The only reason I asked was that on the official forums, it seems that some people are getting it, but some aren't.

Odd, but I guess we'll see tomorrow, since it being 10 pm here, there isn't much sense in registering now. 

Tyranny is still a populated server. I'm rerolling a HoX there. 

Originally posted by openedge1

Originally posted by Papadam

Originally posted by openedge1

Quit drinking the haterade people, and get a life.

 

LOL

This is coming from the person who have done nothing but post about how much he hates LotrO for the last 1.5 year, in pretty much every single post made... Its just so ironic :D

Im glad that you enjoy AoC now so you dont spend so much time hating in the LotrO forum now!

Just went there, can never leave my old home. Maybe you need to go back and find my LOTRO complaints posted in the last week or two so you can troll them...

But here is the difference.

I can point out EVERY issue in LOTRO, that still exists to this day, and has not been fixed.

All of my issues are being addressed in AoC.

I have continually tried to play LOTRO, and meet the same issues over and over.

The difference with AoC is people are basing their opinions on the launch of the game, and have probably not touched the game since then. They are not aware of the changes. There are even posters here who have not tried the game, but are being sheep to comment.

When was the last time YOU played?

That is a huge difference.

Well I am sorry to hear that Lotro did not address your problems but Funcom just flat out lied after they took peoples money. You got a link to where Lotro lied to you after you paid them?
 

Most people feel cheated by them that was the MAJOR problem and but maybe Funcom has fixed your problems but for most they have not. Where is the DX-10? or the bar brawling? or the FREE (not 2.99 a download) trial?

What did Lotro promise you that they did not provide? Maybe you disagree with the direction of the game or the way it plays etc.... but they did not take peoples money and not deliver what they said they would.

You can bash Lotro all you want and have your opinions but Turbine did not lie to people when Lotro was released. Its like playing The Legend of Zelda and Nintendo telling you the sword and shield will be coming soon. 

Imagine how successful that game would be if Nintendo did that when Link is clearly holding a sword and shield on the box.

I do agree with you post on the box price as it is a good move for any game this time a year and Subs net more money than box sales over time.

---

Originally posted by jblah

---

Originally posted by openedge1

---

Originally posted by Papadam

---

Originally posted by openedge1

 

Quit drinking the haterade people, and get a life.

---

 

 
LOL
This is coming from the person who have done nothing but post about how much he hates LotrO for the last 1.5 year, in pretty much every single post made... Its just so ironic :D
Im glad that you enjoy AoC now so you dont spend so much time hating in the LotrO forum now!

---

Just went there, can never leave my old home. Maybe you need to go back and find my LOTRO complaints posted in the last week or two so you can troll them...
But here is the difference.
I can point out EVERY issue in LOTRO, that still exists to this day, and has not been fixed.
All of my issues are being addressed in AoC.
I have continually tried to play LOTRO, and meet the same issues over and over.
The difference with AoC is people are basing their opinions on the launch of the game, and have probably not touched the game since then. They are not aware of the changes. There are even posters here who have not tried the game, but are being sheep to comment.
When was the last time YOU played?
That is a huge difference.

---

Well I am sorry to hear that Lotro did not address your problems but Funcom just flat out lied after they took peoples money. You got a link to where Lotro lied to you after you paid them?
 
Most people feel cheated by them that was the MAJOR problem and but maybe Funcom has fixed your problems but for most they have not. Where is the DX-10? or the bar brawling? or the FREE (not 2.99 a download) trial?
What did Lotro promise you that they did not provide? Maybe you disagree with the direction of the game or the way it plays etc.... but they did not take peoples money and not deliver what they said they would.
 
You can bash Lotro all you want and have your opinions but Turbine did not lie to people when Lotro was released. Its like playing The Legend of Zelda and Nintendo telling you the sword and shield will be coming soon. 
Imagine how successful that game would be if Nintendo did that when Link is clearly holding a sword and shield on the box.
I do agree with you post on the box price as it is a good move for any game this time a year and Subs net more money than box sales over time.

