First off, I'm not flamebating here, I want to know the differences between the two games so I can focus a bit more on one of them since I most likely wont be buying both of them.
 
So really, what is the difference between JGE and BP? JGE seems to look a bit more arcady where BP looks more mature to me.
 
Are there death penalties in any of the games?
 
BP seems to go heavy on instancing PvE missions etc, what's the take on JGE on this part?
 
JGE seems to have adopted the "battleground" idea for pvp, true? How does BP handle pvp?
 
Anything else? I want to know it all, I want moar! MOAR! :)
 
I know the devs on both sides are very quite about alot but I'm sure you guys know more than me about both of them, give me your take on the two space juggernauts.

Here what I know:

BP is care bear weak sauce arcade garbage with heavy instancing and some pos and some cool ship customization.

JGE is the space sim with the most potential as it has the best space flight engine and a dev team that kicks ass. What we know right now is that the world pvp is about as cool as it gets with unreg space being where things play out. You have to get the nations crafter hauler types to start build a battle station while the heavy and light fighter stand guard and intell ranger ships keep tabs on enemy movements making sure everyone is informed should an enemy make a move. After the battle station is complete haulers and crafters need to keep the station stocked and fueled and you can either defend go and cap another area or go on the attack. There are 3 nations so you have to compete with 2 for control unreg space.

There is all kinds off pve stuff and real cool features to make the game pretty stinkin sweet.

There is an instanced simulator with a cool senarieo that they are calling battle space and has been reportedly fun.

Best bet is JGE cause the flight engine is the best to build content on and in a twitched skill based space mmo game it is the most important thing really.

Originally posted by freejackmack

Here what I know:

BP is care bear weak sauce arcade garbage with heavy instancing and some pos and some cool ship customization.

JGE is the space sim with the most potential as it has the best space flight engine and a dev team that kicks ass. What we know right now is that the world pvp is about as cool as it gets with unreg space being where things play out. You have to get the nations crafter hauler types to start build a battle station while the heavy and light fighter stand guard and intell ranger ships keep tabs on enemy movements making sure everyone is informed should an enemy make a move. After the battle station is complete haulers and crafters need to keep the station stocked and fueled and you can either defend go and cap another area or go on the attack. There are 3 nations so you have to compete with 2 for control unreg space.

There is all kinds off pve stuff and real cool features to make the game pretty stinkin sweet.

There is an instanced simulator with a cool senarieo that they are calling battle space and has been reportedly fun.

Best bet is JGE cause the flight engine is the best to build content on and in a twitched skill based space mmo game it is the most important thing really.

 

Thanks for the info, got some followup questions for you.

You seem to be pretty biased regarding the two games, why is it that BP is a carebear game? What makes JGE a non carebear game?

From what I've learned about JGE most of the PvP wont be taking place in open space but in the so called Battlespace, I don't know if this info is correct but rumors about this seem to be pretty accurate since Battlespace will yield rewards in itself.

I didn't even know you could build battle stations in JGE, yes I am that underinformed, but even if you can, you can do that in BP as well.

Anyways, thanks for your reply, all point of views are very welcome. Although it would be nice with a reply from someone with some info from a neutral point of view sort of.

The first response post is retarded. We know nearly nothing about BP and from what I have read it certainly will not be care bear crap.

JGE is the carebear game! Zero death penalty, consensual only PvP even in PvP zones. No ship loss, no cargo loss, no equipment loss, NOTHING. Just a free ride to the nearest space station.

It will NOT have twitch controls, if you watch the GDC video of the girl flying in the game using mouse and keyboard you can plainly see that the game nearly flies the ship FOR you. I could train a monkey to fly in JGE after cutting off his thumbs.

As for PvE, no raids, no end game content announced and as for the economy. It will always be dead because nobody ever loses anything so the only thing people will have to buy is stuff to upgrade when they level. How long will that last?

Soft grouping has also been announced. Which is a gold farmers dream. Soft grouping means that nobody ever has to take the time to even form a group, just fly up on someone who is doing the mission you have, shoot ONE time then sit back and relax while they do all the work and you benefit. Talk about catering to lazy ass carebears jeesh.

