Originally posted by Rhoklaw 

If any current subscriber can prove to me that a new player can survive the first day without being ganked once

No. Well, unless you find sitting around a guard tower entertaining.

Originally posted by 1pitboss

Originally posted by biske

Originally posted by 1pitboss

That is why this game will fail within 6 months. While I like pvp and remember playing in UO that is exaclty why UO failed. Yes, pvp is fun and exciting but not a game that is always like that, let's face it most paying players will not stay around and pay a fee to log on and get ganked. As far as finances go and I know about money which is what these companys live off of this game will fold or make serious changes to its format. Don't believe me that is fine, flame me that is fine, I do not care, money is the bottom line. There is not enough pure pvp base willing to pay to play this game. Most gamers really want a socal thing and throw in some killing and quest but log on and get ganked and ganked means frustration and players just will not pay for that and then keep paying for it. In 6 months all you pkers whining away.

 

If you call being the longest running MMO in history and still running to date a failure, then sure, give it 6 months.

If you look at the current populations of other games you will see I am right. Yes, UO is still around but who cares? who pays for it no one? instead they are making WOW and others rich.
 

Because the vast majority of players don't like PvP. UO pre tam is like EvE right now, and look at EvE 500k players and growing. What do you say about that?

Just don't play DF, EvE, MO, or Rise. The players that want these type of games don't want you QQing and runing our games when there are games out there that you can play, even PvP based ones. FFXI, WoW, WAR, AoC, VG, LotR, SWtOR, Startrek, and SGW. Go play those.

Also, while its Dog eat Dog now, in a month or two it will be GvG when clans are established. Even in EvE and old UO there is order

Well, most PvP games offer CvC or GvG type gameplay. So DFO doesn't offer anything new in that category. My question was based more towards ganking of lowbies, which has nothing to do with CvC or GvG. So if what your saying is true, that DFO offers players the chance to wipe out some new players for kicks, thats what deters me from playing.

I for one don't understand, from a business point of view, why any gaming company would consider this type of gameplay an ideal income strategy. No one enjoys being ganked by some other player or players who are obviously overpowered compared to them. Thats about as fun as watching paint dry and I certainly don't think too many people pay to do that.

I have nothing against your gaming interests and simply wanted to know what DFO was about. I can see now, it offers nothing but frustration in my eyes and will therefor bypass it while I wait for Earthrise.

Thank you...

Originally posted by JuJutsu

What hurt UO was the release of of EQ, a game where players didn't have to put up with PKing asshats. I'd like for Aventurine to have a game online for a while, it'll keep the sociopaths from irritating the rest of us. But it won't last. Six months from now all the FFA PK whiners will be back QQing about nothing for them to do and blaming Darkfall's failure on the game design....and not where it belongs, on the sewer it has for a target market.

you don't think it was because uo was bland?  because uo only had one race?  because devs at uo completely ignored the playerbase and went hog-wild nerfing one thing after another and changing up way too many skills/effects?

heard lots of complaints along those lines, way moreso than "oh da bad PkS".

Originally posted by biske

 

Amen! Frankly It is that kind of thinking that turned one of the greatest games of all time into the carebare neon unicorns super dragon pets lets go kill peerless together because pvp is dead shell of the game it used to be. This game has boasted many times that they are modeled after the spirit of the origional oldschool pre trammel (pvp-free good world)  uo. And the number one mistake they made was listening to the 10% who wanted an easy ride free ticket without having to put forth any work or effort into building themselves up, and look what happened, the playerbase got cut in half with the release of trammel when a majority of their tenured players walked out on the spot, the game continually declined from there as the continued to make mistake after mistake by listening to the trammy moron 10% who flamed their boards all day complaining about how hard or unbalanced the game was as the players who loved the game kept silent because they were busy actually playing the game and enjoying it, and yet they wondered why they went from the most subscribed online game on the market to only having 5 figures in subscriptions.

 I say if you're struggling then bite your lip and earn your keep. 98% of the online games out there are catered towards the easy ride have your cake and eat it too mentality. Play one of them. Don't even think about killing this games potential like they did to uo.