---

 
I know a couple of people who play AoC, and think that Turbine's biz practices are just as bad as FCs.

Just to let you all know tho, DX10 was available at launch and EA, they removed it because it didn't add anything meaningful to the graphical design. Other than PvP levels, Dunking brawling, and DX10 total absence FC hasn't lied about anything. Don't get me started on the PvP system being added in july, I've reread thoes post and they all said we hope in them.

Originally posted by xpiher

 

---

Originally posted by jblah

---

Originally posted by openedge1

---

Originally posted by Papadam

---

Originally posted by openedge1

 

Quit drinking the haterade people, and get a life.

---

 

 
LOL
This is coming from the person who have done nothing but post about how much he hates LotrO for the last 1.5 year, in pretty much every single post made... Its just so ironic :D
Im glad that you enjoy AoC now so you dont spend so much time hating in the LotrO forum now!

---

Just went there, can never leave my old home. Maybe you need to go back and find my LOTRO complaints posted in the last week or two so you can troll them...
But here is the difference.
I can point out EVERY issue in LOTRO, that still exists to this day, and has not been fixed.
All of my issues are being addressed in AoC.
I have continually tried to play LOTRO, and meet the same issues over and over.
The difference with AoC is people are basing their opinions on the launch of the game, and have probably not touched the game since then. They are not aware of the changes. There are even posters here who have not tried the game, but are being sheep to comment.
When was the last time YOU played?
That is a huge difference.

---

Well I am sorry to hear that Lotro did not address your problems but Funcom just flat out lied after they took peoples money. You got a link to where Lotro lied to you after you paid them?
 
Most people feel cheated by them that was the MAJOR problem and but maybe Funcom has fixed your problems but for most they have not. Where is the DX-10? or the bar brawling? or the FREE (not 2.99 a download) trial?
What did Lotro promise you that they did not provide? Maybe you disagree with the direction of the game or the way it plays etc.... but they did not take peoples money and not deliver what they said they would.
 
You can bash Lotro all you want and have your opinions but Turbine did not lie to people when Lotro was released. Its like playing The Legend of Zelda and Nintendo telling you the sword and shield will be coming soon. 
Imagine how successful that game would be if Nintendo did that when Link is clearly holding a sword and shield on the box.
I do agree with you post on the box price as it is a good move for any game this time a year and Subs net more money than box sales over time.

---

 
I know a couple of people who play AoC, and think that Turbine's biz practices are just as bad as FCs.

 

Just to let you all know tho, DX10 was available at launch and EA, they removed it because it didn't add anything meaningful to the graphical design. Other than PvP levels, Dunking brawling, and DX10 total absence FC hasn't lied about anything. Don't get me started on the PvP system being added in july, I've reread thoes post and they all said we hope in them.

The only way I feel that Funcom lied to me is not due to what the box said it would contain nor is it what gaute wrote in the newsletter, but the way Gaute and Erling was sitting in intervies claiming the game was doing fine, few problems but no bad ones etc. This is where Funcom lied the most for my part, because the game did have huge issues, OOM etc. And this is also where they have changed totally these days. Every newsletter Gaute wrote did say that he hopes to have things ready for next patch etc. This wasn't a lie, he never said that things would be ready to that specific date, but you had a big amount of players that clearly can't read that took the words they liked and made up sentences for their own. And in their sentences the word "hope" never existed. :P

Originally posted by Crashloop

The only way I feel that Funcom lied to me is not due to what the box said it would contain nor is it what gaute wrote in the newsletter, but the way Gaute and Erling was sitting in intervies claiming the game was doing fine, few problems but no bad ones etc. This is where Funcom lied the most for my part, because the game did have huge issues, OOM etc. And this is also where they have changed totally these days. Every newsletter Gaute wrote did say that he hopes to have things ready for next patch etc. This wasn't a lie, he never said that things would be ready to that specific date, but you had a big amount of players that clearly can't read that took the words they liked and made up sentences for their own. And in their sentences the word "hope" never existed. :P

 

Funcom is the only company to lie?

