Originally posted by ktanner3

Far as your other criteria about it "having legs", no Star Trek film ever did what you are demanding of this one. Trek has never had a movie that dominated a summer. In fact, Trek usually came out in the winter season because it was never good enough to compete in the summer. The mere fact that this one has already trounced "Wolverine" and is now surpassing Angels and Demons is very impressive. With the negative reviews I've been seeing for the latest Terminator movie, don't be surprised if Trek finishes a close second for the memorial day weekend. 

First, it is way to early to say it will gross over 300 mil, it may well top off at mid 200 Mil with the 3rd weekend decline, week foreign take, and T4 as competition this weekend.  Second, I clearly pointed out the context in which I was making that statement with the top three ST movies prior to JJ's ST raking in 3 to 1 or higher in terms of budget to gross.  Whatever ST tops out at it is not going to be anywhere near those in profit to cost and that is an important consideration.  Kahn brought in 11 times its budget in gross, Voyage Home 4 times its budget in gross, First Contact was 3 times its budget.  JJ's ST might not even bring in a 1:1 return on its budget.  The point being that the old ST they so willingly tossed aside to make way for JJ's ST was pretty good, until the last couple, at bringing in a good ROI.  

Again, we shall see this weekend, if ST holds where it was for last weekend it could be on its way to being a $300 Mil gross but if it tapers off another 40% to 60% it is unlikely it will end up grossing more than $260/$270 Mil (remember how weak ST is oversees, this film and traditionally ST is substantially weaker worldwide than other such films - this ST around low 30% of gross in foreign with most such movies around mid 40%).  Currently ST is around $238 Mil WW which means it is likely to need to or more weekends at its current take to approach $300+ Mil and the likelihood is this weekend will drop off half or more from last weekend and next weekend perhaps the same again.  Spending $150-$160 Mil to make JJ's ST and bringing in WW $250 to $280 Mil is a success but far from a blockbuster is all I am saying.  In the end, ST is likely to net not much more than good ST movies of old (not even adjusted for inflation and ticket prices).

Originally posted by ktanner3

Based on your own criteria, this latest Star Trek movie is the most profitable of them all. It cost $150 million to make and will end up grossing more than $300 million.Even factoring in inflation for the other films won't make a difference. This one is the most profitable. 

The Box Office Mojo site had an interesting comment saying that this ST is the "fifth biggest Star Trek movie, adjusted for ticket price inflation".  Surely it has more money to earn but it is likely to taper off dramatically over this weekend and next weekend.  So having a $150-$160 budget and well through its likely best weeks it is only 5th all time (about dead middle) in ST movies and we are to believe this is a raging blockbuster? 

And FYI - ST its first day (a Thursday) did $4 Mil (est) according to Box Office Mojo, T4 has clocked in 13.4 Mil on its first day (yesterday).  I think this weekend will show ST diving and ending up much more like Wolverine (a profitable movie) in the end.  ST kind of got luck it had no genre competition in that second weekend and it made the most of it, but this weekend that changes with T4.

Originally posted by AgtSmith

Originally posted by ktanner3

Far as your other criteria about it "having legs", no Star Trek film ever did what you are demanding of this one. Trek has never had a movie that dominated a summer. In fact, Trek usually came out in the winter season because it was never good enough to compete in the summer. The mere fact that this one has already trounced "Wolverine" and is now surpassing Angels and Demons is very impressive. With the negative reviews I've been seeing for the latest Terminator movie, don't be surprised if Trek finishes a close second for the memorial day weekend. 

 

 

First, it is way to early to say it will gross over 300 mil, it may well top off at mid 200 Mil with the 3rd weekend decline, week foreign take, and T4 as competition this weekend.  Second, I clearly pointed out the context in which I was making that statement with the top three ST movies prior to JJ's ST raking in 3 to 1 or higher in terms of budget to gross.  Whatever ST tops out at it is not going to be anywhere near those in profit to cost and that is an important consideration.  Kahn brought in 11 times its budget in gross, Voyage Home 4 times its budget in gross, First Contact was 3 times its budget.  JJ's ST might not even bring in a 1:1 return on its budget.  The point being that the old ST they so willingly tossed aside to make way for JJ's ST was pretty good, until the last couple, at bringing in a good ROI.  

