Originally posted by Wharg0ul

Originally posted by warpp

Originally posted by Wharg0ul

if VG wasn't so buggy, glitchy, and stiff...I could get into it, probably. But it feels....odd...awkward.

VG2??

When was the last time you played it? it does not have that many bugs in it any more. You might get a little hitching when you go into the major cities but that 's only for a few seconds now. There are mmorpg out there now that have more bugs that VG by a mile.

None of it is game breaking at all.

 

Like 6 months ago, I think. Even once the bugs are cleared up, I don't think that would compensate for the "stiff" feeling that it has.

I might give it another shot once (if) I get tired of Spellborn.

They have had a charecter revamp since then,plus i don't really think they were that stiff. I think the movement was realistic and very good but that's just my opinion. You should download the free trail and give it another shot.

I played TCOS and was in the beta for 15 months,it's a good game and has a good combat system once you get your head around the skilldeck system but the world is not as open as VG or as explorable.

It's a good game though and it's free up to level 7 or have they changed that.

Originally posted by warpp

Originally posted by Wharg0ul

Originally posted by warpp

Originally posted by Wharg0ul

if VG wasn't so buggy, glitchy, and stiff...I could get into it, probably. But it feels....odd...awkward.

VG2??

When was the last time you played it? it does not have that many bugs in it any more. You might get a little hitching when you go into the major cities but that 's only for a few seconds now. There are mmorpg out there now that have more bugs that VG by a mile.

None of it is game breaking at all.

 

Like 6 months ago, I think. Even once the bugs are cleared up, I don't think that would compensate for the "stiff" feeling that it has.

I might give it another shot once (if) I get tired of Spellborn.

They have had a charecter revamp since then,plus i don't really think they were that stiff. I think the movement was realistic and very good but that's just my opinion. You should download the free trail and give it another shot.

I played TCOS and was in the beta for 15 months,it's a good game and has a good combat system once you get your head around the skilldeck system but the world is not as open as VG or as explorable.

It's a good game though and it's free up to level 7 or have they changed that.

It still has the level 7 limited trial, yes.
 

Love the game, just wish it had some of the niceties of say, a deeper crafting system and as pertains to this thread, player housing.

I love the fact that the game doesn't hold your hand all the way though...the skilldeck, and combo system is nice...the lack of a gear dependency is a MAJOOR plus...it feels "old school" in a way.

Anyway....gonna shut up now and avoid derailig the thread topic. Thanks for the VG info.

Tried VG a few days ago, and although the game might be good, the animations are so bad, and in some cases missing, that I just couldt force myself to play it. I feel like controlling a omnidirectional vehicle detached from the ground. Try to move forward pressing W and D while you turn your toon to the left with your mouse, and you'll se what I mean.

as asked previously, i didnt bring this up to piss anybody off,

My point is that games being developed today are following a tested model (WOW) and hoping to cash in with a few improvements chucked in. there are no radically different games in development, which would thrown in a completely new theme into the mmo world.

so what you have is a relevance/attention to features from the currently known set.

Player housing has been thrown around pretty often, but i do not see it as being critical in a combat based mmo. If you do find housing, its coz the devs  love to throw you a carrot to pay for their dev costs (retail box sales) and keep their fingers crossed about profits (subs) while you mess around in your HOUSE.

Originally posted by charlesf

as asked previously, i didnt bring this up to piss anybody off,

My point is that games being developed today are following a tested model (WOW) and hoping to cash in with a few improvements chucked in. there are no radically different games in development, which would thrown in a completely new theme into the mmo world.

so what you have is a relevance/attention to features from the currently known set.

Player housing has been thrown around pretty often, but i do not see it as being critical in a combat based mmo. If you do find housing, its coz the devs  love to throw you a carrot to pay for their dev costs (retail box sales) and keep their fingers crossed about profits (subs) while you mess around in your HOUSE.

Of course it's not critical...  but neither are different item skins, combat movement graphics, graphics as a whole, or different char. skins...  Should these not be in a game since they aren't "critical in a combat based MMO"?