Turbine - Over 4 million characters made (a truth, but who cares how many characters were made, which then led to specualtion by some with bad math announcing 800k players...they call this leading...almost like lieing)

Steefel statement from Turbine - We believe LOTRO is most likely to rival WoW (that seems to be pulling the wool over many players eyes)

I could go on and list other developers and their special little quotes, but we have already done this.

According to House MD (Fox channel Tuesdays), everyone lies.

Originally posted by FischerBlack

The AoC box price and Funcom's stock price are in a race to 0. They started almost even, the stock price took the early lead but now the box is catching up.

lol classic. You win my post of the day competition !!

Originally posted by xpiher

 

---

Originally posted by jblah

---

Originally posted by openedge1

---

Originally posted by Papadam

---

Originally posted by openedge1

 

Quit drinking the haterade people, and get a life.

---

 

 
LOL
This is coming from the person who have done nothing but post about how much he hates LotrO for the last 1.5 year, in pretty much every single post made... Its just so ironic :D
Im glad that you enjoy AoC now so you dont spend so much time hating in the LotrO forum now!

---

Just went there, can never leave my old home. Maybe you need to go back and find my LOTRO complaints posted in the last week or two so you can troll them...
But here is the difference.
I can point out EVERY issue in LOTRO, that still exists to this day, and has not been fixed.
All of my issues are being addressed in AoC.
I have continually tried to play LOTRO, and meet the same issues over and over.
The difference with AoC is people are basing their opinions on the launch of the game, and have probably not touched the game since then. They are not aware of the changes. There are even posters here who have not tried the game, but are being sheep to comment.
When was the last time YOU played?
That is a huge difference.

---

Well I am sorry to hear that Lotro did not address your problems but Funcom just flat out lied after they took peoples money. You got a link to where Lotro lied to you after you paid them?
 
Most people feel cheated by them that was the MAJOR problem and but maybe Funcom has fixed your problems but for most they have not. Where is the DX-10? or the bar brawling? or the FREE (not 2.99 a download) trial?
What did Lotro promise you that they did not provide? Maybe you disagree with the direction of the game or the way it plays etc.... but they did not take peoples money and not deliver what they said they would.
 
You can bash Lotro all you want and have your opinions but Turbine did not lie to people when Lotro was released. Its like playing The Legend of Zelda and Nintendo telling you the sword and shield will be coming soon. 
Imagine how successful that game would be if Nintendo did that when Link is clearly holding a sword and shield on the box.
I do agree with you post on the box price as it is a good move for any game this time a year and Subs net more money than box sales over time.

---

 
I know a couple of people who play AoC, and think that Turbine's biz practices are just as bad as FCs.

 

Just to let you all know tho, DX10 was available at launch and EA, they removed it because it didn't add anything meaningful to the graphical design. Other than PvP levels, Dunking brawling, and DX10 total absence FC hasn't lied about anything. Don't get me started on the PvP system being added in july, I've reread thoes post and they all said we hope in them.

Wow is all I can say on that reply. DX-10 was available at launch and in EA? You guys really will say anything but I guess you mean the box under the options was available (although it did nothing) yes you would be correct but I think DX-10 is supposed to add more to the game then just an check box.
 

Other than Pvp levels, drunkin brawling and DX-10 FC has not lied about anything? You yourself used the words OTHER THEN. You guys really will say anything and spin anything to get your subs back.

You AOC fans are doing your game alot more harm then good by posting things like that as aside from Avery you guys are using all of GG's practices to get players to come to AOC.

