Well  if a mob passed me while chasing another player, and my faction with that mob was negative so it also disliked me, then logically it should attack me on its way back to where it normally patrolled.

I miss that kind of sensible AI which existed in classic EQ. Most of the newer theme park games either warp the NPC mob back to its starting point or code the NPC mob to ignore other players while it heads back to its starting spot, even though its original target is cleared from its hate list.

I hope Darkfall truly does have realistic AI for NPC mobs.

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Well  if a mob passed me while chasing another player, and my faction with that mob was negative so it also disliked me, then logically it should attack me on it's way back to where it normally patrolled.

I miss that kind of sensible AI which existed in classic EQ. Most of the newer theme park games either warp the NPC mob back to its starting point or code the NPC mob to ignore other players while it heads back to its starting spot, even though it's original target is cleared from its hate list.

I hope Darkfall truly does have realistic AI for NPC mobs.

Well, it depends on the purpose of mobs. In the end, mobs are powerups. If the game was predominantly a pve game then I would agree with you.

But since this is a pvp game, the mob really is there to just further your character and make the world seem like it has a little bit of life.

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Well  if a mob passed me while chasing another player, and my faction with that mob was negative so it also disliked me, then logically it should attack me on its way back to where it normally patrolled.

I miss that kind of sensible AI which existed in classic EQ. Most of the newer theme park games either warp the NPC mob back to its starting point or code the NPC mob to ignore other players while it heads back to its starting spot, even though its original target is cleared from its hate list.

I hope Darkfall truly does have realistic AI for NPC mobs.

I'd have to imagine that AI is implemented that way to prevent people from making huge aggro trains and killing everyone.. then looting them.

Or maybe I'm crazy

Probably not going to be many NPC mobs in this game. You are mainly going to be fighting other players with hopefully some form of intelligence.

Originally posted by Briansho

Probably not going to be many NPC mobs in this game. You are mainly going to be fighting other players with hopefully some form of intelligence.

thre will be plenty of mobs in game

Originally posted by Sovrath

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Well  if a mob passed me while chasing another player, and my faction with that mob was negative so it also disliked me, then logically it should attack me on it's way back to where it normally patrolled.

I miss that kind of sensible AI which existed in classic EQ. Most of the newer theme park games either warp the NPC mob back to its starting point or code the NPC mob to ignore other players while it heads back to its starting spot, even though it's original target is cleared from its hate list.

I hope Darkfall truly does have realistic AI for NPC mobs.

 

Well, it depends on the purpose of mobs. In the end, mobs are powerups. If the game was predominantly a pve game then I would agree with you.

But since this is a pvp game, the mob really is there to just further your character and make the world seem like it has a little bit of life.

actully pve is there for the same reason pvp there game play

The recent patch notes say the ordinary world mobs such as lions, tigers etc have now been implemented. Would be nice for ave to give a few screenies of those.

Originally posted by Xxeon

Originally posted by Sovrath

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Well  if a mob passed me while chasing another player, and my faction with that mob was negative so it also disliked me, then logically it should attack me on it's way back to where it normally patrolled.

I miss that kind of sensible AI which existed in classic EQ. Most of the newer theme park games either warp the NPC mob back to its starting point or code the NPC mob to ignore other players while it heads back to its starting spot, even though it's original target is cleared from its hate list.

I hope Darkfall truly does have realistic AI for NPC mobs.

 

Well, it depends on the purpose of mobs. In the end, mobs are powerups. If the game was predominantly a pve game then I would agree with you.

But since this is a pvp game, the mob really is there to just further your character and make the world seem like it has a little bit of life.

actully pve is there for the same reason pvp there game play

Yes, I understand that.

However designers/developers don't throw in mobs just because.

If the devs wanted to they could easily put in ai that kept players highly challenged. But if the reason the mobs are there is because they are for leveling purposes (lineage 2 for example) then they are made to be beaten. They might cause a bit of effort, especially if there are respawns or you aggro more than you can handle, but they are there as essentially powerups.

And since this is a pvp game, and one that hearkens back to some older styles of gameplay, they aren't going to be small 15 minute encounters where you test your skills.

If there was no pvp and the mobs were the sole means of entertainment then sure, I can see them being far more robust.

