Originally posted by IronZ

Obviously the launch is what killed it.  I bought the CE of the game for $70 or so and was very excited about it.  Then I tried to play it.  Everyone knows the story, it failed at launch big time.  I went back a couple of months ago due to the good things I was hearing about it.  I got it installed and updated and was set to play.  The first thing I did was create a new toon.  I just wanted to start fresh and see the game from the beginning in it's less buggy state.  When I got done customizing my toon I tried to enter the game and (this is where the bugs came back) I never left the "platform" thing that your guy is standing on after you create him.  Yes, I had full control of my character... I was just on my little platform, lol.  I said to heck with it and walked off into a great white void.  I didn't die or take any damage for that matter, I was just.....alone in a great white void.  Needless to say, I spent $15 to reinstall the game, create a toon, find a major bug, and then uninstall, lol.  That was twice they burnt me, to hell with Vanguard and all who work with it!! hehe

 

Z

I would not call this a major bug as it isn't happening to everybody.  It sounds more like a driver problem.  Do you have the latest video drivers?

Also, did you submit a bug report?  Did you go to the VG official boards and ask if anyone was having the same problem?

Or did you just throw up your hands because you really, down deep, wanted VG to fail?  And couldn't wait to come here to bash the game?

OOriginally posted by boojiboy

Originally posted by Vinterkrig

the game would have been amazing, so many cool classes

two things that killed it

 

1. released to early, it needed more work

2. you needed a beast of a computer to run the game

 

The game IS amazing and it's far from dead.  But your two points are the primary reasons the launch was a failure.  That said, those issues have been addressed and Vanguard has slowly gaining subs for 6-7 months now.  The bad launch is the reason why Vanguard will never be a mass-market MMO, but because it is the best PvE game out there, it'll continue with a healthly population and a good future.

OH, I dont' know if it is the best PvE game out there. That is completely subjective. I will say that it offers something that a lot of contemporary PvE games don't offer and that is the idea of exploration.

Still, there are are many issues with the game. There are still some bugs though those can be overlooked, the maps aren't really great, it is not apparent what one should be doing which is either a plus or a minus depending on what one is looking for in a game.

I have a Vanguard sub as my "I'm relaxing before I go to bed" game. It offers a lot though it does so inelegantly.

For instance, I finally purchased a horse and was marveling at how clunky and junky that horse was in relation to the horse I use in LOTRO or even Oblivion.

The world is beautiful and very large and there seems to be a lot to discover but there is a lot of junkiness, a lot of inelegant work that makes the whole thing feel like an indy company made it.

That doesn't have to be a bad thing but when you get players who are used to the level of polish of games like WoW and LOTRO it would be a VERY hard sell to get them to continue to play Vanguard. Even if the game was launched now, it just doesn't compete as it seems very cobbled together.

I think that Vanguard really is for the gamer's gamer. People who know its issues but know what the strengths are and are actively seeking a game with these strengths, regardless of the issues.

Actually the game is doing pretty good and very playable keep up the good work.

Originally posted by Ionselon

Originally posted by IronZ

Obviously the launch is what killed it.  I bought the CE of the game for $70 or so and was very excited about it.  Then I tried to play it.  Everyone knows the story, it failed at launch big time.  I went back a couple of months ago due to the good things I was hearing about it.  I got it installed and updated and was set to play.  The first thing I did was create a new toon.  I just wanted to start fresh and see the game from the beginning in it's less buggy state.  When I got done customizing my toon I tried to enter the game and (this is where the bugs came back) I never left the "platform" thing that your guy is standing on after you create him.  Yes, I had full control of my character... I was just on my little platform, lol.  I said to heck with it and walked off into a great white void.  I didn't die or take any damage for that matter, I was just.....alone in a great white void.  Needless to say, I spent $15 to reinstall the game, create a toon, find a major bug, and then uninstall, lol.  That was twice they burnt me, to hell with Vanguard and all who work with it!! hehe

 

Z

 

I would not call this a major bug as it isn't happening to everybody.  It sounds more like a driver problem.  Do you have the latest video drivers?

Also, did you submit a bug report?  Did you go to the VG official boards and ask if anyone was having the same problem?