Originally posted by openedge1

Originally posted by Crashloop

The only way I feel that Funcom lied to me is not due to what the box said it would contain nor is it what gaute wrote in the newsletter, but the way Gaute and Erling was sitting in intervies claiming the game was doing fine, few problems but no bad ones etc. This is where Funcom lied the most for my part, because the game did have huge issues, OOM etc. And this is also where they have changed totally these days. Every newsletter Gaute wrote did say that he hopes to have things ready for next patch etc. This wasn't a lie, he never said that things would be ready to that specific date, but you had a big amount of players that clearly can't read that took the words they liked and made up sentences for their own. And in their sentences the word "hope" never existed. :P

 

Funcom is the only company to lie?

Turbine - Over 4 million characters made (a truth, but who cares how many characters were made, which then led to specualtion by some with bad math announcing 800k players...they call this leading...almost like lieing)

Steefel statement from Turbine - We believe LOTRO is most likely to rival WoW (that seems to be pulling the wool over many players eyes)

I could go on and list other developers and their special little quotes, but we have already done this.

According to House MD (Fox channel Tuesdays), everyone lies.

Fact- Over 4 million characters were created in Lotro.
 

Fiction- AOC had DX-10 at release, drunkin brawling, PVP system.

Turbine never said they had 800k subs and that statement from Turbine about rivaling WOW although I have never seen that posted can be understood with reading comprehension as an opinion.

See the difference yet? Probably not you were probably one of the guys that clicked the DX-10 box under the options in game and though DX-10 looked awesome in AOC.

Fox news haha you do believe everything you hear on TV.

For me AOC was by far the wrost excuse for a MMO I have ever seen. With most of what was listed on the box missing for months after launch. The only thing going for it was the enviroment graphics. I quit months ago and would not come back if they paid me $15 a month to play it.

Originally posted by openedge1

Originally posted by Crashloop

The only way I feel that Funcom lied to me is not due to what the box said it would contain nor is it what gaute wrote in the newsletter, but the way Gaute and Erling was sitting in intervies claiming the game was doing fine, few problems but no bad ones etc. This is where Funcom lied the most for my part, because the game did have huge issues, OOM etc. And this is also where they have changed totally these days. Every newsletter Gaute wrote did say that he hopes to have things ready for next patch etc. This wasn't a lie, he never said that things would be ready to that specific date, but you had a big amount of players that clearly can't read that took the words they liked and made up sentences for their own. And in their sentences the word "hope" never existed. :P

 

Funcom is the only company to lie?

Turbine - Over 4 million characters made (a truth, but who cares how many characters were made, which then led to specualtion by some with bad math announcing 800k players...they call this leading...almost like lieing)

Steefel statement from Turbine - We believe LOTRO is most likely to rival WoW (that seems to be pulling the wool over many players eyes)

I could go on and list other developers and their special little quotes, but we have already done this.

According to House MD (Fox channel Tuesdays), everyone lies.

I believe all people lie at some point, the daily "white lies" as in when someone asks you if you have done your homework, taken out the trash etc and your reply is no haven't had the time yet are not really bad. It's the black lies that are the worst when people straight out lie to your face. It can be discussed over and over if Funcom did lie or if they simply wasn't aware of the huge problems that was growing with OOM and other things. Personally when I saw the intervies and you have Gaute sitting there saying "yes some people have had problems but that is normal and we aim to fix that next patch", then you log on to the forums and you have massive amounts of threads describing the problem, the problem wasn't small it was actually affecting  probably more then 50% of the playerbase. This was when I started to loose faith in Funcom's abilities to fix the game. Then again with the new game director things changed, developers in Funcom that was interviewed had suddenly a whole different approach. They didn't try to minimalize the issues that had been earlier, and problems they experienced was discussed openly.

The Female attack speed issue that was when Gaute still was GD was a perfect example of how communication should be done on a issue. Sharum posted several times explaining the reason for the issue, how they were fixing it and also letting us know the progress of fixing. Sure you had people still whining over it taking too long time etc., but Sharum being there and being honest on how things went and informing us every  now and then meant a lot to the community. Communication between Developers and players are the key to minimize the issues, and this was Gaute Godagers probably weakest point. When the OOM issues was at the worst there was close to none information about how things were going, if it had been a lot of people would have been happier and accepting that this wouldn't be fixed staright away.

