Originally posted by popinjay

 

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Popinjay, you are massively getting on my nerves now. If i recollect you kept abusing me for the heinous crime of saying that a lot of people disenchanted with the game, especially at release, didn't really know how to play it properly and aren't aware of the feature it has. After all that hysterical abuse you now go saying "oh lol there's keep ownership, lol!" after authoritatively proclaiming how there isn't any and thats one of the reasons it sucks - this is getting really rich. Really really rich.

 

Actually I don't know what I'm trying to say here. I'm not trying to discredit you or anything its just I'm wondering why should I post anymore on these boards. There is no fact-checking here and unintentional ignorance gets accepted as a "fact" and "common knowledge" if enough people shout it loud enough. It's a shouting match really, what's the point?

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I'm truly sorry Markaraos, I didn't realize my posting upset you so.

Is there a way that you can /blist me so you don't have to see what I type? I'm not sure if there is or not.

But I hope you feel better later, anyways... Merry Christmas to you and Happy New Year!

Lol, who are you and what did you do the real popinjay?! Do you have an evil brother that logs in here while you're asleep?

Anywayz, Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you as well.

My problem's with war are very simple.  There are only 2 actually.

1- t4 rvr sucks on my top of the line rig due to lag/bad performance

2- pve REQUIRED to complete PVP objectives.

Nuff said back to EVE i went:)

Originally posted by popinjay

 

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people are using it. Every day I attack a keep that is owned by a guild. It used to be really expensive to own a keep but they changed that so people are claiming keeps.

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You can only speak to your server, as only grunties or anyone else can. Just because you have some guilds using it on your server, does not mean they are used on all or most of the servers, or people there even about it in the first place.

That is like when people say their server is empty, someone replies "Not mine server.. it's poppin". Or they say they have major lag on one and you say "Oh, thats not my server. you must be on a GOA one". Or CTD. "Not my server." Or anything else. YMMV, remember? I don't think on the servers where it's low/low theres a lot of guilds owning things. As someone pointed out, what would be the point of that?

Warhammer is not a consistant fluid game, I think we all know this. What is on or happens on one server is not likely to be the same experience on another, no?
 

Alright, lets say that I believed you that you really didn't know. Which is cool by the way, I have no problem with people not knowing all the ins and outs of the game, it happens. Its true that keep ownership and how RvR works was public info long before release in the newsletters, on the mythic website, as well as talked about a lot on these boards before and after release... but lets say that someone missed all that for whatever reason, there are legitimate reasons after all.

I would expect someone that really didn't know what was in the game to ask sincerely 'is there anything like this in the game?' instead of declaring with full certainty 'There is none of this in the game! It should get some or its not worth playing!'

The latter I would expect from someone who had an agenda and really wanted to lead people to think the game didn't have these things. We have seen that sort of behavior from people on these boards in the past, from fans of other games, who intentionally wanted to drive away people interested in WAR. I would hope you aren't one of those people, and were simply not familiar with the game, but usually people who genuinely don't know are a little more... humble about declaring the state of things. They are less insistent and more open to finding out that their limited experience is just that.

Even now, you still insist that your view on claiming keeps is the more widespread and correct one, that on the whole it is never used, is useless, etc, even at the same time you declare that everyone whose experience differs from yours 'only applies to their own server'. 

Why does your personal experience not 'only apply to your own server'?  

Either way, I hope the experience and your blunder humbles you a bit, if you really werent out to spread misinformation, and that you endeavor to confirm the facts before posting. Merry Christmas. :)

Originally posted by Yamota

Yeah and I am quite picky when it comes to MMORPGs. Havent liked any of them since AC DT.

Was surprised that I had so fun in this game. I spend most of my time PvP and get exp at the same time. How awesome isnt that?

Good luck post level 22+ when the level curve surfaces and the grind starts.

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Its true that keep ownership and how RvR works was public info long before release in the newsletters, on the mythic website, as well as talked about a lot on these boards before and after release... but lets say that someone missed all that for whatever reason, there are legitimate reasons after all.

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Like someone who doesn't follow the pre-hype boards of a game? Or someone who never knew about the Warhammer universe and lore? Or someone who just sees what new game is coming out and waits? Guilty. Got me.

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I would expect someone that really didn't know what was in the game to ask sincerely 'is there anything like this in the game?' instead of declaring with full certainty 'There is none of this in the game! It should get some or its not worth playing!