     Sorry but that is not true...Their subs went up significantly after Trammel was added....It wasnt until much later with the ninjas and samarais and crap that it started to tumble.......They added Trammell because players were leaving at a good clip and they had a ton of complaints about no safe areas at all......Yeah it was a carebear move but they would not have had any game if it had stayed the way it was.......

Originally posted by Theocritus

Originally posted by biske

 

Amen! Frankly It is that kind of thinking that turned one of the greatest games of all time into the carebare neon unicorns super dragon pets lets go kill peerless together because pvp is dead shell of the game it used to be. This game has boasted many times that they are modeled after the spirit of the origional oldschool pre trammel (pvp-free good world)  uo. And the number one mistake they made was listening to the 10% who wanted an easy ride free ticket without having to put forth any work or effort into building themselves up, and look what happened, the playerbase got cut in half with the release of trammel when a majority of their tenured players walked out on the spot, the game continually declined from there as the continued to make mistake after mistake by listening to the trammy moron 10% who flamed their boards all day complaining about how hard or unbalanced the game was as the players who loved the game kept silent because they were busy actually playing the game and enjoying it, and yet they wondered why they went from the most subscribed online game on the market to only having 5 figures in subscriptions.

 I say if you're struggling then bite your lip and earn your keep. 98% of the online games out there are catered towards the easy ride have your cake and eat it too mentality. Play one of them. Don't even think about killing this games potential like they did to uo.

 

     Sorry but that is not true...Their subs went up significantly after Trammel was added....It wasnt until much later with the ninjas and samarais and crap that it started to tumble.......They added Trammell because players were leaving at a good clip and they had a ton of complaints about no safe areas at all......Yeah it was a carebear move but they would not have had any game if it had stayed the way it was.......

actually if you want to mark the exact point that it began to fall, it would be publish 16, the release of insurance. Its true that the most significant drop did take place around the time of samurai empire,  but se was not the cause, it was the release of wow.

Originally posted by xpiher

Originally posted by 1pitboss

Originally posted by biske

Originally posted by 1pitboss

That is why this game will fail within 6 months. While I like pvp and remember playing in UO that is exaclty why UO failed. Yes, pvp is fun and exciting but not a game that is always like that, let's face it most paying players will not stay around and pay a fee to log on and get ganked. As far as finances go and I know about money which is what these companys live off of this game will fold or make serious changes to its format. Don't believe me that is fine, flame me that is fine, I do not care, money is the bottom line. There is not enough pure pvp base willing to pay to play this game. Most gamers really want a socal thing and throw in some killing and quest but log on and get ganked and ganked means frustration and players just will not pay for that and then keep paying for it. In 6 months all you pkers whining away.

 

If you call being the longest running MMO in history and still running to date a failure, then sure, give it 6 months.

If you look at the current populations of other games you will see I am right. Yes, UO is still around but who cares? who pays for it no one? instead they are making WOW and others rich.
 

 

Because the vast majority of players don't like PvP. UO pre tam is like EvE right now, and look at EvE 500k players and growing. What do you say about that?

Just don't play DF, EvE, MO, or Rise. The players that want these type of games don't want you QQing and runing our games when there are games out there that you can play, even PvP based ones. FFXI, WoW, WAR, AoC, VG, LotR, SWtOR, Startrek, and SGW. Go play those.

 

Also, while its Dog eat Dog now, in a month or two it will be GvG when clans are established. Even in EvE and old UO there is order

Amen! You can talk about marketing and budget all you want, but I'm yet to hear anyone from darkfall say they care about what in the blue hell happens to their marketshare, they made the game because they are doing what they love. And they love pvp. If you don't, theres thousands of other games out there, let people who do what they love provide a service to people who love the same thing and leave the pocketbooks out of it. What I do know is there are thousands of oldschool pvpers from ten years ago who left uo heartbroken that EA ruined the game they loved, and I know hundreds more who still play uo for no other reason then the fact that even though its a shell of the game it once was, and they spend a good amount of their time reverently reflecting on past memories of glory, there is still yet to be another game that had that same spirit, the same culture. So let us finally have our day and leave the money grubbing marketing plans to WoW. Some people do things because they love it, not because they want more subscriptions then most major religions.
 

