts with  all chars very specialized for different tasks. Personally i know of a guy with 9 accounts. So with every ONE actual NEW player joining the game, it's only a matter of time before that person will have multiple accounts...i take it you catch my drift.

Having said all this one fact remains...i concede that: The number of players online you see when you log in has risen. But in my opinion a lot of that has to do with the game having been released in a box version now.

To be honest Ive always loved EVE but found at some point the subscription a bit too pricey.. we have a family of gamers who all play a subscribed game - thats up to 4 active accounts without sub accounts for either EVE, WOW or whatever the flavour of the month is.

EVE can now be played for "free" effectivly, with the new ability to buy ingame time with ISK via the ingame markets securely.

EVE is the game that has 10,000 plus zones with 9995 zones that have the exact same skybox pasted into it right?. That's the game where talking about right? The scenic redundancy of the game is what killed it for my experience. 

That and the fact there is an actual specified UP and DOWN in the game. Some space zones are actually tilted down so you can only pan around your spaceship in that certain angle. This isn't a space game folks, they are just hiding all the trees.

1. What evidence to you put fourth to suggest other mmo's are in decline? I'm not saying they are but I find the basis of your observation to be flawed.  Vangaurds numbers are going up, its a (big) themepark......are you saying games like Warhammer on the decline? 

2. Its easy to hold a niche when you're the only game in town in that niche.  Eve is a great game but it has a lot of ultra boring aspects to it. (I realize this leaves me open to the purists who will say I dont have the brain capacity to handle eve.  I find people who insult others because they 'don't get Eve' to be less intelligent than they pretend.

3. Free content updates help out a lot. This, along with their sustained and agressive ad campaigns really, really help.

4. I resubbed a few months ago and I found that there were a LOT of newer accounts. 2008++

5. You can not rule out extra accounts. Many people who play the game seriously have two accounts.  So although this doesnt matter to CCP's bottom line.....when it says there are 40k people logged in there are probably more like (pulling numbers out of thin air) 20-30k people actually online.

I think its great to see CCP do well with Eve. Despite my own personal reservations about the game (I guess i'm just a ADD unenlighted person) I find aspects to the game to be very grindy.   I do not however, necessairly agree with the OP because his observations are purely subjective. I have found that people tend to use the word "failure" to an MMO as it reflects their own personal desires.   Games would not be in operation if they were not operating in the black so the very fact that you're able to play any online game suggests the population is at least above crtical mass.....and in some cases is not in decline.

I love it!!! It's like these guys are all butt hurt that Eve actually gains subs every year!

"Eve is boring" "Eve isn't a space game" Eve is all Alt accounts" "It's Because of a Retail Box" LOL!!!!!!!!!

This is really sad!!!

Wanna know why Eve's subs grow year after year? The game is unique to anything on the market today.

While we had 10,000 EQ/WoW clones on the market eve is the only Sci-fi themed Sandbox with risk, depth and complexity.

Make all the excuses you guys want Eve is designed to evolve over the next 20 years!!! I will be reading "eve is boring threads when im 50 while millions are playing eve.

the sheer scale of what you can do.  Feel like trading ore from one station to the next for a little bit of cash?  go for it.  Feel like operation multi-million ISK trade routes through lowsec space?  go for it.  Feel like blowing the crap out of pirates or pillaging unwise players?  go for it.  Feel like feeding the huge industry used to churn out all those ships?  go for it.

I think there is enough content in EVE to please most people and is separate enough from each other (read: not have to grind out mobs to mine most of the time, and the fact that you can get by without firing a single shot) that people aren't forced into anything.

of course the reason why it's not mainstream is due to the sheer complexity of the game but even then, that appeals to some players.

Originally posted by Death1942

the sheer scale of what you can do.  Feel like trading ore from one station to the next for a little bit of cash?  go for it.  Feel like operation multi-million ISK trade routes through lowsec space?  go for it.  Feel like blowing the crap out of pirates or pillaging unwise players?  go for it.  Feel like feeding the huge industry used to churn out all those ships?  go for it.

 

I think there is enough content in EVE to please most people and is separate enough from each other (read: not have to grind out mobs to mine most of the time, and the fact that you can get by without firing a single shot) that people aren't forced into anything.

 

of course the reason why it's not mainstream is due to the sheer complexity of the game but even then, that appeals to some players.

I'd much rather have sex with 1 really hot women than 500 ugly tramps in 50 different countries. Especially if you where required to read a manual because the ladies where so complex it boggled the mind. Freedom isn't that wonderful.

just imo

Good Question, I have not bothered to read the other replies as at the end of page one it looked like the start of a flame war...

IMO, I think its the constant expansions, new stuff being added all the time, the game is not static, its moving all the time, also helps that CCP have a vision of where they want to take the game, I believe they have a ten year plan....

Plus the harsh dark side of the game, its as close to being realistic without being unplayable

I think eve will continue to grow, with such thing in the works as Walking In Stations, and later on, plantery interactions, possibley a whole side mmo based on the man game with ground battles, the possibilities are endless

also just thought of something else, the fact that you are not restricted to a specific career path or specific euipment of ships, if you train the skills you can do whatever you like, but we all know the game requires you to have a brain which some may find off putting but to others can equally be attractive

Here's a quick answer:

Almost all MMO's that are new are trying to be WoW, or WoW Killers.

WoW is like all other MMO's

Eve is neither of the above.

Longer answer:
AoC impelented mounted combat, and gore. (WoW is bringing in mounted combat, there's a little more gore too)
Warhammer introduced whatever they did (WoW is probably bringing in whatever too)
X MMO had a great (X) idea (WoW will probably do that too).

Blizzard is good at what they do, they like ideas, not only that but they do it well.
AoC was a flop, there were many holes, but it had great ideas.
WoW and Blizzard have the backing, and the great experience of all things, and they will implement it, and people will love it, not only that but MOST of the people that play the game will love it. Argent Tournament anyone?

The reason Eve is so big is because it's nothing like WoW, it doesn't try to kill WoW, it's just what it is, a sandbox, linear outline, but you make the game do what you want to do. The quests are repetetive, sure, but there's different ways to go about it, etc.

Want to make money? Be industrial, or a pirate, or a mission runner.
Want a risky life? Be industrial in low sec, a pirate, or a mission runner in low sec.
Or whatever else.

I play Eve and WoW, and have a high level AoC character.
I'll be paying for Eve only soon.

eve morning restarts, grrrrr, cant wait to log in, get a load of ore before work, I have 4 accounts myself and just started playing again, the only game that may be close to this is alganon, if any of you were at the dev chat last night you will see why, with the offline training, and learning skills and building a skill library for everything, it appears that alganon will be the equivelant of the fantasy eve, they also have ten years mapped out from when it goes live, definatly going to check alganon out when it hits, maybe ill split up 2 accounts for eve and 2 accounts for alganon.