 

Again, we shall see this weekend, if ST holds where it was for last weekend it could be on its way to being a $300 Mil gross but if it tapers off another 40% to 60% it is unlikely it will end up grossing more than $260/$270 Mil (remember how weak ST is oversees, this film and traditionally ST is substantially weaker worldwide than other such films - this ST around low 30% of gross in foreign with most such movies around mid 40%).  Currently ST is around $238 Mil WW which means it is likely to need to or more weekends at its current take to approach $300+ Mil and the likelihood is this weekend will drop off half or more from last weekend and next weekend perhaps the same again.  Spending $150-$160 Mil to make JJ's ST and bringing in WW $250 to $280 Mil is a success but far from a blockbuster is all I am saying.  In the end, ST is likely to net not much more than good ST movies of old (not even adjusted for inflation and ticket prices).

 

Originally posted by ktanner3

Based on your own criteria, this latest Star Trek movie is the most profitable of them all. It cost $150 million to make and will end up grossing more than $300 million.Even factoring in inflation for the other films won't make a difference. This one is the most profitable. 

 

The Box Office Mojo site had an interesting comment saying that this ST is the "fifth biggest Star Trek movie, adjusted for ticket price inflation".  Surely it has more money to earn but it is likely to taper off dramatically over this weekend and next weekend.  So having a $150-$160 budget and well through its likely best weeks it is only 5th all time (about dead middle) in ST movies and we are to believe this is a raging blockbuster? 

 

And FYI - ST its first day (a Thursday) did $4 Mil (est) according to Box Office Mojo, T4 has clocked in 13.4 Mil on its first day (yesterday).  I think this weekend will show ST diving and ending up much more like Wolverine (a profitable movie) in the end.  ST kind of got luck it had no genre competition in that second weekend and it made the most of it, but this weekend that changes with T4.

 

Oh brother. Wolverine was a crappy movie that tanked it's second weekend. It isn't even in the same ballpark as Star Trek is right now.
 

We'll just have to agree to disagree. Most people would say that this film is a blockbuster. I highly doubt it will have any trouble reaching $300 million dollars. Of course T4 will hit big.It should be the number one movie of the holiday weekend being that it's the new release of the weekend and based off a popular franchise. But based off the horrible reviews and word of mouth I'm hearing, let's see how big it is shall we?And I still guarantee Star Trek having a strong THIRD weekend. Where is Wolverine again? Oh that's right. No one cares anymore.

Originally posted by bossalinie  

Um the way I saw it was the Romulan guy was surprised that he was back in time, thus his anger was displayed whne he was told what year it was. Remember when the captain was telling him that his planet still exist? That was not of any concern to him. Maybe because his wife was gone already. plus, he has the red matter anyways and knows what it's capable of...who's to say he didn't have plans of clearing the nova himself once his rant was complete

As for the outpost. There 's no telling when he was dropped off or the distance OR when he may have discovered the post. Dropping Spock of in a reasonable range to an outpost seems a ilttle weird anyways...sounds like a bad 30 minute GI Joe. "I, the supervillian, and going to destroy your planet and I want you to watch. BUT, I am going to drop you off close enough for you to radio in a rescue squad to come a defeat me."

 

I love stuff like this...the things you don't know. It brings about discussion

Actually, he didn't have the red matter for another 25 years, when future Spock stupidly allowed Nero to take it from him.

And honestly, wtf what Spock doing with an entire barrel of the stuff, when it was obvious just a very little bit was needed to cause the black hole?

Bleh who cares how big the ST movie is, it will do great. Most trekkie fans I have talked to including my mom loved the movie. The ones I know that didn't like the movie, didn't like ST to begin with. T4 and Night at the Museum will be the top movies this weekend and next weekend with the new Land of the Lost being the first top movie come the first weekend in June. It really doesn't matter if it's a top movie though, it only really matters if you like it or not. Critics are just that, critics. People who are paid to over analzye a movie because they are paid to. Sometimes I wonder if they can ever enjoy any movie. I will enjoy ST and T4 and NatM along with LotL. Take care and just enjoy watching movies and be glad you didn't have to watch the movie through some acient 1800 slide projection casing.