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This was not typed and shouted. (I guess you're using hyperbole for effect, but ok). Again on Tor Achere before it closed down, this was not a common discussion over chat. Heck, there WAS hardly any 'common' discussions over chat channels back then. No one knew anything other than beta folks. No one knew other people existed, cause you didn't SEE many and there was so little 'Common' chat to prove they were there at all.

The Warhammer box on my shelf has no mention of guilds "owning" or claiming keeps as a key design feature on its cover. The whopping 37-page Warhammer manual (of which 26 are relavant, the rest is "credits" and crap) that come with the box game doensn't mention guilds "owing" keeps. Maybe I skimmed through that too and missed it, but I sure didn't see it in there either, maybe its on the disk itself lol. But it certainly isn't as readily available information as you make it out to be for someone picking up the game, loading it, reading the manual and playing it. Might be on their sites in a "conspicuous" space right as you log in, but how many people go to the site to read that crap? Maybe later, but in the first month, everything I need to know about the game should be mostly in the manual, and I go with that.

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The latter I would expect from someone who had an agenda and really wanted to lead people to think the game didn't have these things. We have seen that sort of behavior from people on these boards in the past, from fans of other games, who intentionally wanted to drive away people interested in WAR. I would hope you aren't one of those people, and were simply not familiar with the game, but usually people who genuinely don't know are a little more... humble about declaring the state of things. They are less insistent and more open to finding out that their limited experience is just that.

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What you need to do right now to allay these fears building in your mind as you say, is to go through my posts. Check them and see where I said Warhammer is a shitty game ever. See where I said Warhammer is a terrible game. See where I said Warhammer should be scrapped and microwaved. As much as I post here, you should have plenty of ammo, friend.

You'll never see anything I said about Warhammer other than: Good game (when I was actually playing it around level 10ish or so), Fair game (as I got higher) and boring game (when I couldn't force myself to log on anymore due to the repetition and aimless fighting after level 26ish). If you find where I said any of that other stuff, I'll give you a big, fat cookie.

Until you do, you can go right ahead and believe that I am actually NOT trying to make the game fail, but rather bring a dose of reality and counterbalance to the more "rah rah Mythic" types who are misleading a lot of new folks by saying they play Warhammer "wrong", that's why they don't have fun. It's too complex for them, etc etc. Cow poopy.

My sig says what it says cause its a F A C T, it was said, and by a leading person in the Mythic food chain. It's not a flame; if someone makes that kind of statement, are they optimistic or crazy? Being he's in a "responsible" corporate position, that's a fair discussion to have, but a Warboi will see that as a open flame. Meh... eye of the beholder and all that.

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Why does your personal experience not 'only apply to your own server'?

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Either way, I hope the experience and your blunder humbles you a bit, if you really werent out to spread misinformation, and that you endeavor to confirm the facts before posting. Merry Christmas. :)

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Thanks grunties, you as well :) Don't drink too much egg nog!

grunties, well, would you believe Popinjay once posted this:

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well, I know one thing.. I used to let my 10 year old son do all the pvp grinding in WoW. it was that simple to do.. no strategy involved. he just used macros i had made. There also wasnt any reason to pvp in WoW other than for gear to go PvE, that was it.
At least in War, there is a purpose in the "endgame". Sieges, city battles, extra dungeons, etc.. that really does make a difference and you wont see a lot of ppl going AFK like in WoW pvp and racking up badges/points while others do the work. (yeah, I was one of those, but I was mainly PvE for gear to raid so I didnt care about WoW pvp)
The concept of no real goal for pvping other than "just to kill the other guy" was about as mindless as PvE quests to go "kill X amount of Bolusian Tree Squirrels". It just might be the thing a PvP hater such as myself needs to get interested in it.
I will be giving War a shot (and wont be letting my son play it this time) :P

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Or this? (I guess I owe some WoW fans an apology now)

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I play Wow and War as well, and War did one smart thing.
They focus on the PvP. WoW focuses on the PvE. So at best, all War will get from WoW is the much younger kid "YEAHBOI! FUCK IT I OWZYOOSE ALL UBER L33T" population that gave WoW a bad name in the first place probably.
Warhammer will not pull WoWs base, which is about raiding and endgame dungeoning. That will stay there with the mandatory raiding times and gear driven play. That base that plays WoW likes it just that way. They wont be coming here, esp with Wrath of the Lich King coming and NEW raiding and gear to worry about. lol
There is a segment who play Wow who just want to pvp. Thats it. They dont wanna do anything else. That crowd will get siphoned off WoW and come here. But that crowd will make such a small dent leaving it wont be missed, esp when you can replace it with customers FASTER than will leave WoW. (which they are doing btw)
War is a good game so far (7/10) and will not fail. Its not a niche game, as there is a big and growing population of new gamers who want to meet people and kill them. But owning WoW?
Only if you like PvP will it "own" WoW.