This game will be nothing more than WoW in space that will fail as epic as Auto Assault (Net Devils big claim to fame)

Originally posted by Caligulug

The first response post is retarded. We know nearly nothing about BP and from what I have read it certainly will not be care bear crap.

 

JGE is the carebear game! Zero death penalty, consensual only PvP even in PvP zones. No ship loss, no cargo loss, no equipment loss, NOTHING. Just a free ride to the nearest space station.

It will NOT have twitch controls, if you watch the GDC video of the girl flying in the game using mouse and keyboard you can plainly see that the game nearly flies the ship FOR you. I could train a monkey to fly in JGE after cutting off his thumbs.

 

As for PvE, no raids, no end game content announced and as for the economy. It will always be dead because nobody ever loses anything so the only thing people will have to buy is stuff to upgrade when they level. How long will that last?

 

Soft grouping has also been announced. Which is a gold farmers dream. Soft grouping means that nobody ever has to take the time to even form a group, just fly up on someone who is doing the mission you have, shoot ONE time then sit back and relax while they do all the work and you benefit. Talk about catering to lazy ass carebears jeesh.

 

This game will be nothing more than WoW in space that will fail as epic as Auto Assault (Net Devils big claim to fame)

While the game doesn't have ship loss or item loss, they do have repair costs and we have yet to know how much that will be. This might work fine or not, but it's nothing to complain about till you actually see it in action.

Those demo video's aren't going to show you how it feels to fly a ship. We have no idea how the game will play out till it hits the shelves.

From the WIKI: "Jumpgate Evolution is a Massively Multiplayer Online Game set in the open expanses of space. With breathtaking visuals and innovative TWITCH-based space combat."

End game RAID content from the wiki:

"Battle stations will be a type of PvE mission or RAID boss.
At lower levels, a wing of fighters can take on a battle station
At higher levels, as a "Raid boss", Battlestations will require an entire squad
Battlestations are multi-stage fights with layered defenses
Fighters and bombers are used in combination to take out a battle station
Bombers act as 'nukes', delivering a heavy destructive payload
Fighters must protect the bombers from waves of enemy ships sent to take them out
At early levels, weak points will be automatically targeted
At higher levels, players must manually target weak points"

Soft Grouping:"Soft grouping allows everyone involved in a fight full experience and full loot, regardless of whether they are actually grouped together. This is necessary due to the chaos of large-scale 3D combat. No one owns a mob in a dogfight." 

I cant see a reason to complain about this, that is unless you enjoy stealing mobs, making it so people have to leave an area. Who cares if someone hits your mob and gets some credit. Only means it was that much easier for you to kill it. You lose NOTHING in that situation and only gain.

Black Prophecy seems more carebear since the only way to pvp is through instanced encounters.

On the PvE servers, JGE will have sectors that are safe and unsafe, similar to Eve. You'll have the option of going through the sector, taking a shortcut, or going the long safe way around. There will be PvP servers as well allowing combat anywhere.

PvP In JGE from the wiki:

"There are three kinds of Player vs Player combat in Jumpgate Evolution:
World PvP related to sector control
Dogfighting in unregulated space (piracy, skirmishes, etc)
Instanced PvP, known as Battlespaces in JGE[6]

NetDevil understands the issues surrounding a balance of world PvP and Battlespaces. Both should be equally viable and, if balanced properly, neither one should be more advantageous than the other. "

Here's the wiki page for summed up info on the game:

http://jumpgateevo.wikia.com/wiki/Jumpgate_Evolution_Wiki

I am just throwing the care bear label around like every one else does. Really the games have some similarities beyond space but JGE's Dancer flight engine is seasoned and the best space fight engine of any space sim out there currently, so just for that reason alone JGE stands out and the quality from this dev team can be expected to be high as well and JGE has a finished feel even now and it is still in alpha.

And we don't have a lot to go on with BP but it might be fun I really don't think the flight engine is as advanced nor will the battles be as big because JGE has supper scalibale specs and can be played on integrated graffix with a geforce 4 video card or whatever 5 year old cards there are. So you can bet there will be some SWEET big battles in JGE. up to like 500 I think they were saying. BP is more high end and not going for the big battle theme as far as we know.