Originally posted by ktanner3 

Oh brother. Wolverine was a crappy movie that tanked it's second weekend. It isn't even in the same ballpark as Star Trek is right now.

 

We'll just have to agree to disagree. Most people would say that this film is a blockbuster. I highly doubt it will have any trouble reaching $300 million dollars. Of course T4 will hit big.It should be the number one movie of the holiday weekend being that it's the new release of the weekend and based off a popular franchise. But based off the horrible reviews and word of mouth I'm hearing, let's see how big it is shall we?And I still guarantee Star Trek having a strong THIRD weekend. Where is Wolverine again? Oh that's right. No one cares anymore.

I just don't see how you are projecting another 60 Mil for ST with T4 this weekend, very low oversees numbers (even lower than Wolverine's), and the normal dropoff after first two weeks.  And if you really look at the number ST is a heck of a lot closer to Wolverine (which did good in terms of being profitable like ST is even if not a big raging smash).

We shall see what happens this weekend.  If ST has a 3rd weekend that is not a big dropoff from its second weekend (this being its first weekend with genre competition) then it could be said to be working to that blockbuster tier.  However, if ST does this weekend what wolverine did as soon as ST came along then ST is likely more an 'also ran' that while profitable is hardly a blockbuster. 

I checked since you seem so down on Wolverine and up on ST.  As now (up to this weekend), Wolverine is beating the snot out of ST hands down.

ST - $238,475,256 (WW gross) 

Wolverine - $300,249,847 (WW gross)

Unless you are suggesting that ST is going to do $60+ Mil this weekend then ST will not be on par with where Wolverine was after three weekends (ST was also behind after two weekends only by a little though, around 6 mill or so).  I see two movies on par with each other, the big diff is ST had a better second weekend as no big SciFi or action flick opened in its second weekend like ST opened in Wolverines second weekend where Wolverine does way better overseas (mid 40% of gross) to STs poor showing oversees (low 30%).  Both movies are profitable, both successful summer flicks - but neither is a Casino Royale ($592 Mil WW) or Ironman ($582 Mil WW).  

So how is it that Wolverine is a crap flow and ST a smash blockbuster?

Originally posted by mackdawg19

Bleh who cares how big the ST movie is, it will do great. Most trekkie fans I have talked to including my mom loved the movie. The ones I know that didn't like the movie, didn't like ST to begin with. T4 and Night at the Museum will be the top movies this weekend and next weekend with the new Land of the Lost being the first top movie come the first weekend in June. It really doesn't matter if it's a top movie though, it only really matters if you like it or not. Critics are just that, critics. People who are paid to over analzye a movie because they are paid to. Sometimes I wonder if they can ever enjoy any movie. I will enjoy ST and T4 and NatM along with LotL. Take care and just enjoy watching movies and be glad you didn't have to watch the movie through some acient 1800 slide projection casing.

That's pretty much the reaction I've been seeing from most fans. They love having Star Trek back on the screen and people that never watched Star Trek in the first place are eating this one up. I'm going today to see it a second time with a few friends of mine. I've never seen this kind of performance from any film in the franchise so this is a nice change from the days of "Nemesis." The fact that Star Trek is holding its own during the summer is a welcome first.

T4 is getting shellacked by the critics though I doubt it could be worse than T3 was.I'll wait for word of mouth before seeing that one. Land of the Lost just looks silly and I'm not a big fan of Will Ferral.

http://www.mtv.com/movies/news/articles/1611063/story.jhtml

Looks like they are already planning the sequal.

Originally posted by mackdawg19

Bleh who cares how big the ST movie is, it will do great. Most trekkie fans I have talked to including my mom loved the movie. The ones I know that didn't like the movie, didn't like ST to begin with. T4 and Night at the Museum will be the top movies this weekend and next weekend with the new Land of the Lost being the first top movie come the first weekend in June. It really doesn't matter if it's a top movie though, it only really matters if you like it or not. Critics are just that, critics. People who are paid to over analzye a movie because they are paid to. Sometimes I wonder if they can ever enjoy any movie. I will enjoy ST and T4 and NatM along with LotL. Take care and just enjoy watching movies and be glad you didn't have to watch the movie through some acient 1800 slide projection casing.