STOP COMPARING THIS GAME TO EVE.

First, the crafting system in EVE is better, period.  You can also do crafting only and actually make money, unlike what I've been hearing from this game.

Second, EVE is FAR more complex than this game.  This game doesn't even come close to comparing with the things you can do in EVE.

And the biggest point, EVE does have safe areas.  Empire space, anyone?  And you can advance pretty far in Empire space.  There are also tutorials and everything to guide you.  There are no tutorials here.  EVE is also one of the best (only?) sci-fi space MMOs out there.  Darkfall is just fantasy, and there are thousands of those.

And to answer the OPs question...new players will be ganked, constantly.  Have you seen the community that follows this game?  The only reason ganking isn't rampant already is because everyone's still learning everything.  Once people figure things out and get situated, then the gank squads will start going after newbies.  The game is very similar to Asheron's Call, and trust me, people on DT camped newbies all the time for sheer amusement.

A two year veteran with the best gear could be killed by 3-4 new players, relatively easily if he gets careless. This isn't WoW. Even maxing everything out doesn't make you a God, it just gives you more options.

Originally posted by Bintowe

STOP COMPARING THIS GAME TO EVE.

First, the crafting system in EVE is better, period.  You can also do crafting only and actually make money, unlike what I've been hearing from this game.

Second, EVE is FAR more complex than this game.  This game doesn't even come close to comparing with the things you can do in EVE.

And the biggest point, EVE does have safe areas.  Empire space, anyone?  And you can advance pretty far in Empire space.  There are also tutorials and everything to guide you.  There are no tutorials here.  EVE is also one of the best (only?) sci-fi space MMOs out there.  Darkfall is just fantasy, and there are thousands of those.

And to answer the OPs question...new players will be ganked, constantly.  Have you seen the community that follows this game?  The only reason ganking isn't rampant already is because everyone's still learning everything.  Once people figure things out and get situated, then the gank squads will start going after newbies.  The game is very similar to Asheron's Call, and trust me, people on DT camped newbies all the time for sheer amusement.

LOL dude you are priceless... Out of 3 pages of discussion, ONE PERSON names EVE, and he compares UO pre-trammel with EVE, and you completely loose your shit over it...

Did you even read the guy's post? There you are talking about crafting systems when he was talking about something completely different.

Originally posted by Bintowe

STOP COMPARING THIS GAME TO EVE.

First, the crafting system in EVE is better, period.  You can also do crafting only and actually make money, unlike what I've been hearing from this game.

Second, EVE is FAR more complex than this game.  This game doesn't even come close to comparing with the things you can do in EVE.

And the biggest point, EVE does have safe areas.  Empire space, anyone?  And you can advance pretty far in Empire space.  There are also tutorials and everything to guide you.  There are no tutorials here.  EVE is also one of the best (only?) sci-fi space MMOs out there.  Darkfall is just fantasy, and there are thousands of those.

And to answer the OPs question...new players will be ganked, constantly.  Have you seen the community that follows this game?  The only reason ganking isn't rampant already is because everyone's still learning everything.  Once people figure things out and get situated, then the gank squads will start going after newbies.  The game is very similar to Asheron's Call, and trust me, people on DT camped newbies all the time for sheer amusement.

I really hope your right and this game is like Asheron's Call, I really hope your right.  Because if it is, then this is one amazing game!