 BP will probably be alot better,it seems it has a ton of similarities with Freelancer and X series,just watch the latest gameplay video,it looks awesome soo far,expecialy compared for JGE.

I'm tired of seeing the word "carebear" thrown around like a mark of manhood.

Games that aren't "carebear" require heavy death penalties and to recover from death penalities requires a great deal of free time. In other words, non-carebear games have HUGE and BORING grinds to them just so that you can do a little bit of PvP. For example, people claim Darkfall is an anti-carebear game, but it requires alot of mining, logging, crafting and PvEing, just to equip yourself with armor, weapons, potions and magic so that you can PvP properly. If I need to waste my valuable time on useless activities like that just to get into a little bit of PvP action, then I'd rather go to a carebear game, because a carebear game has LOTS and LOTS of PvP action.

Originally posted by Caligulug

The first response post is retarded. We know nearly nothing about BP and from what I have read it certainly will not be care bear crap.

 

JGE is the carebear game! Zero death penalty, consensual only PvP even in PvP zones. No ship loss, no cargo loss, no equipment loss, NOTHING. Just a free ride to the nearest space station.

It will NOT have twitch controls, if you watch the GDC video of the girl flying in the game using mouse and keyboard you can plainly see that the game nearly flies the ship FOR you. I could train a monkey to fly in JGE after cutting off his thumbs.

 

As for PvE, no raids, no end game content announced and as for the economy. It will always be dead because nobody ever loses anything so the only thing people will have to buy is stuff to upgrade when they level. How long will that last?

 

Soft grouping has also been announced. Which is a gold farmers dream. Soft grouping means that nobody ever has to take the time to even form a group, just fly up on someone who is doing the mission you have, shoot ONE time then sit back and relax while they do all the work and you benefit. Talk about catering to lazy ass carebears jeesh.

 

This game will be nothing more than WoW in space that will fail as epic as Auto Assault (Net Devils big claim to fame)

Ya you are about as an expert at what JGE is as everyone is at BP.

JGE has been tested at events and been reported that JGE has TWITCH SKILL BASED COMBAT!!! So you might want to not judge it on the vids you saw. There are 2 flight modes which you can flip on the fly. 1 mode is near newtonian physics with some drag and the other has way more drag for more control but less speed and less drifting. 

You better back up off my favorate "game to be" you son of a WoW horrrr.

Or I will send the Sesame Street gang to pop a cap in ya.

 That Elmo is one bad little mamajama boiiee!

Please disregard Caligulug.

We have nothing from BP other than the last few days interviews.

If something would lead me to distrust BP would be the fact that they didn't include joystick support up from the start which for a space sim is prety weird. I also don't like the enphasis on instances although I understand that it's the best way to ensure game performance.

It seems however that both developers first finished the instances (PvE and PvP) and only then devoted themselves to open world stuff. I'd say that having controlled environment PvP is currently considered the best option seing the success of WoW.

Personally I don't like instanced combat because it has no consequence on the player itself or the world. Also if you suffer no penalties for dying and can fly whatever you want, you might be inclined to be a little reckless. I'm aware that losing stuff might lead you to not risk combat or do it only when you're sure to win. Without concrete data on player profiles i'd prefer the penalties system, but I'd go and invest some cash on a market study to determine my potential player base for each case.

ATM JGE is closer and does have 9 years of experience to draw upon.

Come betas and we'll know :)

Exactly..

Till these games come out, we have know idea whether or not they'll actually be fun. Only thing we have to go on really is the demo video's and what they say on the websites. If I've learned anything from playing these online games, those things are in no way a good indicator of whether or not I'd actually have fun and stick with a game. I've played games where I hated instancing and then I've played ones where I loved it. Same with pvp, sometimes it's really fun and sometimes it just plain sucks. I've played plenty of games to know that the only real way of knowing if it'll be fun is actually playing it. Speculating on if it'll be fun based off what they say or the video's is just that, speculation.