And I have no doubt that all companies/people around the world lie at daily/weekly/yearly basis. Some lies aren't bad, some are. Funcom never lied in their gameletters to the community, the way they formulated them always made room for delays so that wasn't a lie when the pvp patch was delayed. I don't know how many times I defended Funcom when people misquoted the newsletters, but i was suddenly a fanboi back then for proving people wrong when they clearly couldn't read or understand what was written. :P

That said the way Funcom communicate today is very good, we are informed on delays, we are informed why the merge failed, both given the reason for why and the way they want to fix it. Sure I want the merge to happen now, but as ong they inform me on why it doesn't happen now I'm a happy subscriber. Sure it takes longer then planned, but that's life. Sometimes things you couldn't predict or didn't see in testing pops up, I have seen it many times in my type of work so I know it happens.

Originally posted by therain93

Saw this on the backshelves at Target -- AoC clearanced down to 9.98.  Not necessarily a bad deal considering the 1 month free trial is included.

Doesn't really matter, the MMO companys lives on the monthly fees, not the box sales. Only exception are Guildwars right now.

Some games like EQ2 have a free trial and when it's done you can just start to pay the monthly fees without any box or other costs whatsoever.

Originally posted by AmazingAvery

This is a good deal for those living in America. Not bad for the price of a cup of coffee per week. Puchase gets you the DVD's too which are always handy to have.

To set the cup of coffee on?

Originally posted by FischerBlack

The AoC box price and Funcom's stock price are in a race to 0. They started almost even, the stock price took the early lead but now the box is catching up.

This is Signature worthy.  /bow

Originally posted by jblah

Originally posted by xpiher

 

---

Originally posted by jblah

---

Originally posted by openedge1

---

Originally posted by Papadam

---

Originally posted by openedge1

 

Quit drinking the haterade people, and get a life.

---

 

 
LOL
This is coming from the person who have done nothing but post about how much he hates LotrO for the last 1.5 year, in pretty much every single post made... Its just so ironic :D
Im glad that you enjoy AoC now so you dont spend so much time hating in the LotrO forum now!

---

Just went there, can never leave my old home. Maybe you need to go back and find my LOTRO complaints posted in the last week or two so you can troll them...
But here is the difference.
I can point out EVERY issue in LOTRO, that still exists to this day, and has not been fixed.
All of my issues are being addressed in AoC.
I have continually tried to play LOTRO, and meet the same issues over and over.
The difference with AoC is people are basing their opinions on the launch of the game, and have probably not touched the game since then. They are not aware of the changes. There are even posters here who have not tried the game, but are being sheep to comment.
When was the last time YOU played?
That is a huge difference.

---

Well I am sorry to hear that Lotro did not address your problems but Funcom just flat out lied after they took peoples money. You got a link to where Lotro lied to you after you paid them?
 
Most people feel cheated by them that was the MAJOR problem and but maybe Funcom has fixed your problems but for most they have not. Where is the DX-10? or the bar brawling? or the FREE (not 2.99 a download) trial?
What did Lotro promise you that they did not provide? Maybe you disagree with the direction of the game or the way it plays etc.... but they did not take peoples money and not deliver what they said they would.
 
You can bash Lotro all you want and have your opinions but Turbine did not lie to people when Lotro was released. Its like playing The Legend of Zelda and Nintendo telling you the sword and shield will be coming soon. 
Imagine how successful that game would be if Nintendo did that when Link is clearly holding a sword and shield on the box.
I do agree with you post on the box price as it is a good move for any game this time a year and Subs net more money than box sales over time.

---

 
I know a couple of people who play AoC, and think that Turbine's biz practices are just as bad as FCs.