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Man, I was dead wrong on a couple things in the second one, lol! NOW I'm humbled.

Sorry Wow fans, you have my sincere apologies; you were mostly right.

Im loving this game.I dont undertand what people mean thats its get grindy after rank 15 or 22 or 31.This is mass combat verse other players, real people not npcs.I found other mmos grindy.Kill this then that  take something here then there or go into the npc dungeon for hours.I think this game has less grind then any other game.I cant wait to get into a wb to siege a keep or defend one.Or if i want i can go killcomputer monsters.Just love the mmo PvP.

Compared to MMO released in 2008 WAR is far much better amongst them.
I do play WAR and I do enjoy it at the moment but I wouldnt call it a game that I would want to play on for years

Just waiting for something better to come along.Hopefully Darkfall wont disappoint

player cities  yes....????  no...???  or guild cities built around keeps....they got the influence system down....now give us one more reason to Orvr

Originally posted by needalife214

player cities  yes....????  no...???  or guild cities built around keeps....they got the influence system down....now give us one more reason to Orvr

WAR is not a guild-based game. It is not a guild vs guild game. It is a REALM vs REALM game. Guilds in WAR were originally called "regiments" because that's what they are - permanent military units that work together.

How hard is it to understand? It was never the intention of WAR devs to make guilds the top level of player loyalty (like WoW, EvE or AoC for example). In WAR your whole FACTION is your guild. Therefore - the CAPITAL CITY is your "guild" city. It levels through ranks and there'll be more of them coming up. They'll probably level beyond rank 5 as the game gets mature, unlocking new content etc.

Again - what you're proposing would be great for a GUILD-BASED game. However WAR is not guild-based, it is REALM-BASED. Making guilds too powerful or overly competetive would completely defeat the basic premise of the game - all members of a faction are together in the same boat - basically all your faction mates are your guildies you depend upon.

I've seen those "me-me-me" guilds on our server being formed at the start of the game. Most of those "leet" guys thought they're going to be the "uber" guild better than anyone else - cause they though it is the point of the game like in the games I mentioned. It is not. It is a REALM BASED game. After a "learning period" most guilds are now smaller in size and comprised of people who reall like to play together - as it should be. When numbers are needed then alliances come into play and finally server-wide coordination.

And why is all that? Because, unlike in those other games, a single guild or even a single alliance cannot even think of attempting the endgame alone. For that you need the whole server to work together. All guilds are truly part of a huge super guild that is called the REALM.

Why am I saying this? Because it is quite obvious to me that people calling for keep "ownership" havent yet grasped what WAR is - a REALM based game. In WAR your guild holds a keep for its REALM and not for itself. You can hold that keep - and it'll be a great source of pride and rewards for your guild - but it is your REALM'S keep primarily and your whole realm will help you defend it.

WAR is not a Darkfall or AoC or even WoW in that respect - and I'm thankful for it. Finally a game without guild leetness and consequent nazism and bullying which made me almost leave the mmos altogether.

Hope this helps. Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

Originally posted by sabutai33

Originally posted by Yamota

Yeah and I am quite picky when it comes to MMORPGs. Havent liked any of them since AC DT.

Was surprised that I had so fun in this game. I spend most of my time PvP and get exp at the same time. How awesome isnt that?

 

Good luck post level 22+ when the level curve surfaces and the grind starts.

 

What grind ? It's only a grind if you make it so ( aka , trying to rank up as fast as possible). I rerolled a KoTbS and am having a blast in t3 rvr. I don't "grind" . I come in and go around the zones. 90%+ of the time their is some major pvp happening. I am R28 RR27 and i didn't even see the level fly by , so much fun  i am having.

Originally posted by Whiskeyjack1

Originally posted by sabutai33

Originally posted by Yamota

Yeah and I am quite picky when it comes to MMORPGs. Havent liked any of them since AC DT.