Also getting advice on what games you might enjoy playing is nearly the same. You'll never really know untill you play the game yourself. Someone else might tell you the pvp or the crafting is a blast, then you get in there and find it far too complex, simple, boring, or whatever for your taste. It's never going to get you anywhere asking people since it's all individual views.

Not that I'm saying people talking, complaining, or hyping these games isn't bad. If a game generally has a LOT of good points being made about it, chances are it's probably at least good. Same goes for people complaining about the game.

Ultimately, playing a demo, free 14 day trial, beta, or whatever, is the best way to see if the game appeals to your taste. No one can tell you what you like except you. Besides, most of the complaints I've seen are from people disappointed with them leaving out or adding an option that went against what they were used to or desired. Doesn't mean it wont work for someone else.

Ah there is in fact one more reason for me to distrust BP.

The economy will NOT be player driven. Along with the heavy reliance on instances it would seem that this game has a lot less depth than JGE.

The only feature I really do like (over JGE's) is having "fully customizable" ships, meaning it leaves room for more combat related tactics. However, combat is mostly about the "feel" of the flight engine and that really needs to be individually tested.

I got the same "problem" not sure which game of the 2 to get.

 I loved Freespace 2 (heard alot about freelancer but the screens didn't do it for me) and Eve wasn't what i wanted in a space game. However these 2 does.

Anyone know if BP will be released this year? If not, i might just pick up JGE, and play it till i get a chance to try BP and if it's better, just switch over.

When did "scalable" start meaning "crappy"?  People seem to only talk about scalable graphics when they explaining away bad graphics, or at least an outdated graphics engine.  So you can turn the graphics all the way down and play it on a laptop, or an iphone or a modded 8 bit nintendo... but when you turn the graphics all the way up, they don't really look all that good.

I think that if BP has decent flight physics and controls, it will probably be a pretty decent game.  Visibly customizable ships, stunning graphics, and then beyond that... just about every feature either game lists is also touted by the other.  I'll probably play both, especially since JGE will be out first.... but at this point, BP looks a lot better to me.  I can't get over the feeling that JGE is really just a redressed version of a game I didn't enjoy in the first place.

Originally posted by Salvatoris

When did "scalable" start meaning "crappy"?  People seem to only talk about scalable graphics when they explaining away bad graphics, or at least an outdated graphics engine.  So you can turn the graphics all the way down and play it on a laptop, or an iphone or a modded 8 bit nintendo... but when you turn the graphics all the way up, they don't really look all that good.

I think that if BP has decent flight physics and controls, it will probably be a pretty decent game.  Visibly customizable ships, stunning graphics, and then beyond that... just about every feature either game lists is also touted by the other.  I'll probably play both, especially since JGE will be out first.... but at this point, BP looks a lot better to me.  I can't get over the feeling that JGE is really just a redressed version of a game I didn't enjoy in the first place.

JGE is being designed for large scale world pvp battles, BP is not. JGE has the Dancer Engine, BP does not. ND is dedicated to quality so what you do get will be fun and have that finished feel which JGE already has in alpha, BP does not.

BP may be good but not as good as JGE.

Originally posted by freejackmack

Originally posted by Salvatoris

When did "scalable" start meaning "crappy"?  People seem to only talk about scalable graphics when they explaining away bad graphics, or at least an outdated graphics engine.  So you can turn the graphics all the way down and play it on a laptop, or an iphone or a modded 8 bit nintendo... but when you turn the graphics all the way up, they don't really look all that good.

I think that if BP has decent flight physics and controls, it will probably be a pretty decent game.  Visibly customizable ships, stunning graphics, and then beyond that... just about every feature either game lists is also touted by the other.  I'll probably play both, especially since JGE will be out first.... but at this point, BP looks a lot better to me.  I can't get over the feeling that JGE is really just a redressed version of a game I didn't enjoy in the first place.

 

JGE is being designed for large scale world PvP battles, BP is not. JGE has the Dancer Engine, BP does not. ND is dedicated to quality so what you do get will be fun and have that finished feel which JGE already has in alpha, BP does not.

BP may be good but not as good as JGE.

Yeah... but everything you said about BP, except for it not using the dancer engine, is just conjecture.  We don't even know what engine BP uses, there is speculation that it's the same as neocron, but I haven't read anything official on that.  We also don't know how many people they plan to have involved in PvP battles, or if BP is fun to play in alpha. 