Player housing, like so many other features in todays MMO's, is an immersion factor.  If a game only had one character skin and one weapon skin and no armor could it still be a good game?  Yes...  Do these things add to the game play?  Of course they do...  Player housing is a very viable addition in any MMO.  It gives players a place to brag about, which is what so much of MMOs are about anyway.  It also adds many other options to how the devs work with several other "non-critical" things like storage, crafting, etc.

Don't discourage Devs from making better games...  The more things like player housing they add the more a game is likely to succeed...  If you just want to run around and pk or PvP all the time go load Diablo II and have a blast...

Originally posted by PatchDay

Originally posted by paulscott

Originally posted by PatchDay

Originally posted by paulscott

Play Wurmonline seriously for a month and you'll come to love housing. 

 

Though I will admit housing DOES NOT make sense for nearly every game on the market.  None for "World of Everclone", and even only a little bit for even your niche games like Darkfall or EvE(atleast for most of the player base).

 

Depends on what you consider 'housing'. Many EVE players live in POSes (player owned structures). You can setup guns to defend them, do research, park ships in them, refit, craftm mine minerals, etc. Even in high sec many are setup for researching prints

 

 

 

EvE does indead have housing and better housing than most games,  however it's not something that affects a "good" majority of the players directly(on through market prices, and similar).

 

sigh you obviously dont play EVE Online. Research slots in Empire are HARD to come by. It's a rare resource and the queues are many months. Thus, you need make deals with a POS owner to install your blueprint there to research

Your post 100% untrue. POSes have an important impact on economy. Some crafters/inventors even predicted the market would crash once Goons messed up BoB because they were a major supplier of moon minerals, etc

My total time on EvE is around 4 months, with huge breaks between those.   And 2 months somewhat recently. I also spent a lot of time in lowsec and even got lots of giggles convining people that my character isn't 2 years old because I took lots of breaks.

Yes reasearch slots are nearly impossible to come by in high sec.   But that still doesn't affect a lot of the player base.

There is also a MASSIVE difference between guild property and player property.   An even larger differeance between renting a research slot and player housing.

Originally posted by paulscott

Originally posted by PatchDay

Originally posted by paulscott

Originally posted by PatchDay

Originally posted by paulscott

Play Wurmonline seriously for a month and you'll come to love housing. 

 

Though I will admit housing DOES NOT make sense for nearly every game on the market.  None for "World of Everclone", and even only a little bit for even your niche games like Darkfall or EvE(atleast for most of the player base).

 

Depends on what you consider 'housing'. Many EVE players live in POSes (player owned structures). You can setup guns to defend them, do research, park ships in them, refit, craftm mine minerals, etc. Even in high sec many are setup for researching prints

 

 

 

EvE does indead have housing and better housing than most games,  however it's not something that affects a "good" majority of the players directly(on through market prices, and similar).

 

sigh you obviously dont play EVE Online. Research slots in Empire are HARD to come by. It's a rare resource and the queues are many months. Thus, you need make deals with a POS owner to install your blueprint there to research

Your post 100% untrue. POSes have an important impact on economy. Some crafters/inventors even predicted the market would crash once Goons messed up BoB because they were a major supplier of moon minerals, etc

My total time on EvE is around 4 months, with huge breaks between those.   And 2 months somewhat recently. I also spent a lot of time in lowsec and even got lots of giggles convining people that my character isn't 2 years old because I took lots of breaks.

 

Yes reasearch slots are nearly impossible to come by in high sec.   But that still doesn't affect a lot of the player base.

 

There is also a MASSIVE difference between guild property and player property.   An even larger differeance between renting a research slot and player housing.

 

 

 

 A single player can own a POS. It's not GUILD Property.   For all intents and purposes a POS is equivalent to a house. You can live in it. You own it. You pay rent for it. Others can dwell in it.

The main difference between a POS and a player house in UO/Linkrealms is that you don't decorate them.