Or did you just throw up your hands because you really, down deep, wanted VG to fail?  And couldn't wait to come here to bash the game?

Wow... you're pretty pathetic.  Where in that post did I say I wanted it to fail??  Why would I resub if I wanted it to fail??  Do you really call what I said bashing??  Again, pathetic.  I'm a computer junkie.  I know about all that new fangled video driver stuff.  I update them all the time and roll them back if the new drivers are buggy, not that hard really.  I'm sorry your little epeen got bruised because I stated my experience with the game.  And yes, it was a major bug to me.  It wasn't video drivers because the "physics" were there.  I walked to the edge of the platform and fell off when I went over.  The game world never loaded.  I thought it was pretty clear.  Since you aren't bright enough to pick up on it, the "to hell" comment was light hearted, notice the little "hehe" at the end??

Z

Originally posted by Iro

Originally posted by IronZ

Obviously the launch is what killed it.  I bought the CE of the game for $70 or so and was very excited about it.  Then I tried to play it.  Everyone knows the story, it failed at launch big time.  I went back a couple of months ago due to the good things I was hearing about it.  I got it installed and updated and was set to play.  The first thing I did was create a new toon.  I just wanted to start fresh and see the game from the beginning in it's less buggy state.  When I got done customizing my toon I tried to enter the game and (this is where the bugs came back) I never left the "platform" thing that your guy is standing on after you create him.  Yes, I had full control of my character... I was just on my little platform, lol.  I said to heck with it and walked off into a great white void.  I didn't die or take any damage for that matter, I was just.....alone in a great white void.  Needless to say, I spent $15 to reinstall the game, create a toon, find a major bug, and then uninstall, lol.  That was twice they burnt me, to hell with Vanguard and all who work with it!! hehe

 

Z

nZ

Originally posted by Ionselon

 

I would not call this a major bug as it isn't happening to everybody.  It sounds more like a driver problem.  Do you have the latest video drivers?

Also, did you submit a bug report?  Did you go to the VG official boards and ask if anyone was having the same problem?

Or did you just throw up your hands because you really, down deep, wanted VG to fail?  And couldn't wait to come here to bash the game?

Wow... you're pretty pathetic.  Where in that post did I say I wanted it to fail??  Why would I resub if I wanted it to fail??  Do you really call what I said bashing??  Again, pathetic.  I'm a computer junkie.  I know about all that new fangled video driver stuff.  I update them all the time and roll them back if the new drivers are buggy, not that hard really.  I'm sorry your little epeen got bruised because I stated my experience with the game.  And yes, it was a major bug to me.  It wasn't video drivers because the "physics" were there.  I walked to the edge of the platform and fell off when I went over.  The game world never loaded.  I thought it was pretty clear.  Since you aren't bright enough to pick up on it, the "to hell" comment was light hearted, notice the little "hehe" at the end??

 

Z

It looks as if you have had problems with your ATI graphcis card on Vista in the past.
 

IronZ wrote:

Windows Vista x64 here. My wife has Vista x86 and my daughter has XP Pro x86. The only game problem any of us have is trying to play Spore on my X64. It just doesn't work. I think it's ATI's drivers though.

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/2645966#2645966

Originally posted by JGMIII

VG servers were closed down?

That's news to me last I checked VG had around 75-100k subs Sony would be mentally retarded to toss away 1 million+ in revenues a month.

so where this VG is dead link? something official?

If this game had 100k subscribers, then the 4 servers it has would be packed beyond belief and most likely crash due to overloading. 

Most game designers have said that a typical mmo has rought 20% of its subscriber base logged in at prime time hours.  I've seen people here say they counted 1200+ people online during prime time on the most populated server. I personally think that percentage gets higher when the user base boils down to the more devoted and dedicated fans, but that is just my personal speculation.  I doubt the game has more than 20k users and is a far distance away from 1 million a month in revenue.

As for the original poster, I think they are correct on every point.  While Vanguard isn't dead, its future pretty much is (which is what I think they are referring to).  The game will receive some zone overhauls every now and then, which will be hailed as something akin to a free expansion, but in another 2 years this game will most likely be the same 3 continents as it will be the next 2 years after that.  The game is deprived the resources needed to make it flourish. 