The things we do know for sure are that BP blows JGE away graphically, and that BP will have visually customizable ships where JGE will not.  On the subject of a commitment to quality.... neither developer has a perfect record, but Net Devil released a big-budget MMO that shut down within a year.  I guess if you already know you love the original jumpgate, then you can probably expect to love JGE too, but how many of us are actively playing jumpgate?  I believe they have a 14 day free trial, we should all download it and decide if that game, with a graphics upgrade is really what we are looking for.

This thread is pointless...There is simply not enough info about BP to compare it to JGE....

Simply because both these games are in space and involve ships doesnt mean they will be anything alike.

Originally posted by Salvatoris

Originally posted by freejackmack

Originally posted by Salvatoris

When did "scalable" start meaning "crappy"?  People seem to only talk about scalable graphics when they explaining away bad graphics, or at least an outdated graphics engine.  So you can turn the graphics all the way down and play it on a laptop, or an iphone or a modded 8 bit nintendo... but when you turn the graphics all the way up, they don't really look all that good.

I think that if BP has decent flight physics and controls, it will probably be a pretty decent game.  Visibly customizable ships, stunning graphics, and then beyond that... just about every feature either game lists is also touted by the other.  I'll probably play both, especially since JGE will be out first.... but at this point, BP looks a lot better to me.  I can't get over the feeling that JGE is really just a redressed version of a game I didn't enjoy in the first place.

 

JGE is being designed for large scale world PvP battles, BP is not. JGE has the Dancer Engine, BP does not. ND is dedicated to quality so what you do get will be fun and have that finished feel which JGE already has in alpha, BP does not.

BP may be good but not as good as JGE.

 

Yeah... but everything you said about BP, except for it not using the dancer engine, is just conjecture.  We don't even know what engine BP uses, there is speculation that it's the same as neocron, but I haven't read anything official on that.  We also don't know how many people they plan to have involved in PvP battles, or if BP is fun to play in alpha. 

The things we do know for sure are that BP blows JGE away graphically, and that BP will have visually customizable ships where JGE will not.  On the subject of a commitment to quality.... neither developer has a perfect record, but Net Devil released a big-budget MMO that shut down within a year.  I guess if you already know you love the original jumpgate, then you can probably expect to love JGE too, but how many of us are actively playing jumpgate?  I believe they have a 14 day free trial, we should all download it and decide if that game, with a graphics upgrade is really what we are looking for.

Wow you have not even played JGC. Then you have no idea what you are talking about when you present BP as possibly better than JGE. You see JGC has the most advanced space flight engine in existence even to this day. Nothing else even comes close. It's not about graphics, it never was, it is about space flight and the experience of space combat. JGE has the best part of JGC and is making the other wishes I had for JGC come true. BIG scale combat is one of the best features of JGE and is one of the reasons for scalable graphics beside accessibility they work for the greater good. You can play on a geforce 4 for Christmas sakes, that is cool, all while fighting in a battle of up to 500, way cool and fun!

JGC is the reason I am so excited about JGE. It is the best a man can get for his money.

Listen BP might turn out to be cool but the technical hurdles it has to climb to catch up to JGE's current in game quality of experience are just not practical for BP's dev team to try and come close to. JGE has the space flight engine and an awesome dev team to produce the most completely awesome twitch skill based mmo ever and BP has.... well they have decent graphics which limits both quality and performance of game play unless you have an uber rig, while limiting both people who can even run the game and the size of the battles that can take place.

And by the way JGE's graphics are pretty feakin awesome especially for a graphics engine that can run on p4 geforce 4 system.

Ya go play JGC WHICH YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE BEFORE POSTING ON A SUBJECT YOU DON'T HAVE A CLUE ABOUT.

Originally posted by freejackmack

Originally posted by Salvatoris

Originally posted by freejackmack

Originally posted by Salvatoris

When did "scalable" start meaning "crappy"?  People seem to only talk about scalable graphics when they explaining away bad graphics, or at least an outdated graphics engine.  So you can turn the graphics all the way down and play it on a laptop, or an iphone or a modded 8 bit nintendo... but when you turn the graphics all the way up, they don't really look all that good.