Originally posted by biske

Originally posted by Theocritus

Originally posted by biske

 

Amen! Frankly It is that kind of thinking that turned one of the greatest games of all time into the carebare neon unicorns super dragon pets lets go kill peerless together because pvp is dead shell of the game it used to be. This game has boasted many times that they are modeled after the spirit of the origional oldschool pre trammel (pvp-free good world)  uo. And the number one mistake they made was listening to the 10% who wanted an easy ride free ticket without having to put forth any work or effort into building themselves up, and look what happened, the playerbase got cut in half with the release of trammel when a majority of their tenured players walked out on the spot, the game continually declined from there as the continued to make mistake after mistake by listening to the trammy moron 10% who flamed their boards all day complaining about how hard or unbalanced the game was as the players who loved the game kept silent because they were busy actually playing the game and enjoying it, and yet they wondered why they went from the most subscribed online game on the market to only having 5 figures in subscriptions.

 I say if you're struggling then bite your lip and earn your keep. 98% of the online games out there are catered towards the easy ride have your cake and eat it too mentality. Play one of them. Don't even think about killing this games potential like they did to uo.

 

     Sorry but that is not true...Their subs went up significantly after Trammel was added....It wasnt until much later with the ninjas and samarais and crap that it started to tumble.......They added Trammell because players were leaving at a good clip and they had a ton of complaints about no safe areas at all......Yeah it was a carebear move but they would not have had any game if it had stayed the way it was.......

 actually if you want to mark the exact point that it began to fall, it would be publish 16, the release of insurance. Its true that the most significant drop did take place around the time of samurai empire,  but se was not the cause, it was the release of wow.

Actually... no.

P16 was in 2002, right? At the time, subscriptions were still quite stable. In 2003, after Age of Shadows, that's when subscription numbers started to drop.

Also, before oldskoolers start rose-tinted goggling about Pre Tram: No. After Trammel was created in 2000, Subscriptions were still going up.

Oh fuck me. I was slightly wrong. I looked on http://www.mmogchart.com/Chart2.html and yes, the drop was indeed most significant around Samurai Empire in 2004.

Dont play it if u dont like the ruleset. Its that simple.

Why u guys QQ about it when u now the ruleset? Its not like u HAVE to buy it and such.

I will try it out, i know the rules and if i dont like it, get to much ganked and such as example i will just move on to another game and wont be in DF forum crying about it.  Becours i knew the ruleset before i bought it.

You crybabies are QQ:ing about it before u even had the chanse to play it. Its very pathatic really.

For an example. A new movie coming out, lets say its a comedy. But i hate comedy movies so il join a forum  whining and QQ about that movie is just a comedy. People say to me "Dont buy it if u dont like comedy its that simple" But i keep insist telling people how i will not like it, predicts its future to people who actually likes comedy movies.

Ok first of all.

If you have never played a full loot pvp mmo, no shit it will take time to adapt.

rule 1 is you dont go out with your best stuff unless you can replace it.

You only go out with stuff you can easily replace.

Always stay aware when npc'ing or resource gathering, DF is helpful in that sounds carry, you can hear another player ratting or farming stuff from the sound of fighting or footsteps.

New player, 4 months in, day 1. He will try npc, and will die often, and get lost in the massive world, probably be ganked.

My tip: Get into a clan, ANY clan as long as it is active and doing stuff like npc killing and a bit of pvp, doesn't matter if they have 50 or if they are a big clan with cities and hamlets and have 300. Join them and learn the ropes, as with EVE, playing solo as a noob=rapid boredom and quitting, in most cases.

Originally posted by silicon111

Dont play it if u dont like the ruleset. Its that simple.

Why u guys QQ about it when u now the ruleset? Its not like u HAVE to buy it and such.

I will try it out, i know the rules and if i dont like it, get to much ganked and such as example i will just move on to another game and wont be in DF forum crying about it.  Becours i knew the ruleset before i bought it.

You crybabies are QQ:ing about it before u even had the chanse to play it. Its very pathatic really.

For an example. A new movie coming out, lets say its a comedy. But i hate comedy movies so il join a forum  whining and QQ about that movie is just a comedy. People say to me "Dont buy it if u dont like comedy its that simple" But i keep insist telling people how i will not like it, predicts its future to people who actually likes comedy movies.