 

Just to let you all know tho, DX10 was available at launch and EA, they removed it because it didn't add anything meaningful to the graphical design. Other than PvP levels, Dunking brawling, and DX10 total absence FC hasn't lied about anything. Don't get me started on the PvP system being added in july, I've reread thoes post and they all said we hope in them.

Wow is all I can say on that reply. DX-10 was available at launch and in EA? You guys really will say anything but I guess you mean the box under the options was available (although it did nothing) yes you would be correct but I think DX-10 is supposed to add more to the game then just an check box.
 

Other than Pvp levels, drunkin brawling and DX-10 FC has not lied about anything? You yourself used the words OTHER THEN. You guys really will say anything and spin anything to get your subs back.

 

You AOC fans are doing your game alot more harm then good by posting things like that as aside from Avery you guys are using all of GG's practices to get players to come to AOC.

 

DX10 was mentioned about a week or so before launch that would NOT be included in the game due to they ahd prioritized optimizing the game rather then add some Dx10 features. Yes it was printed on the box, but the box for the game was probably made like half a year ago anyway so changing that on that short notice wouldn't be possible as the game itself was already shipped out to stores or in the process to be done so.

Drunken brawling I don't think was mentioned on the box, but it was mentioned in several interviews and forums that would be included, but they did say shortly after release I think it was that drunken brawling wasn't implemented and wouldn't be done as first priority. PVP levels was missing, same with the consequence system and that took what seemed forever to implement.

Those who feel that they are lied to because the box said Dx10 and it wasn't ingame could have cancelled their pre order or not bought it after it got known that the game wouldn't have Dx10 from start if that meant that much to them. Yes it said Dx10 on the box, but the copies of the game and the box itself was probably made months ago and already shipped and on it's way to the customers.

Originally posted by Crashloop

DX10 was mentioned about a week or so before launch that would NOT be included in the game due to they ahd prioritized optimizing the game rather then add some Dx10 features. Yes it was printed on the box, but the box for the game was probably made like half a year ago anyway so changing that on that short notice wouldn't be possible as the game itself was already shipped out to stores or in the process to be done so.

Drunken brawling I don't think was mentioned on the box, but it was mentioned in several interviews and forums that would be included, but they did say shortly after release I think it was that drunken brawling wasn't implemented and wouldn't be done as first priority. PVP levels was missing, same with the consequence system and that took what seemed forever to implement.

Those who feel that they are lied to because the box said Dx10 and it wasn't ingame could have cancelled their pre order or not bought it after it got known that the game wouldn't have Dx10 from start if that meant that much to them. Yes it said Dx10 on the box, but the copies of the game and the box itself was probably made months ago and already shipped and on it's way to the customers.

Oh wow - Your presentation of what went on around launch is almost surreal

But hey! Let's (for arguments sake) say that Funcom didn't lie about anything. I don't really care much for the dx10 issue but 1 week before launch they mentioned that "aww dx10 is not quite ready and won't be in for launch as planned and advertized". (Everyone will understand boxes were printed 2 months earlier and Funcom had NO idea they were at least 9 months away from being ready with their dx10 implementation... Right, I'll buy that )

Let's talk about drunken brawling, PvP-system and the almost endless crafting system... "We are not lying here we just didn't get it ready for launch and everyone will understand it when Erling tells them that NO major features are missing 3 weeks after launch" 

Lets not mention "promises" of kingship and all other failed deliveries from funcom

Feel free to be all defensive and in denial about it. The end result was (and Funcom even acknowledged that in their financial report): The majority of their customers did NOT buy it! (Lower retention than expected blablabla.)

Even with Gaute gone (nice and visionary guy who failed completely at project management) the management of Funcom remains the same and most of us that left will still feel that Funcom lied to us.

Go on about semantics and "proof" etc... In the end it will be the feelings of all the lost customers that decide if we ever want to give Funcom another chance. So far they haven't convinced me

Originally posted by Loke666

Originally posted by therain93

Saw this on the backshelves at Target -- AoC clearanced down to 9.98.  Not necessarily a bad deal considering the 1 month free trial is included.