The foundation that Sigil created had the potential to be amazing and in some aspects it really is.  Beyond that the game is pretty close to what it was at release and mostly canabalizing itself to expand.  I keep watching the progress in the hopes that there is some miracle turn around.

Originally posted by morpin

Originally posted by Iro

Originally posted by IronZ

Obviously the launch is what killed it.  I bought the CE of the game for $70 or so and was very excited about it.  Then I tried to play it.  Everyone knows the story, it failed at launch big time.  I went back a couple of months ago due to the good things I was hearing about it.  I got it installed and updated and was set to play.  The first thing I did was create a new toon.  I just wanted to start fresh and see the game from the beginning in it's less buggy state.  When I got done customizing my toon I tried to enter the game and (this is where the bugs came back) I never left the "platform" thing that your guy is standing on after you create him.  Yes, I had full control of my character... I was just on my little platform, lol.  I said to heck with it and walked off into a great white void.  I didn't die or take any damage for that matter, I was just.....alone in a great white void.  Needless to say, I spent $15 to reinstall the game, create a toon, find a major bug, and then uninstall, lol.  That was twice they burnt me, to hell with Vanguard and all who work with it!! hehe

 

Z

nZ

Originally posted by Ionselon

 

I would not call this a major bug as it isn't happening to everybody.  It sounds more like a driver problem.  Do you have the latest video drivers?

Also, did you submit a bug report?  Did you go to the VG official boards and ask if anyone was having the same problem?

Or did you just throw up your hands because you really, down deep, wanted VG to fail?  And couldn't wait to come here to bash the game?

Wow... you're pretty pathetic.  Where in that post did I say I wanted it to fail??  Why would I resub if I wanted it to fail??  Do you really call what I said bashing??  Again, pathetic.  I'm a computer junkie.  I know about all that new fangled video driver stuff.  I update them all the time and roll them back if the new drivers are buggy, not that hard really.  I'm sorry your little epeen got bruised because I stated my experience with the game.  And yes, it was a major bug to me.  It wasn't video drivers because the "physics" were there.  I walked to the edge of the platform and fell off when I went over.  The game world never loaded.  I thought it was pretty clear.  Since you aren't bright enough to pick up on it, the "to hell" comment was light hearted, notice the little "hehe" at the end??

 

Z

It looks as if you have had problems with your ATI graphcis card on Vista in the past.
 

IronZ wrote:

Windows Vista x64 here. My wife has Vista x86 and my daughter has XP Pro x86. The only game problem any of us have is trying to play Spore on my X64. It just doesn't work. I think it's ATI's drivers though.

 

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/2645966#2645966

 

 

With Spore, yes.  If you do a quick search of the error I was getting you would find out that it is a HUGE problem with that game on various cards.  As was stated before, video drivers wouldn't change the physics of the game itself.  It was the experience I had when I gave it one more shot.  It did't work, period.  No bashing, trolling, or whatever you want to call it.  I stated my experience and claimed nothing more about it.  Basically, it's still like it was at launch, some people have bugs, some don't.  I remember some folks claiming to have zero problems with the game when I first tried it at launch.  Some are playing it without problems now, good for them!  If you want to search my posts you'll see that I've stated before that I don't want to see any game fail, it's not good for the genre.  Go ahead....search it...

Z

Z

Vanguard....

Well, I just resubscribed for a couple of months, I was interested in seeing how it was, the last time I played it was in 2007. I was really surprised at the vast improvements across the board when it came to performance, they streamlined the game really well, I think there is still room for some improvements here and there, but it's definitely a totally night/day experience.

I also like the new character models, and the new hairstyles coming up look cool. Except I wish they'd give Wood Elf women more attractive, longer options. This game really is what a mmoRPG should be like.  I love the enormous world, it's not static, and it's very open, you can litterally go anywhere you see in the distance. I also like the fact you can get a mount early on. One complaint I have is the level of difficulty, especially once you leave the early levels, solo content could use expansion, and the difficulty for some quests that claim to be solo quests should be toned down.

Aside from that I really don't see a reason *not* to play this game. It's by far one of the prettier games on the market, it's full of unique systems, and overall just has that *thing* that draws you back in each time. I really hope SOE will begin to market and re-introduce this game to the public after their next couple GU's, as it has plenty to offer, and such great potential to actually compete in the current market, and against games that aren't even out yet.