This post really irritates me.  To suggest that those fans who didn't like the movie didn't like ST to begin with is just plain wrong.  I'm one of the star trek fans who has enjoyed every single version of star trek from the animated version to Next Generation, DS9, Voyager, Enterprise.  I'm the fan who actually liked Star Trek V simply because of the silliness of the campfire dinner between Kirk, Spock and McCoy.   So when I say I didn't like this new version of Trek, don't even try to suggest I didn't like ST to begin with.  

I didn't like this new version of Star Trek because it is not the Star Trek I have know for most of my life. Its some alternate reality version of it.   A cheap copy basically.  Its kind of like when some kid comes along and sings a classic song and all the younger generation thinks the new version is better. Same concept really.  

The Spock I have known about wouldn't be such an emotional idiot who has sex outside of Pon Far and would dump a starfleet cadet/officer on a frozen wasteland just for disagreeing with him.   The Spock I know of wouldn't just let Vulcan stay dead and would do something about it, using time travel. I mean if they would go back in time in a pathetic Klingon bird of prey to bring back whales to save the Earth, why wouldn't Spock find a better ship and do the same trick to bring back Vulcan and save his mother etc?   These are not simply plot holes..they are stupid ideas beyond belief.  

 Just got back from the theater and it was a packed house. Pretty good for a third weekend. 

waiting three weeks is blasphemy ;P 

Originally posted by SAHARAHSTORM

waiting three weeks is blasphemy ;P 

Supplanting 40+ years of SciFi's greatest continuing franchise second to none in depth and development of the world and characters with this superficial MTV generation action flick is the real blasphemy.

 Every ST fan new or old would go see the movie! IT'S STAR TREK... When DS9 came out I thought it sucked, but I still watched it.... The original  series will always be classic, but new is always, and should always be a welcomed guest. We advance as people by embracing new things... No hardcore scifi fans want any movie turned into a bubble gum flick, but I bet they will still go see it ;O)

I hate to rain on the nerd parade, but this flick was more like the original series then anything Ive seen thus far. period.

I grew up watching reruns of TOS on channel 6 after school. It didn't take itself too seriously that it couldn't screw off. teh dynamics between bones, spock and Kirk made the show. This show has earned some of that back.

I loved TNG, voyager was ok, and i never got into DS9. I didn't mind enterprise so much, though i didn't watch it regularly. Personally, i lok forward to more of these movies. It was a great time, which is what a movie is supposed to be....

 off topic, but I grew up in Orlando!

Originally posted by SAHARAHSTORM

 off topic, but I grew up in Orlando!

Likewise, been here most of my life :-)

Originally posted by SAHARAHSTORM

waiting three weeks is blasphemy ;P 

Nah, patience is logical.;)

Originally posted by spankybus

I hate to rain on the nerd parade, but this flick was more like the original series then anything Ive seen thus far. period.

 

I grew up watching reruns of TOS on channel 6 after school. It didn't take itself too seriously that it couldn't screw off. teh dynamics between bones, spock and Kirk made the show. This show has earned some of that back.

 

I loved TNG, voyager was ok, and i never got into DS9. I didn't mind enterprise so much, though i didn't watch it regularly. Personally, i lok forward to more of these movies. It was a great time, which is what a movie is supposed to be....

Well said. I can easily go back and pick out numerous inaccuracies in the past movies that conflicted with what the T.V show had established. Interesting how the naysayers convienently forget that fact. Star Trek broke its own canon on numerous occasions so I fail to see how this movie is any more blasphemous than the others. Let's consider and nitpick..

The Motion Picture: The Klingons we are introduced to look completely different than what we saw in the show. They go from looking like humans with go-tees to animals with ridges.

The Wrath of Khan:
-Khan recognizes Chekov even though Chekov wasn’t on the enterprise during that period 15 years before.
-Khan had opportunities to kill Kirk that he seemed to miss. Such as when he was able to beam up the Genesis device but for some reason couldn’t beam up Kirk. What about that superior intellect?

-A person that has a genetically enhanced brain isn't going to think two dimensionlly.

-Why follow the enterprise into the nebula when you can just wait for them to come out?