 If you think POSes dont effect a large playerbase then it is obvious you havent played the game long. Where do you think Moon minerals come from?

Read this guide about T2 production please.

Originally posted by PatchDay

Originally posted by paulscott

Originally posted by PatchDay

Originally posted by paulscott

Originally posted by PatchDay

Originally posted by paulscott

Play Wurmonline seriously for a month and you'll come to love housing. 

 

Though I will admit housing DOES NOT make sense for nearly every game on the market.  None for "World of Everclone", and even only a little bit for even your niche games like Darkfall or EvE(atleast for most of the player base).

 

Depends on what you consider 'housing'. Many EVE players live in POSes (player owned structures). You can setup guns to defend them, do research, park ships in them, refit, craftm mine minerals, etc. Even in high sec many are setup for researching prints

 

 

 

EvE does indead have housing and better housing than most games,  however it's not something that affects a "good" majority of the players directly(on through market prices, and similar).

 

sigh you obviously dont play EVE Online. Research slots in Empire are HARD to come by. It's a rare resource and the queues are many months. Thus, you need make deals with a POS owner to install your blueprint there to research

Your post 100% untrue. POSes have an important impact on economy. Some crafters/inventors even predicted the market would crash once Goons messed up BoB because they were a major supplier of moon minerals, etc

My total time on EvE is around 4 months, with huge breaks between those.   And 2 months somewhat recently. I also spent a lot of time in lowsec and even got lots of giggles convining people that my character isn't 2 years old because I took lots of breaks.

 

Yes reasearch slots are nearly impossible to come by in high sec.   But that still doesn't affect a lot of the player base.

 

There is also a MASSIVE difference between guild property and player property.   An even larger differeance between renting a research slot and player housing.

 

 

 

 

 A single player can own a POS. It's not GUILD Property.   For all intents and purposes a POS is equivalent to a house. You can live in it. You own it. You pay rent for it. Others can dwell in it.

The main difference between a POS and a player house in UO/Linkrealms is that you don't decorate them.

 

 If you think POSes dont effect a large playerbase then it is obvious you havent played the game long. Where do you think Moon minerals come from?

Read this guide about T2 production please.

 

You're tossing in examples that wouldn't be guild property and examples that almost certainly would be.

Originally posted by warpp

Originally posted by Abrahmm

Originally posted by warpp

Originally posted by Abrahmm

Originally posted by charlesf

haha i dont remember housing in Conan..i thot they were always on the move...isnt that what games are supposed to be? as said before if u need housing for immersion, u need to be looking for a diff kind of mmo, rather than expect the current crop of mmo's to provide you with housing.

 

You are right, the current crop of MMOs don't provide housing. Also an odd coincidence that the current crop of MMOs completely suck.

You are also right, I am looking for a different kind of MMO. I'm looking for the kind that requires an active brain. I'm looking for the kind that encourages social interaction. I'm looking for the kind that used to be made, before they started being massed produced for the inept masses. SWG had an awesome housing system(only one major flaw which was easily fixable if SOE was at all competant). Great game.

WTF are you talking about? VG has housing which is just as good as SWG housing,plus vast guild castles and villages of different types. You can load your house up with an immense number of items just like SWG,all in the real world and not instanced because there is no instances in VG.

 

First, I wouldn't really call VG "current", it has been out for how long now? I'm talking more about the games released in the last 3-4 years or so.

Second, I look for more in a game than just housing, but housing is a really big bonus. SWG still has the same housing it had before(in fact I think it may have just been upgraded a little), but I don't play that game any more because it's a hunk of crap. I also won't play VG because it is an SOE game, so I won't just out of principle.

Are you serious,man you really don't know what you are talking about. First off,VG has been out  27 months and was released on the 15-2-2007,so where you get the idea that it's not current is beyond me. Second ,yeah SOE this and SOE that,blah blah blah,i played SWG and i played every other mmorpgf that SOE have had their hands on,starting with EQ1 right through to POTBS.