I logged in a bit tonight having been playing eq2 for awhile.  My but vg isn't a pretty game :P  Still wish the animations esp the cape animations were better but the environment and graphics are so pretty and run very nicely on my system.  I'm focused on eq2 for now but I'm starting to look forward to returning to vg.  The servers xeth and seradon said medium pops which is good but there weren't as many lower level players as I expected.  around 80-100 players for each tier not counting 50.  I really don't know why more poeple don't play vg.

It isn't perfect for sure but what game is, and it does have some very nice features.

I haven't played VG for quite some time now, I have station pass from SoE, but I no longer have the game discs for VG, is there somewhere I can redownload the game?

Originally posted by Kilnu

I haven't played VG for quite some time now, I have station pass from SoE, but I no longer have the game discs for VG, is there somewhere I can redownload the game?

Just go to http://www.station.sony.com/ and Download the station launcher beta. It will download the whole thing for ya :)

Thanks Eki!!!

 Yes the game still has performance issues, yes it has come along way where at the beginning it was almost unplayable.  It does lack the polish and smoothness of wow , eq2 , lotro, etc. fun game but still needs major work on stuttering, hitching and lag in combat.  Keep working Sony I hope you get it right. 

Originally posted by Johnhost

So Microsoft not wanting to piss any more money away parted ways with Sigil.  So then SOE eagerlly buys it, and does hardly anything to develop it, and now is pissing it away with RMT crap.

If the statement on Microsoft that I read on this forum, concerning another game, is correct then I think it was not only about pissing out more money.
Something along the lines, meaning something like this: Blizzard have been the only game that have 11 million subscribers so we are not interested in the market.

So in perspective. SOE buying a game is a positive thing counting in favour for SOE is it not?

Originally posted by Orphes

Originally posted by Johnhost

So Microsoft not wanting to piss any more money away parted ways with Sigil.  So then SOE eagerlly buys it, and does hardly anything to develop it, and now is pissing it away with RMT crap.

 

If the statement on Microsoft that I read on this forum, concerning another game, is correct then I think it was not only about pissing out more money.
Something along the lines, meaning something like this: Blizzard have been the only game that have 11 million subscribers so we are not interested in the market.

So in perspective. SOE buying a game is a positive thing counting in favour for SOE is it not?

Microsoft bailed on marvel online, because they did not believe they could compete in the current market. That is where your reference comes from, not from thier dealings with vanguard.

Microsoft was killing the VG project, because it wasn't on schedule and there was some internal direction changes at microsoft.

Soe invested in the game only to have the same results as microsoft.  Throwing good money after bad is never positive.  Investing in a game so it can have a terrible release will just push more investors away from investing in more open world "sand boxlike" style games in favor of games that did better using other formats.

Sadly all vanguard has really done is offer a case study of what not to do, which is why I have said in the past it would have better off not released at all.  Even though I think the foundation of the game is a much better direction for my personal play style and maybe the market overall.

Originally posted by IronZ

With Spore, yes.  If you do a quick search of the error I was getting you would find out that it is a HUGE problem with that game on various cards.  As was stated before, video drivers wouldn't change the physics of the game itself.  It was the experience I had when I gave it one more shot.  It did't work, period.  No bashing, trolling, or whatever you want to call it.  I stated my experience and claimed nothing more about it.  Basically, it's still like it was at launch, some people have bugs, some don't.  I remember some folks claiming to have zero problems with the game when I first tried it at launch.  Some are playing it without problems now, good for them!  If you want to search my posts you'll see that I've stated before that I don't want to see any game fail, it's not good for the genre.  Go ahead....search it...

For not wanting a game to fail and being a computer junkie, you sure didn't put up much of a fight, is all everyone is saying. It most likely is a drivers issue, regardless of what you think, and you did not remotely try to fix it. If you didn't want the game to fail, you might of checked a forum or fiddled with something on your PC. Basically what I am saying and what the other guy is saying is there are some holes in your logic.

Originally posted by Daffid011

Originally posted by Orphes

Originally posted by Johnhost

So Microsoft not wanting to piss any more money away parted ways with Sigil.  So then SOE eagerlly buys it, and does hardly anything to develop it, and now is pissing it away with RMT crap.