 

I think a more accurate analogy would be comparing DFO to Star Wars 1 and having Jar Jar Binks = Ganking. When reviews came back after SW1 released, most of them cried out for less Jar Jar annoyance and low and behold, Jar Jar played a smaller role in SW2.

I'm not saying they should change anything in DFO, I was simply asking if ganking of lowbies is able to be minimized. If not, than no, I won't be trying DFO. I'm not trying to change your game, so relax.

Originally posted by Rhoklaw

Since this is a FFA PvP Full Loot game, I can't help but wonder how new players will survive such a brutal world? I for one do not enjoy being ganked by high level players the minute I log in my first character. So, what are the game mechanics, if any, that prevent this from happening? If there are none, I feel sorry for Aventurine expecting any future subscriptions to a game that is obviously anti friendly to new players.

Examples of new player friendly PvP games are WoW, DAoC, Shadowbane and WAR.

If any current subscriber can prove to me that a new player can survive the first day without being ganked once, please indulge me the secret. I may even give DFO a try if this is at all possible.

I thought this game had no levels. Where is the difficulty in surviving if it's skill based? Unless the learning curve is super high of course.

Numbers don't lie...

http://www.mmogchart.com/Chart2.html

Originally posted by brs24

Originally posted by Bintowe

STOP COMPARING THIS GAME TO EVE.

First, the crafting system in EVE is better, period.  You can also do crafting only and actually make money, unlike what I've been hearing from this game.

Second, EVE is FAR more complex than this game.  This game doesn't even come close to comparing with the things you can do in EVE.

And the biggest point, EVE does have safe areas.  Empire space, anyone?  And you can advance pretty far in Empire space.  There are also tutorials and everything to guide you.  There are no tutorials here.  EVE is also one of the best (only?) sci-fi space MMOs out there.  Darkfall is just fantasy, and there are thousands of those.

And to answer the OPs question...new players will be ganked, constantly.  Have you seen the community that follows this game?  The only reason ganking isn't rampant already is because everyone's still learning everything.  Once people figure things out and get situated, then the gank squads will start going after newbies.  The game is very similar to Asheron's Call, and trust me, people on DT camped newbies all the time for sheer amusement.

I really hope your right and this game is like Asheron's Call, I really hope your right.  Because if it is, then this is one amazing game!

so um, why aren't you playing AC then?  wasn't there an AC2 as well?  why aren't you playing one of those?

and i second it -- stop insulting eve like that.  seriously.  the two games are nothing alike.  df seems to have a lot more in common with hko than eve.

Originally posted by sk8terh8ter

Originally posted by Rhoklaw

Since this is a FFA PvP Full Loot game, I can't help but wonder how new players will survive such a brutal world? I for one do not enjoy being ganked by high level players the minute I log in my first character. So, what are the game mechanics, if any, that prevent this from happening? If there are none, I feel sorry for Aventurine expecting any future subscriptions to a game that is obviously anti friendly to new players.

Examples of new player friendly PvP games are WoW, DAoC, Shadowbane and WAR.

If any current subscriber can prove to me that a new player can survive the first day without being ganked once, please indulge me the secret. I may even give DFO a try if this is at all possible.

 

I thought this game had no levels. Where is the difficulty in surviving if it's skill based? Unless the learning curve is super high of course.

so, what you believe is that someone wearing the best armor, with amor-casting skills maxed, spell casting skills maxed, archery skills maxed, decked out with potions/scrolls/magic weapons/whatever... who joins with a group of people and camps noob areas... that the players who just joined (noobs), will be fully able to destroy them?

if you're trolling, you're not making any sense.  if you're being serious, it still isn't making any sense.  maybe you're just new and don't understand the whole "skill level" thing?

Originally posted by guidi2009

Wait, what.  Wow is pvp friendly to new players?  I dont think so.  you have to go from level 1 to 80 and then catch up in gear.  That takes months upon months Wow and others and not pvp friendly to new players

well, on a pvp server it might not be noob friendly; but on any server, you can join the lvl 10-19 battlegrounds.  only lvl 10-19 players can get into those... same thing for the other BGs with set levels...

what are you talking about?