Was surprised that I had so fun in this game. I spend most of my time PvP and get exp at the same time. How awesome isnt that?

 

Good luck post level 22+ when the level curve surfaces and the grind starts.

 

 

What grind ? It's only a grind if you make it so ( aka , trying to rank up as fast as possible). I rerolled a KoTbS and am having a blast in t3 rvr. I don't "grind" . I come in and go around the zones. 90%+ of the time their is some major pvp happening. I am R28 RR27 and i didn't even see the level fly by , so much fun  i am having.

There is no grind at lvl 22. At that lvl you enter t3 and the quest give 2 time more then in t2.  I heard there was one before but its been dealt with a while ago.
 

I like warhammer online and it was a great experience.  It can't really hold anyone like wow did tho.  Played 3 month and now I can't even find it within me to log back on.  Playing atlatica online now.  That little free 2 play mmo is a lot more fun imo and it the reason I don't play war anymore.

Originally posted by markoraos

Originally posted by needalife214

player cities  yes....????  no...???  or guild cities built around keeps....they got the influence system down....now give us one more reason to Orvr

 

WAR is not a guild-based game. It is not a guild vs guild game. It is a REALM vs REALM game. Guilds in WAR were originally called "regiments" because that's what they are - permanent military units that work together.

How hard is it to understand? It was never the intention of WAR devs to make guilds the top level of player loyalty (like WoW, EvE or AoC for example). In WAR your whole FACTION is your guild. Therefore - the CAPITAL CITY is your "guild" city. It levels through ranks and there'll be more of them coming up. They'll probably level beyond rank 5 as the game gets mature, unlocking new content etc.

Again - what you're proposing would be great for a GUILD-BASED game. However WAR is not guild-based, it is REALM-BASED. Making guilds too powerful or overly competetive would completely defeat the basic premise of the game - all members of a faction are together in the same boat - basically all your faction mates are your guildies you depend upon.

I've seen those "me-me-me" guilds on our server being formed at the start of the game. Most of those "leet" guys thought they're going to be the "uber" guild better than anyone else - cause they though it is the point of the game like in the games I mentioned. It is not. It is a REALM BASED game. After a "learning period" most guilds are now smaller in size and comprised of people who reall like to play together - as it should be. When numbers are needed then alliances come into play and finally server-wide coordination.

And why is all that? Because, unlike in those other games, a single guild or even a single alliance cannot even think of attempting the endgame alone. For that you need the whole server to work together. All guilds are truly part of a huge super guild that is called the REALM.

Why am I saying this? Because it is quite obvious to me that people calling for keep "ownership" havent yet grasped what WAR is - a REALM based game. In WAR your guild holds a keep for its REALM and not for itself. You can hold that keep - and it'll be a great source of pride and rewards for your guild - but it is your REALM'S keep primarily and your whole realm will help you defend it.

WAR is not a Darkfall or AoC or even WoW in that respect - and I'm thankful for it. Finally a game without guild leetness and consequent nazism and bullying which made me almost leave the mmos altogether.

Hope this helps. Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

you misunderstood me.....I understand what war is ... but what you fail to see is that people need goals getting to 40 is not enough and the grind to rr 80 is a long one....yeah your realm holds on to a keep  but leaves when a zerg comes   make Keeps like DAoC.....just copy paste the whole RvR system that would be good enough for me....I love this game but the content is not all there yet give me a few more RvR fluff and give me a reason to die for my realm... not a reason to leave a keep and then move on to the next undefended one..This was not how it was on DAoC (maybe gamers hve changed i dont know but I feel WAR is getting close but cant grasp the fun factor) and on dark cragg bullying in region chat is a daily thing 

and the end game......a city seige,,,doesn't work when people just crash the server to reset the teirs

as i said before WAR is close...but needs a few more hand holds to reach the fun factor that will bring in a good amount of players

This game is awesome, but what makes you think the graphics are crappy? they are elite compared to most MMORPGs ;)

Originally posted by Whiskeyjack1 

What grind ? It's only a grind if you make it so ( aka , trying to rank up as fast as possible). I rerolled a KoTbS and am having a blast in t3 rvr. I don't "grind" . I come in and go around the zones. 90%+ of the time their is some major pvp happening. I am R28 RR27 and i didn't even see the level fly by , so much fun  i am having.