SOE have messed some games up and i will be the first to admit that,but at the same time they are master at turning games around just like EQ2 when it first came out and now the same with VG,even though it wasnt SOE game in the first place,it was sigil who messed it up not SOE.

Right you look for more in a mmorpg,that's good because so do i. I mentioned housing because that's what this thread is about but believe me when i say that VG has many many more things going for it. It's only comparison to WOW is that it has classes and levels and is a mmorpg but that would be true of 99% of mmorpg out today.

What are you looking for because VG is as close as you are going to get to sandbox unless you play Darkfall. It's is as close to EQ1 as you can get,from the brilliant classes to the brilliant skills each class has. It has the best dungeons to date in a mmorpg except perhaps EQ1 .

Crafting is the best of any mmorpg that has ever been made and that includes SWG( i don't say that lightly) it has ship building to brick making to house building and just to name a few. The world is vast and open with no instances so you really can enter a dungeon and meet other groups doing the same dungeon,just like EQ1.

Corpse runs and xp lost,not as bad as eq1 but as close as you are going to get. Named mobs that really do drop rare and epic items and spawn from hours to days.

The classes in VG are the best in any mmorpg oput at the moment( nothing like switching levitation on on my bard and running at supersonic speed just like in eq1). It has vast mountain ranges and deep under ground citys and dark places that are dangerous and fun.

I can level up as a crafter and not even kill a mob but just be a merchant or i can level up diplomacy or i can just level up as an adventurer,or all 3. I can start 16 different toons and not do the same quests for any of the toons all the way to top level. There is no game on the market right now that offers the same exploration feeling as VG,you truley can get lost for hours on end.

20 odd different mounts and that does not include fully controllable flying mounts. APW is a vast raiding dungeon that would fit most of WOW instances in that one dungeon.

Overland raid bosses and ships that range from small to vast. The best weather system in a mmorpg to date.......................

www.youtube.com/watch

www.youtube.com/watch

www.youtube.com/watch

I could go on and on but i would not stop till morning with all the content VG has.

PVP..yes VG has a FFA kill anyone and anybody including group add guildmates and loot there gold server,it's not very full because most people are on the PVE servers but it's just like EQ1 PVP servers.

Yes you don't like SOE and you hold a grudge against SOE but by being silly you are missing out on a game that has not follow the easy mode like most of the mmorpg out today. There is solo content but you will need a group to really enjoy the game and reach your goals.

Oh and the graphics are top notch and fishing is a great as well.

Take a look at the DarkElf starting area.. oh if your thinking what class he is ,well he is a darkelf bard that plays musical intruments...for real..

www.youtube.com/watch

www.youtube.com/watch

My english is not good so spelling are not all right...)

You are doing yourself a dis service by not at least trying this game..

The free trail is free so what have you got to lose,you wont be paying SOE anything..

vanguard.station.sony.com/isleofdawn/     30 min download..you can come back here and tell me i am wrong.

You are right, Vanguard is newer than I thought. I just remembered a SWG guildie playing it shortly after the fall of SWG, but he must have been playing in the beta.

Beyond that, the rest is moot. SOE = No $$ from me. Simple as that.

Back on topic PaulScott  does establish an important point. Should we make a distinction between personal housing and guild housing/cities? 

If we were to stick to purely personal housing I still say its a feature that's almost must have for me. I'd enjoy creating a shop like that link I posted earlier where players could come shop around. So say if I was a collector of dragon heads. So I go out and slay dragons and sell their heads. Would be interesting to setup this sort of shop where I market this housing decoration

I guess housing is a wanted feature for 'creative' types like myself. I bet the OP probably could care less what his charatcer looks like. Myself, I can spend hours designing a costume (like city of heroes, etc)

Runes of Magic has extremely useful player housing, shame that it was provided to suck cash out of the players. Would be great if a P2P game would incorporate similar housing features.