-Where was the rest of Starfleet during all this? Two federation ships are fighting each other in Federation territory and NO ONE notices?

The Search for Spock

-The whole concept of how they brought Spock back was completely absurd. From the torpedo soft landing to Spock’s body reanimating as a child that conveniently grows to the appropriate age and then stops.

The Voyage Home

-So if I wanted to go back in time all I would have to do is fly a ship around the sun? Amazing.

The Final Frontier

-Sulu and Chekov getting lost. Please, they are navigators on a ship.
-Ditto to Scotty hitting his head
-The half brother thing between Spock and Sybok was pretty lame. Never mentioned in the show before and all of sudden there he is.
-It makes no sense for the enterprise crew that had been loyal to Kirk all those years to just all of a sudden abandon him because of one “experience with their pain.”

The Undiscovered Country

-Klingon blood appears to be purple but on TNG it is red. Which one is it?
-No Klingon death chant for the chancellor of the high council?
-Uhura has been a communications officer and linguistics expert for 20+ years and she never learned to speak Klingon?
-How can two officers from the enterprise beam over to a ship, execute people and then beam back without anyone noticing? We know Valeris was involved but she was on the bridge during all this. Who was in the transporter room to beam the assassins back? How come there wasn’t an alert to the bridge that the transporter was being used?

Generations

-Why not stop Soren by going back in time further? Why not go back to when he is on your ship?
-How did Soren transport over to the observatory when the captain said he wasn’t allowing anyone there until the investigation was complete?
-Scotty’s appearance conflicts with the episode he did in season six where he thinks Jim Kirk brought the ship of out of mothballs to rescue him. Surely if he witnesses Kirks death on the Enterprise B he would remember this death when he materializes 75 years later.
-The captain of the enterprise B is too incompetent to be a believable starship captain.

First Contact

-Zeprham Cochrane is completely different from the character we saw in TOS.
-The Borg Queen completely changes the Borg from a collective mind to a dictator like society.

Guess none of those movies are any good either. Interestingly enough I can spot more innaccuracies with the TOS movies than I can the TNG ones and those are held up by the die hards as the best ones. Curious...

Originally posted by ktanner3

 But I see this going the way of the Star Wars prequals;something that will come in with a bang and be completely forgotten in the years to come.

you are right. When everyone saw Star Trek coming out, everyone that i know just mentioned about ramblings and science and stuff. but when they saw the movie they came out asking more about it

This movie is like it has been stated way too much before, aimed at the masses that arent familiar at all with the regular star trek line. At least is bringing out some interest in old movies and even the tv series.

Originally posted by yigael

Originally posted by ktanner3

 But I see this going the way of the Star Wars prequals;something that will come in with a bang and be completely forgotten in the years to come.

 

you are right. When everyone saw Star Trek coming out, everyone that i know just mentioned about ramblings and science and stuff. but when they saw the movie they came out asking more about it

This movie is like it has been stated way too much before, aimed at the masses that arent familiar at all with the regular star trek line. At least is bringing out some interest in old movies and even the tv series.

I'm noticing that as well. Lots of people are picking up the new blu-ray releases of the first 6 movies who would never have bothered before.

Oh and for our loudest sceptic:Star Trek is the first movie this year to pass $200 million domestically and has made over $310 million worldwide after only four weeks. Guess that 300 million mark wasn't so hard after all ;)

Originally posted by ktanner3

 

I'm noticing that as well. Lots of people are picking up the new blu-ray releases of the first 6 movies who would never have bothered before.

Oh and for our loudest sceptic:Star Trek is the first movie this year to pass $200 million domestically and has made over $310 million worldwide after only four weeks. Guess that 300 million mark wasn't so hard after all ;) 

Again, I am not saying it won't make money or that it isn't fairly called a good summer movie.  But it is nowhere near the mark of blockbuster so many where claiming, true blockbusters make $500 Mil+.  And when you adjust for inflation JJ's ST is still behind 4 other ST movies in terms of attendance.  Oh, and JJ's ST still trails the commonly described as lame Wolverine in total gross, so don't tell me ST is some runaway hit blockbuster while is not even outdoing a roundly panned movie like Wolverine (ST at $311 Mil while Wolverine in one extra week is at $341 Mil).