I think that if BP has decent flight physics and controls, it will probably be a pretty decent game.  Visibly customizable ships, stunning graphics, and then beyond that... just about every feature either game lists is also touted by the other.  I'll probably play both, especially since JGE will be out first.... but at this point, BP looks a lot better to me.  I can't get over the feeling that JGE is really just a redressed version of a game I didn't enjoy in the first place.

 

JGE is being designed for large scale world PvP battles, BP is not. JGE has the Dancer Engine, BP does not. ND is dedicated to quality so what you do get will be fun and have that finished feel which JGE already has in alpha, BP does not.

BP may be good but not as good as JGE.

 

Yeah... but everything you said about BP, except for it not using the dancer engine, is just conjecture.  We don't even know what engine BP uses, there is speculation that it's the same as neocron, but I haven't read anything official on that.  We also don't know how many people they plan to have involved in PvP battles, or if BP is fun to play in alpha. 

The things we do know for sure are that BP blows JGE away graphically, and that BP will have visually customizable ships where JGE will not.  On the subject of a commitment to quality.... neither developer has a perfect record, but Net Devil released a big-budget MMO that shut down within a year.  I guess if you already know you love the original jumpgate, then you can probably expect to love JGE too, but how many of us are actively playing jumpgate?  I believe they have a 14 day free trial, we should all download it and decide if that game, with a graphics upgrade is really what we are looking for.

Wow you have not even played JGC. Then you have no idea what you are talking about when you present BP as possibly better than JGE. You see JGC has the most advanced space flight engine in existence even to this day. Nothing else even comes close. It's not about graphics, it never was, it is about space flight and the experience of space combat. JGE has the best part of JGC and is making the other wishes I had for JGC come true. BIG scale combat is one of the best features of JGE and is one of the reasons for scalable graphics beside accessibility they work for the greater good. You can play on a geforce 4 for Christmas sakes, that is cool, all while fighting in a battle of up to 500, way cool and fun!

I have played the original Jumpgate, and I didn't care for it.  Outdated, (AKA scalable) graphics aren't a selling point to me.  I am not looking for a game to play on my laptop.  I don't really care how advanced the game was 6 years ago... it's 2009 now, what was advanced a decade ago is obsolete now.  Scalable means the graphics can be adjusted up and down... it really doesn't mean a game has to have low system requirements on it's higher graphics settings.  There is no reason why a game with scalable graphics can't look great when the graphics are turned all the way up.  "Scalable" is a code word for crappy when it comes to video game graphics.  You really never hear anyone say it about a game with good graphics.  It is generally reserved for games that like WoW... and JGE.

JGC is the reason I am so excited about JGE. It is the best a man can get for his money.

It's cool that you like it, but if it's the best a man can get, why aren't more people playing it? 

Listen BP might turn out to be cool but the technical hurdles it has to climb to catch up to JGE's current in game quality of experience are just not practical for BP's dev team to try and come close to. JGE has the space flight engine and an awesome dev team to produce the most completely awesome twitch skill based mmo ever and BP has.... well they have decent graphics which limits both quality and performance of game play unless you have an uber rig, while limiting both people who can even run the game and the size of the battles that can take place.

And by the way JGE's graphics are pretty feakin awesome especially for a graphics engine that can run on p4 geforce 4 system.

They must be only releasing videos with the graphics turned way down then, because I haven't seen any videos are screenshots that didn't look like they were from a game that was several years old.  I'm not saying the graphics are bad... just not what I expect from games coming out today.... and obviously not nearly as good as BP.  The whole, "JGE has a space flight engine" argument is a little silly.  I have seen video of BP, and it obviously has a space flight too.  Why you assume an engine almost a decade old is the most powerful available today is beyond me. 

Ya go play JGC WHICH YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE BEFORE POSTING ON A SUBJECT YOU DON'T HAVE A CLUE ABOUT.

Like i said... I played it, and didn't care for it.  That's why I was suggesting everyone else try it out before they get too excited about playing JGE.