Can someone elaborate on how Runes of Magic handled housing? I guess I'll go see if I can huntdown a FAQ. will update this post if I see anything

Originally posted by PatchDay

Can someone elaborate on how Runes of Magic handled housing? I guess I'll go see if I can huntdown a FAQ. will update this post if I see anything

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlXO0TLpgpo

Haven't played yet and probably won't for a while.   But it's a revealing video.   Doesn't look half bad for housing, even if EvE does mostly beat it in the housing aspect**.

**non-instanced, compliementing every feature of the game.   Only downside is that EvE's housing is focused majorally on the grouping/corp aspects.   And when people are talking about housing ,I feel, they are mostly talking about the *individual* instead of the *big picture*.    I just want to make it clear where I was coming from.

Not bad at all interesting how they integrated it into their gameplay. Yep I agree I would consider eve a much different animal... for future reference I won't bother mentioning it

Originally posted by charlesf

Why is player housing so high up on the wish list of so called mmo players?

Wtf r u supposed to do with housing...sit home and watch the fireplace...?

Do u also want your very own cleanin biatch?

MMO's should be about adventure, pvp stuff like that.

Go out get your stuff, live in barracks while moving thru friendly zones, move fkin on...

go play sims if u need housing...

obviously a member of the new generation of mmo players.

In Atlantica Online they would also add a housing system in future patches...

for the life of me i dont know why this is important (maybe for extra storage)...

if this is an item mall add-on i think money is not best spent here

Depends on what you want in a MMO. I find houseing fun in MMO's. Gives you a place to have friends in and get away from the public chat. Its also fun to style sometihng that fits your mood and your personality. F2P malls have a good idea chargeing for house stuff, great way to make a buck off of RP's. My girl loves the houseing ideas in MMO's. I like it as well.  Kills the bordem for a few hours a day. An it gives a brake from endless grinding for exp/mats. So houseing is a welcome addition any any MMO. Hell even RS has a type of houseing system.

I'm betting the OP is the same asshole you find on a role playing server calling roleplayers names and naming his toon Omgimakilzj00.

**non-instanced, compliementing every feature of the game.   Only downside is that EvE's housing is focused majorally on the grouping/corp aspects.   And when people are talking about housing ,I feel, they are mostly talking about the *individual* instead of the *big picture*.    I just want to make it clear where I was coming from.

I think it was my biggest disapointment when I played EVE in the early days.  Given the scale of the EVE universe I wanted to play a 'Mountain Man' prospector character.  I would go out into uncharted space, build myself a base on an asteroid and prospect the area for rare ores.  I would then mine, refine them and when I had a full cargo travel back to civilization to sell it and buy supplies.   When I found that that was not possible it killed a lot of my interest in the game.  When PoS were introduced years later it was still not possible because by that time all the space was claimed by corps and alliances and getting a PoS was too expensive for a single player like me. 

I really liked the concept of player cities in SWG.  It build a sense of civilization and it was great seeing your city grow and attract new people.  The individual player housing in that game I really did not like.  I am not much into the 'Barbie's Dream House' aspect of it and the only people I cared to impress with my house were friends whom I did not need to impress.  I essentially used my house in SWG as one big storage room and would have just taken a bigger bank instead. 

For me player housing needs to have a functional purpose or it is just fluff.  Fluff can be fun in a game but it needs to be included after real content.   There was just too much fluff in SWG for me. 

Like an earlier poster, I'm relatively new to the MMO genre.  I'm more or less a semi-hardcore RTS online player.  However, what I like in MMO's is the individiuality.  MMO's eclipse real life in that you can do something not possible in RL, I know for a FACT that I can shoot giant balls of fire out of my hands(sometimes out of my ass tho) as much as i'd like to.  But even beyond that, character creation, armor dyeing housing.  They all build towards individuality to make you feel like your not just the next warrior with the big sword.  Your -insert name here-  who has ty-dye armor.. ON PURPOSE!  With the goofy hair and stands 8 feet tall with lanky build.  I haven't played many games with in-game housing, but I played LOTRO, and I loved it. 

As for SWG, i've heard so much about the housing, and i wish I could have been there to enjoy it.