 

Doesn't really matter, the MMO companys lives on the monthly fees, not the box sales. Only exception are Guildwars right now.

Some games like EQ2 have a free trial and when it's done you can just start to pay the monthly fees without any box or other costs whatsoever.

Riiiiiiiight, after 8 months, how many supposed AAA titles are being dumped for 9.98 from national retailers?  As you might guess, I would disagree considerably with your statement.  Sure, mmo companies/publishers aren't living off of the box sales but they do make up some chunk of the cost.  And, again, we're not talking about a game starting off for free and charging a subscription, but a game once retailing for 49.99+ being reduced 80% within 8 months and pushed to a back aisle endcap.  Heck, there are subscription based games 3+ years old still charging more for the box in the game section.

The success of games (and especially mmos) are mainly based on two things -- a good launch and visibility on the shelf at your local retailer (which is the only point of producing a box).  AoC failed with the former and may be on the path of losing the latter....so I think this clearance does matter.

AOC is $10 at my local best buy, and the 3 copies they have are next to tabula rosa and COH on the bottom shelf.   Guildwars, Wotlk and the WOW battlechest are the titles on the 'top shelf' right now.  Warhammer was there a few weeks ago, but the 30ish copies they have are now near the bottom.

I had to run there last night after once again spilling juice on my keyboard.   I always check out the little MMORPG section

Two words:  Eve Online

Seems to be doing ok for itself, even though its not exactly on the top shelf of every local games store.  Visibility in retail stores for an MMO isn't everything.  It's a product that relies a lot on the internet.  Subsequently, word of mouth travels far on here.  AOC's launch was hurt due to the problems that we all know it had.  Many problems have since been resolved.  Some are still outstanding.

As for lieing about Directx 10, well, some people will still hold onto that argument even WELL AFTER Directx 10 features are in (which we all know are coming in the next patch).  Simply because they just cannot let a matter drop.

As for drunken brawling.  I'm sorry, but ANYONE who believes that drunken brawling is some sort of Holy Grail as far as returning subs are concerned is seriously deluded.  I couldn't care less if they had advertised that the game had bright red beachballs in it, if it's not useful for the game at that point then I back the decision to keep it out of the game completely until such time arises when it should be in.

As for Kingships?  Please.  You saw just how much work was needed just after launch on the core systems of the game, including PVP.  Superficial crap like kingship was mentioned at the wrong time by someone who has since left the development team.  Which brings me onto my next point..

There is a reason why Gaute left, and I bet the blame doesn't solely lie with FC.  Gaute was no saint or martyr.  He was a visionary.  But, like Brad Mcquaid, he obviously made some wrong choices.  This is the second time he was in charge of a launched game which floundered at the start.  Obviously Gaute and FC had difference in opinions.  Now, if they manage to do what they are saying they are doing, then I think Gaute's resignation will turn out to be a good thing for the health of the game.

I believe that AOC is getting back on track, it isn't at its destination yet though.  Not until the following are in and done will the game be getting closer to being an almost complete and polished game in MMO terms:

Server merges
The two L80 dungeons
Directx 10 features
Trial Accounts
Reitemisation (which will include gem and crafted item balancing)
Revamp of gem cutting and Architect professions
Commons District (L75+ complete area)

ALL of these things are coming in the next couple of months.  Some are coming much sooner than others.

If some people don't like the game, then try it with a trial account when they are released in the New Year, THEN you'll have some RECENT evidence to back up your claims on just how crap the game is.  Or are these people too chicken to admit the possibility that their claims no longer have a good foundation?

If some people TRUELY want to give the game a second chance, then do so, you might get a nice surprise.  ;)  However, if you hate the game and the company so much that you wouldn't pour water on them if they were on fire, then don't troll these forums, go and annoy the DF crowd.  They're always good for a laugh.