 

If the statement on Microsoft that I read on this forum, concerning another game, is correct then I think it was not only about pissing out more money.
Something along the lines, meaning something like this: Blizzard have been the only game that have 11 million subscribers so we are not interested in the market.

So in perspective. SOE buying a game is a positive thing counting in favour for SOE is it not?

Microsoft bailed on marvel online, because they did not believe they could compete in the current market. That is where your reference comes from, not from thier dealings with vanguard.

Microsoft was killing the VG project, because it wasn't on schedule and there was some internal direction changes at microsoft.

 

Soe invested in the game only to have the same results as microsoft.  Throwing good money after bad is never positive.  Investing in a game so it can have a terrible release will just push more investors away from investing in more open world "sand boxlike" style games in favor of games that did better using other formats.

 

Sadly all vanguard has really done is offer a case study of what not to do, which is why I have said in the past it would have better off not released at all.  Even though I think the foundation of the game is a much better direction for my personal play style and maybe the market overall. 

Well I guess that is your point of view.

The story as I know it has been that Microsoft invested anywehre between $24 Million to $60 Million into the project.  Microsoft carried this game for 4 years of development.

April 2002... May 2006.  (I was in the beta when Microsoft was still hosting it).

If *you* were in beta at that time.. then you wouldn't have posted what you just did.

SOE became a co-publisher of Vanguard in May of 2006.

The game launched in January of 2007.

Which means that SOE made sure development was funded from May 2006... Jan 2007.  SOE also took resources off other projects and had them assist the Sigil team.

So I'm not sure where this idea that the game wasn't invested in by anyone or given a chance comes from.

That's almost 5 years of development costs covered by other companies (Microsoft and SOE).  How many more years did you expect anyone to fund it?

Do you think SOE had 40 to 100 million dollars laying around just in case some game could be bought cheap?  Do you think Smedley has the authority to append the SOE budget that much?  Or do you think that people higher up in Sony Corporation actually have to approve anything like that?

I mean there is a pretty easy to see logic pattern here.

Who else do you think would have picked this game up and had the resources and server hosting to finish it?

In the US the only companies with that kind of setup at the time were NCSoft and EA.

Short version:  If SOE didn't pick the game up it wouldn't have been published at all.

Yes perhaps that would have been better to some people... I don't know what else to say.

*note*

I'm not a big fan of SOE... but people blaming what VG "launched as" on SOE is just something I can't see any logic to.

Yes I had high hopes for VG... Yet when I got invited to the Microsoft beta that changed pretty fast.  I remember reading the beta leak threads on FoH forums back then... (as an example) and most people (who weren't in beta) just said it couldn't be that bad... oh well.

Originally posted by Daffid011

Originally posted by Orphes

Originally posted by Johnhost

So Microsoft not wanting to piss any more money away parted ways with Sigil.  So then SOE eagerlly buys it, and does hardly anything to develop it, and now is pissing it away with RMT crap.

 

If the statement on Microsoft that I read on this forum, concerning another game, is correct then I think it was not only about pissing out more money.
Something along the lines, meaning something like this: Blizzard have been the only game that have 11 million subscribers so we are not interested in the market.

So in perspective. SOE buying a game is a positive thing counting in favour for SOE is it not?

Microsoft bailed on marvel online, because they did not believe they could compete in the current market. That is where your reference comes from, not from thier dealings with vanguard.

Microsoft was killing the VG project, because it wasn't on schedule and there was some internal direction changes at microsoft.

 

Soe invested in the game only to have the same results as microsoft.  Throwing good money after bad is never positive.  Investing in a game so it can have a terrible release will just push more investors away from investing in more open world "sand boxlike" style games in favor of games that did better using other formats.

 

Sadly all vanguard has really done is offer a case study of what not to do, which is why I have said in the past it would have better off not released at all.  Even though I think the foundation of the game is a much better direction for my personal play style and maybe the market overall.

 

 

I was trying to point out that Microsoft probably/apperantly is not a good at MMO. And also their views on it. Our chance to be dominating is to small and we are not doing small stuff.

Maybe they noticed that Vanguard won't be the greatest game... (Oh, wait.)