But players do need to remember that this is a pvp game. Quite frankly, I can name several more robust pve games that would offer more than what I"m seeing on the pve side of Dark Fall. However, having said that, it seems to be excelling in its pvp system.

We need the mobs with natural hate to attack anyone who is on it's hate list as this forms part of the PVE environment and will allow some experience factor to increase skills when not being used in PvP. Make sense to have a balance so that certain mobs will not attack 10 party member as to preserve it life and viscera verse. if there are a group of four mobs and you are alone then they should feel they have the upper hand and attack provided they have a reason for example goblin group protecting it's village or scouting for toys and food.
 

I hope that it will work something like this anyway, keeping the balance of power in the wilderness will be a challenge IMHO for the developers.
 

Bandit

Training mobs onto another player is just another 'mechanism' that players would use to not get a murder count.  It would be exploited non-stop and the whole 'punishment for being a murderer' goes right out the window because nobody would get murder counts.

Originally posted by Alandora

Training mobs onto another player is just another 'mechanism' that players would use to not get a murder count.  It would be exploited non-stop and the whole 'punishment for being a murderer' goes right out the window because nobody would get murder counts.

Won't players be able to have alts on secondary accounts to erase their murderer status with by killing them over and over? I am not advocating it, but it's gonna happen.

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Originally posted by Alandora

Training mobs onto another player is just another 'mechanism' that players would use to not get a murder count.  It would be exploited non-stop and the whole 'punishment for being a murderer' goes right out the window because nobody would get murder counts.

Won't players be able to have alts on secondary accounts to erase their murderer status with by killing them over and over? I am not advocating it, but it's gonna happen.

Yes, secondary accounts will be common.

And, btw, the mob mechanism you asked about allows to grief people (using the old and nice trains on them).  So, particularly, I dont like it.

Originally posted by Keeper2000

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Originally posted by Alandora

Training mobs onto another player is just another 'mechanism' that players would use to not get a murder count.  It would be exploited non-stop and the whole 'punishment for being a murderer' goes right out the window because nobody would get murder counts.

Won't players be able to have alts on secondary accounts to erase their murderer status with by killing them over and over? I am not advocating it, but it's gonna happen.

Yes, secondary accounts will be common.

And, btw, the mob mechanism you asked about allows to grief people (using the old and nice trains on them).  So, particularly, I dont like it.

 

I don't think griefing is a realistic complaint in a full loot FFA PvP environment.  If I stalk you and kill you repeatedly day in and day out, mano a mano, will you consider that griefing? The ruleset and mechanics will allow it.

If you are paying attention, as you should be, and not afk in the wilderness, then you will see the mobs chasing someone the first time they pass you and you should be prepared for their return. If not, that is your fault.

I just want to enjoy a realistic environment again, similar to classic EQ, with real consequences and realistic NPC mob interaction.

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Originally posted by Alandora

Training mobs onto another player is just another 'mechanism' that players would use to not get a murder count.  It would be exploited non-stop and the whole 'punishment for being a murderer' goes right out the window because nobody would get murder counts.

Won't players be able to have alts on secondary accounts to erase their murderer status with by killing them over and over? I am not advocating it, but it's gonna happen.

Yeah, that was the point to a thread a made a long time ago.  The whole 'murderer' system is flawed because the worst 'murderers' will never actually get punished for it.  They will either find ways to kill players without getting murder counts to begin with (ie train mobs onto them), or they will have an exploit to remove murder counts quickly.

It's like UO.. you never really 'feared' people who were red, because they were generally the dumb players.  The players you most had to fear were players who never even turned gray... they were the truly masterful murderers.

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Originally posted by Keeper2000

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Originally posted by Alandora

Training mobs onto another player is just another 'mechanism' that players would use to not get a murder count.  It would be exploited non-stop and the whole 'punishment for being a murderer' goes right out the window because nobody would get murder counts.

Won't players be able to have alts on secondary accounts to erase their murderer status with by killing them over and over? I am not advocating it, but it's gonna happen.

Yes, secondary accounts will be common.

And, btw, the mob mechanism you asked about allows to grief people (using the old and nice trains on them).  So, particularly, I dont like it.

 

I don't think griefing is a realistic complaint in a full loot FFA PvP environment.  If I stalk you and kill you repeatedly day in and day out, mano a mano, will you consider that griefing? The ruleset and mechanics will allow it.