I agree to this sentiment. Other MMORPGs have felt like a grind because you had to endlessly do NPC quests which often revolved around killing NPC mobs. I dont feel like that with WAR because I PvP for my exp and so far its been all fun.

But I do have to say that scenarios are getting a bit boring and I hope that other forms of PvP will present themselve which will allow me to advance my chararacter in that way.

I heard there is something called open RvR but so far I havent seen any of that. How does it work and can you get exp by doing that?

Originally posted by lukyjay

This game is awesome, but what makes you think the graphics are crappy? they are elite compared to most MMORPGs ;)

Well mostly it is because of the low polygon count and cartoony gfx. I prefer gfx more like Crysis, AoC, EQ 2. WoW type of gfx, which WAR has, is a turnoff for me. What particulary ticks me of is that DAoC had better spell effects and animations than WAR which is weird since it is apparently developed by the same company.

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by lukyjay

This game is awesome, but what makes you think the graphics are crappy? they are elite compared to most MMORPGs ;)

 

Well mostly it is because of the low polygon count and cartoony gfx. I prefer gfx more like Crysis, AoC, EQ 2. WoW type of gfx, which WAR has, is a turnoff for me. What particulary ticks me of is that DAoC had better spell effects and animations than WAR which is weird since it is apparently developed by the same company.

Yeah, i see what you mean. Though they take a lot of effort to make graphics that good. In my opinion, AoC and LoTRO (The only 2 games with realistic graphics) have terrible gameplay! They should be spending more effort onto gameplay than graphics, which is what they did with WoW.

If you look at the concept art on the WAR website, you will see how they were originally going to make it look, like an actual anime game. :/

Originally posted by lukyjay

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by lukyjay

This game is awesome, but what makes you think the graphics are crappy? they are elite compared to most MMORPGs ;)

 

Well mostly it is because of the low polygon count and cartoony gfx. I prefer gfx more like Crysis, AoC, EQ 2. WoW type of gfx, which WAR has, is a turnoff for me. What particulary ticks me of is that DAoC had better spell effects and animations than WAR which is weird since it is apparently developed by the same company.

Yeah, i see what you mean. Though they take a lot of effort to make graphics that good. In my opinion, AoC and LoTRO (The only 2 games with realistic graphics) have terrible gameplay! They should be spending more effort onto gameplay than graphics, which is what they did with WoW.

 

If you look at the concept art on the WAR website, you will see how they were originally going to make it look, like an actual anime game. :/

Yeah, no question about it. Gameplay is alot more important than GFX and hence why I play WAR instead of LOTR and AoC (tried both).

And actually after I played a while and seen some of the zones out there then I need to take back that it is crappy. It is low tech but artistically it is quite beautiful.

I resubbed to war a couple of days ago after they put in ORVR. I'm having a blast! its actually worth doing ORVR now!.

Also on a note when someone said it takes 6 months to a year for a game to come repetitive..Well i wish WoW was like that because in the 10 days i played it , it was boring as all hell. If only that game would do something different then grind to 80 and do completely nothing. Didnt even get the feeling to lvl my other toons to 80.

Long live the WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by lukyjay

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by lukyjay

This game is awesome, but what makes you think the graphics are crappy? they are elite compared to most MMORPGs ;)

 

Well mostly it is because of the low polygon count and cartoony gfx. I prefer gfx more like Crysis, AoC, EQ 2. WoW type of gfx, which WAR has, is a turnoff for me. What particulary ticks me of is that DAoC had better spell effects and animations than WAR which is weird since it is apparently developed by the same company.

Yeah, i see what you mean. Though they take a lot of effort to make graphics that good. In my opinion, AoC and LoTRO (The only 2 games with realistic graphics) have terrible gameplay! They should be spending more effort onto gameplay than graphics, which is what they did with WoW.

 

If you look at the concept art on the WAR website, you will see how they were originally going to make it look, like an actual anime game. :/

Yeah, no question about it. Gameplay is alot more important than GFX and hence why I play WAR instead of LOTR and AoC (tried both).

And actually after I played a while and seen some of the zones out there then I need to take back that it is crappy. It is low tech but artistically it is quite beautiful.

sorry guys this is opinion. There are many people who would say that some of the art design in lotro is bad and that the gameplay for either is better than most other games. What this boils down to is that everyone likes something different. The spectrum of whether or not the gameplay is better or worse than other games is so wide that it seems to me that the designers have done something right.