If you are paying attention, as you should be, and not afk in the wilderness, then you will see the mobs chasing someone the first time they pass you and you should be prepared for their return. If not, that is your fault.

I just want to enjoy a realistic environment again, similar to classic EQ, with real consequences and realistic NPC mob interaction.

If the game rules allow it, I wont complain.  But I dont have to like it.  I respect that you like it.

Btw, the "paying attention" argument had been used by most griefers since the begining of MMOs lol.

Finally, the "using the game mechaisnm" can be decieving.  Lin2, for example, is a FFA PvP and some people did complaing about trains and I think they do have a point.  The main resoning is this: if you attack someone you get flagged so we can PvP but if you train me with mobs, you dont.  In a full loot, I would be able to train you, get you killed, loot you and not get flagged.

We can discuss this point to the end of days, of coruse (as it had been done in hundreds of threads).  The point is that your opinion is that you like it and mine is that I dont.

Originally posted by Keeper2000

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Originally posted by Keeper2000

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Originally posted by Alandora

Training mobs onto another player is just another 'mechanism' that players would use to not get a murder count.  It would be exploited non-stop and the whole 'punishment for being a murderer' goes right out the window because nobody would get murder counts.

Won't players be able to have alts on secondary accounts to erase their murderer status with by killing them over and over? I am not advocating it, but it's gonna happen.

Yes, secondary accounts will be common.

And, btw, the mob mechanism you asked about allows to grief people (using the old and nice trains on them).  So, particularly, I dont like it.

 

I don't think griefing is a realistic complaint in a full loot FFA PvP environment.  If I stalk you and kill you repeatedly day in and day out, mano a mano, will you consider that griefing? The ruleset and mechanics will allow it.

If you are paying attention, as you should be, and not afk in the wilderness, then you will see the mobs chasing someone the first time they pass you and you should be prepared for their return. If not, that is your fault.

I just want to enjoy a realistic environment again, similar to classic EQ, with real consequences and realistic NPC mob interaction.

If the game rules allow it, I wont complain.  But I dont have to like it.  I respect that you like it.

Btw, the "paying attention" argument had been used by most griefers since the begining of MMOs lol.

Finally, the "using the game mechaisnm" can be decieving.  Lin2, for example, is a FFA PvP and some people did complaing about trains and I think they do have a point.  The main resoning is this: if you attack someone you get flagged so we can PvP but if you train me with mobs, you dont.  In a full loot, I would be able to train you, get you killed, loot you and not get flagged.

We can discuss this point to the end of days, of coruse (as it had been done in hundreds of threads).  The point is that your opinion is that you like it and mine is that I dont.

 

I understand your point, that realistic NPC AI could be used as a way to circumvent murderer status, however if Aventurine hasn't coded a solution to the example I gave of secondary accounts being used to erase murderer status, then I think it's a mistake to dummy down the NPC mob AI, which hurts overall immersion. The solution to secondary accounts exploitation is simple, just allow one positive kill per account per week, but I don't think Aventurine has considered this, at least I have not read they have.

 I agree with the OP. 

Training mobs on noobs is fun.

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Originally posted by Keeper2000

Originally posted by RedwoodSap

Originally posted by Alandora

Training mobs onto another player is just another 'mechanism' that players would use to not get a murder count.  It would be exploited non-stop and the whole 'punishment for being a murderer' goes right out the window because nobody would get murder counts.

Won't players be able to have alts on secondary accounts to erase their murderer status with by killing them over and over? I am not advocating it, but it's gonna happen.

Yes, secondary accounts will be common.

And, btw, the mob mechanism you asked about allows to grief people (using the old and nice trains on them).  So, particularly, I dont like it.

 

I don't think griefing is a realistic complaint in a full loot FFA PvP environment.  If I stalk you and kill you repeatedly day in and day out, mano a mano, will you consider that griefing? The ruleset and mechanics will allow it.

If you are paying attention, as you should be, and not afk in the wilderness, then you will see the mobs chasing someone the first time they pass you and you should be prepared for their return. If not, that is your fault.

I just want to enjoy a realistic environment again, similar to classic EQ, with real consequences and realistic NPC mob interaction.

Well if there is some form of feign death then you are screwed.

Training people makes more sense in a pvp game than a pve game, but some may call you a pussy for doing it.  Its ok, weak players gotta have a way to fight too.